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Author Topic: Knee cracking/popping after partial meniscus trim  (Read 55295 times)

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Offline thetruthh34

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Knee cracking/popping after partial meniscus trim
« on: September 06, 2011, 12:59:21 AM »
Hi its been about 2 weeks now since they removed almost half of my medial meniscus. all other parts in the knee are excellent.

My knee has started to pop and crack a lot since my surgery is this normal?

One more thing if the meniscus is the shock absorber for your knee during physical activity is it still ok to play sports such as basketball with only half of your medial meniscus?

Offline kscope09

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Re: Knee cracking/popping after partial meniscus trim
« Reply #1 on: September 06, 2011, 02:58:57 PM »
If you only had it two weeks ago then there will still be some fluid sloshing around in there and that could ahve something to do with it and also your quads will be farely week which can contribute.

As for sports, when you feel your up to it again go see a sports doc and get them to check you over and tell you if your ready or not and they will advise you on how to be careful so as not to damage it too  much thougfh it will eventually wear away whatevr you do.  Maybe spongey trainers/sneakers and goo arch support along with plenty of glucosamine with chondroitin and maybe a brace or sleeve to help reduce impact and provide some support.
Feb 08 Inurred right knee
18 months of physio, knee tracking but knee still painful
Aug 09 Scope - Small tear in acl, fragment found in postereo-lateral compartment, suprapatella and lateral plica and small defect in mfc.
May 10 Right knee feeling better but left knee causing trouble as a result o

Offline slyguy1

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Re: Knee cracking/popping after partial meniscus trim
« Reply #2 on: September 06, 2011, 03:09:13 PM »
yes that cracking is normal and eventually will go away upon further healing but as far as sports i would wait till you are fully healed.....maybe choose a sport that is less impact ......hate to say it since i used to run and can't anymore....thank god i can still walk even if i limp once in a while

Offline vickster

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Re: Knee cracking/popping after partial meniscus trim
« Reply #3 on: September 06, 2011, 03:13:29 PM »
Best talk to your OS and physio before return to sports - however, it is not unreasonable to expect that the knee will never be as it was before the injury and you may need to modify your choice of sport, footwear or use a brace.  But only the professionals involved in your surgery and rehab can truly advise.

Noises are quite normal at this stage, and usually nothing to worry about unless accompanied by significant pain

Good luck :)
Came off bike onto concrete 9/9/09
LK arthroscopy 8/2/10
2nd scope on 16/12/10
RK arthroscopy on 5/2/15
Lateral meniscus trim, excision of hoffa's fat pad, chondral stabilisation
LK scope 10.1.19 medial menisectomy, trochlea microfracture, general tidy up

Offline slyguy1

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Re: Knee cracking/popping after partial meniscus trim
« Reply #4 on: September 07, 2011, 01:33:43 AM »
Hey Vickster....can i ask you how your situation is? You never got mxf but might be getting osteotomy? What is your os saying these days?

Offline vickster

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Re: Knee cracking/popping after partial meniscus trim
« Reply #5 on: September 07, 2011, 08:40:58 AM »
Hi Slyguy,
Generally going pretty well actually - have the odd painful day, sometimes with a reason (e.g. walking around too much on uneven ground), sometimes not (can still get sore and stiff sat at work). 

Not seen OS since end Jan when had the post-scope follow up.  He basically said to see how it goes for 6 months, that was 8 months ago - his letter to my GP said he'd like to avoid the DF osteotomy for as long as possible (he's not the only one  :o).  I never had mfx as my defect naturally filled with fibrocartilage (which is the aim of mfx so would have been a little pointless).  I couldn't have the defect repaired with a MACI due to the knock knees and the kissing damage to the tibia. I am sure that the damage will probably get worse laterally given the dodgy alignment (never had scans etc but my physuiio definitely agrees that I am valgus aligned) and the missing bit of meniscus.  How long the fibro will hold up in the defect is also any body's guess but it was fine at the second scope.

I am cycling lots - about 50-100 miles a week (both transport and exercise), did complete a 40 mile ride a while back, legs were dead tired but knee was ok (well no worse than the other).  I can do 15 miles without any great concern - I can feel big hills through the knee but that's fine.

I cannot jog/run (but was never a runner anyhow), other than the cycling no other sport (I will probably go back to the gym when the weather turns nasty) and I cannot kneel comfortably (but have been told from very early on that this isn't surprising given the damage to the femur which is in a WB area, that connects to the ground when I kneel).

While I can do everything I want to do, especially cycle and am mostly painfree, I am not going near surgeons.  I am seeing a new PT every 6 weeks, just to monitor, he was very pleased with progress in the 1st 6 weeks, increase in flex due to cycling really and I try to have a stretch every evening.

