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Author Topic: Knee damaged more, now what's wrong?  (Read 4589 times)

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Offline dm

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Knee damaged more, now what's wrong?
« on: November 24, 2007, 10:28:31 PM »
About 6 weeks ago I got kicked in my bad knee, right at the joint line, enough to bruise me.  :( Since then I have had pains in the knee that migrate from one spot to another, at random. ??? This is new, I have previous damage and have had 4 previous knee scopes, so I'm worried about what's going on. Today I was walking and as I took a step, my knee went "CRACK" very very loudly.  :oSounded like someone nearby broke a very dry thick stick. It was so loud that it was heard 15-20 ft away. My knee screamed at the same instant, and it felt like something crunched in my knee. This was a new thing in addition to the random pains I've been having.

I'm suspicious of having a piece of bone or articular cartilage broken off already,and today's CRACKing incident makes me think some more just got cut loose. I'm awaiting ins authorization for an MRI, my dr's got to get my notes back from dictation to send to the ins co for the authorization to be processed. I so hate paperwork!

Anyone have experience in dealing with bits floating around in their knee?

I'm getting the impression that I'm most likely going to have to have the knee scoped again and have it fixed. I'm also seeing sharp bone edges (spurring) on my current xrays that are within 3/16" of being permanently in contact, so I am also thinking I'm going to end up having the bones shaved while the doc's in there. I'd like to know if anyone's had that done, and what was involved in the recovery.

So, my knee's a mess, and I'm living on painkillers. Any good advice for the situation I'm in?
Thanks
multiple arthroscopies 2/00,3/01,6/01,1/03, 12/07,10/10. chondromalacia, severe medial joint space narrowing following 3 partial menisectomies, chronic pain problems, kneecap problems, OCD lesion, failed mfx.

Offline norah

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Re: Knee damaged more, now what's wrong?
« Reply #1 on: November 24, 2007, 11:18:13 PM »
Hi DM

I had a sudden haemarthrosis in May this year, X-ray showed "floating bone" laterally from patella. MRI confirmed PFJA , patella alta with osteophyte formation to name but a few.  I am waiting on surgery which will include totaly reshaping my patella.  I still feel a sharp pain at the side of my knee radiating up my thigh. This appears to be caused by a bit of my patella breaking off.  I cant really say how it feels to have the bone shaved off yet but it will be part of my TTT and joint debridement surgery. It is highly possible that if there is any overgrowth of bone the surgeon will remove it during surgery.  Keep in touch.

June
1977 Campbells stabilisation (R) patella. 1978 Campbells stabilisation (L) patella.  1979 Hauser (L) knee.  1980 Removal of metal work and manipulation. May 2007 Sudden haemarthrosis (R) knee. MRI - PFA with malaligned and deformed patella. March 2008 (R) TTT LR medial reefing & patella chielectomy.

Offline dm

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Re: Knee damaged more, now what's wrong?
« Reply #2 on: December 01, 2007, 04:29:31 PM »
Well, I saw my dr after having my mri, and it's what I thought, there's a loose chunk floating in there hanging up in stuff. The dr says a chunk of my remaining medial meniscus sheared off and is what's floating around in there. I suspect there may be more than one bit in there. I also asked if he was going to address the arthritis while he's doing my scope, since the xrays to me look like the bone ends are getting pretty sharp edged. I think that if the bone edges will end up driving me back to another scope in a couple years, it makes sense to just go ahead and file them down now while he's in there anyway.

I'm fully expecting to be stuck on crutches a few weeks like last time, given how long I've been with this being untreated. Who knows what other stuff he'll find that that loose chunk's done in there while sticking in things. I know mri aren't absolute diagnostic tests, so I fully expect a surprise or two.
multiple arthroscopies 2/00,3/01,6/01,1/03, 12/07,10/10. chondromalacia, severe medial joint space narrowing following 3 partial menisectomies, chronic pain problems, kneecap problems, OCD lesion, failed mfx.

Offline dm

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Re: Knee damaged more, now what's wrong?
« Reply #3 on: December 21, 2007, 05:05:51 AM »
my surgery's in a few hours.... hope they fix it all ...and hopefully I can manage to not wreck it again....
multiple arthroscopies 2/00,3/01,6/01,1/03, 12/07,10/10. chondromalacia, severe medial joint space narrowing following 3 partial menisectomies, chronic pain problems, kneecap problems, OCD lesion, failed mfx.

Offline dm

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Re: Knee damaged more, now what's wrong?
« Reply #4 on: January 05, 2008, 01:20:08 AM »
Well, it's been 2 weeks since my scope was done, and I'm worried. I get my stitches out monday, and I'll talk to the doc then. Meanwhile, I'm still crutching around, I can't manage to let loose of the sticks yet. I keep trying to put full weight on it, and it doesn't like it. I've a huge increase in pain under the kneecap when I try to take normal steps. I can get about 50% weight on it while restricting range of motion without too much misery. I can't put any weight on it and bend it, it screams... :o :'( This makes sitting down and standing up oh so much fun....NOT!

