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Author Topic: Running and Osteoarthritis  (Read 80566 times)

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Offline Mike_A

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Re: Running and Osteoarthritis
« Reply #30 on: February 27, 2010, 12:53:03 AM »
Really enjoyed your post Lottie... I'm gonna pickup a stationary bike this weekend hopefully and start with 25 or so minutes of that every morning.  I don't have a gym membership right now but I'm doing some wall squats, single legged stiff deadlifts (bodyweight), and calve raises now for my legs... any other ideas for some exercises that I can do at home or does that sound about right?  Thanks.

Offline Lottiefox

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Re: Running and Osteoarthritis
« Reply #31 on: February 28, 2010, 10:49:06 PM »
Hi Mike

Has the swelling gone down a bit and the knees improved without the morning run?!

I think you've got some good ideas for working the lower body. I know I find the indoor bike quite useful but I have to make sure I work both legs equally as my left knee is in a worse state than the right and if I fail to concentrate I end up letting the left one get pulled around rather than actively working it. I'm sure you do it already but make sure on things like wall squats that you've got good lower body alignment - feet, ankles, knees, hips etc aligned and no additonal stress through the knee joint. Personally wall squats hurt my knees but I have very specific lateral patella damage and the squat upwards motion just crunches them too much.

You could add in some exercises that work the glutes as well, something like the bridge done on both legs and then single legs really works the butt and in turn helps support the knees. Hip extensions are also good so long as you can kneel on the knee without causing pain (avoid this if it hurts!!) Hip adduction and abduction exercises also help the knee, especially by reducing the stress on the medial part of the knee, but remember to push using your adductor or abductor muscles not your feet or knees. If you have a resistance band or theraband lie on your side, bend your knees to about 80 degrees  and tie it round your ankles pretty firmly and then lift the top leg upwards against the resistance of the band. Hold and then slowly lower. Do a set of 10-12 reps on each leg and between 1-3 sets. Sitting with a squeezy ball in between your knees and pushing inwards also works the adductor muscles and can be done at a desk! Concentrate on squeezing the adductor muscles though, not just pushing with the knee bones! Also don't neglect the benefit of the good old straight leg raise for quads strengthening - use an ankle weight if a simple straight leg lift is too easy and concentrate on using the quads to lift the leg. Hold for a while if you can, play about with length of time on lift, hold, lower. Tie something round the ankle for weight if you don't have any ankle weights - a book works for me if need be!

Examples here:

http://exercise.about.com/od/exerciseworkouts/ss/bestbuttexercis_2.htm

Scroll down a bit for this one - the butt lift etc - adapt the basic move using one leg , it soon shows which leg is weaker than the other!

http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/glutes.htm

The other things I'd really recommend is to make stretches and balance work your friend. Don't neglect proper, extended stretches of the quads, hamstrings, calves, ITB and glutes. Do them after exercise but also when things just feel tight. Have you ever done any foam rolling? This can be brilliant for helping identify trigger points and releasing them, I do my calves and ITB every day, usually more than once.

http://www.runnersworld.com/article/0,7120,s6-241-285--11556-0,00.html

As the article says you can use a tennis ball if you don't have a roller to start with.

Finally - balance work is great for knees. Do things on one leg, try and get hold of a wobble board or BOSU ball and do some of your upper body work on it (lateral raises take on a whole new dimension standing on a BOSU!!), use it for squats if you can manage them, or simply stand on one with your eyes closed and lift one leg. Try this on the level first!! Balance work really helps the little muscles around the knee and prepares us for stabilisation in everyday life. We rarely move in one direction and improving our proprioception means we can be better prepared for sudden twists/changes in direction and better protected against injury.

All of these are just general suggestions - obviously you shouldn't do anything that hurts YOUR knees or that your PT has recommended against. If in doubt, consult your doctor or ask a PT who knows your knees. I know lunges are often recommended to strengthen legs - if I do a lunge you may as well cart me off to A&E in an oxygen tent - they simply HURT and don't work for me now, I used to be able to lunge really well with weights and all sorts. No more!!!

