KNEEtalk

The LIBRARY => NOTES - Your success stories => Topic started by: amdre on October 23, 2005, 03:12:49 AM

Title: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on October 23, 2005, 03:12:49 AM
i just damaged mine and my doc didnt give me much hope so i was wondering if someone out there can.

thanks
Andre
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: finzy on November 29, 2005, 11:58:17 AM
hey Andre, I was just scanning the boards and found your post by chance. I had peroneal nerve palsy which caused foot drop. I am not sure how yours developed but mine came after knee surgery, on the opposite knee of the surgery(go figure) I was sitting for a long period of time at a banquet. and by the end of the night I could not lift my foot. it was all very strange indeed. after about 3 months of various tests for just about everything under the sun...finally had a knee mri which showed a bakers cyst which was most likely the culprit. dr went in and cleaned up the frayed cartililage which was causing the irritation and cyst. and slowly but surely the nerve came back. and no more foot drop.Have you had an emg test? this is done by a neurologist and it ia the best way to check and see wether the nerve is damaged beyond repair. when I had mine done about a month after the foot drop started he could tell by the testing he did that the nerver did get crunched(his words) somehow but that it was still working just needed time and no more pressure on it. I was told to avoid crossing legs, and sitting with anything right up against the back of my knee for that would irritate the nerve.
  not sure if any of this helps in your particular case but I just wanted to let you know that my nerve healed up just fine and I have not had any further problems with foot drop.
 good luck! 

Peggy
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on November 30, 2005, 04:40:07 PM
thank you for the reply finzy. i suffered a knee dislocation during a football and tore pretty much ever muslce surrounding the knee, three ligaments plus the nerve. i had surgery to repair the muscle and one of the three ligaments. when the doc went in he said the nerve was still intact but it seemed to be bruised or even crushed and told me i may never walk properly again and may not play football again.i had an EMG done about 5 weeks after and their was no communication from the nerves to the muscles. he said there was about 20cm of difunction going on and about an 1inch of damage to the nerve(not sure how he got those numbers) he also said that recovery, if any, would take up to 200 days estimating a mm aday for regeneration. i was wondering if 200 days past or even a year pasts should i count myself out from being apart of the positive statistics? i havent really heard of anyone recovering fully from this type of injury.

thank you so much for your response
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: JG on December 10, 2005, 04:23:32 PM
Amdre,

Here is a website of a guy who has a similar situation.  I actually had peroneal decompression surgery in May.  I've had so many surgeries on my left knee and I tend to grow scar tissue.  The scar tissues basically strangled the nerve until I started developing drop foot. 

Your situation is much more serious with the dislocation.  You might want to contact this guy, he seem sto know a lot about damage to the nerve versus just compression type injuries.

http://www.victoryvinny.com/knee/knee.html

Janice
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: globalrecon on January 13, 2006, 06:23:03 PM
Amdre,

I read your post and had to register for this site and reply.

I had a similar injury as yourself.  On Dec 11 1993 (12 years ago) I dislocated my left knee in a wrestling match.  The Popliteal Artery along with the peroneal nerve were crushed.  I had no pulse in my leg below my knee for nearly an hour, until the ER doc reduced the dislocation.  Luckily the pulse returned otherwise amputation could have been a result.  Diagnossis was a blown ACL, PCL, LCL a torn MCL and a fractured Fibula as well as the peroneal nerve damage.  I was told the same thing you were Post op.  All the Doc's said I will be lucky if I were to ever walk remotely normal again.  It was predicted that my wrestling career was over and that I probablly would never be able to run as I use to for wrestling practice.  The tests showed no to little peroneal nerve regeneration would ever occur and I would have to wear an AFO for the remainder of my life.  I was refered to one of the best OS in the pacific Northwest Dr. Peter Mandt who has worked with the U.S. ski team, seahawks and many other teams and such, luckily for me.  Dr. Mandt conuslted many renowned Doc's and even flew one in from somewhere (cant remember where). After ~ 8 hr's in the OR the "global reconstruction" was complete and I had 2 alographs done from 2 different donor's for my ACL and PCL.  After many months of painfull rehab and many phycological bouts I was able to walk with crutches.  I rehabed very rigorusly and was able to return to Wrestling the following year, with the AFO for the remainder of high school (I never returend to football though b/c it was too risky with all the cutting thats done).  I was never my self again on the wrestling mat but at least I was back doing what I loved.  I had to ride the stationary bike while my temates ran for the remainder of my high school career.  I was unable to lift my foot without the AFO until my Freshman year in College, the nerve had taken 3 years to regenerate enough to walk without the AFO.  But the Point here is it did regenerate.  If you do you physical therapy until you cant stand to do it any more, then do it more you can over come this.  I didnt even do my therapy enough, I wish I had b/c I may have even more dorsiflexion if I had.  My frshman year in college I was recruited by the track coach while lifiting in the weight room, he wanted me to throw the shot, javilin and discus.  The following year he wanted me to run x-country to train for track and I was actually able to run with success, I was awarded 2x's as the most improved male athlete on the team once my College running carreer was over and at nearly 180 lbs (a huge runner) had recorded a 6.13 min/mile average over a 10k race.  12 years down the road I have yet to have another knee surgery and I can walk, run, snowboard and just about anything I want.  Ive heard of and have friends that have only torn thier ACLs that have had numerous surgeries.  With hard work and dedication you can over come anything.  Yes I still have some pain and I still have drop foot but hey I cant even remember what it was like to have a normal knee.

Jake
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on January 21, 2006, 02:05:31 PM
Hey Jake

thanks for the post and the inspiration to continue. during the holidays and up to the present time i have been getting alot of motor skills back. with help from my calve muslces i can evert my foot and i can feel the pathways in my foot opening up when i try dorsiflexion. i have to sit out another year from sports due to the nerve damage but i am determined to play again in 2007 for sure. i was wondering if you or anyone knows diferrent kind of therapies that would help[ i n the nerve regeneration .....i have been doing hyperbaric oxygen,and using oxygen carriers to maximize the blood flow and oxygen that the nerve recieves. is there any other therapies i can do to help stimulate the nerve and activate the unused muscles through stimulation of the nerve?
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: soccerdoc on February 14, 2006, 02:36:33 AM
 amdre,

Just saw the post and Jake is right.  I am 12 years post peroneal crush type injury on my good leg.  This was not the result of a serious injury or post opertive complication.  Initally, due to the foot drop and other symptoms a couple of neurosurgeon friends were sure this was from a spine problem.  It wasn't and the PT I saw was also an cerified athletic trainer.  It was very frustrating but eventually I started to improve.I resumed refereeing using an AFO and with aggressive therapy and then more I recovered over a 12- 24 month period.  It sounds as if you are doing all the right stuff, nerve regeneration takes time and it can very frustrating as you know.  Timeframes are estimates speaking as a hopeless optimist.  In head trauma rehab the standard used to be that recovery happens over 2 years and that's it, then gain in certain cognitive functions were being documented 5 years post-injury.  The late gains were miodest but gains none the less.  In my experience this is true for nerve regeneration in some cases.

Keep your spirits up and as Jake said work hard and then work harder.  Best of luck with the rehab..................jim
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on February 22, 2006, 10:06:16 PM
Hey SoccerDoc

I have taken the adice of Jake and continued to work hard in theapy...honestly i was on the verge of giving up becuase i had no improvement.Until last week ..it was actually a week and four months after the injury ..i got my first motor function back. My peroneal tendon is now acitive and i am able to evert my foot.... still no dorsiflexion though. i was very excited to see some kind of improvementand now my confidence level is through the roof.i keep pics and daily logs to note my progress ...so if i get down again it will remind me on how far i have come.
For others who have had the same injury and need hlp deciding on different theraputic wys of handling this injury..i have done:

-Hyperbaric Oxygen Chambers daily for 3 months right after and now 2-3 times a week for hours aday
 this is used to speed up and circulate the blood flow in the body and induce natural healing with the high pressured 100% clean intake of oxygen.

-Frequent Specific MicroCurents 3times a week or the first 3 months and off and on there after
used to stimulate the frequency of the nerve and break up scar tissuse formed around the nerve after surgery.

-Neuro electric  muscle stimulationdaily( i bought a 150$ unit)
Used to stim the inactive muscles which the peroneal nerve controls and help stim the Quads.because of the injury i suffered i cannot work those muscle mself safely so i need to stimulate them until my other leg muscles become stronger.

-Water Therapy once a week at my school pool
use it for training...since i cannot run on land i run in the deep end of the pool wih floation devices..this helps my cardio and gets my body active again.i also soak in the pool and just use the gravity off the pool to help trick the nerve into movement...thats just something i do not sure if it works but i am willing to try anything.

-i have also used Oxygen carriers to maximize the amount of oxygen my blood cells can hold and carry throughout the body.
This with the HBO Therapy i think have helped the most with my recovery so farI

I am not recommending any of these treatments to anyone just listing the types of things i go through incase people are wondering what kind of treatment is out there for such an injury as nerve damage.since i live in canada the price tag is next to nothing but the time is the most important. it is hard to find the time for all of the therapy but i just keep telling myself if i give the injry all the ingredients to heal then it will heal. I am not fully healed yet but i know i will be. And Thank You Jake for sparking my confidence and giving me the stregth to get back into therapy and really work at it. and thank you for the esponse soccerdoc...good luck to everyone in your battles with recovery.
_
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: soccerdoc on April 23, 2006, 02:03:12 AM
Hi Amdre,

Geez just saw this, my apologies for missing it.  You have done a great job on the rehab and looking at ways to maximize your recovery.  In the states it is different story getting insurance to cover some of the things you listed.  But what you have by looking for other things you can do to facilitate a maximum recovery is the ideal.  Goo d show.  So how are you doing now?  I am a big fan of "neuro-electric stimulators" btw.  Hope things are progressing for you.  Take care..........jim
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on April 24, 2006, 04:33:18 AM
Hey Jim,

how r ya?....im not too bad these days still in recovery mode and was making alot of progress. this past month i seemed to have hit a staggered point in my recovery. this month i havent noticed any real siignifcant changes in feeling and sensation nor strength in the dorsi flexion..Eversion is getting strong doctor thinks other muscls are compensating too much so i need to try and retrin myself to not use them as much...(calf muscles).. i believe (but could be wrong) that the nerve has regenerated enough for a small signal but it is not enough to initiate any sort of contraction. the reason for these wishful thoughts is because of the consistent shocks and jolts i get constantly some to the point of pain.(hopefully its a good thing..so the doctors say). you said you had a n.e.m.s unit...what type of frequency does yours run off of  and does it initiate a contraction for you? when i used it when i firrst got injured on the highest frequency i couldnt feel a thing. now i can but it takes a machine with alot of juice.
Hows your recovery doing and have you heard of any recovery stories......i want to try and find as many as possble to help keep peoples spirits alive. for me its hard always gotta look and see my old self to remeber where i was. thanks alot for the reply keep me posted.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: soccerdoc on April 24, 2006, 05:02:54 AM
Hey Amdre,

Glad to hear you are still in recovery mode.  The over-compensation and advice from your doc to try and retrain your muscle recruitment is good.  As to the NEMS unit, mine was a rental from the physio and I don't recall the brand or model but he is a friend and I can ask him.  When my peroneal nerve was recovering and regenerating I had periods of very intense pain, the sensations were a deep aching, burning and what I called zingers..shock like.  A neurosurgeon friend said it was not unusual.  You might want to look into using surface EMG monitoring (aka emg biofeedback) to see if you can enhance neuromotor signaling.  This has been used in stroke rehab and there is no reason it could not be done with a series of surface electrodes. 

My peroneal nerve is fully recovered.  My left medial compartment is trashed but I am still able to do virtually all activities.  My good knee the right one is showing some arthritic changes, has a posterior syst that is a buggar at times but I want to defer an arthroscopy until Late November if possible.  All in all I think things are going well.

Hang in there, look into the emg stuff and I'll find out what nems unit I had.  Take care
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on May 15, 2006, 07:53:45 AM
Hello All,

I don't know whether you are all still monitoring this thread but can I join you.  I have recently been diagnosed with foot drop ollowing knee surgery on the 7th April so I am very much in the early stages.  No therepy has been discussed with me yet other than rest and close monitoring.  I am at the stage of, I prefer the foot to work with no pain but will have pain for a functioning foot.  Hope you are all recovering well.  Jacky
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: soccerdoc on May 15, 2006, 06:31:45 PM
Jacky.

Sorry to hear about the foot  drop.  Do you have any other nerve symptoms, sensory changes, etc.  Nerve injuries take a long time.  Has your OS given you a time frame of any sort? 
jim
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on May 15, 2006, 08:25:50 PM
Jim,

Thank you for replying.  I have occasional 'twitches'.  When the skin is touched on the outside of my leg it shudders like it would when you have a temperature, the top of my foot is numb, I still get very purple toes when my foot is down.  It is very painful to put the foot to the ground.  I have feeling - too much feeling but I suspect that is good. 

Both times the plaster cast has been removed my foot has dramatically fallen and I have had to have entenox for them to lift the foot back into postion for the plaster cast to be replaced. 

The OS has not given any time frame.  I don't know what questions to ask. 

The fact that I have feeling suggests that everything will return in due course.  I am expecting the plaster to be removed next week as the op site has healed well but they won't leave the foot hanging there like a soggy end will they?

Thank you Jacky
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on May 16, 2006, 06:19:07 PM
GOOD NEWS - my mum was speaking to a physio today who said that nerves that are stretched heal with a little time and physio and should be back to walking normally in no time.  ( a provisio was given that no notes had been seen and just general advice) Worrying unnecessarily!!!  Jak
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: soccerdoc on May 16, 2006, 10:53:52 PM
Hey Jacky....

Good news lad, and no they shouldn't leave the foot hanging like a soggy end.  As nerves recover there is often excessive sensation, pain etc as the fibers are sorting their connections out.  What is the OS saying in terms of NWB or PWB?  If you are PWB they may want to use  an AFO but that's something the OS and phsyio will work out.  Be patient, bruised, stretched or injured nerves heal slowly, usually more slowly than we would like..  Hang in there and take care.

jim
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: rozzzie on May 18, 2006, 11:33:18 PM
Quite a while ago, I fell and cracked the fibula right where the peronal nerve crosses, also a very bad sprain.  It took 6 months but I did get rid of the food drop.  I had the ankle in a cast for 6 weeks then I had an AFO (ankle foot orthodic) to allow me to walk.  I think I had about 4 months of PT.  It is possible to recover from this. 

Have you had an EMG to check on the health of the nerve?

Wishing you the best.

