The WAITING ROOM => GENERAL KNEE QUESTIONS and comments (good for new threads) => Topic started by: Mikeydidit on May 16, 2011, 08:04:56 PM

Title: Help without surgery??
Post by: Mikeydidit on May 16, 2011, 08:04:56 PM
Hi all, and thanks for reading this. I am just over 50 and have terrible knees. I had arthroscopic surgery on my right knee around two years ago. She removed some arthritis and shaved my torn meniscus while she was in there. The cartilage is about gone in this knee so she also drilled holes in the bone so fluids would drain out and harden. ( I don't remember the name of the procedure) I was told before the surgery i would be walking the next week. After surgery i was told to not walk on it for three months. So i was handed a walker for a month and then crutches for two more months. Like others i have seen post, the time on one leg has also taken a toll on the left knee. I finally told her to get me off the crutches or she was going to have to do the left knee too.

 Its too the point where I am probably looking at least for a right knee replacement if not a double. The doctors i see are pretty good from what I hear, but do not want to replace mine because I'm too young?

I still go to work most everyday. I still have a lot of pain now really in both knees although the right one is the worst of the two. The mornings are not as bad as later in the day. I take ostiobiflex everyday but I am not sure it actually does anything.

Have you found anything that helped your knee's other than surgery or replacement? I guess until I get to be "old enough" I will have to deal with the pain unless something out there actually helps..

Title: Re: Help without surgery??
Post by: amoler on May 17, 2011, 02:23:54 AM
I'm having PRP done in aout 6 weeks, because I am willing to try almost anything to avoid more surgery.
Title: Re: Help without surgery??
Post by: tenisfan on May 17, 2011, 05:56:16 AM
I have tried Synvesic injections that have worked really well. Kim
Title: Re: Help without surgery??
Post by: muscle20 on May 18, 2011, 02:22:35 AM
hi mikey,
            im in a similar position to you and will turn 50 this year. had clean out and tear trim in december but to be honest im worse off. the only thing it did was to confirm medial arthritas in left knee grade 4. thigh  and hamstring muscles have shut down giving me a limp which may lead to hip wear if i cant do something soon. dont want a tkr. because i cant see it lasting a very active person for many years. have seen physio and osteapath. the oste used a lot of ems to try and kick start the muscles and told me to get back in the gym and hit the weights again if i wanted to help the hip and limp. only done 2 painfull sessions so far but will go a month and see what happens. lots of swelling and cant lock the leg back. will also look at trying the hylaron injections but the surgeon said i only had a small chance it would do anything. will post as i go on .
Title: Re: Help without surgery??
Post by: Mikeydidit on May 18, 2011, 02:47:05 PM
Thanks for the replies. When i first had knee problems my Dr. sent me to the PT (That stands for physical torturest)  ??? I always seemed to come away worse than i went in. I did end up with some orthopedic inserts for my shoes that supposedly straightened out my knee. I still wear them although I am not sure I'm convinced.

After surgery i had 5 injections, one a week (Oh what fun they were) of what they referred to as "Chicken Fat". The first ones did seem to help but the last couple seemed to add pressure in the knee. Wasn't fun.

Since surgery (around 6 months ago) i went to anther Ortho Dr. and he drained more fluid off the knee. Thats around 5 times I have had that done. If you have never had that done all i can say is put that procedure off as long as possible.  (Maybe i HATE needles) I am not a stranger to pain and I am a good sized person. I liked to have passed out twice during these. I did get the steroid injection put in while the needle was already through my cap. It may have lasted a day. Not worth it IMHO.

He did tell me before i left to come see him again  and they would drain more fluid off (can't wait) and "yep your on your way for a total knee replacement. But like muscle20 posted they think i still too active and will wear it out too soon.

It is getting bad enough now that it starting to effect me all the way up to my hip too muscle20. Some days (like yesterday) I have to make myself lay around and watch TV and get off it. Mine lets me know when that is trust me. Advil PM's are my friend some bad evenings when i can't let my knee's touch each other in bed while trying to go to sleep. You may want to give those a try. But start off with one or you may sleep in the next morning.. Also i take them around 7:00 PM so that by 9:00 or so they are kicking in.

