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Author Topic: PRP injections are regenerating my knee cartilage & ligaments  (Read 254415 times)

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Offline irentat

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Re: PRP injections are regenerating my knee cartilage & ligaments
« Reply #30 on: April 01, 2009, 02:51:24 PM »
Well I had my first PRP injection in my left ankle yesterday, ;D Mon. March 30th 2009.  And I have to say the injection was Extremely painful.  After the injection I was not able to walk on it for an hour and I just hung out in my OS's office until I felt I could make it out to my car.  I was able to walk on the ankle later that night, but it is a little sore today as well.  Otherwise I feel great, listen if its gonna help me walk again like a normal human being, the pain of the injection is a non-issue for me.  I am very excited to say the least, and I hope it will help me.  If it does, Im going to go back and do my right ankle and both my knees.  I was also very happy because my insurance is covering the shots, they said I can have as many shots as I like as long as it's one shot per day.  My OS says all I will need is probably 2 shots, anything more is overkill. I asked him about the HGH injections and he said that he never heard anything about it in regards to healing cartilage.  So im going to do some more research on it before I proceed with it, whether its through him or on my own.  Anyway I will keep you all posted on my recovery, Thanks,
Chad-
Chad,

Did your doctor not adjust the pH?  This has to be done or you will get the pain results you did.   Tell your doctor to contact the centrifuge manufacturer and suggest the type and dosage of pH adjustment.  I think my doctor uses less than 1/4 cc of sodium bicarbonate in my 3 cc's.

Personally I don't feel your OS is correct with only 2 shots but try it and start doing the other joints.  Also, you are correct on the number of shots.  Remember, they are your platelets. 

Regarding the HGH look into "intra-articular HGH".  Take the data and show the doctor if you are interested.

Also, GET TO THE BOTTOM OF YOUR OA!!!!!

Offline C Broder

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Re: PRP injections are regenerating my knee cartilage & ligaments
« Reply #31 on: April 01, 2009, 06:47:17 PM »
Well I had my first PRP injection in my left ankle yesterday, ;D Mon. March 30th 2009.  And I have to say the injection was Extremely painful.  After the injection I was not able to walk on it for an hour and I just hung out in my OS's office until I felt I could make it out to my car.  I was able to walk on the ankle later that night, but it is a little sore today as well.  Otherwise I feel great, listen if its gonna help me walk again like a normal human being, the pain of the injection is a non-issue for me.  I am very excited to say the least, and I hope it will help me.  If it does, Im going to go back and do my right ankle and both my knees.  I was also very happy because my insurance is covering the shots, they said I can have as many shots as I like as long as it's one shot per day.  My OS says all I will need is probably 2 shots, anything more is overkill. I asked him about the HGH injections and he said that he never heard anything about it in regards to healing cartilage.  So im going to do some more research on it before I proceed with it, whether its through him or on my own.  Anyway I will keep you all posted on my recovery, Thanks,
Chad-
Chad,

Did your doctor not adjust the pH?  This has to be done or you will get the pain results you did.   Tell your doctor to contact the centrifuge manufacturer and suggest the type and dosage of pH adjustment.  I think my doctor uses less than 1/4 cc of sodium bicarbonate in my 3 cc's.

Personally I don't feel your OS is correct with only 2 shots but try it and start doing the other joints.  Also, you are correct on the number of shots.  Remember, they are your platelets. 

Regarding the HGH look into "intra-articular HGH".  Take the data and show the doctor if you are interested.

Also, GET TO THE BOTTOM OF YOUR OA!!!!!