Rozzzie
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on May 19, 2006, 02:45:30 PM
Thanks soccardoc and Rozzie,

I see my surgeon on Monday.  I have already been in a cast for 6 weeks and go for intensive physio for two weeks on the 5th June.  I will see what the surgeon says on Monday re if any tests are necessary - you never know when the cast comes off this time it may be all healed! (always the optimist)  i know I have some hard work physio wise ahead but that is OK and doesn't phase me.  Thank you and will post monday with the result.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on August 18, 2006, 02:37:35 AM
Hey all,

good too hear from all of you and hope you still check in now and then...sorry for the late post ..just been very busy.
as you recommended jak ...i was able to see another nerve specialist for another EMG (8months after the injury) unfortunately his readings were not to my liking. he told me that he was still getting no reaction response from the peroneal nerve to the "tib ant" muscle. i dont know if he doesnt know how to read it properly or what  but i have motor function in my foot again. i can evert and invert fully with strength and know i can dorsi flex half way with little strength. when i asked how i was pulling up ..he again said compensation. "that my body must be finding unique ways to dorsi flex" i think its a bunch of bull and wondering if neone knows any other way you can dorsi flex without the tib ant muscle activating. and to j smioo1 keep your head up ...a of mine i played football with stretched his peroneal nerve as well..took him a 2years to recovery (mainly because of severe ligament damage as well)but he is back playing..i think he still has trouble moving his big toe but other than that he is fully functional. just work hard and always remember you are progressing everyday. when i got down i would think of how far i have gotten since i first got injured and just keep going. still not giving up and it will be one year in september since the injury. nerves take time ...now is time to test your patience stamina and drive.

good luck all hope to hear from you soon.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on August 19, 2006, 11:06:10 AM
Thanks for the very much needed encouragement.  I am now able to invert and evert my foot.  I have a twitch in my tibulas (?)  physio speak but looks like the tendon to the big toe.  I am now fully weight bearing and will shortly be going onto two walking sticks instead of the the crutches.  As you rightly say - note all the progresses made and look back two weeks not two days.  Hope you are continue to progress.  I am currently on two weeks intensive physio and making the most of it.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on August 21, 2006, 12:49:25 AM

"Thanks for the very much needed encouragement.  I am now able to invert and evert my foot.  I have a twitch in my tibulas (?)  physio speak but looks like the tendon to the big toe.  I am now fully weight bearing and will shortly be going onto two walking sticks instead of the the crutches.  As you rightly say - note all the progresses made and look back two weeks not two days.  Hope you are continue to progress.  I am currently on two weeks intensive physio and making the most of it."

hey man keep up the good work and keep me posted on your recovery...not only does it keep me motivated but im sure othesr may benefit from the good news as well. at the begining stages all i heard was non sense from people that are supposed to be highly educated. defy the odds and recover from this set back..its just another obstacle that we can overcome. and like always i will keep yall informed of my progress...i may be alittle delayed but i will continue to reply.

take care everyone.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on September 09, 2006, 11:13:58 PM
Hello again everyone

I am updating readers on my progress. Football season has started and unfortunately i have to sit out this year but i was given a glimps of hope from my docs that once doubted any nerve regeneraion. i saw my OS and Nerve specialist on sat the 2nd of september/06 to see if the movement in my foot (dorsiflexion and eversion) are a result of compensation or infact nerve and muscle activity and also to check the stability of the LCL and postiolateral compartment surgery. The way they approached my injury was too repair one thing at a time to allow for better recovery in the LCL due to the amount of damaged suffered. it has ben a year since the first surgery and the postiolateral compartment is rock solid. both the doctors have cleared me for ACL surgery and more extensive rehab to strengthen the weak Tibialas anterior muscle and strengthen the nerve response by sending signals back to the brain instead of from the brain to the nerve they have also coordinated alot of different ways of retrainning the nerve.Still cannot lift big toe and balance (eyes closed) iof injured legg is very unstable (still weak signals cannot tell how much weight i need on foot). dorsiflexion is now at 55 degrees compared to 80 degrees on my good foot. ankle motor skill is coming back the main concern now is strength. in regards to the clearance for the acl surgery.. the doctors felt it would be a useless surgery if i still had paralysis in my left leg. If everything goes well the Docs have given me hope to play again next year but i would have to wear a brace for the rest of my sporting life. holding on to hope and staying focused on a big recovery.

Good luck to everyone
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on September 10, 2006, 09:17:32 AM
Hey Amdre,

This is excellent news, especially when you look back to your earlier posts.  55 degrees dorsiflexion is very good.  Do you still have your AFO to walk?  What rehab exercises are you doing to strengthen the tibialas anterior muscle?  I can now move my toes upwards but the same as you my big toe does not join the party.  I continue to struggle with building up my quad and hamstring but also have numbness at the rear outside of my thigh.  Are you fully weight bearing and do you use any walking aids.  I am now on sticks and yesterday had my first driving lesson following my injury.  I have a driving assessment week next Tuesday to see if I will be able to retain my full manual driving licence.  I am so pleased to hear of your progress and keep going - you will get there.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on September 13, 2006, 07:52:50 AM
Hey Amdre,

This is excellent news, especially when you look back to your earlier posts.  55 degrees dorsiflexion is very good.  Do you still have your AFO to walk?  What rehab exercises are you doing to strengthen the tibialas anterior muscle?  I can now move my toes upwards but the same as you my big toe does not join the party.  I continue to struggle with building up my quad and hamstring but also have numbness at the rear outside of my thigh.  Are you fully weight bearing and do you use any walking aids.  I am now on sticks and yesterday had my first driving lesson following my injury.  I have a driving assessment week next Tuesday to see if I will be able to retain my full manual driving licence.  I am so pleased to hear of your progress and keep going - you will get there.

Hey J_smi001,
Good to hear from you again and glad your healing is coming along.that dang big toe ha..haha its pretty stubborn.but in response to your question about "tib ant" strengthening. first we do full a full leg warmup and then workout to strengthen the leg as a unit and to keep the activity and blood flowing. once that is done i am put on this half moon shaped board with my injured foot in a seperate foot strap. on the half moon (i forget what it is called i will find out 2morrow when i go in) there are attachments for resistance these attachments go all the way around the board(180degrees) your foot which is in the strap is placed in the middle of the board and a resistence band is attached to your foot so you can pull(eversion and inversion) then on that same board there is an 6inch 1cm thick pole in the middle of the half moon just behind where you originally placed your foot for the other exercises. lift your foot and place your heal on it(the shoe strap has a place for the pole to keep your foot from sliding off) your foot is now off the ground and angle toes facing the ground.the resistance band is put on the front of the shoe strap and now you start lifting up against the band.once i get to as far as i can get to ...i am assited or "spotted" my therapist will fully dorsi flex my fott for me and then once she lets go i hold it in its dorsiflexed state for as long as i can....this is repeated until fatigue. proprioception balancing on one foot with eyes open and closed to help retrain the muscle in the foot for balance. muscle stimulation..we have been doing this since i lost the function just because we needed to keep the muscle alive even though it was not functional. always keep it alive was what i was told so ive jjust been constantly trying to pull it up. almost to the point of making it an obsession..lol. there is not too much you can do for the muscle until you start getting nerve response so the main focus is to make the nerve muscle response as great as it can be. so try tricking the nerve to work .when you pull your foot down past its resting point it automatically springs back to its resting point. try pulling down and use that natural momentum to dorsiflex.another way is to ly on your stomach bend your leg at a 90 degree angle and use gravity as your aid and pulldown instead of up. use a mirror an practice walking heal to toe and the push off.try not to compensate with hip hiking. just some ideas that my therapist have done with me and we have been making good progess and i really trust what they have been doing. yes i still wear my afo when i go out of the house otherwise no. i can weight bear and walk fine normal without it ..but the shoe is heavy and i fatigue fast and then my foot will strat to hang again. sorry for the novel..just trying to explain everything the best i can...so you can understand if you are willing to inquire more about the different methods. hey tand thats wicked news about your driving test hope all goes well. its a great sign that you can move your toes up its gonna come back. i started noticing the ability to evert and then my toes and slowly starting noticing dorsiflexion.We can do this We are only getting better.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on September 27, 2006, 04:54:24 PM
OK I had physio today and took a copy of your last message with me.  Now perhaps that was not such a good idea as today i felt as though I was being trained for the next olympics.  The pull down and srping back one is great and I now do this is the hydro pool as well and with the water boyancy you can really trick yourself (never mind the foot) that it is starting to wwork normally.  I PASSED my driving, just restricted to driving whilst wearing an AFO.  I drive better than I walk!  The exercises are coming on great and I have 10 degrees dorsiflexion and can abduct my toes, no less!  I have been told to expect a nettle sting type pain as the nerve regrows - did you experience this?  Let me know how you are progressing - you are a real help to my rehab and thank you for that.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amberjade on October 01, 2006, 08:52:07 PM
Hi just picked up on these posts and if anyone still looks in can they help please. I fell off my horse at start of summer and broke 3 ribs and damaged sple :o :'(en and pancreas, when I was discharged from hospital I spent sumer weeks on Morphine recovering, 4 weeks ago I went to get out of bed and fell, my leg was and is dead knee down and I have complete foot drop. My Dr sent me to emergency... I had a large, hot hard swelling just below knee where I guess nerve damage site is? I have a caliper and manage ok but no improvement in 4 weeks. I go for a series of tests on 23 Oct and see os following week. Biggest change of life for me is that no way can I drive. Not helped that my middle child fell off her horse between my original accident and foot drop!!!! Any hope or advice or things I should be asking, thanks Amber
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on October 02, 2006, 07:16:36 PM
Amberjade,

Welcome to this thread and really hope you join Amdre and myself discussing the little improvements towards the goal of full recovery.  Please let us know how your appoitment goes on the 23rd.  Will be keeping everything crossed for you (except big toe on right foot!) Lets hope you regain some sensation as the swelling goes down.  I don't know about Amdre but my whole leg is not numb from the knee down, only numbness follows the track of the peroneal nerve.  sending you good vibes and much luck Jak
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on October 06, 2006, 05:38:09 PM
Please let me join you on this thread.

Six weeks ago I was rugby training when I suffered a knee injury. Not quite sure how it happened as I was only running and nobody touched me. But basically the head broke off my fibula and I dislocated my knee, tearing my ACL completely and also damaged my Posterolateral Corner and Peroneal nerve. I am now 5 weeks post op from PLC reconstruction and repair to fibula. I have no dorsiflexion or eversion and the muscles down my shin and on the top of my foot are numb. The surgion says that the nerve was stretched quite considerably but was still intact. I do get pins and needles in my foot and in my toes, quite bad sometimes. Is this good?

once I get the required flexion in my knee of 110 degrees the OS will be looking at doing the ACL reconstruction.

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on October 06, 2006, 06:12:30 PM
Hamish,
First, welcome.  Second, oh dear poor you that sounds painful.  My nerve was stretched 6 months ago and I did start to get a bit anxious as I had no dorsiflexion, eversion or inversion, mine was described as complete drop foot.  It can be a worrying sight but nerves do take a long time and I keep getting told by very knowledgeable physio's that 12 months is the real time. I had very odd sensations in my foot but I was told that it was not necessarily nerve re-generating.  There are no two ways about it though as it comes back it is painful (in my experience).  I have 10mg of amiltriptyline to calm the nerves down at night to give me some sleep.  A stretched nerve should come back but this is not going to be quick.  The other good news is that you become better able to adapt to it and then it does not seem quite so bad.  With my splint there is little I can't do.  Now I have a little more foot movement I am to progress to a toe off splint that allows me to use what dorsiflexion I have.  Hope this is helpful and hang in there.  Another tip I was given, and  have no idea whether it helped or not, but talk to your foot and ask it to move and also stroke down the route of the peroneal nerve to try and encourage it.  Jak
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on October 06, 2006, 07:01:34 PM
Thanks Jake,

I have started talking to my foot and stroking my leg already, I'm getting some strange looks. Thanks for the advise, reading through the posts it is becoming apparent this will take some time and I will just have to keep at it. Probably need to stop worrying and concentrate on my knee in the short term.

Cheers
Hamish

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: moriahj20 on October 06, 2006, 09:52:38 PM
hi,
 i just found this message board and i am SO glad i did!!  i tore one of my peroneal nerves in an accident about 2 1/2 months ago resulting in foot drop. a metal pole went about 5 inches into my leg and hit the nerve. no one - not the ER doc, my neurosurgeon, his nurse practioner - would give me ANY idea if i would ever get rid of the foot drop but my new physical therapist who is wonderful told me that it will heal and i will be able to walk normal again, but that it will take a long time. reading all of your posts confirms that. i went through about 3 weeks of the worst pain i could ever imagine but i am past that now and my walking is improving each day. the physical therapy is working wonders. i haven't gotten a whole lot more range of motion in my ankle since the accident but then again, its only been a couple months. i just moved to a new state and have an appointment with a new neuro on the 13th and will probably have another EMG soon. i am told this will indicate how well the nerve is healing. i wish i knew more about what to expect but this board has helped so so much. thanks to all who posted!
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on October 06, 2006, 10:06:44 PM
Hamish and Moriahj20,

hamish - can I suggest you don't talk to your foot and stroke it in public - otherwise your foot drop will be the least of your worries!  Also have you had an EMG to test your nerve function? 

Moriahj - Best of luck at the second EMG and hope for a positive result for you that some nerve reaction is there.  With range of motion in your ankle I suspect you are referring to being able to dorsiflex - left the foot upwards?  If so after two months this is a very good sign.  Take care both and have a good weekend.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: moriahj20 on October 06, 2006, 10:53:18 PM
j_smi001,
thank you so much for responding! yes by range of motion i did mean dorsiflex - lifting it upwards. i can go about halfway. ive been told the nerve is still functioning (from the doctor that administered the emg and from my neurosurgeon) so i guess thats pretty good. i am optimistic that one day i'll walk without limping. thanks again for the encouragement!
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amberjade on October 07, 2006, 01:39:22 PM
Hi all Amber here!! Not feeling that good today, its the first time I have really missed and needed to drive and I have had 2 bad falls this week... I dont know why I just WENT!! As dead and numb as my leg is with no movement still I have a weird burning down side of led. Reading the new accidents on this thread  they sound horrible. Used my crutches a bit this week with the leg brace as so unsteady but this in turn has made my previously broken ribs hurt. Sorry for moaning and its hard to ask family for sympathy as it was self inflicted ( I knew horse a nightmare!!) and my bro has cancer... bad and advanced. My 12 yr old fell off her horse after my first fall and then nerve and foot drop, she had cast off last week and was in agony and feeling really rough so I took her back and saw a top consultant and he re x rayed and it stiil broken plus she has developed CRPS/RSD does anyone have experience of this. Sorry to moan going to limp / stagger to stables to feed the things!!
                  ps
                         any tips on how chat room works ?
                                   Hope you all ok  love Amber
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on October 13, 2006, 12:49:28 AM
HEY HEY ALL

sorry again for the late post.J_smi001 good to hear that you are doing really well with your recovery.its not over yet and there is more progression ahead.its gonna be awesome when you overcome this setback.to all that have joined the thread welcome and glad to hear from yall and its great to have more people share there support and experiences with others with similar or even unrelated injuries.