Good luck and keep us posted!

Lottie  ;D



Bilateral patella OA since 2009, no surgeries.
Euflexxa working well x3 to current
Right forefoot CRPS post fusion surgery 2011
Refusing to let the ailing parts stop me....

Offline Mike_A

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Re: Running and Osteoarthritis
« Reply #32 on: March 04, 2010, 08:52:47 PM »
Thanks for all the great advice Lottie, extremely informative and helpful!!  I'll probably reference this post often.

Offline BECKZ_oo7

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Re: Running and Osteoarthritis
« Reply #33 on: March 08, 2010, 07:12:35 AM »
hey i know how it feels mate...

but really running will only make it worse for u and ur knee(s)...

Besides there are other exercises tht can help u REPLACE RUNNING, such as stationary biking and swimming.. u can also do weights whilst sitting... 

Offline runlolarun

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Re: Running and Osteoarthritis
« Reply #34 on: March 14, 2010, 10:33:38 PM »
Just to stir the running pot more...I'm posting 2 articles,

This one:
http://www.healthline.com/hlbook/art-jogging-or-running

is about continuing to run with OA, and why it's not such a bad idea.  I quote "No evidence exists that individuals with arthritis who continue to run will accelerate their arthritis (Lane et al. 1987; Fries et al. 1994)"   

Take with whatever grains of salt you need to, but, anecdotally and experientially, it sounds right to me.

This one:
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2010/03/100312071800.htm

is quite recent, and very heartening for those of us considering TKRs.  Basically, the gist is that impact sports DO NOT increase the risk of mechanical failure in knee replacements.  Another finding that flies in the face of conventional wisdom.

Interesting stuff...


Offline slyguy1

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Re: Running and Osteoarthritis
« Reply #35 on: August 22, 2010, 11:25:46 AM »
Question for Lottiefox.....just read your post on exercises for second time....very informative. Since you were a runner you probably miss the great cardio workout it gave you.....i know i still miss it....what would consider a decent cardio workout if you are stuck at home and can't make it to a gym?

Offline Lottiefox

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Re: Running and Osteoarthritis
« Reply #36 on: August 23, 2010, 12:33:50 PM »
Hi slyguy,

Yes I miss a lot of the cardio I used to get from running; I was never a BIG runner but I used to run, and lots of my routines or classes would involve running even if I wasn't actually doing a "run" if you get me. I used to enjoy outdoor boot camp type stuff, but thats heavy on the knees and runs/sprints etc are part of it. No more for me sadly.

If you don't have a bike at home I find using boxing a good way to get the heart rate up. I either use pads and gloves with a partner or I do have a punchbag on a stand that I can smack. Alternate this with other things and you can get a really good circuit going that keeps your heart rate elevated. Mix up the punches, set yourself times for so many punches, or combinations. Easy on the knees, and great for cardio and stress for me. I also use interval training a lot on different exercises - my fave is the tabata concept of 20 seconds maximum effort 10 seconds rest repeated 8 times. You can use this on ANYTHING - push ups, crunches, holding a plank, weights,dips, anything you do but chunk it into the 8 sets of the 20/10 combo. Heart rate gets up and stays up. Rest for 30 seconds between different exercises then do another set of something. Mix up core, upper body, cardio....etc. More interesting that bland "home exercises" and you can monitor how many reps you manage in each set....(I am sad). the other thing I like is kettlebell work but my knees need to be feeling well for this and it may be too much too soon for you at the moment as it requires a semi squat position and shift of weight as you swing it up. GREAT for cardio and is non impact but I'd recommend making sure you can cope post surgery before you try and launch one!

Hope this helps if only a bit

Lottie x :)
Bilateral patella OA since 2009, no surgeries.
Euflexxa working well x3 to current
Right forefoot CRPS post fusion surgery 2011
Refusing to let the ailing parts stop me....