Honestly I dont know if he adjusted the pH??  This is all very new to me.  I watched very closely what he was doing and I do not remember him adding anything to the platelets.  I just started researching PRP in Feb. after I heard about Hines Ward getting the injections during the Superbowl.  I am going to ask him about the pH though the next time I see him.  Thank you for your reply.  Also my ankle is feeling a little better today, Wed. April 1st, last night my right ankle was bothering me because I have been putting all my weight on it trying to keep pressure off of my left ankle...lol  As soon as my left ankly feels better Im gonna go in for a shot in my right ankle.  Probably in 2 weeks time.  Thanks,
Chad-

 

Offline C Broder

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Re: PRP injections are regenerating my knee cartilage & ligaments
« Reply #32 on: April 01, 2009, 07:21:46 PM »
In one visit, for my right knee joint,  I had 1 shot of PRP, about 4cc worth. as well as 20-30 shots of prolotheray all around the joint (a fish extract of sodium mohrrite ? not sure of the spelling).

The swelling was likely caused by the prolotherapy. I can't comment if the PRP caused some of the swelling too as all the shots were administered during the same visit to the doc.

Normally i think the nurses withdraw about 20cc's worth of blood to be centrifuged if you only do 1 PRP injection, and about 50-60 cc's if you need 2 PRP injections.

My pain is gone, and most importantly, my stability is WAY better than before. But the Crunching is still there. So the question for me is.....should i go with  PRP or HGH on my next visit ? After 6 visits and 6 shots of PRP, as I mentioned my ligaments are way improved, but I still have crunching that is very bothersome, and others have told me that HGH is more documented for healing cartilage. Thus my decision to convert over to HGH on my next visit.

Another big question I have is, does the healing continue over the next 3-6 months ? No one really seems to know. Although it was suggested to me that the ligaments and tendons admnistered with PRP will continue to heal over an ensuing 3 months.

OK, now that makes sense.  I have had both the fish oil and dextrose prolotherapy done on my ligaments and both cause the pain and swelling.  My Prolotherapist does either modality with B-12 added in to increase the healing speed.  Further, he has also tried Zinc with the dextrose. Zinc and the fish oil he said would not work.  DAMN that zinc hurts for 24 hours but it heals even faster. 

From all my research on prolotherapy in the ligaments, the healing does continue for many months after the shots stop.  Specifically, with dextrose, it is an osmotic agent that explodes the surrounding cells and forces the body to come in and rebuild the ligaments to their correct alignment.  From the time I have gotten them in November, I have had this nagging "sprain" feeling in my ankle ligaments from this procedure.  I look forward to the day that it goes away  but I think I have at least 2 more cycles to go.  I understand my ligaments were pretty screwed up.  They had to be to let my ankle move so much to lose all of my cartilage.

Regarding HGH, I would definitely go for it.  As you stated not only has it been documented but I have personally seen the cartilage reappear through the x-rays taken monthly over a period of 5 months since I started the injections.  At 5 months I was over 3 MM growth in all areas except one area I was only at 3 MM with normal being 4 MM or so.  This was from a starting point of 0 MM cartilage since I had surgery to remove the dead bone.  Dr. Dunn did this to give the cartilage a solid place to rebuild.  You don't sound NEARLY as far off as I and absolutely won't need the surgery part.  You will do great. 

Of course, the best thing to do would be offloading the knee but that is not realistic and so just realize you will need to go in for a few more shots than someone who was off of their knee for a period of a month or more.  That new cartilage is fragile and crushes easily.

Ben,
Do you know what type of HGH you were given?  Do you know if it was Jintropin or Somatropin?  These are the only two types that I really know about.  Thanks.

Offline arkitect06

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Re: PRP injections are regenerating my knee cartilage & ligaments
« Reply #33 on: April 01, 2009, 07:25:09 PM »
Change of plans....my first PRP is tomorrow morning! 

Farrah
11/16/10 Fulkerson TTT, chondroplasty, LR (Left Knee)
11/17/09 SCS re-implant
7/29/09 I&D
5/7/09 SCS removal b/c of MRSA
12/15/08 & 2/6/09 SCS Revision
10/30/08 Spinal Cord Stimulator Implantation
6/27/08 diagnosed with RSD
1/8/08 Fulkerson TTT, chondroplasty, LR (Right Knee)

Offline Shine

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Re: PRP injections are regenerating my knee cartilage & ligaments
« Reply #34 on: April 01, 2009, 09:03:07 PM »
Hi Farrah,

Good 4 u! I hope it helps. My third injection that I got 2 wks ago is already helping more. Good luck! summer

Offline C Broder

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Re: PRP injections are regenerating my knee cartilage & ligaments
« Reply #35 on: April 01, 2009, 09:58:57 PM »
Change of plans....my first PRP is tomorrow morning! 

