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Author Topic: Cheap mri? Need to go private but consultants are expensive!!  (Read 8929 times)

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Offline Roberts

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Hi everyone, I have decided to get an mri done in London before I go and see a consultant about my knee. I was wondering if anyone could recommend a place to me that is good and cheap!
I still can't decide which ortho consultant to go and see, if only there was a way of telling who is good, how confusing.
9/05 Tore calf muscle, wouldn't heal, led to bad limping, led to painful opposite hip, weakened hip, led to weakened quads
7/07 Quad tendonitis, knee pain and swelling after 1 legged squats
6/10 Arthroscopy! Smooved cartilage, now have LOTS of strengthening to do

Offline tanyap

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Re: Cheap mri? Need to go private but consultants are expensive!!
« Reply #1 on: May 09, 2008, 03:32:58 PM »
Hi roberts,
apologies if you have mentioned the reason elsewhere and i havent seen it but why would you go for an mri before going to see an OS? Is that not a bit like putting the cart before the horse? How do you know you need an mri? some OSs wont accept mri's that are not from 'recognised' places that they would refer you to so you could end up with a useless radiology report from it?
Would it not make more sense to see an OS first then take it from there?
Tanya
1986 - recurrent dislocations of right patella began
1988 - Modified Hauser Procedure
1991 - dislocations started again
2005 to 2007 - 150 dislocations in 2 years - OUCH!!!
June 2007 - new OS, new physio
Oct 2007 - VMO woke up
Mar 2008 - big quads, still dislocating
Apr 2008 - next OS app

Offline Roberts

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Re: Cheap mri? Need to go private but consultants are expensive!!
« Reply #2 on: May 09, 2008, 06:58:56 PM »
Hi Tanyap I thought someone might ask that!
I've rung a few consultants and they said that they generally tend to send you for an mri and one secretary said I could get an cheap mri somewhere else in London, I guess I've now assumed that I could do this for any consultant. I haven't actually decided which consultant to see as there are so many choices and I'm confused.
My reason for wanting an mri is because I have had a knee problem since july 05, I have had physio on the nhs for 6 months and made no progress, any strengthening exercises makes my leg swell and leaves me with a limp so I unable to progress. I get a sharp pain when I try to go up or downstairs or squat, I am now struggling on slopes and any walking for longer than 5 minutes on the flat makes my knee get stiff and hurt and swell if I try to persevere.
Basically my daily life is very limited and involves a lot of resting.
I have just been to my gp to get a referral for an mri and he said that I'm wasting my time and that there is nothing I can do, but its not possible to carry on living like this and my other knee is getting sore now.
Oh and I saw an OS on the nhs in March and he said it was just chondromalacia and to carry on struggling with physio but I can't carry on doing something that puts me in more pain and surely there must be something else that can be done?!? I can't understand there are other people in my situation are just accepting that they can't do anything anymore, there must be something else I can do.
9/05 Tore calf muscle, wouldn't heal, led to bad limping, led to painful opposite hip, weakened hip, led to weakened quads
7/07 Quad tendonitis, knee pain and swelling after 1 legged squats
6/10 Arthroscopy! Smooved cartilage, now have LOTS of strengthening to do

Offline Silkncardcrafts

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Re: Cheap mri? Need to go private but consultants are expensive!!
« Reply #3 on: May 11, 2008, 08:34:42 AM »
Hi there,

I think you are wasting your time getting a MRI before seeing an OS.

Rather than see an OS first I would go and see a good sports physician/doctor. There is a great sports medicine clinic in London called Pure Sports Medicine. I was a patient there for a couple of years when I lived in London and were great. If you need to see an OS they will refer you onto someone good. Their web site is www.puresportsmed.com

If you have patella problems a MRI is a total waste of time. CT scans and plain x-rays are the best for showing patella problems.

My advice would be to go and see a sports physician/doctor rather than wasting your time with your GP. Most GPs have no idea about joint problems.

