KNEEtalk

The REHAB DEPARTMENT => General rehab issues and pain problems => Topic started by: alacy on August 20, 2005, 03:46:57 PM

Title: HELP! need sleep suggestions post TTT
Post by: alacy on August 20, 2005, 03:46:57 PM
I'm so desperate. I haven't slept well in so long!!!!! I had my surgery June 29. Can anyone suggest comfotable sleeping positions? 

Thanks
Anna
Title: Re: HELP! need sleep suggestions post TTT
Post by: Mandy on August 20, 2005, 03:51:39 PM
hi anna~

do u have a recliner at home?  i ended up sleeping in the recliner for about a week and  a half before sleeping in my actual bed.  i found i could get more comfy there and slept better.  otherwise what i did for sleeping in my bed, i took my brace off and didnt sleep with it on.  i'm not sure if i was actually supposed to do this so ya might wanna ask your OS if you can or not. 

if sleeping just isnt working for you, i'd ask you OS and see if s/he has any suggestions or remedies for not sleeping.  i took over the counter Tylenol PM every once in awhile when i just couldnt fall asleep.

hope this helped.
~mandy
Title: Re: HELP! need sleep suggestions post TTT
Post by: shadehawk on August 20, 2005, 10:03:07 PM
Anna,

Sorry that you are having sleeping problems.  There is nothing worse than not being able to sleep.  I have heard several people on this site speak highly of Ambien.  It is a sleeping aide and you could maybe ask your GP about it.....

Good luck to you and in the meantime maybe a lazyboy might help....

Good luck,
Shade
Title: Re: HELP! need sleep suggestions post TTT
Post by: alacy on August 21, 2005, 04:35:46 AM
Mandy and Shade thanks for the suggestions. It's so fusterating! I took my strong pain med tonight to see if it will help. I think I might try the Tylenol PM.

How long is pain medication needed after surgery?  I am on Ultram and Motrin as needed. Which for me means I take one or both of them most of the time.  But, when it's really acting up they don't help.  Even with ice and elevation. I always feel guilty asking my OS for refills. My Ultram is almost gone and I'm wondering is I should ask for more or try just Motrin and just get through the discomfort.

Thanks again forthe advise :D

Anna
Title: Re: HELP! need sleep suggestions post TTT
Post by: shadehawk on August 21, 2005, 03:07:01 PM
Anna,

Never feel guilty asking your OS or GP for pain meds.  You have had surgery on your knee and that causes major trauma, controlling pain with your surgery is very important......

I had my surgery on July 29th and still have alot of pain and will be going to my GP this week to try to get my meds straightened out for pain relief.  I could not get through a day without meds.

Talk to your GP or OS and let them know how bad your pain is and when it is worse....

Shade
Title: Re: HELP! need sleep suggestions post TTT
Post by: Major Ursa Norte on August 24, 2005, 06:00:27 PM
I agree. Don't hesitate about asking for the pain meds. You might even try switching around in case your body has developed a tolerance to your current one. On the sleeping position. In 2002 I had a lateral release and patella mediation, followed by another surgery one week later to clean out a bout of bone infection. The pain was staggering. I tried everything, but found no relief until my wife came home with a full body pillow. This allowed me to place the pillow between my legs and then roll onto my side. The pillow supported the weight of my leg and did not let the brace cam into my skin. Worked wonders for me. I was actually able to get more than a few hours of sleep during the night. My pain meds were Loracet plus coupled with a heavy duty muscle relaxer to stop the muscle jerks my thigh was going through post op.

3 years later and I still sleep with the body pillow. Wish I still had the muscle relaxers though, as my thigh still jerks on most nights.
Title: Re: HELP! need sleep suggestions post TTT
Post by: annaliese on August 27, 2005, 10:19:51 AM
Hi Anna,

I had four weeks of sleeping on my back (and not very well or even all through the night for that matter) before I could manage sleeping on my side.  Get yourself a nice semi-firm foam pillow - and a satin pillowcase, and pop it between your knees for sleeping on your non-operated side.  I found that my brace would drag on cotton or flannette pillowcases, but glides nicely over satin.  For sleeping on your operated side, two pillows are good, one for under the operated knee and one for between the knees.

As far as pain meds goes, if you need them - take them!  Pain meds are there for a reason, which is to make you comfortable enough to get some sleep.  Sleep as much as you can - I found that after a couple of weeks, the meds were waking me up in the middle of the night and I was having to take a nap for a couple of hours mid-afternoon.  Sleep is when our bodies heal and regenerate themselves, so get as much sleep as you can, whenever is practical. 