My range of motion isn't too bad, I've worked it to about -5 to plus 100ish (from -10 to plus 45 when I got home). I can't flex it more than that w/o bad pain in the back left corner, and feelings of tightness and some pain across the entire front of the knee.

I keep trying to back off the painkillers, but end up upping the dose again when the pain ramps back up. With the way the knee feels, I'm worried that there's some serious stuff going on. I wish I had the MRI back, I'd show y'all a couple of the pics with the way the kneecap's sitting - with the curve worn into the medial side of it, it looks like the kneecap has sunk in and twisted medially. I'm seriously wondering if there's any articular cartilage there at all, and imagine that the left femoral condyle's not doing so hot either.  I know, I'll get the details monday, but I can't get it out of my head that I'm gonna get told that I need another surgery to repair the kneecap damage as best they can, before I end up without one. The kneecap/femur area feels just as bad, in fact maybe worse, than before they scoped the knee, so I doubt they'd done anything to fix it. My postop instructions say "wbat - crutches - rom - prn" so I have been putting weight on the knee, "crutch walking", and working to get my range of motion back.

Anyhow, thanks for listening to me worry.... DM
multiple arthroscopies 2/00,3/01,6/01,1/03, 12/07,10/10. chondromalacia, severe medial joint space narrowing following 3 partial menisectomies, chronic pain problems, kneecap problems, OCD lesion, failed mfx.

Offline Nettan

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Re: Knee damaged more, now what's wrong?
« Reply #5 on: January 05, 2008, 10:42:17 AM »
You are only 2 weeks out and if there was some work done in there you need to be patient.
I am sure you will feel better by time.
Good luck on Monday.
Surgery 6 times left knee torn meniscus, RSDS,chondromalacia, nervdamage cause constant nervpain,chronic inflamm.
Spinaldamage wheeler 100%.
Right knee damaged aug-06, use brace surgery 4/9-07.LCL tear.

Offline DeborahinNC

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Re: Knee damaged more, now what's wrong?
« Reply #6 on: January 05, 2008, 09:31:38 PM »
Hi DM

Hope you get a good report on Monday.  In the meantime give yourself a break, you are only 2 weeks out.  Also, please remember the idea of pain management (have a sister-in-law with a master's in pain management) so you know we are to keep the pain gone.  I know we all want to ditch the pain meds as soon as possible but we don't help our healing process by letting ourselves get into pain.  Notice the WE part - of course I did the same thing even though I know better.

I do hope you do well, there was a big assault on your knee and give it some time to feel better before you decide it didn't work.

Will look for your post after OS apt. Hope you heal well and quickly.

Be well,
Deborah

Offline dm

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Re: Knee damaged more, now what's wrong? - update
« Reply #7 on: January 08, 2008, 03:40:54 AM »
Thanks for the support guys, I appreciate it. I'd hit a new low the other day, with the pain and all getting to me. Got the pictures from my scope today, it was a mess. The backside of my patella has been shearing off in bits, there was "fringes" of articular cartilage everywhere. What's left of my medial meniscus has been reduced yet again, there was a good tear, plus some more frayed bits. Thankfully my lateral meniscus is okay, after having stuff stuck in there for almost 2 weeks, I'd been worried about it getting damaged too, and my acl is still intact.

Got an explaination for the reason for some of the pain under the kneecap, my OS had to shave the back of my patella a bit to remove the frayed bits :o - so he did end up doing something under there, I hadn't thought of needing a "haircut" in there didn't know articular cartilage could "fray" like that. He tells me that there's evidence of bad wearing under kneecap, especially medially, may end up having to do a realignment or a "decompression" of the kneecap later if it gets worse. He told me that the recovery gets a bit harder each time, and I guess this one's a big leap of "harder" compared the last, since it's still so painful. He'd like me to get off the crutches in the next week, but I may end up using them at least at work for a while longer, to prevent me from overdoing it too soon. I'm on restrictions until my next visit, so the crutches make a visible excuse for the moment. Thankfully he gave me another script for the painkillers I've been using, I am about out.

The good news is that he thinks I should be able to go back to my martial arts lessons :D ;D, (Yay!) once things heal up, but certainly not for another month or so, not until I can practice on my own without it killing me, that's for sure. It's way too soon, I know, but at least I don't have to give up my fun yet. :) Now I just gotta wait....

Here's hoping the pain quits soon....
multiple arthroscopies 2/00,3/01,6/01,1/03, 12/07,10/10. chondromalacia, severe medial joint space narrowing following 3 partial menisectomies, chronic pain problems, kneecap problems, OCD lesion, failed mfx.