I am posting my latest and hopefully last operation results.Sept 26/06 i went under for the last piece of the puzzle to be fixed. i had my ACL recon. and things went well.
i am now doing rehab everyday. for the first week(wed,thurs,fri) post -op we pulled 5-to 6 hours aday they consisted of:
IFC treatment not exactly sure what it stands for but it is for swelling... 20mins
Hyvamat treatment is an electrode massage also used for swelling 20mins
stretching and bending excerises for range of motion 20mins
Cryotemp machine -pretty much all of RICE this machine wraps around your whole leg and ice water is pumped through it compressing your leg while elevated.20min
rest for 40mins then we would repeat.
at home i brought with me from the clinic a sequential pump that compresses the swelling 10mins on and then i ice for 15mins for 2 hours.

second week pretty much the same with a shortened time frame...but i felt i could start riding a bike on the a high setting. didnt work out to well ..lol knee blew up with more swelling.bike was then introduced two days later and i was able to start riding backwards with trouble going forward without cheating.
on the friday which would be oct 6 we switched from IFC to contrast bath(hot and cold tubs) to warm up and pump the swelling out.
still doing the other stuff at home.

next week ...swelling has gone down alot except in the joint and i now have about 75-80% flexion and full extension. we have now added strengthening into the mix
my day now consists of
Contrast bath 20mins 3mins hot 1 mins cold 3 times ending in hot.
bike i strated on level 13 and this week i have gotten own to 3 ....7 is a comfortable ride 3 is pushing through fo better range of motion.
stretching hamstrings ...abducters and aducters,calves glutes, it band, hip flexor and anything else i can stretch without stress on the ACL recon.
then its off to the gym everything is 3x10 we start with abducter then aducters machines then leg curls.
back in the clinic for ball squats and glute bridging (core slash/glute and hamstring workout)
VMO Muscle stimulation of the quads standing.(its done standing so we dont sheer the fibula and the head of the tib.
then IFC/HYVMAT once completed then its off to the cyro temp.
and now today we have reintroduced the all of the foot exercises.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on October 13, 2006, 01:02:18 AM
Hey there moriahj20

just read your post and i can relate to what you have gone through and what you are going through. my docs where the exact same never straight with answers and if they did have an answer it was usualy negative.so its good to hear that you have found a postive reinforcement for yourself. you sound like you are doing great in terms of recovery of a severed nerve you should get full regeneration. its slow and painful at the begining but it will keep progressing.keep us posted on your recovery.

good luck with the recovery
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on October 13, 2006, 01:13:02 AM
hey hey amberjade

First id like to say nice to hear from you and sorry to hear about your rough times at the moment .i hope you and your daughter are doing and feeling better. did they re cast her? since she is 12 she is lucky in a sense that she has age on her side for recovery and the hard part would be helping her through the rough and maybe painful times. i have chidren and i can only imagine and sympathizes for you. in regards to her nerve damage did the doctors say wheter it was severed or stretched or crushed? i hope to hear from yall soon and stay positive even though things may not be on the bright side ...eventually things will be better.

Amdre
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on October 13, 2006, 01:31:21 AM
hey there Hamish

Our injuries are some what very similar. even the approach the doctors took in repairing my damaged knee. although mine doc didnt want to do the ACL until there was sign of Nerve muscle response. mainly for the reason that if my nerve didnt come back i would have now need for an ACL. docotors logic and less work for him i guess. it was very painful at the begining stages of the injury.....from reading up on pherphrial nerve damage the shocks and tingling are supposed to be a part of the degeneration process. you be very hyper sensetive to the point that another person can shock you by just laying there hands over your injured nerve. hows your recovery coming ? i just started to get my functions back i jan-feb....i started to get eversion back(5months after injury)
then in july august  i started to regain my dorsi flexion and now have 85 degrees of flexion compared to 103 on my good foot. my last input was wrong for my good foot.
the main thing is to keep your Tibialas Anterior muscle awake by stimulating it with a neuro muscle stim. and just practice using your your bodies natural retractiong phase as a tool for pulling your foot and toes up. what i mean by this is ....if you already know then exuse the rest of this. when you pull your toes down past its original or natrual position it automatically retracts when you release.once you release try and pull up like you normally would using your bodies natural retraction.

Keep your head up and stay focused Good luck in the Recovery
Amdre
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on October 13, 2006, 03:56:52 PM
OK I had physio today and took a copy of your last message with me.  Now perhaps that was not such a good idea as today i felt as though I was being trained for the next olympics.  The pull down and srping back one is great and I now do this is the hydro pool as well and with the water boyancy you can really trick yourself (never mind the foot) that it is starting to wwork normally.  I PASSED my driving, just restricted to driving whilst wearing an AFO.  I drive better than I walk!  The exercises are coming on great and I have 10 degrees dorsiflexion and can abduct my toes, no less!  I have been told to expect a nettle sting type pain as the nerve regrows - did you experience this?  Let me know how you are progressing - you are a real help to my rehab and thank you for that.

Sorry for the late reply to your question J_smi001,

Just catching up on the conversations i have missed.at the begining when i first injured myself i had stinging and shocking sensations which would run from the top of my knee down. about four months after injury it went away and now and then i get them again..not as sharp or as consistent but i still get zapped now and then. my leg was also numb from mid-shin down. glad to hear about you passing your test ...there is no stopping you ..man your just progressing in every aspect. hows your toe movement?
we are experimenting with something...i dont recomenned this at all ...and ill tell you how it goes...but we have tried to stimulate and send signals to my left big toe from its start point i believe its the L5 S1 locations on your spinal cord. i can move my toes but i cannot pull my big toe up only down and the other four i can slightly do it.the other four will come...but it seems like the extension hallucis longus is to deep to stim from a point over lower leg and the dep peroneal nerve may have trouble regenerating...with out signals being sent to and from this muscle. so far i have started feeling new tingling in the toe but nothing convincing.we have been also sending signals back to the brain from the toe with hot and cold sensations and just touch...with a variety of pressure. no new improvements but its still early so ill keep you in touch. take care man and i hope to hear from you soon.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on October 13, 2006, 05:39:03 PM
Hello Amdre,

Great to hear from you.  You give me so much support and inspiration and I remain gratetful for that.  This stimulation sounds interesting and you must keep me up to date with your progress.  I am being 'promoted' to a toe off splint, which is for when you get some movement back in your foot.  Currently my splint is around the back of my leg and under the foot, the new one will be at the front of my leg, running by the outside of the ankle and under the foot.  The toe odd splint allows you to use what movement you have and encourages you to use the calf muscles, so i am quite excited by this developemt.  I now have about 25 degrees dorsi flexion so really made a hugh leap but I seemed to have plateaued now.  I can do 3km's in 10 minutes on the stationary bike - not terrific but definately coming good.  You take good care and good to have you back.  Glad you have your new acl and all went well with the op.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on October 14, 2006, 03:26:28 AM
Hello Amdre,

Great to hear from you.  You give me so much support and inspiration and I remain gratetful for that.  This stimulation sounds interesting and you must keep me up to date with your progress.  I am being 'promoted' to a toe off splint, which is for when you get some movement back in your foot.  Currently my splint is around the back of my leg and under the foot, the new one will be at the front of my leg, running by the outside of the ankle and under the foot.  The toe odd splint allows you to use what movement you have and encourages you to use the calf muscles, so i am quite excited by this developemt.  I now have about 25 degrees dorsi flexion so really made a hugh leap but I seemed to have plateaued now.  I can do 3km's in 10 minutes on the stationary bike - not terrific but definately coming good.  You take good care and good to have you back.  Glad you have your new acl and all went well with the op.

Hey J_smi001,

good to hear things are going well....and i must say that you and everyone ho have joined this post keep me going as well. from the first response of hope till now...i havent stopped and i dont think i will until i have reached my goal. and i see that you are on the same path and i commend you for that.we can help eachother defy odds and baffle these doubtful doctors with our hard work and consistency. This new brace you speak of sounds awesome.....my afo limits me and i dont get to use the dorsiflexion that i now have...so i stopped using it....but now i fatigue vey quick ...and sometimes i trip when i walk ...a brace like yours would be very useful...do you know who makes them?..i want to check around in canada for one that way i can still have support when i walk and utilizes my new found wealth..lol(dorsi flexion).
good to here the dorsi flexion is coming along well..dont be discouraged about the plateau....youve gained back so much so fast. give it some more time and you will begin to see huger(i think i made up that word) improvements. Just to tell you about today at therapy ...we tried more lumbar and deep peroneal motor point stimulation for the Extensor Hallucis Longus(EHL) and today nothing.....my therapist thinks the dmagae my still be inrepair mode so not alot of signals are getting through. so we have put it on hold until we get more signs of nerve regeneration. And they now added Walking on my heels.This has to be done accompanied by someone just incase i lose ballance and so i dont stress out the newly repaired ACL.after two and a half weeks post op i now have 114 degrees flexion compared to 135 on the good side. and full extension and still minimal swelling in the knee. I have also added a web site on my profile if you click on the globe under my user name "amdre" it will take you there.......its still under construction but should be up soon..i have videos of me playing ball and i am gathering the rest of my surgery pics to post when my doc gets back from vacation.

Take Care and i will hear from you soon
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on October 14, 2006, 07:34:29 PM
Hi,

http://www.benefitsnowshop.co.uk/shop/detail.asp?bid=&item=2645&sectionid=502

Been to your 'myspace' - very impressive.  One day you will have to explain the game to me!  You looked good and soon be back I have no doubt about that.  Sorry about the EHL test, disappointing but a mere set back on the long road to recovery. 

I have attached a web site address above to show what a toe-off splint looks like.  I don't know whether it will be of any use to you or not.  I have not got mine yet as it has to be fitted by the orthotics department but I will let you know how I get on with it once I have it.  This is a UK site but there must be Canadian ones as well.

What is your secret to regaining ROM so quickly? I reckon you could sell the secret on this site for a healthy profit (LOL). 

Just a quick post to give you the web address - take care Jak

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on October 15, 2006, 12:26:56 AM
Hi,

http://www.benefitsnowshop.co.uk/shop/detail.asp?bid=&item=2645&sectionid=502

Been to your 'myspace' - very impressive.  One day you will have to explain the game to me!  You looked good and soon be back I have no doubt about that.  Sorry about the EHL test, disappointing but a mere set back on the long road to recovery. 

I have attached a web site address above to show what a toe-off splint looks like.  I don't know whether it will be of any use to you or not.  I have not got mine yet as it has to be fitted by the orthotics department but I will let you know how I get on with it once I have it.  This is a UK site but there must be Canadian ones as well.

What is your secret to regaining ROM so quickly? I reckon you could sell the secret on this site for a healthy profit (LOL). 

Just a quick post to give you the web address - take care Jak



Hey Jak,

Much easier then writting your username ..haha , thanks for te site im gonna check it out and see if we have anything available down here.....you think i should discuss it with my Docs first to see if it could be use for me? BY ROM i am guessing you mean range of motion.....my first surgery of the posterolateral compartment i had alot of difficulties getting my ROM back due to scar tissue build up which needed to be cleared out with a scope surgery.few days after the scope i got my ROM back once the swelling subsided.they said it built up due to the lack of massaging and breaking up of the tissue. and not enough massaging in the patella. so this surgery i knew exactly what i needed to do and what my pain threshold is. Riding the stationary bike helps me out the most with range by far i can control exactly how much i want to push and i get a very good stretch when i do low settings..also riding feels good once i make a rotation because after that first time i get a rotation it just gets easier and easier. So mainly my therapy staff just told me to keep my patella mobile ...massage around the area of the surgery to break up scar tissue and keep using RICE methods at home and constant stretching and flexing of the knee. I think alot of it has to do with the lack of muscle though...i dont really have much muscle tone left....my leg has experienced alot of atrophy...so the challenge is gonna be strengthing by far.


Good to hear from you man...keep me posted as usual with everything...i will do the same
Take Care and talk to ya again soon
Andre
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amberjade on October 15, 2006, 07:56:26 PM
Hi Amber here does anyone use crutches when they have foot drop, I have air cast but they said to use crutches sometimes so I did fri nite and ankle went so I now covered in bruises!!
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on October 16, 2006, 02:19:32 PM
Hi Amber here does anyone use crutches when they have foot drop, I have air cast but they said to use crutches sometimes so I did fri nite and ankle went so I now covered in bruises!!

Hey Ambejade,

I guess it really depends on how stable you are on your injured leg..... im guessing if the docs said to use cutches sometimes then its still probably alittle precaution to keep your injury safe. you should look into getting an AFO brace to keep your foot on a 90 degree angle so you can walk without having the stepage gait(foot dangling). Usually they can be pretty cheap depending on the type you want but it will definately prevent tripping and twisting or even breaking of your ankle. sometimes when i got out of bed i would step down and twist...almost breaking my ankle...so an AFO brace is a good thing to help prevent that.