Good luck !!!  :D
11/1996 - RK LR
07/1997 - LK LR
11/1998 - LK MPFL Reco
12/2005 - RK LR Repair
07/2006 - LK MPFL Repair
11/2006 - LK LR Repair
22/05/08 - LK Trochleoplasty
11/02/10 - RK Trochleoplasty
07/03/11 - RK Chrondroplasty

Offline Roberts

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Re: Cheap mri? Need to go private but consultants are expensive!!
« Reply #4 on: May 11, 2008, 08:37:56 PM »
Hi Kjwilkin, ok I'm not getting an mri 1st, I was just going to go and see a good OS but now you recommend the sports medicine clinic I think you may be wise in saying I should go there 1st. I have seen a few physios in my area (sussex) and all of them can't help me so I had been wanting to see someone with more expertise in knees and thought that an OS was the next best to see.
Thanks for telling me I have another option, its so hard to find people out there that can advise what to do next so your help is much appreciated. :)
I think I will ring them tomorrow!
9/05 Tore calf muscle, wouldn't heal, led to bad limping, led to painful opposite hip, weakened hip, led to weakened quads
7/07 Quad tendonitis, knee pain and swelling after 1 legged squats
6/10 Arthroscopy! Smooved cartilage, now have LOTS of strengthening to do

Offline tanyap

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Re: Cheap mri? Need to go private but consultants are expensive!!
« Reply #5 on: May 12, 2008, 09:29:36 AM »
Hi,
ok - your GP says nothing can be done??? That is pure $%"!! Your GP is not a knee expert, Im sure there is plenty can be done if you find the right person!
Ive struggled with physio for 3 years now and my muscles are great! but Im still suffering knee problems and my new OS has told me that physio isnt the answer for me! While the last guy kept insisting it was the only answer. So a new opinion is important. You dont have to be a genius to know that if you have persevered with physio for an extended period of time and it hasnt worked then its time to try something new.

Kirsty gives good advice there,dont bother paying out for an MRI unless you know you have to. And a sports physician will know best who to send you onto or whats the best way to proceed.

One very important thing is this: DONT GIVE UP!!!!!!!!!!! You may have to search for someone to help you but someone is out there who knows how best to proceed.

Dont be surprised if you have a lot of muscle atropy that you will be sent back to physio for a while, but you may need more specialised physio that doesnt aggravate the problem, and perhaps e-stim - but generally they will want to see muscle before accurately diagnosing the underlying problem. Lack of muscle itself causes problems - I was at a point with pain where I just didnt use my leg at all, I actually dont know how I managed to get about (mostly I didnt) and i honestly punished myself everyday with physio and no joy, then I got sent to a new physio who tackled me with different exercises and would not allow me to move forward til Id mastered the previous exercise. 8 months later Id a full leg of muscle and lots of my earlier problems were cured, no pain now, no swelling, no stiffness anymore. All that remains is the original problem - which is instability. And as a result of all that a new OS was able to better guage whats going on cos it wasnt being clouded with the issues that had come from muscle atrophy.

So go to the London Sports Medicine place - and see what you get advised there - and come back and tell us!!!
Tanya
1986 - recurrent dislocations of right patella began
1988 - Modified Hauser Procedure
1991 - dislocations started again
2005 to 2007 - 150 dislocations in 2 years - OUCH!!!
June 2007 - new OS, new physio
Oct 2007 - VMO woke up
Mar 2008 - big quads, still dislocating
Apr 2008 - next OS app

Offline Silkncardcrafts

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Re: Cheap mri? Need to go private but consultants are expensive!!
« Reply #6 on: May 12, 2008, 11:13:40 AM »
Hi there,

Totally agree with Tanya. A GP is not an expert and there will be someone out there that can help you with your knee that specialises in that area. So, if you go to Pure Sports Medicine they will be able to point you in the right direction.

I also agree with Tanya re physio. It is important to go to a physio that specialises in knees. When I was in London I was supposedly going to a top physio who had no idea on my knee problems. Think I knew more than she did. That was until I went to Pure Sports Medicine and was referred to a better physio.

Good luck. Let us know how you go.  :)
11/1996 - RK LR
07/1997 - LK LR
11/1998 - LK MPFL Reco
12/2005 - RK LR Repair
07/2006 - LK MPFL Repair
11/2006 - LK LR Repair
22/05/08 - LK Trochleoplasty
11/02/10 - RK Trochleoplasty
07/03/11 - RK Chrondroplasty