Offline DeborahinNC

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Re: Knee damaged more, now what's wrong?
« Reply #8 on: January 11, 2008, 04:18:27 AM »
Hi dm,

Sorry have not been to the board for a couple days.  You sound like you are feeling (at least emotionally) a little better with this last post.  I think everyone gets down.  Its a real pain to have your life limited by our own bodies.  It also sounds like you had a lot of cleanup done on this last surgery.  Hopefully this one will hold you for a while and you can heal and then get back to what you love.

Have you started PT yet?  I'm used to the meniscus stuff and I started within a couple weeks but not with the patellar issues.

Here is to quick healing and painfree days.  Be good to yourself though and don't go to fast.  Just know that you can get back to martial arts just not tomorrow.

Be well and let me know how you are doing.

Deborah

Offline dm

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Re: Knee damaged more, now what's wrong?
« Reply #9 on: January 13, 2008, 06:33:01 AM »
It's 3 weeks out now, and still a challenge. Having issues sleeping, every time I move the leg, the kneecap area screams, waking me several times a night. What do you guys think of trying to sleep in an immobilizer, as uncomfortable as they are, to try and get a decent night's sleep?
multiple arthroscopies 2/00,3/01,6/01,1/03, 12/07,10/10. chondromalacia, severe medial joint space narrowing following 3 partial menisectomies, chronic pain problems, kneecap problems, OCD lesion, failed mfx.

Offline txathletictrainer

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Re: Knee damaged more, now what's wrong?
« Reply #10 on: January 16, 2008, 12:06:33 AM »
The best thing I did that helped to sleep when I was in my immobilizer was sleep in my recliner. That way you don't worry about turning over in your sleep. It takes a day or two to get used to it, but it really helps.
chronic patellar dislocations beginning in 98.
popliteal hemangioma 2000;
 distal patellar tendon realignment 2000,
 meniscus tear 2001, 2003, 2005,
3x MCL tear, partial ACL 2006.
synisc Jan 08 - did nothing.
 MCL and partial ACL July 2008

Offline dm

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Re: Knee damaged more, now what's wrong?
« Reply #11 on: January 16, 2008, 10:57:26 PM »
The recliner is a good idea, if I need to. I'm not in an immobilizer right now, never was after this scope, but was wondering if using one of my old ones just to sleep in might be worth doing to see if I can get through the night without the knee waking me up. I move in my sleep, the knee yelps, and I wake up, repeatedly. This is not very restful. Ideas?
multiple arthroscopies 2/00,3/01,6/01,1/03, 12/07,10/10. chondromalacia, severe medial joint space narrowing following 3 partial menisectomies, chronic pain problems, kneecap problems, OCD lesion, failed mfx.

Offline Nettan

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Re: Knee damaged more, now what's wrong?
« Reply #12 on: January 17, 2008, 05:47:59 AM »
I had a Immo made for me after a cast that I slept in during some years. That worked very well.
Though I would discuss that option with your doc before considering sleeping with one.
I slept in the sofa with lots of pillows supporting after my last surgery for pretty long, that worked well as I couldn't turn around.
Surgery 6 times left knee torn meniscus, RSDS,chondromalacia, nervdamage cause constant nervpain,chronic inflamm.
Spinaldamage wheeler 100%.
Right knee damaged aug-06, use brace surgery 4/9-07.LCL tear.

Offline dm

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Re: Knee damaged more, now what's wrong?
« Reply #13 on: January 17, 2008, 03:58:49 PM »
I'll have to try something like that.. using extra pillows so I don't roll over once I've gotten comfortable.

I just got back from my 1st PT appt... I'm rather ticked off.... Had me doing some quad contractions with stim and a mildly warm heat pad on top, and that was it! Didn't even ask me how the knee felt after, or ice it or anything!  >:( I came home and put ice on it myself... the quad exercises pissed off the backside of my kneecap more!! Didn't know what else to do but comment on my way out that I was heading for an ice pack since the knee hurts MORE.... So here I sit for a few to get things to calm down a bit (physically and mentally) before I have to go back to work for 5 more hours....

If next week's appt isn't any different (they don't have appts on friday afternoons for some reason, and I can't go in the am), I'm going to see what it takes to change PT places.... I don't have to be treated like that! I think it was plain wrong to just give me something to do, then "you can go now" and not even ask how I felt after.... and I made it very plain that my knee is a mess!
multiple arthroscopies 2/00,3/01,6/01,1/03, 12/07,10/10. chondromalacia, severe medial joint space narrowing following 3 partial menisectomies, chronic pain problems, kneecap problems, OCD lesion, failed mfx.

Offline Nettan

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Re: Knee damaged more, now what's wrong?
« Reply #14 on: January 17, 2008, 06:38:46 PM »
Ask questions and be honest with how you feel next time and also get a plan for the nearest couple of weeks.
Surgery 6 times left knee torn meniscus, RSDS,chondromalacia, nervdamage cause constant nervpain,chronic inflamm.
Spinaldamage wheeler 100%.
Right knee damaged aug-06, use brace surgery 4/9-07.LCL tear.