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on October 16, 2006, 08:15:53 PM
Andre gives good advice.  I am starting a walking aid collection!  I started off in a wheel chair (now dispensed with, thankfully), have elbow crutches, walking sticks - both of which are mostly redundant except for those serious shopping trips around big malls but AFO wise I have three, a Swiss AFO (most commonly used splint for foot drop), a night/resting splint that I use at night to keep the foot in a dorsiflexion position, otherwise the inevitable trip ensues with a now extremely floppy foot for that first dash to the loo in the morning and a new toe-off splint that allows me to use some of the dorsiflexion I have in my foot.  Please be careful with the foot first thing as I have also woken up and forgotten my situation and then quickly reminded.
I had hydro today and alls going well - Andre, can you go onto your toes and hold it there?  I have been trying to do this with the water taking alot of the weight but it is proving near impossible at the moment.  Have you asked your OS re the toe-off splint?  I know I am being given mine as I think they see this as a permanent solution to my foot drop (Umm we will see!)  I asked my OS about a silicon AFO that is much more descreet and most importantly can be worn in water but I was not a suitable candidate as I still have swelling issues.  I think it is definately worth discussing, I think the SAFO site was something like www.dorset-ortho.com.  I can now do ten minutes on the cross trainer and 10 minutes on the rower.  I am getting back to some sort of fitness and it feels so good to be able to go fast and long enough to work up a sweat!  Next step a little jog and perhaps low impact aerobics...............  Jak
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on October 17, 2006, 05:13:53 AM
Andre gives good advice.  I am starting a walking aid collection!  I started off in a wheel chair (now dispensed with, thankfully), have elbow crutches, walking sticks - both of which are mostly redundant except for those serious shopping trips around big malls but AFO wise I have three, a Swiss AFO (most commonly used splint for foot drop), a night/resting splint that I use at night to keep the foot in a dorsiflexion position, otherwise the inevitable trip ensues with a now extremely floppy foot for that first dash to the loo in the morning and a new toe-off splint that allows me to use some of the dorsiflexion I have in my foot.  Please be careful with the foot first thing as I have also woken up and forgotten my situation and then quickly reminded.
I had hydro today and alls going well - Andre, can you go onto your toes and hold it there?  I have been trying to do this with the water taking alot of the weight but it is proving near impossible at the moment.  Have you asked your OS re the toe-off splint?  I know I am being given mine as I think they see this as a permanent solution to my foot drop (Umm we will see!)  I asked my OS about a silicon AFO that is much more descreet and most importantly can be worn in water but I was not a suitable candidate as I still have swelling issues.  I think it is definately worth discussing, I think the SAFO site was something like www.dorset-ortho.com.  I can now do ten minutes on the cross trainer and 10 minutes on the rower.  I am getting back to some sort of fitness and it feels so good to be able to go fast and long enough to work up a sweat!  Next step a little jog and perhaps low impact aerobics...............  Jak


Hey Jak

Man going up on your toes looks and sounds sooooo easy but it has been annoying the hell out of me....lol...we never tried it in the water...(which i think would have been the better route).they are having me do it as a part of my calve raises exercise. i can't seem to get on my toes and my right leg seems to be carrying most of the load.....i can feel the muscles in my foot trying to respond its just not there yet. i have this thing i do to try and pin point te muscle to activate ...not sure if it works but to me i feel its been helping.....i close my eyes.....and try to invision the pathways of the signals i am trying to send to my foot.i try and become the pathway..looking the signal from the brain down the spinal cord down the leg to the foot....lol i dont know ...might be alittle desprate thinkning i guess but i feel that it has made some change so might as well past it on...is there anything that you do to keep your self focused? .....I know exactly how you feel about being able to workout and getting  your body active again ....that is impressive and a good sign of hard work and determination.things will start to come along better when your body is active...(i believe) just seems like when your body works together it regenerates together as well. Man i cant wait to hear about you jogging...that would be pretty cool. This Injury has had alot of good things come out of it for me.......besides the pain and the self pity...you learn alot about yourself and alot about how to deal with the "impossible". you have stepped up to the impossible and bringing the old cliche "Impossible is nothing" into real life. No matter what happens keep focusing on how you will feel once you have recovered...if it is a feeling your truly  want then you will do it...hard work is already what you do.

My 3 weeks post -op will be tomorrow tuesday the 17th october/06
today mon the 16th i have reached my goal of riding the stationary bike at the lowest setting number 1( 1 is a really tough push, 5 is a comfortable ride)
swelling is almost out...but after activity like the bike it tends to flare up again.
Therapists  have now added leg press 1 set of 10   (no sinlge leg press) to go along with the rest of the routine.
have not checked the flexion again since usually get it down on at the end of the week. dorsi flexion is the same and 4 toes excluding the big toe are responding still a very weak signal...still working at it.

Take care and talk to you soon
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amberjade on October 17, 2006, 01:31:40 PM
Hi Amdre, I do have an air walker boot is that same thing? Getting more stable but still no movement having results next weel ::) Measured ankle its lost 2 inches in 5 weeks!! Hope u ok Amber ps are uk or states
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on October 18, 2006, 03:18:28 AM
Hi Amdre, I do have an air walker boot is that same thing? Getting more stable but still no movement having results next weel ::) Measured ankle its lost 2 inches in 5 weeks!! Hope u ok Amber ps are uk or states

Hey Amberjade

Hows everything going and are you feeling and doing better? i remeber you said you cant drive and there was alot of unfortunate things going on so i am hoping that things are seeming to get better. The Air Walker Boot Depending on the type you have is mostly for Protection i believe...they are much heavier and they control your range of motion...some with levels and angle adjustments and some just stationary at 90 degrees. The AFO(ankle foot orthotic) or the S(Silicon)AFO which Jak just sent me a site for(above post) are not used for protection in the same sense as the air walker.....they are used mainly for full wieght bearing patients that need assitance in dorsi -flexion due to the foot drop. An AFO is light weight and slides right into your shoe with a strap around the calve area. and the SAFO from what it looks like on the site itlooks to be almost like a silicon sleeve that inherits your foots natural position....Jak could probably better explain it...i have only seen what it looks like on the site.
Its good to hear you are getting more stable .....what kind of test or tests will you be going for and ...i know from experience don't let anything discourage you from recovery...get your test done to see where you are at now and then let time and the will to recover help you progress and heal.
Keep in touch and keep us posted with your recovery ......ps and i am from neither the states or uk i am from canada...where are you from if you dont mind me asking?


Take care and hope all is well
Andre
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on October 18, 2006, 03:29:14 AM
Hey Jak

Awesome news today.....we tried again ...stimulating the EHL from its lumbar location (L5,S1) and its motor point just beneath the Tib Ant. the problem before was the pad placement and the pad size......before we used to large pads to try and lessen our chance of missing the proper nerve....but by doing that we also decreased the amount of voltage (i guess i call it that) we would be sending once the nerve was located. so what we did was we used a smaller and more concentrated pad on the lumbar location and used a large pad on the motor point....and Voila!!!!!!!!!!! i started to get some spark in the toe and the pathway to the toe...it felt like i could raise it up but i couldnt .....but the fact that i felt like i could raise the toe was the hugest change. Still have a long way to go with this i believe but things or on a more positive note with this approach. cross your fingers.

Take care ....and talk to ya soon.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on October 18, 2006, 04:29:00 PM
Woow, Amdre that is fantastic news and that feeling must be great.  I am so pleased that they are trying this stimulation with you.  I asked about it but was told that they don't have the necessary equipment to try it.  I am very fortunate to have a caring and professional team that has really made a difference in the last 6 months.  I can't add anything to your summary of AFO's and SAFO's and think you have done a good job in explaining them.  You take care.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on October 19, 2006, 12:49:34 AM
Hey All

Its been 3 weeks and a day since my ACL surgery and things are going well. The main focus was flexion , extension and to get ride of swelling.this week strengthening the Qud muscles ha been put in the fore front and will most likely stay tat way since i have experienced alot of atrophy. i have also experienced atrophy in the left glute and hip flexor has been working over time....so a muscle in balance is definately occuring. this week they have made a small introduction of Core exercises to correct this.

Quad ball squats 3 x 10 ball between legs and activating core on eacht rep.
Glute Bridging 3x 10 activating Core with 5 second holds at the end of te up phase.
Supermans 3 x 10 ativating Core lying flat lifting one arm and opposite leg activating muscles in proper order glutes ,hams, and then foot on injured leg.

take care
Andre
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on October 19, 2006, 08:22:03 PM
Aha, at last we are on the same regime.  I have the pleasure of these exercises at each physio session and have them as part of my home programme.  The glut bridging one became a tad easy for me last week so I had y 'good' leg pulled further forward of the oerated leg and that made it so much harder.  I am also on to a two pound ankle weight on my sitting leg raises.  Off to physio in the morning and just got back from evening ydro session.  I have atrophied quad and hamstring and this is proving most difficult to conquor.  Keep smiling and have a good weekend.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on October 19, 2006, 11:38:54 PM
Aha, at last we are on the same regime.  I have the pleasure of these exercises at each physio session and have them as part of my home programme.  The glut bridging one became a tad easy for me last week so I had y 'good' leg pulled further forward of the oerated leg and that made it so much harder.  I am also on to a two pound ankle weight on my sitting leg raises.  Off to physio in the morning and just got back from evening ydro session.  I have atrophied quad and hamstring and this is proving most difficult to conquor.  Keep smiling and have a good weekend.
[/quote}

Hey Jacky,

Weekend.....what day is it in the uk...you guys on friday already? hey thats pretty cool that we got some of the same workouts ...how do they feel?...and have you felt a difference  or a change since you have been doing them.? the hardest part i think is remebering to breathe...lol...when ever i activate my core i inhale and dont exhale.....lol...i learned quickly to balance the both or youll feel like you had too much to drink.....i know what you mean about the atrophied muscles....thy will join the party soon...they just take awhile to come back to there full potiential so im told.the more i work out on the quad the better and stronger it feels so im sure it will come back strong.

Today therapy session was cut short due to family issues...although i have some of the equipment at home to do some of the procedures.
Today after a contrast bathe of hot and cold i got on the bike to loosesn up.
went through my stretching and thats it. went to see the surgeon for the first follow up since the surgery and things are looking good  range has improved to 125 compared to 135 with full extension..swelling  still sticking around was prescribed  anit inflams but i refused to take them.
 
At home worked on the standing VMO stimulation along with all lower body strengthening and range of motion.

we are still on thursday but you have a good weekend too and talk to you soon.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amberjade on October 23, 2006, 12:12:09 AM
Hi amdre , Im in south uk. Having my emg tody so bit scared but will at least get some news and will let you all kmow take care  :)
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amberjade on October 24, 2006, 02:22:37 PM
Hi all, Amber here! Had emg done yesterday any help with some of what my results are please!! Right superficial peroneal nerve sensory 100% absent, no movement or voluntary activity in edb.... what is edb?, I have some potential but not much recovery in edb is hopeful. Have mainly neuropraxia but he said nerve intact but some fibres inside are likely to have severed, he called this neurot?????? but got coffee on sheet cant read it! Said i should get recovery over next year os so but due to denervation I cant expect full recovery, cried most of day but feel better now abd seeing consultant this Friday to  discuss what I dont know will they just try and keep it safe, said cant rehab muscles served by the damaged nerve. Not sure what all this means, take care all love Amber ???
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on October 24, 2006, 08:43:37 PM
Amber,
So sorry to hear you have been upset.  It is fair to say that most of us on here are not medically qualified and it would be wrong and perhaps even dangerous to have a guess at what your results might mean.  I don't know what edb is and not heard of it.  In my report it talks about EHL and EDL and tibialis anterior activity.  I am no wiser what these acronyms mean either!  It is probably best for thr Doctors opinion on this one.  The good news is that the report says there will be some recovery.  In my hunble opinion I don't think there is any exact science to nerve recoveries.  I have been told anything from see how it is at 6/12/18 months or even as long as 5 years to see what recovery you may have.  I concentrate on the things I can do and think back a month and track progress, not weekly and definately not daily.  If there is no nerve signal going to the muscle it is true you can not rehab it on your own but a good physio will be able to help in keeping the muscle going through active intervention by the physio.  I can not build the muscle on the outside of the calf muscle for that reason but other muscles will try to help out and compensate where they can.   You are still very early days in respect to nerve damage and I remember when I thought I would never be able to move my foot again, but I can now evert the foot well and lift toes.  Today I got my new splint and that has put a spring on to my step - literally.  Hang in there Amber and remember we will support you in any which way we can on here.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on October 26, 2006, 04:16:37 AM
Hi all, Amber here! Had emg done yesterday any help with some of what my results are please!! Right superficial peroneal nerve sensory 100% absent, no movement or voluntary activity in edb.... what is edb?, I have some potential but not much recovery in edb is hopeful. Have mainly neuropraxia but he said nerve intact but some fibres inside are likely to have severed, he called this neurot?????? but got coffee on sheet cant read it! Said i should get recovery over next year os so but due to denervation I cant expect full recovery, cried most of day but feel better now abd seeing consultant this Friday to  discuss what I dont know will they just try and keep it safe, said cant rehab muscles served by the damaged nerve. Not sure what all this means, take care all love Amber ???


hey amberjade

I am sorry to hear about the way you have been feeling.i too do not know what the EDB is either...but im sure you can find it on the net to get an image of what the doc is talking about. i as well did not have a good result my first time after my EMG and my Doc was not optimisic at all...and basically told me i would be lucky to walk normal again.if its not to personal ...what are some of the things upsetting you? i kinda know some of the things you maybe going through and if you are dealing with any of these issues the you need to go through this before you start getting on the road to recovery.in my experience i went thorugh self pity, depression anger and so much doubt...and this was good because we naturally need to vent these emotions.recovery is always an option  and how much you recover and can recover relies solely upon the way you approach it physically and mentally. we will be here for your support and surrounding yourself with proactive therapists and doctors will help you overcome this obstacle.Everyone on this thread has helped eachother so much ...with support understanding and most of all progresion....i dont think there is one person that has had no progresion and that is the key......you will continue to progress.try not to fall into the doctors estimation as they just use numbers and statistics...you can be a unique case because you are not just a number and you are a unique indiviual that can become more then estimate. and about the muscle inquiry...i think ...not sure but i think they are saying that you cant rehab a muscle that is unresponsive due to nerve damage. this is true but i dont think rehabing the msucle is the goal...keeping it awake so when the nerve regenerates is.i am not a doc so i will not give advice but ask questions till your blue in the face and you totally understand everything they are saying. theyre are different methods that can be used to do these sorts of things so be sure to ask.Hang in there and keep us posted on your recovery.....if you have any questions or want to compare your state with someone else who can relate with you...post it ..keep us informed. Take Care Andre
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on October 26, 2006, 04:28:28 AM
Hey All


Just updating....a new week has gone and a month post-op ..leg is feeling good walking is almost normal except after long sitting positions i tend to have to arm the leg up before i walk. therapy has now  introduced the step machine and alot of glute medial excersies due to compensation and atrpohy suffered.leg muscles have taken a nap for about a year and it is waking up time but they are being kinda stubborn. Four toes are starting to regain strength...re introduced the towel pull excersise to stregthen the toes and regain range of motion in them. big toe is stil not respnding and still working on getting it to flex up. swelling where it should be and hopefully with the building up of muscle around the knee swelling will eventually go away.


Take care all
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on October 27, 2006, 10:53:53 PM
Hello All,

Had physio today and had good and not so good news.  Good news is that I can bend my ankle much further today and it is beyond the 90 degree mark so stairs getting easier.  I have my new toe off splint but finding it quite difficult to get used to and been told to revert back to my old splint for walking distances as foot gets too fatigued/weak to safely maintain the toe off splint.  I have developed sores on my leg apparently from the lack of muscle movement and therefore blood flow and now have to wear a tubi-grip stocking (can I just say, 'I already know this is NOT a good look')   ;).   I have a great exercise in physio where a mini skateboard is attached to some theraband - stretcht stuff, and I have to pull the skateboard towards me with my foot on the board - this really works the hamstrings (which are conspicious by their absence at this moment in time).  The towel pull exercise for the toes is a nightly regime for me and I have all five toes now responding even if the big toe does so when it feels like it and never to the same degree - but getting there.  My two week intensive in-patient stay is temporarily on hold as not met my goals yet to maximise the stay there, so very disappointed at the moment.  My challenge for this next week is to stand for 5 seconds on the bad leg only unassisted - here goes.................  have a good weekend and keep smiling.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amberjade on October 29, 2006, 06:57:11 PM
Hi all Amber here, thanks for your supportive messages.Went to see consultant today not met him before so insisted!! His opening words were " dont know why you are under my care I deal with arms!  This was after 3 hour wait to see him, he did not even look at my leg, said I can get some improvement in pos 2 years , said to have pysio but I feel I need help such as occupational therapy to help with practical things to keep me safe at home. Oh and EDB is a muscle!! Left voicemail with differant departments  when I got home but in morning I am definately going to get on phone and ask to see someone who will tell me whats what! Thing I want to know is do I have hope of driving my normal car or is that the bit that wont get better. Take care all ??? :-\
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on November 03, 2006, 01:47:41 PM
Hi Amdre,

From your recent posts it looks like you are doing well after your ACL reconstruction. Tell me are you still wearing a brace or have you got rid of that now. My rehab from the PLC recontruction is going pretty well and I am now able to walk without crutches and am going to the gym twice a day. Its only 5 monutes walk from my house so its very convenient. I still have to wear my brace all the time and feel a bit of a freak at the gym. I am doing leg presses, albeit with very little weight loaded, and have managed this week to pedal properly on the static bike. My leg looks horrible as it is very skinny but I can feel the strength building all the time.