Farrah

Good Luck hope it helps you.

Offline irentat

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Re: PRP injections are regenerating my knee cartilage & ligaments
« Reply #36 on: April 02, 2009, 05:49:01 AM »
Quote
Ben,
Do you know what type of HGH you were given?  Do you know if it was Jintropin or Somatropin?  These are the only two types that I really know about.  Thanks.
Quote

Dr. Dunn uses Omitrope...I honestly feel because it is cheaper and he must get the same results since he has done hundreds of joints.  My Prolotherapist in Phoenix would not use anything other than Humatrope because it is American made by Eli Lilly.  He was very specific that you don't want to chance putting anything but the purest into the joint. Both worked so I cannot argue one against the other.  Humatrope is a good 20% more in cost and it's not cheap stuff to begin with.  Further, people don't realize the amount Dr. Dunn puts in the joint.  It's way more than you think.

Ben
« Last Edit: April 02, 2009, 05:50:39 AM by irentat »

Offline arkitect06

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Re: PRP injections are regenerating my knee cartilage & ligaments
« Reply #37 on: April 04, 2009, 12:23:33 AM »
Hi, Since I have been posting here, I felt that I should give a short update.  As I have stated before, I have an infection from a previous back surgery back in February.  Well yesterday was suppose to be my first PRP, but the PICC line (type of IV) insertion took longer than originally thought and I had to reschedule the PRP for Monday.  So Monday is finally the day...nothing will cancel it this time! 

Farrah
11/16/10 Fulkerson TTT, chondroplasty, LR (Left Knee)
11/17/09 SCS re-implant
7/29/09 I&D
5/7/09 SCS removal b/c of MRSA
12/15/08 & 2/6/09 SCS Revision
10/30/08 Spinal Cord Stimulator Implantation
6/27/08 diagnosed with RSD
1/8/08 Fulkerson TTT, chondroplasty, LR (Right Knee)

Offline arkitect06

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Re: PRP injections are regenerating my knee cartilage & ligaments
« Reply #38 on: April 06, 2009, 07:31:09 AM »
My PRP is finally here!!!  It's scheduled for 2pm Eastern USA time!

Farrah
11/16/10 Fulkerson TTT, chondroplasty, LR (Left Knee)
11/17/09 SCS re-implant
7/29/09 I&D
5/7/09 SCS removal b/c of MRSA
12/15/08 & 2/6/09 SCS Revision
10/30/08 Spinal Cord Stimulator Implantation
6/27/08 diagnosed with RSD
1/8/08 Fulkerson TTT, chondroplasty, LR (Right Knee)

Offline arkitect06

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Re: PRP injections are regenerating my knee cartilage & ligaments
« Reply #39 on: April 06, 2009, 09:38:09 PM »
Succussful PRP procedure.  I have been home for about 15 minutes and left the doctors office about an hour ago.  I am already getting a lot of soreness as the lidocaine wears off!  I was told to rest, ice, and take pain meds as needed.  My OS said it may take up to 5-6 days for most of the soreness to go away.  I am using my crutches for the worst of it.  Thanks for all the advice everyone!  The doctor gave me a great chance of having 70% of my pain go away....said it may take 10days-4weeks.  I don't have a formal appt with him for another 6 weeks.  I will see him around at physical therapy though...I start that next Wednesday for once a week. 

