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Offline biscuit69

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OA abbreviations HELP!!
« on: October 26, 2004, 05:55:49 PM »
Like most of you my knee constantly aches and i have been told after 6 ops that my knee has had its day.It is grossly unstable so can anyone tell me what the following means? 1,subluxing patella
                            2,patello femoral rub.
                            3,degenerate menisci.
                            4,grade 3-4 OA patello femoral compartment.
                             5,grade 2-3medial and lateral compartments.
I have been told i will need a total knee replacement but my surgeon won,t give me an estimate of when, all i know is my knee gives me tremendous pain and is getting on my nerves.Can anyone tell me how bad these grades of OA are and what is the worst grade 2-3 or grade 3-4. I,m 35 now is there an age limit before you can get a new kneee on the NHS.
                 Thanks again in advance of any help.

Offline CelticNagel

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Re: OA abbreviations HELP!!
« Reply #1 on: October 26, 2004, 08:39:09 PM »
I can answer the grade piece - maybe someone else can respond to the rest.

The severity of OA is often described according to the Outerbridge scale, which classifies the articular degeneration of the knee by compartment in four grades: (i) Grade I refers to softening or blistering of the articular cartilage, (ii) Grade II describes fragmentation or fissuring in an area less than 1 cm, (iii) Grade III describes fragmentation or fissuring in an area greater than 1 cm, and (iv) Grade IV refers to cartilage erosion down to the bone.

2002 partial menisectomy R (2x),2003 partial menisectomy R,2004 partial menisectomy L (2x),tibial fractures, tibial plateau fractures,HTO (L) 10/27/04;HTO (R) TBD

Offline Heather M.

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Re: OA abbreviations HELP!!
« Reply #2 on: October 27, 2004, 12:03:33 AM »
Just to clarify, these grades listed above are for chondromalacia--the damage to articular cartilage.  Grade I is mild and Grade IV is widespread and severe.  

But the report above says grade 3-4 OA.  That is osteoarthritis, which is much more severe than chondromalacia.  You could even say it's a logical extension of chondromalacia, when the damage continues down into the underlying bone.  The grades of OA only go to Grade 4, so that's about as bad as it gets.  

Chondromalacia is a description of the damage to the articular cartilage that coats the bone.  But once you get into damage of the underlying bone, you are talking osteoarthritis.  And total knee replacements.  On the basis of the resutls you are describing, you would be a candidtate for TKR (total knee replacement).  However, the pain and impact to functionality rarely corresponds directly to the level of damage.  You can have people with severe osteoarthritic damage who are active and happy, and others with minor to moderate chondromalacia who are effectively crippled.  It's not known why....

Since you are on the NHS, I can't really help you because I don't understand the system there.  But the clinical indications are for a TKR.  Whether your daily life is sufficiently impacted and whether conservative measures to help the pain are appropriate--that's up to your doctor to discuss with you.  Hopefully, if you have tried conservative measures like SYNVISC and an unloader brace (though not sure that would help as you seem to have damage in all three compartments), cortisone, oral supplements, etc.  It really is the doctor's call, NHS or not.  So here in the US you have to keep looking until you find a doctor willing and able to help you.  Some are very much against early TKR, so understand that you will run into this attitude.

Regarding your points:
1.  Subluxing patella - this means your kneecap isn't tracking correctly.  As you bend and straighten, your kneecap moves around and tries to snap out of place, instead of moving smoothly in the groove as it should.

2.  Patello-femoral rub - ? I think this might be an attempt to describe that you have damaged cartilage in the patello-femoral compartment (usually back of the kneecap) due to your patella's bad tracking.

3.  Degeneration of Menisci - these are the little shock absorbers in our knees.  If yours are gone, that means osteoarthritis is in the future.

4.  Grade III-IV osteoarthritis in patello-femoral compartment--this means severe damage to the cartilage on the back of your kneecap and in the corresponding bones underneath.  This is serious, and by itself could be crippling.  Or, it could cause you no issues at all--no one understands arthritis well enough to say why!

5.  Grade 2-3 (? OA or chondromalacia?  It doesn't say.  Since previous reference was to OA, I will guess this is grade II-III OA) in the lateral and medial compartments.  This is the inside and outside of the knee.  This is important because you only have three compartments in your knee, and this information says there is significant damage in all of them.  Normally, this would exclude you from the more cutting edge cartilage restoration procedures, patellar realignment, etc.  It seems to say your whole knee is shot.

However, it's always a dicey thing to have non-medical professionals try to interpret MRI or x-ray reports without the required context that a medical degree gives you!  Your surgeon may not aggree that the damage is that bad, or that the tests were accurate, or that this supposed OA is the source of your pain.  That's why you have to take this information and discuss it with a surgeon who has looked at the films himself/herself AND who had thoroughly examined your knee and done an appropriate history.

So I really urge you to push to get an appointment with an operating orthopedic surgeon--not a fellow, not a student, not anyone but a doctor who does knee replacements.  It might be wise to take your results (the films and the reports) and pay for a private consultation with a top-notch knee clinic like one in London that has a great reputation.

Hope this information can help.

Scope #1: LR, part. menisectomy w/cyst, chondroplasty
#2-#5: Lysis of adhesions/scar tissue, AIR, patellar tendon debridement, infections, MUA, insufflation
#6: IT band release / Z-Plasty, synovectomy, LOA/AIR, chondroplasty
2006 Arthrofibrosis, patella baja

Offline scoobydoo1

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Re: OA abbreviations HELP!!
« Reply #3 on: April 08, 2005, 10:02:05 PM »
I have a doc who is giving me abbreviations I am just not familiar with.  I'm hoping someone can help me shed light on the matter.  I'm new to this site and am not sure if this is the correct place to ask or not.  The abbreviations are below:




This is how the doc is using them:  Examination remained intact with positive FHAL/EHL/TA/GS, positive LTSD/P/first DWS, positive 2 DP/PT with VCR.