Offline WestPoint

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Re: Running and Osteoarthritis
« Reply #37 on: August 24, 2010, 09:04:25 AM »
Hello Lottie,

I'm surprised to see that you mentioned boxing; that's what probably got me in this situation in the first place, unless it was the running I was doing for cardio. When I punch a bag or mits, I put my body behind my shots, and avoid arm punches. This puts a lot of stress and torque on the knees. Don't you think this would be a bad form of exercise for someone with knee problems?

Offline slyguy1

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Re: Running and Osteoarthritis
« Reply #38 on: August 24, 2010, 11:06:32 AM »
Lottie,

            Interestingly similar to bodyweight circuit training workout that i started doing at home where you do each exercise with minimal rest to keep HR up. Knowing what you know now.....what would you have done differently? As most runners would agree, running does weaken upper body strength and core training is encouraged to prevent injury and take days off from pounding the pavement which i did not do....like the inspirational speaker/psychologist former runner Wayne Dyer PhD who ran for i believe 9 years straight every single day rain or shine (8 miles every day). Sad to inform that he like most of us is not running anymore. Most out there running don't realize the consequences till it's too late (now i am sad). Thank you for sharing Lottie.....any update on your situation?

sly

Offline Lottiefox

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Re: Running and Osteoarthritis
« Reply #39 on: August 24, 2010, 07:09:00 PM »
Hello Lottie,

I'm surprised to see that you mentioned boxing; that's what probably got me in this situation in the first place, unless it was the running I was doing for cardio. When I punch a bag or mits, I put my body behind my shots, and avoid arm punches. This puts a lot of stress and torque on the knees. Don't you think this would be a bad form of exercise for someone with knee problems?

I think my definition of boxing is a little different...I probably mean just pad work or using a punch bag to elevate heart rate. I don't do any of the ducking, pivoting or diving around that proper boxing would entail. I'd agree that such movements place a lot of torque on the knees...but if I stabilise correctly, use my upper body efficiently and balance through my core my knees really aren't doing anything worse than they do going up and down stairs. Running for me definitely did more damage, but thats my biomechanics as much as my poor running technique..... :-\

Sly - what would I have done differently? Got a proper gait analysis before my pain started. Got proper shoes and orthotics. Listened to my body telling me that muscles hurt and were tight and worked on them rather than running through it and probably speeding up the kneecap wear and tear....and definitely not done hill sprints quite so much! Agh!! My situation - I'm avoiding surgery at all costs so far, sticking with PT, exercise I can still enjoy, regular walking, diet management to avoid inflammatory foods, the magic Celebrex has just been started so I'll probably have a heart attack soon...and I am booked for a visco supplement injection in September of Euflexxa. It can't do any damage, and it might just make the knee less creaky. I'll be TKR candidate I know one day, but at 41 and relatively busy I don't want one just yet....

Sly, how are you doing? What exercises do you put into your home circuit? I have some really good magazine articles that gave me some decent ideas, must dig them out. Since having dead knes prevents anything with lunges or most squats I have become very inventive too!

All the best

Lottie
Bilateral patella OA since 2009, no surgeries.
Euflexxa working well x3 to current
Right forefoot CRPS post fusion surgery 2011
Refusing to let the ailing parts stop me....

Offline slyguy1

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Re: Running and Osteoarthritis
« Reply #40 on: August 26, 2010, 12:26:08 PM »
Lottie,

             Seems like we have similar views on trying to stay away from surgery....i am kicking myself for not researching more before getting my scope and waking up in a wheelchair with microfracture....definite wakeup call to look out for myself. I would agree that no matter how you look at it running is not for everyone.....genetics plays a bigger role that people think. Even if you have the perfect build for running wear and tear can still defeat you. I was never into weight lifting as much before my surgery but slowly it has replaced my running days for a descent workout. The downside is that i got a bit too bulky which puts weight on knees so these days i am trying to varying workouts to mix and balance everything.....i like your boxing idea....excellent finish to a good workout. Since i don't have gear at home except a pair of dumbells ....i do a mix of upper body,abs, and leg raises followed by wall squat all in consecutive circuit for 30 minutes. I'll admit i get a better workout at gym b/c the bike is a better cardio session. I was doing elliptical which was great cardio....never will replace a good run (sadly)....i put too much stress on knees with the incline being too high....i was in agony for about 10 days....the only time i've taken lots of advil. I've tried the glucosamine/chondroitin stuff.....did not seem to help but the fish oil that i'm taking seems to help.