I have been doing the toe bends to keep the Tibialas Anterior muscle active as you suggested. My foot is still numb and with no dorsiflexion and eversion. You started to get something back after 5 months so it will be a while yet before I hopefully see something. Still getting the nerve pain in my foot. I see my OS on 22nd November so will find out them when they plan to do my ACL recon and I want to get more info on the nerve damage as I have not had any test to see if the nerve is doing anything.

Cheers
Hamish


hey there Hamish

Our injuries are some what very similar. even the approach the doctors took in repairing my damaged knee. although mine doc didnt want to do the ACL until there was sign of Nerve muscle response. mainly for the reason that if my nerve didnt come back i would have now need for an ACL. docotors logic and less work for him i guess. it was very painful at the begining stages of the injury.....from reading up on pherphrial nerve damage the shocks and tingling are supposed to be a part of the degeneration process. you be very hyper sensetive to the point that another person can shock you by just laying there hands over your injured nerve. hows your recovery coming ? i just started to get my functions back i jan-feb....i started to get eversion back(5months after injury)
then in july august  i started to regain my dorsi flexion and now have 85 degrees of flexion compared to 103 on my good foot. my last input was wrong for my good foot.
the main thing is to keep your Tibialas Anterior muscle awake by stimulating it with a neuro muscle stim. and just practice using your your bodies natural retractiong phase as a tool for pulling your foot and toes up. what i mean by this is ....if you already know then exuse the rest of this. when you pull your toes down past its original or natrual position it automatically retracts when you release.once you release try and pull up like you normally would using your bodies natural retraction.

Keep your head up and stay focused Good luck in the Recovery
Amdre
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on November 04, 2006, 09:58:21 PM
Hi all Amber here, thanks for your supportive messages.Went to see consultant today not met him before so insisted!! His opening words were " dont know why you are under my care I deal with arms!  This was after 3 hour wait to see him, he did not even look at my leg, said I can get some improvement in pos 2 years , said to have pysio but I feel I need help such as occupational therapy to help with practical things to keep me safe at home. Oh and EDB is a muscle!! Left voicemail with differant departments  when I got home but in morning I am definately going to get on phone and ask to see someone who will tell me whats what! Thing I want to know is do I have hope of driving my normal car or is that the bit that wont get better. Take care all ??? :-\

Hey Amberjade,

Good to hear from you again....Dont be discouaged with the Doctors and there approach to your condition....you and speaking for myself ...we have both had negative responses from the docs. the way i look at it is you can use it in either to ways....let them get to you and feel you have no hope or use there negativity as motivation to help ignite a positive recovery for yourself......is the muscle (EDB) extensor digitorum/Brevis? those muscles assist in dorsi flexsion of the toes and foot...just wondering. also in answer to your question about driving ....Do you feel you can or will be able to Drive again? if you dont believe you can do it then chances are you probably wont....but if you believe and have the will to work hard at your beliefs then your chances increase drammaticaly.Good to hear from you again and i wish a strong and healthy recovery...and keep being informed and informing yourself..at the end of all this you should be so informed that you could probably get a degree in the anatomy of te knee...lol.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on November 04, 2006, 10:16:45 PM
Hello All to the foot drop thread,

I agree with Amdre, a positive mind helps wonders.  I continually talk to my foot and visualise it working normally.  This is a long process and there appears to be long peroids of no progress then all of a sudden something you couldn't do becomes manageable.  I am now getting used to my new splint.  I have recently bought a scooter to get about on but find that my foot can move towards the edge of the foot plate, especially when going round a right hand bend, so I have fitted a a little stay to keep my foot safe.  Hope you are all doing OK and having a good weekend.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on November 04, 2006, 10:29:20 PM
Hi Amdre,

From your recent posts it looks like you are doing well after your ACL reconstruction. Tell me are you still wearing a brace or have you got rid of that now. My rehab from the PLC recontruction is going pretty well and I am now able to walk without crutches and am going to the gym twice a day. Its only 5 monutes walk from my house so its very convenient. I still have to wear my brace all the time and feel a bit of a freak at the gym. I am doing leg presses, albeit with very little weight loaded, and have managed this week to pedal properly on the static bike. My leg looks horrible as it is very skinny but I can feel the strength building all the time.

I have been doing the toe bends to keep the Tibialas Anterior muscle active as you suggested. My foot is still numb and with no dorsiflexion and eversion. You started to get something back after 5 months so it will be a while yet before I hopefully see something. Still getting the nerve pain in my foot. I see my OS on 22nd November so will find out them when they plan to do my ACL recon and I want to get more info on the nerve damage as I have not had any test to see if the nerve is doing anything.

Cheers
Hamish

Hey Hamish,

To start its good to hear things are going well with your PCL recovery and i know exactly how feel as i have half a leg as well from the atrophy that has taken place in the quad.In answer to your question , no i dont wear any braces at the moment....as i move into the three months post-op stage i will be fitted for a knee brace for active sport. the reason for that is i chose not to wear my afo because once i go range of motion it would restrict me from goine past 90 degrees it would just keep my foot locked..and i didnt feel that i would progress so i got rid of it...and practice walking in a mirror and practice lifting it past the steppage gait on stairs.i have full ROM and i look as if i can walk normally but the foot still lacks power in the EHL(extensor hallicus longus) and the ED(extensor digitorum and brevis muscles) which we are working on with the toes and foot excersises i had listed before. You should schedule an EMG test just to see exactly how much damage has occured and get an approximate time frame. Also i think the toe bends excersise is for improving the strength in yor toes....wen i had no movment  (dorsi flexion or eversion) we used a N.E.M.S unit for stimulate the non responsive muscle.(our therapists felt that as long as it is getting a signal it will stay wake)
 and for the pain i was given a T.E.N.S unit i didnt use it much cause i didnt feel it was helping. keep us posted on your OS results and your test for nerve condutivity.
keep progressing.

Andre
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on November 04, 2006, 10:56:02 PM
Hey All another week has gone and i am 6weeks post-op next tuesday and things are goine well. nothing much has changed this week but monday plans are looking like a nice compliment to the daily routines. Monday we will be moving up to the 2nd phase of core excersises and once i get them i will post them. Reintroduction of Hydro therapy ...this will consist of resistance form running in the pool to help get the body in full conditioning mode and to help strengthing of th leg. we will also be working balance, meditation and relaxation in the pool.this will be done once a week and core excersises will be done daily. Other then that knee is feeling good except for extension feeling pain in the front of the knee...hopefully just still alittle sore from the recon.

Keep healing and healthy recoveries to all
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on November 09, 2006, 12:19:30 AM
ooops I have broken my new splint so back in the old one again for a while.  I don't know how I did it, I must be very heavy footed.  No real news to report and judging by the lack of posts over the last few days it is the same for everyone else too, still nerve recovery is a a slow process and there are times when here appears to be little progress.  Hope you are all still smiling at least.  take care Jak
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on November 09, 2006, 04:17:07 PM
No change with me, still got Mr Floppy Foot.

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amberjade on November 16, 2006, 11:01:28 AM
Hi Amdre and all on this thread, going to see new dr this Fri as I complained so going to see leg man!! Yes ebd thing is a muscle xx hope you all ok
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on November 16, 2006, 04:09:24 PM
Good one ya Amberjade - hope all goes well tomorrow - you will have to let us know.  I now have a new splint to replace the one I managed to break - apparently it can happen - lol.  If I break this one I will have to go into a more heavy duty one called a blue rocker - sounds like something out of the 50's!  (It might be with the state of the NHS at the moment!)  I am off to two weeks intensive rehab on my leg so hope that will make all the difference and crossing my fingers for a miricle.  Hope you are all OK - Where is Amdre?  hope he is OK as long time no hear.  You all have a good weekend and think positive thoughts.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on November 18, 2006, 10:22:52 PM
Hey All

Sorry for the extremely late post....been very busy with life and kids and school and its daily needs.good work Amberjade tke control of your options and get as informed s you possibly can...and dont forget to let us in on the news. Hey Jak im still kick ing ...lol just been so caught up. how r u doing ? i wish you all the best with yor intensive rehab and i know the outcome will be one that we all will be amazed by. Your a very hard worker and no matter what i sure you will do fine in the rehab.As for me things are going well i can now resist pressure with my dorsiflexion and eversion is strong as an ox. still no response with the EHL stims but hope is still alive. next tuesday will be the 7th week post-op i believe and leg is doing well full flexion and extension now and starting lateral strengthing and doing alot mor stability since i have had a very good ACL recovery. i am very pleased as it shows good health in the knee and when i return to Sport it will not play on my mind as much. I have set a another goal for myself and my rehab..this one is kind of far fetched and i see the Doc on wed to see if iam capable of succeeding this task. By March end i must perform at an elite combine if i still want a shot at a pro level ....no contact just skills....if i can becom more then the negative expectations they have already marked me as i think i will hve ashot..doc doesnt know ..due to the amount of things i have been through and thinks i need the full 9 months recovery. i want to prove him wrong again and defy the odds though i may be putting myself at risk. I feel that it is possible so it must be. Am i being ridiculous ? im only human but yet i feel that i dont fall under those approximations and estimations ...not because i believe i am better then but for the fact that i believe in my self and what i can accomplish. i know my limits and what i feel. thy only know what they have seen and have dealt with. I dont know still very up in the air....my therapists were kind of shocked as wel when i told them my goals. not sure if i am getting way ahead of myself or not....neways take care all and have a good weekend ill be on fequently.....some times things get alittle rocky in the Real World and i get detoured little from the forum but im always here.

Take Care
Andre
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on November 19, 2006, 02:33:45 AM
Hi Andre,

Good to see things are going well. Having looked at your website and seen your video of you playing you are good. I don't know much about American Football but watched a bit and you are a true athelete and a step, spin, power like yours would do very well in rugby or any sport. Adversity breads a lot of things including desire, passion and strength and you hold that over a lot of others. I have no doubt you will succeed. Good luck!

As far as my rehab is going I am now at the gym twice a day and have managed to get my wee skinny leg to 130 degrees flexion and feeling pretty strong. I have an appointment with OS on Wednesday so will find out what the next step will be. At the moment I on the bike, rowing, lots of step ups, heel raises (the hardest), quads (lowering only) and hamstrings on the multi gym, stepper (with brace on). I'm now at the end of my career but have had a pretty good innings at the age of 37 but wasn't ready to retire but still want to be as fit as I can be and working my ass off. Hate watching the guys playing!

Hamish

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on November 23, 2006, 12:44:23 AM
Hey Hamish,

Thank you for the support.Good to hear your flexion is doing better. you and i are on a identical workout plan it seems...lol for our skinny legs. when you see your OS ask him i it good to go in the water and run  .....we have implemented that into the program and i must say it gives you awhole new feeling of a leg workout...especially if you havent gone for a run in a very long time.....might find out you still have muscles in those skinny legs still ..haha....i couldnt move mine for a good hour or two after my first session. And i can totally relate to the burning desire to play again....i tried coaching while i was off on reserve but was not ready to make the transition from player to coach...still young minded and full of dreams that i would like to pursue in this sport. "why dream when you can do ..." i guess thats my new vehicle to recovery.
Hope everything goes well with your  os appointment...also how does it feel training with your brace.? have you gotten used to it yet ? or do you think you cold get used to it?...i get mine in the new year just wondering on some opinions.

Respectfully,
Andre

"sometimes it takes a curve in life to straighten out"
Title: New to board: mother of 3 year old with peroneal nerve damage
Post by: mom444 on November 26, 2006, 03:29:03 AM
Hello All,

I am so glad that I found this board.  I am the mother of a 3 and a half year old daugther who had peroneal nerve damage.  She had surgery to remove scar tissue from the nerve this past July.  We are still hoping and praying for her recovery.  She is currently wearing a little AFO to support her drop foot and her physical therapist wants to start some electric muscle stimulation therapy.

We think the damage occurred when she was about 1 and a half years old.  It took a long time for a diagnosis!  We noticed when she was about a year and a half that she started walking funny but because all toddler walk funny we thought nothing of it.  Then it got to the point where it looked like her left foot was always pointed and we had a hard time putting her shoes on, but we though that is was just an idiopathic thing or that she was being just being stubborn about having her shoes put on.  We finally talked about it with her pediatricians and from there on it was a series of MRIs to check for brain or spinal damage.  It was very, very scary.  Some doctors thought it was just a "tight heel cord" but later on after we had an EMG test done it was finally diagnosed as peroneal neuropathy.

The strangest part of her situation is that we have no idea how the nerve damage happened.  She never fell or hurt herself or had any kind of major trauma that we are aware of.  The only thing we could think of was that she liked to sleep in an odd position up on her knees with her butt in the air.  That might have put pressrue on the nerve.  Also she has always been thin and I have read that often thinner people are more predisposed to injuring the peroneal nerve.

I hope all of you are doing well and are on the road to recovery yourselves.  Maybe we can share some input with each other.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amberjade on November 26, 2006, 09:51:12 PM
Hi all not been on 4 while, pc crashed and bro and daughter been ill. Saw new dr last week much better than last, same sort of stuff we all know re time but confirmed some part will never recover. I have sold car :(  When I first had damage where nerve went I had bright red painful swellind ouside of knee, on sat i felt pop and where damage started its sort of caved in  with this pop, so now have big dent?? Ideas lol?
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on November 27, 2006, 01:20:23 PM
Has anyone here used a dorsiflexion assit brace?  If so, did it help at all?
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on November 28, 2006, 03:57:41 AM
Hey Mom444

I have used an AFO(ankle foot orthodics) brace and i do believe it helped. some of the ways it helped me was helping me clear steps so i wouldnt have to hip hike....also with general everyday walking ...having o hike the hip and the constant foot slapping on the floor kinda slows down walking. and also i feel that it helped me gain dorsiflexion back jst from being at a 90 degree angle all the time. i have finally been able to regain dorsi flexion and do not need assistance from it anymore ...so i would recommend it to someone with dorsi flexion issues.