Offline Roberts

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Re: Cheap mri? Need to go private but consultants are expensive!!
« Reply #7 on: May 16, 2008, 12:59:46 PM »
Hi, I made an appointment and had it yesterday! I saw a sports dr who gave me a much more thorough examination of my knee and asked me lots of questions, this for a start made me trust his judgement. He decided that the ligaments and something else were ok and that my big problem is the fact that my glutes are extremely weak after a problem I had for over a year of limping (calf tear). This weakness has caused my knee to turn inwards and make the knee cap tracking bad. The sharp pain I keep getting is the patella hitting the bone underneath and squishing a nerve - thats my understanding anyway!!
Then this mal tracking is causing swelling which stops the vmo from strengthening and its wasting away away. Which is making the tracking worse cos the vmo is meant to pull the patella back into alignment.
So initial problem to sort is to strengthen my glute med to help tracking of patella.
Also to strengthen vmo, only way to do this is to stop swelling from switching off vmo, so the sports dr did a cortisone injection into the vmo attachment to the knee cap as he said this was inflamed. This should help me to strengthen the vmo. Only scary thing is that he said for the next 10 days it will weaken the muscle so I have to be careful not to tear it otherwise I'm in big trouble. For the 1st 10 days I have to do straight leg raises and then I can start doing squats, now I haven't managed to do squats for the past 9 months so I am doubtful that I will make this much progress but we will see what happens.
He is going to write a letter to my gp and tell my nhs physio what I should be doing, hopefully I will get a letter of this too. I am quite tempted to go back to london to see their physios as my nhs physio was the person who mis-guided me in my rehab and started off this knee problem!!

Tanyap if physio isn't the answer for you, what is? And why?

Also he said that the vmo muscle possibly had micro tears in its attachment to the knee cap and thats why I was getting localised swelling there.
And my left knee cap (bad one) moved further to the outside of my leg compared to my right knee cap and this meant that the muscles were tighter on my left hand side of my left leg, adding to the problem.

So thats my summary of my apppointment, not sure how much of what I've said is correct but its as much as Ive understaood to be happening. I'm still a bit confused but hope that I can manage to progress with some strengthening exercises soon.
9/05 Tore calf muscle, wouldn't heal, led to bad limping, led to painful opposite hip, weakened hip, led to weakened quads
7/07 Quad tendonitis, knee pain and swelling after 1 legged squats
6/10 Arthroscopy! Smooved cartilage, now have LOTS of strengthening to do

Offline tanyap

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Re: Cheap mri? Need to go private but consultants are expensive!!
« Reply #8 on: May 16, 2008, 01:10:02 PM »
wow!! A thorough diagnosis of the problem eh???
thats fermoral anteversion with the knee turning inwards isnt it? there are specific glute exercises you can do to help that - lie on your side and lift your bad leg up (like doing a scissors on your side) progress to weights, and lying on your front lifting your bad leg up behind you, knee locked straight.
It doesnt take long for the glutes to come back - especially if they dont have any damage to them.

to answer your question, i seem to have an underlying issue that almost 3 years of physio has not resolved, ive big quads, and a strong vmo now, my current OS is scoping me next week - my knee is subluxing no matter how much muscle I have - may be meniscus - the scope will tell me more.

im very happy for you that physio should be the answer - we want to avoid being cut open as much as possible!!! im all in favour of conservative treatment - be prepared to give it a good go - 6-8 months at least before wondering if its really working!
tanya
1986 - recurrent dislocations of right patella began
1988 - Modified Hauser Procedure
1991 - dislocations started again
2005 to 2007 - 150 dislocations in 2 years - OUCH!!!
June 2007 - new OS, new physio
Oct 2007 - VMO woke up
Mar 2008 - big quads, still dislocating
Apr 2008 - next OS app

Offline Silkncardcrafts

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Re: Cheap mri? Need to go private but consultants are expensive!!
« Reply #9 on: May 17, 2008, 02:06:25 PM »
That's great news !!! You may want to consider going back to London for physio or get a referral to someone privately in your area that knows what they are doing. It can make all the difference.

Let us know how you go !!!  :)
11/1996 - RK LR
07/1997 - LK LR
11/1998 - LK MPFL Reco
12/2005 - RK LR Repair
07/2006 - LK MPFL Repair
11/2006 - LK LR Repair
22/05/08 - LK Trochleoplasty
11/02/10 - RK Trochleoplasty
07/03/11 - RK Chrondroplasty

Offline Roberts

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Re: Cheap mri? Need to go private but consultants are expensive!!
« Reply #10 on: May 19, 2008, 08:46:31 PM »
Don't know about femoral anteversion, it was just slight whatever it is anyway. Sideways scissors sound like a must!
That sounds frustrating if you have managed to build up your quad muscles but your knee is still subluxing.
I tried 2 lots of 10 straight leg raises yesterday and within hours my vmo muscle was really sore and it still hurts to walk today so I'm a little confused as the sports dr said I should be doing 3 lots of 10 every day  ???
9/05 Tore calf muscle, wouldn't heal, led to bad limping, led to painful opposite hip, weakened hip, led to weakened quads
7/07 Quad tendonitis, knee pain and swelling after 1 legged squats
6/10 Arthroscopy! Smooved cartilage, now have LOTS of strengthening to do