I've been off meds for about three weeks, but I have a low pain threshold and I need to toughen up!  I also got sick of lying awake for hours from 3am onwards, then crashing out when it was time to wake up, and not being able to get out of bed when I had to!  I was on Tramal - not sure what you guys call that in the USA (I'm in NZ).  I can't drive if I take Tramal, and as I live alone I needed to get to PT - so I'm going without meds unless I really need them, then I take a combo pill which has paracetamol and codeine phosphate in it.

Hope this helps - hang in there, it does get easier!

All the best,
AnnaLiese
Title: Re: HELP! need sleep suggestions post TTT
Post by: yellowg17 on August 27, 2005, 10:41:04 AM
Ice helps a lot too
Title: Re: HELP! need sleep suggestions post TTT
Post by: alacy on August 29, 2005, 12:24:26 AM
Thanks for all of the tips. Since my last post I have tried sleeping on my side with the pillow between my legs and I have been sleeping better.

As far as the pain meds.....I called my OS and talked to him through his nurse and he will not refill any pain meds. I can only have Motrin. That pissed me off!!!! I am not someone who even likes taking pain meds and I have a high tolerance for pain. I still had almost a full bottle of Darvocet. So I have been using those when the Mortin doesn't work.  My OS said that it is against his policy to refill narcotics past 6 weeks post-op! I think he should treat it on a case by case basis.

His nuse told me to call my primary care doctor and ask her for medicine if I need it. The whole situation made me feel real stupid for even asking him for more meds.

Thanks again everyone,
Anna
Title: Re: HELP! need sleep suggestions post TTT
Post by: Ron22 on August 29, 2005, 03:18:57 AM
sorry u are going thru what we all have at times....os's cut and run after a time re: pain meds...your best pal is a compassionate gp....find one u can speak to honestly..thankfully i have one..but had to find him..the os who botched my maquet was the same as yours and i felt terrible for days....tell him what the prob is and ask him if he can help u navigate thru this..there is no time limit...surgery is an insult to your body ...it takes time..and pt then re-awakens all of the insulted nerves and tissue..it is a huge prob here in the US......docs worry that the just say no police will get them.....there are docs out there that can help...in my case..i brought my files and spoke honestly....since that day i have never had a prob...getting what i need when things are bad..altho after 9 surgeries he has for his own protection labeled my file thusly as chronic pain.....

take care and find a doc not an OS who will help..

best..

ronnie
Title: Re: HELP! need sleep suggestions post TTT
Post by: alacy on August 30, 2005, 04:01:44 PM
Thanks Ronnie.

I am going to contact my GP today. She has been my doc for years and I think she will help. It's good to know I'm not the only one who is going through this!

I'll let you know what happens!

Anna
Title: Re: HELP! need sleep suggestions post TTT
Post by: alacy on August 31, 2005, 02:27:41 AM
Well good news! I talked to my GP and got my pain meds.  Yhea!!!

That's all for now.
Anna
Title: Re: HELP! need sleep suggestions post TTT
Post by: Durga on September 06, 2005, 06:20:08 PM
If you really don't want to take narcotics, I find Melatonin really helps me sleep.  I am drug sensitive and had surgery 8 weeks ago.  After six days of pain meds, I couldn't swallow another pill.  Melatonin does help me sleep and arnica tincture on my knee and orally helps with pain/swelling...good luck.
Durga
Title: Re: HELP! need sleep suggestions post TTT
Post by: Nekomimi on September 06, 2005, 07:42:17 PM
After 2 months of pain, the ONLY thing that knocks me out is liquid Benadryl (children's brand is fine). Darvocets, hydrocodone, and everything else make me very talkative rather than sleepy! My husband just laughs after I take my medication because I just cannot shut up! I'm normally a quiet person, so I don't know why it would have this effect.

I've been sleeping on my back with a pillow setup which takes me about 10 minutes to get right! :D I end up using a total of 6-7 pillows, no joke!
Title: Re: HELP! need sleep suggestions post TTT
Post by: cholt on September 07, 2005, 01:40:04 AM
Hi, I had similar problems.  I couldn't sleep for so long because of severe leg cramping after my LR.  I tried everything including morphine, demerol w/ phenergan, Lortab, Darvocet, and more.  I also hate pain meds but was desparate.  The best sleep I got was in my recliner with Tylenol PM.  I took 3 not 2.  I would sleep for about 4-5 hours straight which was wonderful.  Now I sleep on my side with a pillow between my legs.  I can still sleep better on my couch than anywhere else.  I have a new bed too!  My couch though has a back that can support me on my side.  Good Luck!