Andre
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on November 28, 2006, 04:05:53 AM
Hey amberjade

Been awhile indeed ...i dont know what to say but....try and stay positive the negatives are already there and it is honestly up to you to make a difference in your health."whether you think you can or cant your right....." and about the "pop" you felt ...doesnt sound good especially if that "pop" has created a physical change in your the appreance of your knee...that most mean something has gone on inside and is due for another check up..just to insure things are ok and nothing serious has gone wrong.

Stay positive, proactive and keep us posted
Andre
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on November 28, 2006, 04:28:13 AM
Hey again Mom444,

I just read your first post ...and to start i would like to welcome you to this thread and let you know that we are all here for support on the road to recovery.

Im sorry to hear about the your daughter and her nerve injury. that is so strange and it must be tough not only for you but her as well. How are you handling this and how much damage has occured to her nerve? Did the EMG specify? From what ive learned the peroneal nerve can be so easily damaged as part of it becomes exposed as it runs down the outside of the knee before it splits and can be hit from a blow to that area ...or maybe even as you said her sleeping awkwardly on it. but i wouldnt know im not a doctor.I wish you all the best and from a recovery point of view she has age on her side so overcoming this shouldnt be a problem.

Take Care and please if you have any questions feel free to post ...there is a broad variety of injuries and alot of us maybe able to relate and help.
Take Care again

Andre 
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on November 29, 2006, 08:04:22 PM
Hey Guys,

Mom
I also wear and AFO and it makes walking a lot easier and more comfortable. Does your daughter wear a night splint? I believe it is important to keep all the tendons and muscles stretched at the back of the leg and also for comforts sake.

Amdre,
Did you wear a night splint? I was at the OS today and things are looking pretty good regards the PLC reconstruction and he was pleased with the strength and flexion I have achieved at 12 weeks and is keen to do the ACL reconstruction soon. Looks like this will be at the beginning of January, which is good as it is soon but allows me to enjoy xmas first. He is also going to book me in for an EMG test but said there is a waiting list for this and it may well be January before I get this. I forgot to ask whether I could start running in the pool but will ask my PT next week. I don't have a specialist knee brace yet but have been using the post op brace when at thegym when I need it. I have been looking at some websites and there seems to be lots out there. Try looking at the website below. Are you going to get a custom fitted brace?

http://www.kneeshop.com/products.asp?cat=18

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on December 02, 2006, 02:03:55 PM
Hey again Mom444,

I just read your first post ...and to start i would like to welcome you to this thread and let you know that we are all here for support on the road to recovery.

Im sorry to hear about the your daughter and her nerve injury. that is so strange and it must be tough not only for you but her as well. How are you handling this and how much damage has occured to her nerve? Did the EMG specify? From what ive learned the peroneal nerve can be so easily damaged as part of it becomes exposed as it runs down the outside of the knee before it splits and can be hit from a blow to that area ...or maybe even as you said her sleeping awkwardly on it. but i wouldnt know im not a doctor.I wish you all the best and from a recovery point of view she has age on her side so overcoming this shouldnt be a problem.

Take Care and please if you have any questions feel free to post ...there is a broad variety of injuries and alot of us maybe able to relate and help.
Take Care again

Andre 


Thanks Andre and every one else.  I'm glad I have found some allies here!  I'm praying for all of your recoveries as well.

Her lesion was "incomplete" according to the EMG so that means that some communication was getting through to the muscles that are innervated by the peroneal nerve.  She has neurolysis surgery this past July.  The surgeon said she had a neuroma that had formed on the nerve.  We still have no idea how this happened.

She has not had any immediate recovery so far but we remain hopeful.  Yes she is still a toddler so we hope age is on her side.

I am a librarian and a college instructor and I have researched the heck out of this.  I have found many research articles about what happens after peroneal nerve surgery, in particular neurolysis.  Many of the studies say that patients did in fact gain improvement but some of the articles do not go into detail about how long it took.

Also, my daughter had this injury for about a year and a half before it was diagnosed and she had the neurolysis surgery.  That  made me very scared because time is of the essence if surgery is to lead to recovery.  However, I found a few articles that said that some of the patients had surgery over a year later past the date of the injury and still had some recovery.

Thank you again everyone.  I'll keep checking back to keep you posted on my little girl and to check your recover as well.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on December 02, 2006, 06:48:43 PM
Hello Mom444 and welcome - sorry you need to be here for your daughter. 

I have been away for an intensive two week programme and have made excellent progress - OK the foot doesn't move much more than it did but I have got to grips with my dynamic splint and can use it to its full effect, my walking looks much more natural (with the splint on) and i have managed to jog a few steps!  I think that this two weeks has given me buckets full of confidence and the drop foot is no where near as traumatic as it first was.  I have been advised to research nerve transfer surgery that is quite new but a nerve that would not be missed is transfered into the damaged peroneal nerve and after the regeneration works like the original nerve.  Don't know if anyone has come across any articles about this?  The best news is that the quad has woken up and although tires very quickly it is firing so onwards and upwards.  The gym ball and I have a daily battle of me trying to stay on and the ball trying to wobble me off!  Good to catch up with you guys again.  Hope all is well and speak again soon.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on December 02, 2006, 07:05:41 PM
Thanks for the welcome j_smi001 and good luck to you too!  :)

Andre,  I just wanted to ask you a question.  You say that you ARE getting some dorsiflexion back?  When and how did you injure your peroneal nerve?  (If you don't mind me asking.)  Did you have neurolysis or any other kind of surgery on it?   I have also heard that sometimes when the nerve is coming back that you get a tingling feeling in the leg.  Did you have any of this?  Or, in short, how long approximately did it take for the nerve to start to regenerate?

Thanks again everyone... 

By the way, I noticed this is a UK site...  I'm "across the pond" myself :)  I wonder if there are any resources available in the UK that are not available in the US or vice versa.  As I mentioned I am a librarian and a college instructor and have been doing a lot of research on these topics.  I'll post direct links to articles if you'd like, just note however that some of the articles from high end medicial journals are not available online in full text.  You need either a password to a database if there is an online version of them or you need to obtain an actual print copy of the article if necessary.  I know the lady who is the librarian at the local children's hospital and she has requested copies of articles for me.  Again, most of what I have found indicates that peroneal nerves can after sugery recover in most cases but the articles do not give many details as to time.   ???

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on December 03, 2006, 07:31:17 PM
Hey Mom444,

How is everyone?..hope you all are doing well in your recovery.

In answer to your question...yes my dorsi flexion has come back ....it is not at its full potential but it is on is way i believe. i have full range and maybe about 70 percent strength...the strength is kind of on and off sometimes depending on how hard i work it but the Tibialas Anterior muscles has restrengthend alot. I injured my knee in a football game ...i went to avoid a defender and my knee freakishly buckled and i had dislocated the knee crushing the peroneal nerve....i went in for surgery the next week to fix the posteriolateral compartment and it was then determined that my nerve was crushed and told it looked crushed to the point of no return. i didnt have surgery on it because of the fact that it was still intact. even though it was crushed it wa still better then being severed my Doc suggested. i believe he gave me this analogy.....picture the nerve as a phone cord...then picture the wires inside the phone cord...if they are crushed some stay intact and can grow back in the same path..but if they are severed and reattached then it would be a much more difficult taks due to the complexity of the wires inside. and i dont mind at all ...you can ask whatever you like. Yes i did i still do have tingling senesations...now they are stil tingly but when i first injured it ....it flt like shocks..sometimes unbareable and all through the night..i was told it was part of the degeneration phase of the nerve supposedly it does this before regeneration begins. i started experiencing regeneration about 5 to 6 months after i think ...i slowly started to regain my eversion .....then in about july august i started to notice that i could move my foot alittle different and it has just been progressing ever since.

Try not to be discouraged about the time estimates....everyone is heals different. I found that coping with the injury does play apart in compensation so try researching some different way in tricking the nervous system into reacting. as i had wrote before some of the things we did in therapy were using the bodies own retraction phase to dorsi flex. pull the foot down past its natural postion...and it automatical will spring back into its natural position....as you do this tell her to concetrate on lifting her foot. or have her lay on her tummy foot bent at 90 dgrees and instead of pulling up tell her topulldown. there are many different ways...but the key is to do them constantly and religiously...maybe it might kick start something. I Wish you the best and any info you find please feel free to post it.

Take Care,
Andre
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on December 03, 2006, 07:45:05 PM
Hey Hamish,

Good to hear things are going well...and good scheduling the acl for after the holidays ....that would be kinda crappy if you were gimpy on christmas..haha.
In answer to your question i did wear i night brace ....i used to almost neglect the fact that i couldnt dorsiflex and would catch myself tripping and almost spraining or even breaking the ankle....so a night brace was a must. Are you ready for this surgery coming up? what are some of your thoughts going into it ?....i ask because i was kind of nervous for my third one only because i had range and all then when i went back under i had to go through eveything all over again. how does it feel working out with a brace? i dont haveone yet ..i get it next month and it will be fitted...just dont know how i will pay for it yet....lol these things are expensive...i think everyone is gonna have to get cheaper gifts this year..lol.

Neways take Care
Andre
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on December 03, 2006, 07:55:23 PM
Hey Jacky,

How are you!......i see things went very well....and you are jogging thats Amazing..how does it feel to jog those couple steps? dont you feel like you just want to take off and run a mile...haha....i think i have heard about nerve transfer surgeries...i will look and see if i can find you the article....is it a nerve graft they want to do and if so where would they be taking the graft from? how do you feel about a surgery like this...what are some of your thoughts on it? how is everything else...do you have alot planned for the holidays...or are you just taking it easy.

Good to hear from you again Jacky kep us me posted
Andre
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on December 04, 2006, 03:47:06 AM
Thanks for the respones Andre and everyone else.

Has anyone else here ever had neurolyis or a "peroneal decompression" surgery?  That's what my daughter had this past July.

It's a bit more difficult with my daughter because she is only 3 and a half and although she is pretty verbal, you can't really dialogue with her about what is going on.

We are hopefully going to start the electrical muscle stimulation therapy soon.  Her PT said it may help the muscles during recovery.

I
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on December 04, 2006, 11:51:28 AM
Hi Andre

Feeling in two minds about going for the ACLR. I am glad we are doing it pretty quickly as I didn't want to wait around for months to get it done but also realise that I will be going back to square one as far as the rehab goes. I have a month to build up as much strengh as possible for it to all go again but know I have to do it :(   How long were you back on crutches for after you had it done. Its a bit of a hassle for me as i live in an apartment 4 storeys up and there is no elavator. Its a good upper body and one leg workout tho. How quickly did your ROM come back after ACLR, was it easier than after the PLCR?

Looking at the braces they are expensive. See it as an investment for the future. I found exercising with my brace ok it didn't inhibit me any way and gave me the security of some support.

Cheers
Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on December 04, 2006, 08:31:56 PM
Hey Jacky,

How are you!......i see things went very well....and you are jogging thats Amazing..how does it feel to jog those couple steps? dont you feel like you just want to take off and run a mile...haha....i think i have heard about nerve transfer surgeries...i will look and see if i can find you the article....is it a nerve graft they want to do and if so where would they be taking the graft from? how do you feel about a surgery like this...what are some of your thoughts on it? how is everything else...do you have alot planned for the holidays...or are you just taking it easy.

Good to hear from you again Jacky kep us me posted
Andre

Jacky,

I'm not entirely sure about what the nerve graft entails either  but the surgeon mentioned that if my daughter required a nerve graft during her surgery that it would have been a "sural" nerve graft and that it might have been taken from the side of her foot...  Don't take my words as gospel though because I may be remembering things the wrong way.  There is also a Web site from a surgeon in Texas in the US named Dr. Nath and he writes a lot about foot drop surgery and other types of surgery.  I am not sure about details about him, all I can do is give you the Web site:  http://www.drnathfootdrop.com  He is in Houston, Texas and we are up in the Northeastern US so we obviously did not go to him.  My daughter's surgery was done by the only pediatric neurosurgeon in our area trained in peripheral nerve surgery.

Best of luck to you on your recovery!
 
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on December 05, 2006, 06:48:22 PM
Thanks for the info on nerve transfer.  It is something to consider but need to get ready for the next surgery in March to derotate the left leg, first and see how that goes.  So looks like I will be around here for quite a bit longer yet.  Found a good site for helping to keep to an exercise programme www.physiotherapyexercises.com may be of some use?  Good to hear from you all again.  For me it is so important to have any small achievements to share with people that understand.  Most just look at me sympathetically but strangely unhelpfully - not sure if any one else can relate to that.  Well that pesky gym ball is calling me - this is a three times a day appointment and continues to be a challenge - note to self - never ask for a gym ball for Christmas!  Oooh gosh Christmas that is coming upon us real fast and not even started yet.  Still had a laugh at the Christmas do when a good colleague said, go on have another drink I would love to see you legless' and then went into reams of apologies, umm excuse me, I have not lost my leg it is still there and it is only the foot that won't play ball (or any other games)  but it was very funny.  Have a good week people and speak again soon.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on December 08, 2006, 10:40:31 PM
Hey Hamish,

Ya Strating from square one can be a drag ..but you do have the upper hand this time..because you know what to expect and what needs to be done to get better.i felt  alot easier to recover from the third surgery. when i got out of the ACL surgery i was on crutches for about id say aweek ..i posted it awhile back.My ROM i got back fairly quick ..it took alittle more then a month.....i found that the stationary bike helped me gain it back faster...just kept trying to get full cosistent circles..then lowered the setting.You'll do fine you've been through it blind and recovere quick...know you know exactly how to recover again. and i hear you about an investment...lol...these braces are pretty pocket draining...but well worth it....plus my doc said he wont clear me to play again without one so its for life.

Take Care Hamish and have a good weekend
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on December 08, 2006, 10:58:47 PM
hey all

just updating on the progression of rehab and the therapy approaches we have been taking.
it has now been about 2 month and abit post-op for the ACL.

We have no started to increase the tempo but not the speed due to the ACL not being vascular yet.
we have introduced agility training on ladders. a ladder is laid down and i basically due football drills at a very slow and controlled pace to help retrain the motions and to retrain the muscle fibres. Dynamic warm-ups have been implemented to start getting my body as physical and active as possible before workout and training.
Water training has taken alittle twist..since i still cant run on land yet...PT(personal Trainner) has calculated the amount of steps it takes to run a 100metre dash in 11 seconds. Since water has an enormous amount of resistence the stepes must be divided by who fast i can do those running steps in the water.once that is done he can then calculate who much resistence is in the water and then tell me how many steps i must do to simulate this excersie....Yes pretty complicated ..but i understand his thought proccess. Other then the new changes the therapy is still similar to what it was before.
The Brace is coming next month then i can try running on land once again.