So, after all the waffle above, it's all good for now :)
« Last Edit: September 07, 2011, 08:43:15 AM by Vickster »
Came off bike onto concrete 9/9/09
LK arthroscopy 8/2/10
2nd scope on 16/12/10
RK arthroscopy on 5/2/15
Lateral meniscus trim, excision of hoffa's fat pad, chondral stabilisation
LK scope 10.1.19 medial menisectomy, trochlea microfracture, general tidy up

Offline slyguy1

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Re: Knee cracking/popping after partial meniscus trim
« Reply #6 on: September 07, 2011, 06:02:11 PM »
Hey Vickster......thanks for that positive update.....feels good to hear that some are doing better without surgery which i wish i never had done. That's great that you can cycle....my only form of cardio since i cannot run but have grown to like at the gym while watching tv:) On occasion i'll do elliptical machine but can feel knee for a few days afterwards so i try not to do too much. Last week i tried to challenge knee by trying one legged wall sit.....i was fine and not in pain but next few days i was limping like a wounded soldier....felt better when i rested and went back to just biking. Are you going to a PT or do you do on own?

         There aren't too many out there with perfectly alligned knees....when i went to an os who does ACI he looked at me from a distance and flat out said i will have to break both knees....10 minutes and $150 dollars and i was out the door (thats with insurance)....never went back. I am guessing as long as your cartlige is good and you keep muscles around knee strong you can probably do a lot more as far as activity. I am over 5 years post-op now....just trying to hold onto what i have left (not much since they took out most of meniscus instead of repairing it) . I have accepted the fact that i will never run again but would like to kneel and bend without pain. I'll have to pray standing up and hope it will be accepted the same:) I am guessing you are in UK since you spoke of getting MACI.....they are not allowed to do that here in US yet...?? Thank you for sharing:)

Offline vickster

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Re: Knee cracking/popping after partial meniscus trim
« Reply #7 on: September 07, 2011, 08:39:43 PM »
I have managed to avoid the big open surgeries and the metalwork so far, but have had the two scopes - 1 was partial menisectomy of about 15% of the lateral meniscus (mine was irreparable in the end) plus chondroplasty to the grade III damage to the lateral patella; second (which was scheduled to be the cell harvest for the MACI, yes I am in the UK) ended up being a tidy up, wash out and a Durolane jab.  I am "lucky" that all my damage is lateral, the PFJ is now good (patella tidy up was successful) and the medial side is also good.  I doubt the menisectomy has helped the state of my lateral cartilage (extensive grade 1-2 on the tibia, plus the traumatic defect to the femur), but at the time of the first op (5 months post injury) the state of the lateral tibia was also commented upon, but I got the impression that it was worse at scope 2, 10 months later!

I am not particularly sporty or active - I cycle as I enjoy it, saves me gas money (although I am sure I spend more on bike kit), and it helps me control my weight (always a struggle) .  The gym is a poor substitute, dull as ditchwater but again, helps when the weather is too cold and wet for biking!

I didn't see a PT for around 6 months after the 2nd scope, but decided to get another opinion from a guy who is more sports oriented, now seeing him every 6 weeks for a check and a massage.  I sometimes do some wallslides and a few other exercises, but PT is basically biking for me (on road or static).  I cannot squat that deeply either, I just try not to drop stuff ;D

MACI is quite similar to ACI as I understand it - they definitely do that across the pond?  What is up with your knee other than the missing meniscus?

Came off bike onto concrete 9/9/09
LK arthroscopy 8/2/10
2nd scope on 16/12/10
RK arthroscopy on 5/2/15
Lateral meniscus trim, excision of hoffa's fat pad, chondral stabilisation
LK scope 10.1.19 medial menisectomy, trochlea microfracture, general tidy up

Offline slyguy1

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Re: Knee cracking/popping after partial meniscus trim
« Reply #8 on: September 08, 2011, 01:46:21 PM »
Hi Vickster........you are lucky being in the UK you have access to more advanced options. Can i ask what is a Durolane jab? I've learned so much from this site that knowing what i know now would have waited to have any surgery. My injury is running related.....the years of recreational running took its toll and i was getting pain going up and down stairs and i went in to see os and after mri was told that i have torn meniscus on both knees....was asked if i wanted surgery on both to get it over with (they are so quick to schedule surgery).....i'm so glad i opted to get it on my right knee (stronger one). I was supposed to have a scope and a "cleanup" on meniscus and would be walking home most likely. I woke up in a wheelchair and was told that damage was extensive and a mxf was done....i'm sure you've heard many stories like mine and have to say it was the worst experience of my life....was on crutches for 8 weeks! I did some research and found out that some damage to meniscus do heal on their own depending on location and blood supply to that area. I was told by os that there was damage to articular cartlige on lateral femoral condylite....lesion was about nickel size. The problem is i'm sure you are aware is most mxf surgeries fail and most go to next surgery.....ACI or MACI and the recuperation from those open surgeries can be over a year or longer depending on succes of surgery. I've read a few success stories and followed their blogs but the bottom line to even having knee scoped is that it guarantees arthritis will set in if not right away with time definitely. The other thing that i learned is that bone injuries take a long time to heal.....many out there are quick to go back to running or skiing and find out that after 6 months the surgery failed and they need ACI....another year of torture.