Cindy
Title: Re: HELP! need sleep suggestions post TTT
Post by: Nekomimi on September 07, 2005, 04:50:10 AM
tylenol pm is the same thing as benadryl :)  glad someone else has learned this trick as well!

tylenol pm=benadryl=diphenhydramine
Title: Re: HELP! need sleep suggestions post TTT
Post by: alacy on September 08, 2005, 01:23:49 AM
I am going to buy Tylenol PM ASAP! I am still waking up 2 times a night. I am using pillows when I sleep on my side and that seems to help.

The pain varies day by day. I have been using Motrin most of the time and the Darvocet when it's bad. But depending on the pain sometimes that won't help. WILL THIS EVER STOP HURTING????? My OS did warn me that some patients have cronic pain after this surgery if there is to much damange to the under side of the patella.  I'm hoping that is not the case for me.

Thanks for all the advise,

Anna
 
Title: Re: HELP! need sleep suggestions post TTT
Post by: cholt on September 08, 2005, 05:45:50 AM
Anna,

I sure do understand the pain being so bad that nothing helps.  I didn't sleep for about 3 weeks after my surgery.  I would get maybe 2 hrs a night.  It was horrible.  I tried every pain med there was.  I had a lot of cramping in my calf.  Like the kind of cramps you have when you are little.  Always worse at night.  Always kept me up, I would just rock and cry.  A heating pad did help more than anything else.  Also my husband would massage it and it would get some relief. 

Believe it or not, you will get better.  I didn't think I ever would!  Ask your GP or OS if you can take Tylenol PM and add one of your pain pills also.  I did, and it helped more.  Also, remember the heat.  It did help.
Good Luck!

Cindy
Title: Re: HELP! need sleep suggestions post TTT
Post by: annaliese on September 08, 2005, 10:20:36 AM
Hey Anna,

Glad to hear you're getting some sleep at last and that you got some meds from your GP.  Remember, if you need the meds, take them.  Living in constant pain is extremely unpleasant and trying to get into your post-op rehab in constant pain won't help you recover either.  Hang in there - I'm 8 weeks post-op and my only pain now is when i try and straighten my leg.

Cindy - my asthma meds give me leg cramps in my calf, but for some reason only in my left one ( which is the recently operated leg!).  My GP recommended magnesium supplements to stop the cramping, particularly for post-op when a calf cramp would be even more unbearable in a brace.  Thank goodness for magnesium tablets - they do actually work and I haven't had a calf cramp in about 18months.

Take care all and sweet dreams!
AnnaLiese
Title: Re: HELP! need sleep suggestions post TTT
Post by: cholt on September 08, 2005, 01:29:18 PM
Annaliese,

Thanks for the info.  I sure do wish my Dr. had know or suggested trying that.  I am 2 months post-op now and feeling much better.  Just getting sleep makes all the difference in the world.  Wishing Relief for ALL!

Cindy
Title: Re: HELP! need sleep suggestions post TTT
Post by: alacy on September 08, 2005, 02:19:40 PM
I tried the Tylenol PM last night and it helped. I also got a different brace yesterday because my patella was sublexing. OUCH! This new one supports both sides of the patella. I have to tell ya it makes a difference. I think the pain is really going to get better without the patella continuing to move around.

I want to thank all of you for your great advise. How's it going with your recovery and PT?


Have a GREAT pain free day!
Anna
Title: Re: HELP! need sleep suggestions post TTT
Post by: annaliese on September 18, 2005, 02:47:42 AM
Hey all,

I'm so glad to hear everyone's getting some sleep! 

Re the cramps - I saw a different doctor last week who said that apparently things like Mylanta (antacids/milk of magnesia - not sure what it's called in the USA) have magnesium and aluminium in them, and may work also.  Personally, I tried mylanta liquid and I've found that they don't have enough magnesium and work out to be more expensive than the magnesium tablets anyway.

My left knee is giving me hell because it is a cold rainy and windy weekend here in Auckand, NZ. Does anyone else notice that they get more pain and joint stiffness when it's going to rain?  My right knee used to ache before it rains, and now it is the left one that screams instead!  The pain is usually around where the drain went into the hole left by the arthroscope...my scar looks great! 

Also - seeing as I am 9 weeks post-op from my LR/TTT/PFR, is anyone else noticing tightness in their LR region?  I still don't have a lot of feeling if I press the skin above the LR region and it feels like a fully stretched rubber band during some exercises!

My PT is still concerned about my moderate quads wasting/atrophy - I can't use the leg extension machine because it hurts my screws too much.  I tried it on Friday at PT and after two extensions at zero weight, Sid and Nancy the screws were making me scream with pain.  The good news is that I'm up to 20kg on the leg press with both legs and 5kg with the left leg - hopefully by next week it will be 10kg with the left leg. 

I can also now do about 4km on the stationary bike at level 6 resistance with little trouble - the LR site feels tight and weird, but I can do it with no pain and that's fantastic!

