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Author Topic: Healing chondromalacia with prolotherapy/PRP *only*  (Read 4153 times)

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Offline wturri78

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Healing chondromalacia with prolotherapy/PRP *only*
« on: March 20, 2014, 07:39:24 PM »
I have chondromalacia in both knees, and to date have had only cortisone injections in both...which have helped somewhat, in the sense that I can go for 40 minutes on an elliptical machine now (before the shots--1 week ago--my knees flared up after anything more than normal daily walking). Of course, last fall I was doing 10 mile trail runs...oh, how far I've fallen  :-\

I know, of course, that this will heal nothing and probably will not last.

I know there are many discussions here about stem cells. I also see that many here have also tried prolo/PRP before, or with, stem cells. Most of the success stories I hear about prolo/PRP are all about ligaments and tendons, and mine are fine (MRI shows damage only on the cartilage behind the patellae).

Dr. Hauser's articles and videos show injections directly into the knee joints as well as all the tendons, what he calls "comprehensive therapy."

Has anyone here actually experienced improvement through *just* prolotherapy? If so, with what mixtures? What about PRP? I'm not asking about ligament tears and such...just injury due to cartilage damage.

If there's hope, I would like to try these things. If it won't help me, I'd rather put the money toward whatever is most likely to help me. At this point the only recommendations from an ortho are "live with it" or do arthroscopic procedures to "clean things up," which puzzles me because the MRI apparently didnt' show anything that can be cleaned up...not sure how you "clean up" a fissure in cartilage?

Anyway, your real and first-hand experience would be most helpful to me!

Offline kneeslover

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Re: Healing chondromalacia with prolotherapy/PRP *only*
« Reply #1 on: March 26, 2014, 04:26:23 PM »
i have had several injections with prolotherapy and prolozone. the first time with the injury went away on its own or perhaps with bodywork; the second time some prolotherapy was very helpful; this time i have done some prolotherapy and some prolozone; it has made my knees stronger for sure, but hasn't pushed me over the edge into "it's gone again" like it did the last time. maybe i sustained a different injury this time. still it was useful and i'm glad i did it. definitely a recommend here!

Offline wturri78

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Re: Healing chondromalacia with prolotherapy/PRP *only*
« Reply #2 on: March 26, 2014, 06:35:34 PM »
i have had several injections with prolotherapy and prolozone. the first time with the injury went away on its own or perhaps with bodywork; the second time some prolotherapy was very helpful; this time i have done some prolotherapy and some prolozone; it has made my knees stronger for sure, but hasn't pushed me over the edge into "it's gone again" like it did the last time. maybe i sustained a different injury this time. still it was useful and i'm glad i did it. definitely a recommend here!

Thanks for sharing! If you don't mind my asking, were your injuries related to tendons and ligaments, or other tissues? Or was cartilage damage a contributing factor, or perhaps the primary problem?

Nothing in my knees hurts, ever, to push or pull on. I can move and flex the kneecap, bear a decent amount of weight, do "active release" and such...nothing seems to either irritatie the tendons or ligaments, or to help with the pain. MRI shows "normal signal" on all connective tissues, just some swelling behind the kneecaps and Grade 2/3 wear on the cartilage.

It seems 90% of the success stories I hear from Prolozone, prolotherapy, PRP and the like, all relate to healing tissues. If the problem is isolated to the cartilage, I wonder if it helps.

Was that your experience?

Offline kneeslover

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Re: Healing chondromalacia with prolotherapy/PRP *only*
« Reply #3 on: March 27, 2014, 07:21:51 PM »
I can't answer that quite yet; i am going to see a new doctor about the new injury; but it did help stabilize from what it was beforehand. will report if i can answer in more detail when i can.