I have been seeing a new system out that comes in replacement parts. I checked and no one in our area is doing those. But hopefully someone will come out with a better way soon.

muscle20 keep me posted on your progress. If the leg workouts help, i may have to try myself. But for me thats usually what gets my hurting worse.
Title: Re: Help without surgery??
Post by: Kimberly 77 on May 18, 2011, 09:17:09 PM
I am 33 years old and my os has told me I need a replacement. He was very reluctant at first but since my 2nd scope he has said we will try shots one more time and if they dont' work we will have to talk about replacement options. Reading your post adds more question to my decision to go ahead with replacement or not. I am also somewhat of a unique case I lost my right leg when I was 6 so I have worn out my left knee. I understand the fustration of pain and all the procedures. Nothing has seemed to help with pain for me other than icing, I get minimal relief for a couple of hours and then swollen again. The shots do the same for me as you said I just swell up for a couple of weeks and no pain relief at all. I am getting Euflexa on the 24th this month, yeah can't wait for the swelling. I think 50 is young for a tkr but you have to ask, Is your quality of life what you want it to be? You should ask your os what the chances of you regaining your mobility without pain?  There are surgeons out there that will agree to do it on a younger person. Mine will do it he is trying to hold me off a bit longer though. I am just not sure I want to do it.
Title: Re: Help without surgery??
Post by: Mikeydidit on May 19, 2011, 09:56:20 PM
Kim we both know the surgeries are no fun.... So I haven't just demanded that they give me a replacement. (Not yet) From the reading i did in the information hub yesterday it only confirms that I need the tkr as a last resort. When the tkr wears out (and it will with someone active) the second isn't expected to do as well as the first.  In fact their is even a chance of having to live with a constant pain after the 2nd one.

I'm doing that now. It may be even worse after that?? I am still pretty active and get fussed at to "slow down" . Thats something i have a hard time doing even with the knee pain (yes, even at 50). My knees finally get enough and i start limping. Then it's time for me to dose up on Advil PM, ice them , and get some sleep.

Each case is going to be different, so in my case I am going to put it off as long as I can. I did read something yesterday about removing a little of your cartilage and having stem cells injected to replace the missing. According to the article it helps generate new cartilage and people are trouble free from this procedure.  The article went back to 2008, so maybe this will be viable alternative at one point. Something that more than professional athletes can afford to have done. And perhaps offered in enough places to actually be able to get it.

Working for a hospital for 29 years now I can tell you they are coming out with some new things everyday. I keep hoping for a shot that will make everything better..   Even though I really hate needles.. ;D
Title: Re: Help without surgery??
Post by: Kimberly 77 on May 20, 2011, 05:26:04 PM
Noone really wants to have a tkr, but noone really wants to deal with the constant pain either. Thats why this is such a tough decision. I know rushing into a replacement probably isn't the right thing but when you hurt your brain tells you anything to make it stop. I am a very active person too, I have 3 kids kind of have to be. I think that is why I am contemplating this next step because I have so many years left and I want some of my life back now, not later. It is hard having to rely on just one leg and it don't work either. I have read about the cartilage transplant procedure and it sounds real promising. I have large cartilage defects and my current surgeon said this was not a option for me, but it really wouldn't hurt for you to look into it. Its a fairly new thing so I don't think there is a lot of long term data to determine if it will last or not but it has helped many people get thier life back so worth looking into. I wish you luck on your journey to being pain free!
Title: Re: Help without surgery??
Post by: muscle20 on June 03, 2011, 10:58:57 PM
hi mikey,out of interest are you uk based? im only doing 1 session a week so far but will now be trying to step that up. the sessions are painfull as i cant lock the knee out.flexion has improved but this could be due to going back on antiflams(naproxene this time). i am seeing some muscletone returning already and the next day it feels good but doesnt last long. the limp is so variable.
my surgeon would give me a tkr tomorrow but im not going there as i explained before even if it would mean pain free. id rather suffer younger when i think i can deal with it and not older. to me its not pain but a constant nag/bind. my surgeon who i will predict is in his forties has said forgret any sort of catlidge replacement in our lifetime although my physio thinks 2 years could see them doing it based on research he has seen. i too looked into the couple of places who reckon they are doing cartlige harvesting and then putting it back in once it grows.the surgeon says its a con and does not work. its not cheap too try and non weight bearing time i think is quite long.
the graunching and crunching in the knee is bad and my physio reckons for 6 months post cleanout is not right and says seek a 2nd opinion. so much advice and the only one who can make the decisions is you.
ill update in a month or so