Farrah
11/16/10 Fulkerson TTT, chondroplasty, LR (Left Knee)
11/17/09 SCS re-implant
7/29/09 I&D
5/7/09 SCS removal b/c of MRSA
12/15/08 & 2/6/09 SCS Revision
10/30/08 Spinal Cord Stimulator Implantation
6/27/08 diagnosed with RSD
1/8/08 Fulkerson TTT, chondroplasty, LR (Right Knee)

Offline Shine

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Re: PRP injections are regenerating my knee cartilage & ligaments
« Reply #40 on: April 07, 2009, 07:11:21 AM »
Hi Farrah,
Glad it went well. I have been told by the Dr. not to ice cause it decreases the inflammation and thats what you want with this shot, to stimulate healing. The pain continues to get even better after 4 weeks especially if you get another shot at week 6. The more you get the longer it seems to heal for. Of course, if you are healed with just this one shot than no shot would be necessary. Hows the pain? -Summer

Offline arkitect06

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Re: PRP injections are regenerating my knee cartilage & ligaments
« Reply #41 on: April 07, 2009, 01:50:59 PM »
Hi Summer, I guess that's where doctors are different in their ideas.  They told me to not take any NSAID meds, but I could ice.  The soreness right now is very tolerable.  The entire time it has been tolerable.  I was prepared for much worse.  I guess it helps that I have percoset for my pain medication!  Today is less sore than last night and I am actually using my leg more today.  Yesterday I didn't want to use my leg b/c it hurt a lot around the tendon.  My OS told me to rest for a few days, so I will be doing just that except for other MD appts. 

Farrah
11/16/10 Fulkerson TTT, chondroplasty, LR (Left Knee)
11/17/09 SCS re-implant
7/29/09 I&D
5/7/09 SCS removal b/c of MRSA
12/15/08 & 2/6/09 SCS Revision
10/30/08 Spinal Cord Stimulator Implantation
6/27/08 diagnosed with RSD
1/8/08 Fulkerson TTT, chondroplasty, LR (Right Knee)

Offline gb

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Re: PRP injections are regenerating my knee cartilage & ligaments
« Reply #42 on: April 07, 2009, 07:16:11 PM »
Farrah - I'm glad to see that you're giving PRP a shot. No pun intended :)

Bear in mind that based on the research I have done on PRP injections, the placement of the injection is just as crucial, if not, more important than the frequency of injections. And so it is critical that you wisely choose an MD with the best possible track record for performing PRP and Prolotherapy. I know time and money play a role in determining the specialist, i'm just pointing this out in case you don't see immediate results / pain relief.

I personally did experience immediate pain relief (immediate meaning 2 weeks following the first series of injections), but my doctor injected me in 20 different spots around my knee with prolotherapy and 1 injection of ~ 4 cc of PRP. I am only speaking to knee injections here. not any other joint.

I have read-up on stories where a patient received prolotherapy and prp injections with  no positive effect, and it was because the injections were administered in the wrong part of the knee, injecting only where the patient thought the pain ws coming from. This is why my doctor injects 20-30 prolotherapy shots around the entire knee, to ensure that he treats the whole knee joint, and he doesn't miss. This greatly increases the odds of properly treating your knee and not wasting your time and money.

Keep us posted on your progress.

gb

Offline irentat

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Re: PRP injections are regenerating my knee cartilage & ligaments
« Reply #43 on: April 07, 2009, 07:44:45 PM »
Hi Summer, I guess that's where doctors are different in their ideas.  They told me to not take any NSAID meds, but I could ice.  The soreness right now is very tolerable.  The entire time it has been tolerable.  I was prepared for much worse.  I guess it helps that I have percoset for my pain medication!  Today is less sore than last night and I am actually using my leg more today.  Yesterday I didn't want to use my leg b/c it hurt a lot around the tendon.  My OS told me to rest for a few days, so I will be doing just that except for other MD appts. 

Farrah

I will reiterate that your pain and swelling is a required healing that the body must go through.  I would not ice. 

Offline gb

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Re: PRP injections are regenerating my knee cartilage & ligaments
« Reply #44 on: April 07, 2009, 07:59:29 PM »
I'll third that. No ice.

My doctor occasionally places a heating pad right after my shots.

gb