Offline tanyap

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Re: Cheap mri? Need to go private but consultants are expensive!!
« Reply #11 on: May 20, 2008, 09:38:02 AM »
hey,
relax - you cant be expected to go from naught to 3x10 daily immediately!!! Do 3 sets of 6 daily, and then in a week go to 3 sets of 8 and in another week go for the 3 sets of 10. Or else drop whatever weights you are using (if you are) to a more comfortable level.
Absolutely FANTASTIC news that you can feel it in your VMO though - my problem for a couple of years was that my VMO was switched off and I could never feel it!!!

When they tell you what you should be doing they forget to say 'build up to.....whatever' - you'll only damage yourself overdoing things too soon.

If you turn your foot out by 10 degrees (ONLY), while doing the leg raises you will maximise engagement of the VMO
tanya
1986 - recurrent dislocations of right patella began
1988 - Modified Hauser Procedure
1991 - dislocations started again
2005 to 2007 - 150 dislocations in 2 years - OUCH!!!
June 2007 - new OS, new physio
Oct 2007 - VMO woke up
Mar 2008 - big quads, still dislocating
Apr 2008 - next OS app

Offline Silkncardcrafts

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Re: Cheap mri? Need to go private but consultants are expensive!!
« Reply #12 on: May 20, 2008, 11:11:27 AM »
Hi there,

I totally agree with Tanya. You can't expect to do 3 full sets of 10 in one go. Just take it slowly.

Like Tanya I have tried to build my quads up as much as I can, but still have problems with instability. I am due to have surgery on Thursday. Unfortunately I have lateral and medial instability, which is hard to fix. Hoping the trochleoplasty will be the answer. Can't believe it will be happening on Thursday.

Good luck !!!  :D
11/1996 - RK LR
07/1997 - LK LR
11/1998 - LK MPFL Reco
12/2005 - RK LR Repair
07/2006 - LK MPFL Repair
11/2006 - LK LR Repair
22/05/08 - LK Trochleoplasty
11/02/10 - RK Trochleoplasty
07/03/11 - RK Chrondroplasty

Offline Roberts

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Re: Cheap mri? Need to go private but consultants are expensive!!
« Reply #13 on: May 20, 2008, 02:58:52 PM »
I wish they would make this more clear! There I am thinking I must be able to do 3x10 as thats what he said, I've probably caused more damage! Ok a definite reduction is required, thanks for your help again  :) Oh and I tried turning my foot out as he told me to do that too and it gave me a sharp pain at the muscle attachment - I guess this is a sign that my muscle is very weak and unhappy! And I use no weight, I'm way to weak for that. and I turned it out by more than 10 degrees, maybe an error too.

Also the sports dr has sent a letter through now detailing my condition. It seems to be that he is treating quadriceps tendinopathy with the injection so I have 2 problems to sort, oh dear. It was a great letter though, started with 'this pleasant 28 year old keen footballer came to see me' what a flatterer  ;D.


kjwilkin I hope the surgery goes well, sounds scary!
9/05 Tore calf muscle, wouldn't heal, led to bad limping, led to painful opposite hip, weakened hip, led to weakened quads
7/07 Quad tendonitis, knee pain and swelling after 1 legged squats
6/10 Arthroscopy! Smooved cartilage, now have LOTS of strengthening to do

Offline tanyap

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Re: Cheap mri? Need to go private but consultants are expensive!!
« Reply #14 on: May 20, 2008, 03:16:10 PM »
ok - so no weights, foot turned out by 10 degrees only....

lift, hold for count of 1 hippopotomous, 2 hippopotomous, 3 hippopotomous, 4 hippopotomous, 5 hippopotomous, gently down and gently release (god its like listening to my phsyio!!!)...

Do that maybe 3 sets of 4 a day to start? Dont worry a bit about being weak - thats the point of doing the physio!!
You'll be surprised at how quick you catch up. its all about slow, steady progress, once you can manage 10 reps 3 times a day aim for 15 reps 3 times a day, then start adding weights (low to begin, 1 kilo).
1986 - recurrent dislocations of right patella began
1988 - Modified Hauser Procedure
1991 - dislocations started again
2005 to 2007 - 150 dislocations in 2 years - OUCH!!!
June 2007 - new OS, new physio
Oct 2007 - VMO woke up
Mar 2008 - big quads, still dislocating
Apr 2008 - next OS app















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