If you hav any ideas or differents thoughts for excersise please post them.
Have a Good Weekend all
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on December 09, 2006, 08:48:48 PM
Hello All,

I hope you are all doing well.

Just and update on my 3 year old daughter.  Yesterday her physical therapist experimented with Electrical Muscle Stimulation therapy...  My daughter, being only 3, was a bit confused and freaked out by it but we hope that it might help.

It looks as if some of the muscles that are controlled by the peroneal nerve, namely I guess the ones that turn the foot sort of in a bit of a sideways postiion, are still working.  However, the main ones that of course raise up the foot still need to regain their power.

Has anyone else here tried Electrical Muscle Stimulation?  I guess it is sometimes referred to as EMS?  If not, have any of your tried any type of similar therapy?  Did the electric stimulation therapy help you to regain use of the muscles and/or exercis the muscles that my have been dormant during the nerve recovery?

An early Merry Christmas, or rather Happy Christmas, to all of you!   :)
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on December 10, 2006, 02:40:17 AM
Hey Mom444,

How did she do having the Muscle stimulator on? other then being scared was she able to feel sensation and relay the sensations to you and the threapist? If you read back to some of the earlier post there are some different approaches that have been taken when dealing with Muscle Stimulation. also what kind of stimulator are they using? the one i have been most fimiliar with is a N.E.M.S unit.(neuro muscle stim) i bought a portable for 120$ canadian(ordered through the clinic) and it was used to stimulate the atrophied and "dormant" muscle that controls the dorsiflexion...Tibialas Anterior muscle which is located along the tibia or shin bone. i would have to say it helped keep the muscle alive so when i strted to get nerve reganeration i still had alittle bit of life and strength to noticable dorsiflex. The best thing i think helped me start to get my motor function back was Retraction Phase Therapy.Using the bodies natural retraction phase to help "trick "the nerve into reacting to an automaic response.(ex.If you pull your toe down past its natural sationary postion...it will retract into its original position..what the therapists did was as they pulled down i would try to meet the resistence once they felt something (or not) they would let go and assist my foot through the full range of motion.Also as i posted earlier Gravity can play another role in "tricking" the nerve into response.have her lay on her tummy with her legs bent at 90 degrees and tell her to pull down instead of up. And one last  thing i felt worked really well was trying to send signals back to the brain instead of from the brain to muscle. this was done simply with temperature changing sharp/ dull tests, pressure testing and just constant touching.

I was also wondering if she can move her toes? if she can ..which ones..usually the big toe muscle (Extensor halliucs longus)is the hardest and most stubborn one to regenerate due to its location and its tricky lumbar motor points. if she can move all her other toes it is important to start strengthening them as they play apart in the dorsiflexion of the foot. towel rolls and retraction phase and stimulation is kind of the ame as the stimulation for the tib ant.(therapist would know exactly).

Hope i was able to help you with some iof my experiences
Take care
Andre
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on December 11, 2006, 03:26:50 PM
Just a questions i wanted to ask about.

Is there anyone who has had an ACL recon and regained strength speed and basically all that they were capable of before the recon?if so .....what were some things that might have helped in your recovery? on my second month post op and my strength has me worried i start running next month and not sure about whether or not my knee can take it due to the lack of muscle from all the atrophy it suffered the past year.

Thanks Everyone
Andre
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on December 12, 2006, 03:50:20 AM
Hey Mom444,

How did she do having the Muscle stimulator on? other then being scared was she able to feel sensation and relay the sensations to you and the threapist? If you read back to some of the earlier post there are some different approaches that have been taken when dealing with Muscle Stimulation. also what kind of stimulator are they using? the one i have been most fimiliar with is a N.E.M.S unit.(neuro muscle stim) i bought a portable for 120$ canadian(ordered through the clinic) and it was used to stimulate the atrophied and "dormant" muscle that controls the dorsiflexion...Tibialas Anterior muscle which is located along the tibia or shin bone. i would have to say it helped keep the muscle alive so when i strted to get nerve reganeration i still had alittle bit of life and strength to noticable dorsiflex. The best thing i think helped me start to get my motor function back was Retraction Phase Therapy.Using the bodies natural retraction phase to help "trick "the nerve into reacting to an automaic response.(ex.If you pull your toe down past its natural sationary postion...it will retract into its original position..what the therapists did was as they pulled down i would try to meet the resistence once they felt something (or not) they would let go and assist my foot through the full range of motion.Also as i posted earlier Gravity can play another role in "tricking" the nerve into response.have her lay on her tummy with her legs bent at 90 degrees and tell her to pull down instead of up. And one last  thing i felt worked really well was trying to send signals back to the brain instead of from the brain to muscle. this was done simply with temperature changing sharp/ dull tests, pressure testing and just constant touching.

I was also wondering if she can move her toes? if she can ..which ones..usually the big toe muscle (Extensor halliucs longus)is the hardest and most stubborn one to regenerate due to its location and its tricky lumbar motor points. if she can move all her other toes it is important to start strengthening them as they play apart in the dorsiflexion of the foot. towel rolls and retraction phase and stimulation is kind of the ame as the stimulation for the tib ant.(therapist would know exactly).

Hope i was able to help you with some iof my experiences
Take care
Andre

Thanks Andre.  Your input helped a lot.  Again, because she is only 3 it's hard for her to explain what she feels in her leg.  We have to put things into a 3 year old's perspective which is a bit challenging for us.  I think it is the NEMS unit that you mentioned. 

I'm glad that I am able to dialogue with some of you who have direct experience with all this.

My next concern is maybe to move her to another physical therapist who is more experienced with helping people with this type of injury.  Because my daughter is only 3 we are required to take her to the PT dept at the local Children's Hospital.  I wonder if I can maybe find a physical therapist who normally deals with adults but who has more experience with peroneal regenration.

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on December 12, 2006, 06:47:23 AM
Hey Mom444,

From what i noticed..not to many theapist know how to approach such an injury Mainly because its out of there expertis.nerve damage is pretty rare and without the ability to actually rehab it they kind of just wing it and let time tell...it will be a search but finding someone who is proactive is a must.At the beging stage me and my school therapist went searching for answers and we were introduced to a sports medicine doctor on a pro team just to ask questions about different approaches. usually they are very busy but they are usually open to public and it could be a good route to find information...once you get the info needed it can be carried out by your regular therapist. usually the info given is just outside of a therapists level of training i guess you can say. some of the things he suggested were making sure i wasnt lacking any vitamins minerals or nutrients in my diet....so i had to take blood tests to see how healthy i was and if  i lacked somewhere i had to basically top up  on it.(his theory was "the more healthy you are the better chance for recovery") also he said (dont qoute me) ... maximizing your oxygen levels was needed to insure better regeneration  ..this was done with a hyperbaric chamber. im not referring anything i have done  ...but there are plenty of options ...we just need to find out who knows them.

I guess what im trying to say is find someone who knows all the ingredients to normal recovery(changes in the body,key contributers in healing red blood cells oxygen,amino acids etc...) and apply them to this injury with the therapist. 
I wish you all the best and i know things are gonna wokout
Andre
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on December 12, 2006, 07:01:05 PM
Thanks Andre :)  I hope things work out for my little girl.  It's so upsetting to see your child injured.

I was wondering what a Rehabilitative Medicine specialist could do.  We had a Rehab Med doctor do her EMG and so far out of all the other doctors we had seen it seems like the Rehab specialist knew the most about this type of injury.

All of this is new to me and confusing.  Would a Rehab Med person do anything a PT wouldn't do?
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on December 12, 2006, 07:06:56 PM
Hello Mom444

I have sent you a personal message.  I cannot answer your query regarding a rehab med as I don't think we have those on the NHS.  I hope that you see some improvement soon in your daughters condition.  Children do adapt so much better than adults but of course it is more difficult to explain what and why things happen.  Does your daughter have hydrotherapy?  I am a great fan of this type of treatment and convinced most of my improvement has been hrough this type of therapy.  You take care and Bless you good.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on December 12, 2006, 09:36:56 PM
Hello Mom444

I have sent you a personal message.  I cannot answer your query regarding a rehab med as I don't think we have those on the NHS.  I hope that you see some improvement soon in your daughters condition.  Children do adapt so much better than adults but of course it is more difficult to explain what and why things happen.  Does your daughter have hydrotherapy?  I am a great fan of this type of treatment and convinced most of my improvement has been hrough this type of therapy.  You take care and Bless you good.

Thank yoiu j_smi001 for your sweet personal message!  I tried to reply but it would not let me so I am replying personally here.

Thankfully this whole ordeal has not caused my daughter too much emotional or physical pain.  She for the most part has been going on being an active and happy toddler.  She flops her foot when she walks and occasionally trips a bit more easiily but she still somehow manages running around and can still play on the jungle gym at the playground!  :)  She occasionally complains that her lttle foot brace hurts her but she is okay for the most part.  They are now making her a foot brace with dosiflexion assist. 

She has a very long and very deep incision scar on the back of her leg from the surgery.  Hopefully it wll fade as she ages.  Strangely enough she did not have a lot of pain directly after the surgery.

I think I will start looking into other therapists after the Christmas break.  I don't want to insult her PT by saying that we want to go to someon else but I think her PT will understand.  We are in the US so we are on my husband's health insurance and sometimes they are restrictive as to where you can go. 

I just have to mention again how thankful I am and how blessed I feel to have found this board.  Prior to this I had no contact with anyone who had been through a similar ordeal.

Thank you for your thoughts and prayers.  I am thinking of and praying for all of you too. 
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on December 15, 2006, 06:11:09 AM
Hey Everyone how are things? hopefully recovery and life is going well.

Just blogging.

Its been 1 year three months and 5 days since the injury
one year three months since the first surgery and
2 and a half months since the ACL surgery.

today the knee feels stable ...lacks strength and reflexively im still alittle slow. i have full extension but when i reach my max ...the "fat pad" seems to have some scar tissue surrounding it still ...from the surgery which im hopig will subside with massage and "Mobs".Walking is fine but putting pressure doesnt feel the greatest( mainly lifting weights)...its hard to explain but i just do not feel confident with alot of pressure....not sure if its because i have been compensating for so long with my good leg or just "Normal" ACL surgery pains. It almost feels like everything i do (weight baring) my good leg automatically takes the load.Really trying to even this out but to me it seems like i need to put more pressure or weight then one leg can handle so my left has to kick in.....im sure my therapist would differ.

 the nerve feels good as well....i still have the tingles and cold rushes ......almost as if ice is being poured down my leg. not sure  if this still symbolizes healing at this stage in recovery ..but im guessing it cant be a bad thing since there has been consistent improvement.
still do not have EHL response trying hard to get a reaction .....we know there is juice following there just not enough and it seems to be to difficult to assist this function with stimulation.The other four toes are working hard to strengthen and are showing improvement just not at the same pace of the Tibialas Anterior Muscle....but im sure they'll tag along. Numbness is spotty.....on the top of my foot i have numbness here and there and when the numb spots are touch it feels awkward almost like a higher level of sensitivity. the outside of my leg feels better as well...near the peroneal tendon when i run my hands up and down a trail on tingles follows my touch pattern...not sure if this is a good thing or bad ...but i do it anways just to get a sense of feeling back to the tendon and leg.

Quads Quads Quads..these suckers have taken a massive blow this past year and are doingalright with strengthening...these muscles are by far the hardest ones to retrain and strengthen i feel especiallly when you cant do leg extension.It almost makes me regret all those days i was in the gym and skipped the leg ext mahine to do squats. And last just some input on the ankle....it has been dangling fo clse to a ear and now that i can move it it feels so tight. every movement feels like a stretch and no matter how much i stretch ...it  still feels like that. i m guessing it just needs to get back in the habit of movement since it went thorugh a hibernation phase. Well that about somes up the way my knee leg and ankle feel since the injury.

I probably wont be on for the rest of the week or weekend so have a good weekend everyone.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on January 02, 2007, 06:54:55 AM
Happy New Year Everyone and Good Luck with Recovery for 2007!
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: stabso on January 02, 2007, 08:51:31 AM
Happy New Year!

I've been reading this forum with interest and even though I don't have a knee injury, I do have full on drop foot as a result of compression of the L5 S1 root nerves by a massive disc rupture.
I had a discectomy (removal of ruptured part of disc) to relieve the pressure on the root nerve on Nov 8th and the back is now doing fine.

What I have been struggling to get my head around, is the foot drop/nerve damage and how to best promote healing especially as I was shocked to be given only a 10% chance of recovery and no physio specific to foot drop.

Anyways, I guess what I'm trying to say is, I'm glad I bumped into this forum and I hope as a "spine" guy, you "knee" guys don't mind me showing up now and again.



Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: fire535 on January 02, 2007, 05:37:37 PM
Good luck with your foot drop.  I am glad you got some relieve from your surgery.  Nerves take time to heal.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on January 02, 2007, 08:00:13 PM
Firstly Happy New Year to all and let 2007 be a good year for nerve recoveries.  Welcome to stabso and fire535, foot drop is foot drop no matter where it originates from and if we can help eachother along a bit with either advice or words of encouragement when needed then that is good.  I have gained great comfort from this thread.  Initially I felt so alone and in complete disorientation until I started to learn about the condition and how others were managing with it. 

My physio has requested nerve conduction tests for the sciatic and peroneal nerve to assess their function.  I suppose I am getting near the 12 month mark.  Although now I have my Toe Off splint I am quite happy as there is very little I can't do.  I am lucky in that  have had some recovery in my foot and so remain very positive.  Just need to get past the HTO in March and hope you will all be there to help me through that.

Heard a great quote today, Never argue with an idiot ... they drag you down to their level then beat you with experience. 
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on January 03, 2007, 04:52:41 PM
Happy New Year everyone!

Welcome to our new people.

Got a new toy today, its called a Foot-up. Its an ankle strap with a tongue that slotts into your laces to hold the foot up. Wearing it for the first time today so will let you know how I get on and if its any good. Has anyone else used one of these?

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: daveybc on January 05, 2007, 06:11:01 PM
 :'(
Hello everyone.  I'm new to these boards but I guess we all have the same thing in common.  I am having surgery today to sew together my Peroneal nerve (it's 90% severed due to being stabbed in the leg).

I'm 28 years old and am very worried about never being able to walk/run/jump etc again without problems or a limp.  I know this may be expecting a lot but I would like to get thru this, no matter how much time it takes, and be able to be back to normal..like I was before the injury.  I've read all the postings here but everyone who has fully recovered seems to have been in their teens which I have been told is the best time (if there is a best time) to have this type of injury.  The younger, the better.  The nerves seem to get old and lazy as you get older. 

Anyway, any advice and/or words of encouragement would be appreciated.  I have surgery in 3 hours.  very scared.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on January 06, 2007, 01:08:09 AM
Welcome and best of luck to all of the new members!