           I am curious about your visco injection you mention....is that similar to synvisc? Please do share some of your articles if you can....always looking to find new ideas to cope better. At 43, i am scared to even think about TKR...but unfortunately reality says it is a matter of time.

Cheers

Sly

Offline Lottiefox

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Re: Running and Osteoarthritis
« Reply #41 on: August 26, 2010, 02:32:54 PM »
Hi Sly,

I'm having a Euflexxa injection - its totally "biological" with no rooster comb bits in it as eggs make me a bit sicky so I didn't fancy egg bits in my poor knee!! They have a good website if you want to nose. It may do nothing, but if it gives even 20% help then its worth it.

Don't beat yourself up re surgery. We make the best choice at the time for us and our situation. It sounds like you're coming on really well. As said I was never a primary runner, but I really miss a sunny morning, and just running across a park or field with the sun on my shoulders, i pod on and that heart rate rising. The gym can't replace that - but I'd far rather the gym and home stuff than give in to the sofa and lardy-life! Ohh yes the too high incline on the cross trainer - nasty! My gym has things called ARC trainers which are similar but which seem kinder to my knees. I've also been doing some arm bike work - thought I was fairly strong upper body wise but that thing can kill me, great cardio! I fear ending up with an upper body like a Russian shot putter and legs like a chicken - not happened yet so I'll keep on keeping on..

Take care

Lottie  :)
Bilateral patella OA since 2009, no surgeries.
Euflexxa working well x3 to current
Right forefoot CRPS post fusion surgery 2011
Refusing to let the ailing parts stop me....

Offline WestPoint

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Re: Running and Osteoarthritis
« Reply #42 on: August 26, 2010, 07:09:00 PM »
Sounds sensible Lottie...

Offline slyguy1

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Re: Running and Osteoarthritis
« Reply #43 on: August 27, 2010, 11:11:13 AM »
Lottie,


             It would be so perfect if they come up with something natural to give us perfect knees even for just 1 hour....enough time to have that perfect run around the park just like we did back in our twenties. Wishful thinking as i haven't had my coffee yet:) Yeah i've seen the nordic trac trainers that simulate skiing. For a nice stretch the elliptical was great cardio but i didn't realize the stress on knee till next day when i woke up in agony and knee swelled like a melon....only time i reach for that advil. I am thankful that i can still get around even if i have to limp on occasion. I've noticed that if i do too much of one area like hamstrings on machine at gym....muscles get too tight and effect tracking of knee. Stretching more on a daily basis seems to help. "Arm bike work".....is that dumbell curls while riding bike? Sounds challenging....one thing about bike i've noticed is that the height of seat makes a difference on pressure on knee joint.....the higher the seat the less stress on knee. I had it low a few times and really felt pain in kneecap afterwards. What about diet and supplements....do you follow a regimen?

Cheers,
Sly
           

Offline runlolarun

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Re: Running and Osteoarthritis
« Reply #44 on: September 26, 2010, 05:42:24 PM »
Here I am again to stir the running debate pot with another article.

This is about Canadian marathoner Ed Whitlock, who's in his 70s, has osteoarthritis in both knees (apparently pretty severe) and wins age group awards running marathons.  Go Ed!

http://runningmagazine.ca/2009/10/sections/feature/comeback-kid-the-return-of-age-group-superhero-ed-whitlock/

that article's from last year, so here's the wiki on Ed, who's apparently still running and winning awards. 

As to me, I'm still running with no problems and loving it, albeit I ain't about to win any awards!

best,
Lorien















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