Take care all, and keep us posted!  Photos coming shortly at http://spaces.msn.com/members/annalieseknee/
Title: Re: HELP! need sleep suggestions post TTT
Post by: alacy on September 25, 2005, 01:15:25 AM
Annaliese,

How's the knee? I understand about the aching, screaming knee when it's damp and raining. I feel the same way. We have had a lot of rain and I am sick of the pain. Today I kneeled for the first time. OUCH! I won't be doing that again. It's been almost three months.....I think I am on the mend. I am walking with almost no limp. Still wearing a brace but, it helps.

Hope you're doing well
Anna
Title: Re: HELP! need sleep suggestions post TTT
Post by: Phouin on July 04, 2018, 07:38:52 AM
I apologize for bump an old topic from the dead, just have a few interesting observations from personal experience, maybe someone will need this information in the future.
I also had trouble sleeping, and was up every 3 to 4 hrs for the 1st 3 weeks. I would take a pain pill to get thru it, go for a walk to loosen up my stiff leg, would sleep laying down, or with 2 pillows under my upper back or on a recliner, and basically do whatever I could to get some sleep. I dd find that sleeping on my sofa 1/2 the night did help, as it is not as firm and that made my leg more comfortable. Around 3 to 4 weeks out things got better, was able to sleep on non-operated side or stomach for a bit longer. Still got up about every 4 to 5 hrs now. 2 days from now I will be at 5 weeks, and am sleeping at 5 to 6 hrs, and only take a pain pills at bedtime. For me I noticed a lot of progress between week 4 and 5. Can't wait till 6 weeks when I am cleared for full weight bearing and no crutches.I also have a lot of experience with recliners!!! ;) Actually we have both a recliner of Dorel  and a fold out couch in the bus. If not for the grandkids camping out with us I would just get 2 lazyboys and get rid of the couch. I still might. As my wife can attest to, I can sleep in a recliner easier than that fold out couch. Maybe when we get some new recliners for the house I'll move the old ones into the bus. I got em broke in now!!
Title: Re: HELP! need sleep suggestions post TTT
Post by: davidroy50 on May 11, 2019, 05:03:08 AM
Taking medicine or sleeping pill is not a good solution for sleep. You have to maintain a few things to get a good night sleep such as use a good mattress, keep the room temperature comfortable, turn off all the lights, avoid digital devices like mobile phone, wifi router, etc, take a little workout or exercise before bed, etc. You can also use a recliner chair for better sleeping. I personally use a recliner chair for sleeping. I bought this recliner from this website http://www.chairsadvisor.com/best-recliner-for-sleeping/ (http://www.chairsadvisor.com/best-recliner-for-sleeping/). There are some other sleeping factors such as daily exercise, proper diet, maintain sleep routine, etc.
Title: Re: HELP! need sleep suggestions post TTT
Post by: John42 on May 11, 2019, 03:29:39 PM
Hi David Roy 50

I always recommend sleeping with a cushion/pillow between your knees - this take the strain/pain away from the injured knee.   Try it and the best of luck with your recovery.

How did you sustain your knee injury?   Where do you live?

Best/ JohnK/ Manchester UK
Title: Re: HELP! need sleep suggestions post TTT
Post by: falo.donq on July 31, 2020, 02:45:46 PM
<p>Taking medication or sleeping pills isn't a good sleep option. You have to do a few things in order to have a decent night's sleep, such as having a nice pillow, keeping the bed temperature cool, shutting off all the lamps, eliminating wireless gadgets such as smartphones, wifi routers, etc. A recliner chair may also be used for easier sleeping. I usually sleep on a recliner mattress. I saw the guide for a <a href="https://modarso.com/best-recliners-for-sleeping/">good sleeping recliner</a> and bought one. There are several other sleeping considerations like daily exercise, a healthy diet, regular sleep care, etc.</p>
Title: Re: HELP! need sleep suggestions post TTT
Post by: kris79 on September 19, 2020, 09:44:12 AM
Hi David Roy 50

I always recommend sleeping with a cushion/pillow between your knees - this take the strain/pain away from the injured knee.   Try it and the best of luck with your recovery.

How did you sustain your knee injury?   Where do you live?

Best/ JohnK/ Manchester UK

Why not get a good recliner which goes soft on your knees and doesn't put much pressure either. A power where you don't have to make use of your knees to make adjustments to the position. These ones can move with the touch of a button and are easy on the muscles and joints as well. I read some of these powered recliners over here, https://www.hod9.com/best-reclining-chair-for-elderly/,  and they look pretty well. The one from the ANJ Home helps you almost stand on your feet without putting any pressures on your knees.