Offline diggz1

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Re: Healing chondromalacia with prolotherapy/PRP *only*
« Reply #4 on: April 01, 2014, 03:46:27 AM »
WTURRI78,
I am going thru the same as you..I had recently found out I have grade IV chondromalacia as well as constant medial knee pain in my right knee from the multiple injuries I have incurred. I also suspect I have chondromalacia in my left knee because of the constant pain as well as grinding I have in it... I received prolotherapy times over the course of 8 months about 3 years ago but I question the Dr very much who was administering it along with the fact my acl tear was misdiagnosed as only a partial tear when it was actually completely torn. Anyways I just received another round of prolo/PRP to both knees by Dr Dean Reeves in Kansas. He told my that cartilage cannot be regrown if you are already bone-on-bone so hopefully you arent to that stage yet..I read on some other posts of Irentat I believe who was injecting testosterone into the knee to help regrown cartilage..I am going to go for another round of PRP/prolo in about 6 weeks and if I dont see much improvement I am going to try and save for the HGH or testosterone injections.. I am curious how you respond with your treatment since it seemed we received it about the same time..I am going to stick with pool work for about 3 weeks before I try and lift weights again and hopefully they will have healed more by then as I have pushed my knees too many over the last 4-5 years to get myself back to playing sports and it has never ended well..
2009--Torn R acl, mcl, medial & lateral meniscus
June 2009-R knee Double partial meniscectomy
July 2012-R knee ACL recon. hamstring graft
Aug2013-R knee Grade IV Chondromalacia
L knee pain 3+ yrs

Offline wturri78

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Re: Healing chondromalacia with prolotherapy/PRP *only*
« Reply #5 on: April 02, 2014, 08:28:40 PM »
WTURRI78,
I am going thru the same as you..I had recently found out I have grade IV chondromalacia as well as constant medial knee pain in my right knee from the multiple injuries I have incurred. I also suspect I have chondromalacia in my left knee because of the constant pain as well as grinding I have in it... I received prolotherapy times over the course of 8 months about 3 years ago but I question the Dr very much who was administering it along with the fact my acl tear was misdiagnosed as only a partial tear when it was actually completely torn. Anyways I just received another round of prolo/PRP to both knees by Dr Dean Reeves in Kansas. He told my that cartilage cannot be regrown if you are already bone-on-bone so hopefully you arent to that stage yet..I read on some other posts of Irentat I believe who was injecting testosterone into the knee to help regrown cartilage..I am going to go for another round of PRP/prolo in about 6 weeks and if I dont see much improvement I am going to try and save for the HGH or testosterone injections.. I am curious how you respond with your treatment since it seemed we received it about the same time..I am going to stick with pool work for about 3 weeks before I try and lift weights again and hopefully they will have healed more by then as I have pushed my knees too many over the last 4-5 years to get myself back to playing sports and it has never ended well..

Thanks for the response! I have not had any tears or sprains in my ligaments or tendons. In fact, so far, the cartilage seems to be the only problem spot, although it hurts like a bear a few hours after jogging or riding a bike.

I had a radiologist actually sit down and walk me through my MRI images and show me what he saw. His impression differed slightly from the official report I first got, in that he doesn't think my cartilage defects are as severe as had been previously reported, and pointed out a few abnormal spots that could indicate a low-grade tendonosis.

I haven't had prolotherapy yet. What I did receive, 3 weeks ago, were shots of a homeopathic substance called "Traumeel" mixed with a very low dose of cortisone. That seemed to help some, but not enough.

I just had a second round of those injections this afternoon, only without cortisone. We will see whether the improvements continue.

If I don't improve, he does suggest beginning prolotherapy with dextrose. His opinion differs from many of the online articles, in that he doesn't inject the irritant into the joint, but only into the tendon around the knee. He uses the homeopathic anti-inflammatory behind the kneecap. Every doctor seems to have his or her own special twist on these procedures.

I haven't tried PRP.

Offline diggz1

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Re: Healing chondromalacia with prolotherapy/PRP *only*
« Reply #6 on: April 15, 2014, 02:45:00 AM »
It does seem like every doctor has a different method for prolotherapy...Have you tried acupuncture? I tried about 10 sessions of acupuncture with zero relief and this past weekend I tried an acupuncturist that my dad has used and it seemed to help some after just the one session...So thats maybe something to look into as well. It seems all acupuncturists are not created equal either as I had more relief from one session from her than I had for 10 from the other one...
2009--Torn R acl, mcl, medial & lateral meniscus
June 2009-R knee Double partial meniscectomy
July 2012-R knee ACL recon. hamstring graft
Aug2013-R knee Grade IV Chondromalacia
L knee pain 3+ yrs