        Sorry i'm babling on here but the other issue is that i stand a lot at work so that did not help the healing process but what did help is taking in nutrients like fish oil, vit D,calcium+mag with the exercising. I don't know how long it's been since your accident but i think you are a good candidate to escape any further surgery by keeping the muscles around the injured area strong and do everything to aid the healing process. The weather here has been awful....raining for 3 days straight.....raw...chilly can feel it in that knee:) Hope the weather is better over there....cheers:)

Offline vickster

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Re: Knee cracking/popping after partial meniscus trim
« Reply #9 on: September 08, 2011, 08:34:59 PM »
Hi Slyguy
We do have access to these ops but only under very specific criteria and often only as part of a trial with limited numbers, at a limited number of centres and with long old wait times (when through the National Health Service).  I am lucky to have private health care through my employer but I had one heck of a fight with my insurers to agree to the MACI (that never happened) as it is not approved as still deemed experimental (hence the trial).  My first OS wanted to do an AMIC procedure (mfx with a membrane, very new, open surgery but only one operation unlike the MACI which is two), but my insurers simply wouldn't agree...so I was referred to a different OS able to do the MACI under the special services (all terribly complex eh).  The (M)ACI does have a mixed success, my function has always been fairly decent - since the meniscus was trimmed (made a massive difference, so nice to be able to straighten my leg now) - but it does seem for people with big pain and damage, it ca n buy time before replacement bits are needed.  Just not suitable for me, as it wouldn't work due to the kissing defects, hence the osteotomy possibly to offload the damaged bit.  I hope my fibrocartilage holds up for as long as possible, I assume I'll know if and when it fails  :-\  I guess I am lucky being one of the weirdos who build fibro in response to trauma so no mfx needed!

Running is certainly often horrid for knees, especially if there is any dodgy alignment.  It has never been my thing, cycling better, but ironically it was what seemed like a fairly innocuous 'off' that did for my knee with the meniscus tear and the osteochondral defect  ::)  The accident was actually 2 years ago tomorrow - happy birthday crappy knee  ;D  I cannot stand for long periods either, was at an away day today, sat all morning, standing all afternoon and my knee is grouchy  :-\  Until my function is seriously impaired and pain unmanageable and frequent, I am not having the DFO, such a major and drastic surgery.  My nagging concern is that by not doing it, the damage is continuing unchecked and once I do feel it is needed, I'll be past the point of no return and next stop a lateral PKR!  Problem is no OS can say how long the cartilage will hold up, so I guess I'll just have to wait and see and cross fingers and toes!

I did try some supplements, but I found the fish oil hard to swallow and the chondroitin/glucosamine made me nauseous!

Weather here has been nice today and good forecast tomorrow (will cycle to work) but rain over the weekend - just typical eh!  Take care, hope the weather holds up.

 I think you are in NJ, I spent some time working in Princeton a few years ago.  I work with pharma companies and lots of my US-based clients are Jersey-based :)
Came off bike onto concrete 9/9/09
LK arthroscopy 8/2/10
2nd scope on 16/12/10
RK arthroscopy on 5/2/15
Lateral meniscus trim, excision of hoffa's fat pad, chondral stabilisation
LK scope 10.1.19 medial menisectomy, trochlea microfracture, general tidy up

Offline thetruthh34

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Re: Knee cracking/popping after partial meniscus trim
« Reply #10 on: September 08, 2011, 10:22:34 PM »
Hi so its been about three weeks now since my surgery. The cracking/popping has stopped a bit but its still there. In addition the knee is still significantly swollen. It is very soft to the touch. Also the hamstring tendon on the medial side seems to be moving when walking. Its very weird.

I am doing physio therapy 3x a week, along with streching quads, and hamstrings.

Can someone advise me on what is going on?

Ps. my follow up appointment with the surgeon is still about a week away

thanks

Offline vickster

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Re: Knee cracking/popping after partial meniscus trim
« Reply #11 on: September 08, 2011, 10:25:03 PM »
Apologies to the OP, we seem to have wandered a little off topic

Hope your knee is feeling better as you get beyond the scope
Came off bike onto concrete 9/9/09
LK arthroscopy 8/2/10
2nd scope on 16/12/10
RK arthroscopy on 5/2/15
Lateral meniscus trim, excision of hoffa's fat pad, chondral stabilisation
LK scope 10.1.19 medial menisectomy, trochlea microfracture, general tidy up

Offline vickster

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Re: Knee cracking/popping after partial meniscus trim
« Reply #12 on: September 08, 2011, 10:29:26 PM »
What does your physio think as the expert?

I presume you are icing and taking anti-inflammatory drugs for the swelling as well as elevating the knee above the heart when resting?

3 weeks is still soon for swelling after the op...my knee is still puffy 2 years post injury (I reckon it always will be  ::) )
Came off bike onto concrete 9/9/09
LK arthroscopy 8/2/10
2nd scope on 16/12/10
RK arthroscopy on 5/2/15
Lateral meniscus trim, excision of hoffa's fat pad, chondral stabilisation
LK scope 10.1.19 medial menisectomy, trochlea microfracture, general tidy up