Thanks again for any help

Offline Natalie.D

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Re: OA abbreviations HELP!!
« Reply #4 on: April 11, 2005, 12:42:16 PM »
Hi biscuit69

Waiting for a TKR on the NHS is usually a long wait!  Depends where in the country you are but here in Scotland the waiting lists for orthopaedics is 9 months/a year (minimum).  The surgeons don't usually like doing TKRs on anyone under the age of about 60 as you only get 10-15 years out of a knee before it needs replaced, obviously there will be exceptions and you may be one of them, I know that my dad has been living with OA for years and years, he is at the severe end of OA and is now 63 and has only just now been accepted for a TKR but has been told that the waiting times are around a year.  So its hard to say, depends on your circumstances and your location.

Dislocations since age 12
Trochlear Dysplasia
TTT, LR, MR L knee 95-Success
TTT, LR, MR R 02-Success
Screws out
Partial tear ACL
Severe end stage OA
4 Debridements
Partial Meniscectomy
Failed Microfracture
11mm Defect LFC
Bone Spurs, Kissing Lesions


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Re: OA abbreviations HELP!!
« Reply #5 on: April 11, 2005, 01:20:36 PM »

Hi, here is a site that might help you look up those abbreviations.

Good luck,  ;)


Offline maryannhou

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Re: OA abbreviations HELP!!
« Reply #6 on: January 30, 2007, 11:44:57 PM »
I had arthoscopic surgery.  I have the pictures here but have no clue to what it means. there is some writing on them this is what it says
g 111 patelllar
pfjt ( i think)
med. compartment he told me looks good
acl/pcl  he told me looks good
g 111 ltb
g 111 patellar
s/p plm/ cplasty
on back of one page it says
left kne artho.
1) partial lateral meniscectomy
2) cplasty gatellar g 3
3 ) lateral compartment g3
dont see the the os till march again..
lateral meniscus repair 1/12/07
TKR comming up 9/18/07
had tkr seeing OS 10\7

Offline Linds

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Re: OA abbreviations HELP!!
« Reply #7 on: January 31, 2007, 01:32:02 PM »

g 111 patelllar> Not sure what this refers to
pfjt ( i think)> This I imagine refers to the Patello Femoral Joint
med. compartment he told me looks good> Medial compartment refers to the portion of the joint located towards the inside of your leg.  IT includes the medial condyle of the femur (long leg bone) the medial meniscus and the medial portion of the tibia
acl/pcl  he told me looks good > ACL is the anterior Cruciate ligament, which runs from the front of the knee joint on the tibia to the inside of the groove of the femur and helps to stabalise the knee joint. PCL refers to the Posterior cruciate ligament which basically runs opposite the ACL providing counter stability to the knee.g 111 ltb
g 111 patellar> Not sure, i'd only be guessing
cplasty> Chondroplasty is reparative surgery on the cartilage of the knee, so they've esentially cleaned up the cartilage
s/p plm/ cplasty > Not sure what thes/p and plm stand for .. but chondroplasty again, so it likely refers to an area they did work on
on back of one page it says
left kne artho> This very simply means it was the left knee he operated on1) partial lateral meniscectomy > This means they removed a small section of teh lateral mensicus, the cusion that sits between your femur and tibia on the outside of the knee.
2) cplasty gatellar g 3> This refers to chondroplasty again... not sure what gatellar means, patellar would mean on the kneecap3 )
 lateral compartment g3>  Not sure what the g3 refers to , I think it may mean grade 3 chondromalacia, but i'm not entirely sure. Lateral compartment refers to the outer part of the knee joint, the side that doesn't face your other leg.\
I hope that helped.. :P  and don't quote me on any of it, because i'm giving it my best guess... based on what I know as a knee patient.

1997 Scope RK
2002 LR RK
2002 Scope and hematoma evac RK
2004 LR LK
May 06 Fall from Horse, partial ACL tear and meniscus injury, Tibial plateau injury
2007 Scope, Plica Excision and Debride LK
2009/2010- Possibly Ankylosing Spondylitis?

Offline maryannhou

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Re: OA abbreviations HELP!!
« Reply #8 on: February 01, 2007, 07:31:46 PM »
thanks for your help gatellar should have been patellar..typo  :-\
lateral meniscus repair 1/12/07
TKR comming up 9/18/07
had tkr seeing OS 10\7

Offline Jaci

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Re: OA abbreviations HELP!!
« Reply #9 on: February 02, 2007, 04:13:47 AM »

My Guess is that these are referring to chondral lesions/ chondromalacia
g 111 ltb> grade 3 lateral tibia
g 111 patellar> grade 3 patellar

2) cplasty gatellar g 3> chrondroplasty patellar grade 3.
3 ) lateral compartment g3> grade 3 damage in the lateral compartment.

The knee is comprised of three compartments-- the lateral compartment (lateral tibial plateau and lateral femoral chondyle), medial  compartment (medial tibial plateau and medial femoral chondyle) and the patello-femoral compartment (patella and the are of the femur that the patella glides over when bending and straightening the knee)

10/03 Twist injury
12/03 Menisectomy- tears ACL, MCL, & LCL missed by OS
Arthrofibrosis ROM 38-68
3/04- 4/08 Multiple scar tissue procedures:
6 scopes w/LOA, AIR, LR, chondroplasty, synovectomy, bone spur & plica removal
3 insufflations, many injections
Chronic AF, patella infera, IPCS