I'm glad also that people are still posting to this thread, I got worried for a while that it was staring to fade!  Please keep on posting so that we can support and encourage each other!    :)

My daughter is now in a dorsiflexion assist foot brace and it is a little bit thicker than her original brace but she seems to be okay with it.  Her preschool teacher noted that she seems to walk better in it.

We are I guess going to continue with her physical therapy and with the electrical muscle stimulation.  I don't know if I mentioned this before but because my daughter is so little her PT had a hard time getting the electrodes to line up on her leg and hit the right muscles.  She will have to order special, extra small electrodes.

It has been a little over five months since her neurolysis/peroneal decompression surgery and she still cannot dorsiflex.  The only thing that she can do is twist her foot slightly to the side, which may or may not be related to the peroneal nerve?  It is all so confusing.

Her PT spoke with the neurosurgeon and they both agreed that the nerve will most likely need to regenerate from the spinal cord so it could take many, many months for us to see any improvement.

We are just staying calm and keeping the faith. 

On a bit of a bright side her surgical scar seems to be healing more each day.  It was very long and frightening looking after the surgery, almost like a Frankenstein cut!  But actually that is the least of our worries...

I hope everyone had fun over the holidays and is enjoying how relaxing January can be!

Bless all of you.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on January 07, 2007, 02:11:28 AM
Hey Everyone,

Welcome to all the new members....we are all here for support. i dont know where i would be without this site and especially the people i have met in this thread.they're experiences and words of encouragement have helped me enormously.

to Hamish.....how is the new foot thingy you got ? does it do the samething as an AFO or is it a new type of splint tried searching it didnt have much luck im gonna try again.also hows everything going with recovery?

to Stabso Doctors expectations are only statisical limitations that you shouldn't apply to yourself. i learned that once you start giving into the stats and the Doc guesses then you will truly get no further then that. you are capable of getting better...everyone is .....stay positive and try to filter out any negative opinions.

Jacky i have been a supporter of you 100 percent  and you have been my biggest supporting aid and we will definately be there in March and after.You have done so well and your drive is inspiring you will do well.and i like the qoute

Hey Daveybc sorry to hear about your injruy and the begining i must say is the hardest to go through. for myself i went through self pity,depression and i just felt useless to the point that i didnt want to do anything that required me to walk ... i hated everything about it and i beat myself up with it until i finally had enough and wanted to change what happend. I don't think age plays a big part but i think your mind and dedication plays an even bigger role in recovery. you already have what i didnt and thats the will to get back to the way you were and that thought is going to be your vehicle to recovery.we are here for support and any questions you may have.

Hey Mom444 the brace was a huge help to me mentally and in recovery. i wish your daughter all the best.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: stabso on January 07, 2007, 10:00:19 AM
Thanks for the warm welcome and words of encouragement.

j_smi001, if there's one particular thing this thread oozes, it's, support. So come March I reckon you'll be in safe hands around here.

Hamish, I bought the Foot Up when it first kicked off and I must say I found the idea of my foot being held up by what is in effect a strong piece of knicker elastic, worrying to say the least.
But it does work as an alternative to the AFO from which I find I need to have a break from.
However, it does have different dynamics as it isn't as rigid as an AFO and is ideally designed for mild to moderate foot drop.
It also allows you to wear your "normal" size shoes as it doesn't involve putting anything into your shoe.

daveybc, hope the op went well and best of luck with the recovery. Keep us informed of how it's going.

mom444, best of luck to your daughter too on her road to recovery.

amdre, There really isn't any info about physio to help with foot drop out there, so many thanks for your hugely inspirational and informative posts on here and as for statistics, 8 out of 10 people think they're rubbish anyway.

Here's a link for the Foot Up
http://www.technologyinmotion.co.uk/flash/ankle-foot/footup.htm




Best
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on January 07, 2007, 06:47:55 PM
Hi Guys,

Andre and Stabso. Worn the foot-up for a couple of days now and an give some feedback. As Stabso says it is just a bit of elastic which fits into the laces and does not give nearly as much support as an AFO and have actually gone over on my ankle a couple of times as it does not give the same ankle support. I think I will still be using the AFO but will also use the Foot-up for going to the gym as it is very controlled what I do there.

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on January 07, 2007, 08:07:09 PM
Hello everyone,

Well my GP hs made the referal to the consultant neurologist to see why I still have muscle wastage in the thigh.  There is a 5cm difference between the two legs - which gives me a turky leg and a chicken wing (not a good look!)  so that is the next hurdle.  It is possible that the aneasthetic during the first op caused some nerve damage much further up (so mom444 - I could be in a similiar position as your daughter and having to regenerate from the spinal cord)- or it could be that I am just plain lazy - not consciously but sub-consciously I am favouring the other leg and over protecting the affected leg.  We will wait for the results.  On a very positive note though I have anteria thingy movement - the ligament/tendon thing that makes your foot dorsiflex - well that is showing itself and I can lift my foot, probably half way.  I have just been so very lucky to still be going to physio and hydrotherapy and sure that it has given me the very best chances.  Good to see we are all checking back in after the holidays.  Thanks for all your kind words of support for March - I really do appreciate it.  Every Blessing to all.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on January 08, 2007, 01:18:47 AM
Hey All

Thanks for the link doesn't look very supportive at all as Hamish explained but it is definately better on the eye. And Yes Stabso,there isn't actual theraputic guidlines for Foot Drop specifically but there are different approaches that can be taken to help assist in recovery. I can only speak from my own experience (which may not be the most "normal" ways to approach the jinury).but for example during the past year (05 sept and on) i learned of another Player who suffered the same exact injury plus artery damage who had almost had his leg amputated. He reocvered (his EHL strength was still unresponsive)and is Back playing professional American football(and doing very well) after a 2 year recovery period .His name is Robert Edwards He played in the NFL and now plays in the CFL....we followed there approach down to every last excersise and therapy session..that we had access to.I to will play again in approx June and at the Pro level that i had always dreamed of playing when i was given 0 chance of recovery due to "compensation" and two negative EMG at 5 and 8 0r 9 Months post injury that showed no response of the Nerve..I feel that it helped me every step of the way and gave me confidence to see that someone else has done it so i knew it was always possible for recovery. Im definately not saying this answers all the questions but i started this thread to hear about what others have done to Recover and Overcome Adversity and also to hear and support others who want to overcome so we all can see there progression. So again there may not be specific ways to treat the injury with physio but hopefully through hearing others progression and experiences we can learn something different to maximize the potential to recovery.

Congrats on the Dorsiflexion Jacky the movements are just gonna get stronger and stronger...do you tingles or sparks whenever you dorsiflex? just wondering ...when i first started they cam back and no i still get them just not as bad.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on January 08, 2007, 01:32:15 AM
Thanks everyone for your words of encouragement!  We are still hoping and praying for my daughter's recovery.

Also, j_smi001 thank you for your private messages!  I would respond to you but I have no idea how to send a message back!?  How do you do it?  Do you need special permissions?  I can't find a private message button on my user panel.

We won't have another EMG for my daughter until May.  Her surgery was at the end of last July so we are just at the 5 month mark.

As I mentioned before I am a librarian and a researcher so I have checked many scholarly journal articles on this subject and not all of the articles say specifically how long it took for injured peroneal nerves to recover after neurolysis.  It's quite frustrating!  Some of the articles just said that patients had "improvement" but they did not state the time.

Hoping all of you are doing well.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on January 08, 2007, 01:41:49 AM
Just Blogging

the first day back in therapy after the holiday break was Jan 3rd my assessment went well. i am 3 months and abit post-op ACL with nomore swelling. After workouts it tends to get a little bit of fluid build up but not enough to effect range of motion or strength. Stability is solid with comparison to thr right leg and seems to have no laxity in either repair. Strength of the VMO and Quad in general has been the issue and has now taken the fore front to rehab. The Quad is withiin an inch of the right leg and is ready for bracing but the strength does and size doesn't reflect the numbers. so i have been put on a Hyperthrophy workout program to build size and then a strength program after the 3 weeks to build up the strength.

Agility training in the Water has now been stepped up to 50 percent sprints in the shallow end so i can practice lifting my foot against resistance
they have also added start and stop motions so i can get used exploding and slowing down when running before i start on land .lateral and backwards running have also been implemented. i see the OS on monday to get re-measured and possilbly get fitted for a brace which has me me very excited....once i get the brace i can start working out all the kinks and start running at a performance level again something i haven't done for way to long now.
Therapy now just consist of Stimulation and Dorsiflexion ,Eversion excersises to maximize the strength.

take care and hope everyone had a good weekend
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on January 08, 2007, 08:01:45 PM
Mom 444,

To reply to a PM - From the main screen in the top left hand corner in the box called user info, it will say you have ** messages.  If you click on that it will take you into your personal message page.  next find the message you wish to reply to and you will see three options, delete, quote and reply, press reply, type hello .................... and send.   Hope you can follow my instructions. 

Amdre - always love to read your blogs and you seem to be doing just great - I can't wait to feel the wind running through my hair! at the moment I have to satisfy myself with standing outside on a windy day!

i have physio and hydro on the same day tomorrow - that should test my new found foot movement.  Mind I quite like the look of the 'foot up' - I have a device called a 'toe off' which was provided for me by the orthotics department but I costs about 400 pounds.  How much is the foot up as maybe now I have regained some definable movement I could go for something a little more descreet?
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on January 12, 2007, 04:46:32 AM
Another question for Hamish regarding the foot up

How strong is the elastic band on the brace that holds your foot up? does it allow for push off or extension of the ankle?
Jacky i think the foot up would be perfect especially now that you have movement..when i was in the AFO and got movment back i felt limited by the brace because i could not practice my new Range of motion...it was just stuck in one spot. The foot up looks like it gives you more freedom to extend dorsiflex and rotate when you start to regain those funtions.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on January 12, 2007, 01:57:11 PM
Hi Guys,

The elastic on the Foot-up is pretty strong and holds the foot up well. Have to remember this can only be used with shoes that are laced. It does not inhibit dorsifextion, aversion and inversion in the same way as an AFO does. I am wearing mine all the time and it seem fine. The only thing from my piont of view, and this is because I still have no dorsiflexion, not even a twitch at all and my ankle obviously does not have the stability, is if I am having a couple of beer or going to be walking on uneven ground I would wear the AFO. I have gone over on my ankle in these circumstances.

The Foot-up cost me around 60 pounds and I ordered it online from

http://www.technologyinmotion.co.uk/flash/ankle-foot/footup.htm

Andre, I know these are available online from some sites in the States and Canada. I will try and find one I found it on and let you know.

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on January 12, 2007, 06:57:25 PM
My daughter's PT was concerned also that the regular AFO held her foot in a frozen position.  Her PT was also concerned about how it may have caused my daughter to not use her calf muscles.  My daugher does have some muscle atrophy in the leg with the nerve damage.  We now have her in a dorsiflextion assist AFO and we often let her go without the brace at home just so that she can maybe build up some of the surrounding leg muscles through normal play.

By the way, my daughter just came in and was mad that I was on the computer and not playing with her.  I told her that I get emails from people all over the world who hurt themselves too and who wear foot braces and that those people ask me how she is doing.  She said, "Really Mommy?  People want to know how I am doing?"  I told her yes and that they want to know if she is getting better. 

She thinks its cool!   :)

We hope you all get better too.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: daveybc on January 16, 2007, 10:17:24 PM
Hey everyone.  I can't help but think how cool this site is.  It sure gives you hope and support.  I hope everyone is doing well or at least better.

I had my surgery after the New Years incident.  It went very well.  The doc said i had two nerves cut, the peroneal severed completely, along with an artery and the muscle.  He repaired it all and said the surgery went as great as it possibly coulud've gone.  now I'm at home, in bed, in a big aluminum foot brace.  for the first 5 days the pain was almost unbearable. ouch.  and pain medication doesnt do much for me except make me vomit so i pretty much had to tough it out.  the pain has for the most part subsided to an annoyance with the occasional spasm in my foot and ankle that hurts like a mofo.  and when i try to use my crutches to get around the weight of the brace makes it feel like my leg is being ripped open.  which is never a great feeling...unless you're in to that type of thing.  which i'm not. 

I go back to see the doc Jan 31st which is when i suspect i get the brace off and start working on getting this limp noodle of a foot working again.  as of now I have more sensation and feeling in it than I did before the surgery.  I can wiggle my toes very very slightly. but i dont know if that's due to the surgery or just the fact that the pain from being stabbed has gone away and allowing me to move it a bit.  not sure but i will definitely keep you posted.

i got some great ideas from everyone here on how to get around and tips to recover once I get this brace off and the surgery heals.  so thanks for that.


http://www.kneeguru.co.uk/KNEEtalk/index.php?topic=33939.0
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on January 16, 2007, 11:30:32 PM
Good luck Davey!  Forgive me if you already mentioned this but because your peroneal nerve was severed did they do a graft or did they sutre the nerve back together?  Did you have any scar tissue that needed to be removed or did none form yet?

As for my daughter we are still waiting and just wondering what to do next in physical therapy.  Her PT said that we might be able to see if we qualified to have physical therapy done by our local school district, that way a therapist would come to the house and we would not have to pay copays.  Boy, I had no idea how much red tape it involves!  First of all, the entire family would have to go through a psychological evaluation!  Then my daughter would have to be evaluated by a psychologist and then have  have someone go sit in at her at nursery school and see how she gets around and interacts with the other students.  It seems a little too creepy to me seeing how the problem only involves her foot and thankfully does not affect her psychologically or mentally.

There does not appear to be any dorsiflexion yet in her foot and it is 5 and a half months past surgery.  We keep hoping and praying.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on January 17, 2007, 04:19:12 AM
Hey all from now on i will be posting my work out sessions on my page. if you would like to view them just click on the world icon under my name and it will take you right there....i had my first day Actual controlled running on land !!!! and it was awesome ....my therapist had to stop me from going to fast a couple times....but for my first time back running in a year i dont feel i lost to much of a step. some soreness and tightness but other then that i was too overwhelmed with the feeling of accomplishment to notice anything else. i should get my brace next week hopefully and we can go fast ..can't wait
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on January 17, 2007, 02:47:47 PM
Hey Andre,

So happy for you to be back running must feel great. Let me know how you get on with the brace when you get it.

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on January 17, 2007, 02:53:49 PM
Oh forgot to say! Got a date for my ACL reconstruction and it is being done on 12th February. Can start makng plans for going forward from here now as I have been in limbo land.

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on January 17, 2007, 03:02:54 PM
Hey Hamish

For sure i will let you know. i hear the brace takes awhile to get used. hopefully i can adjust well enough and i will definately let you know how things progress with it.

Daveybc...its good to see you documenting your recovery ...this will kind of play as a documentary of progress as you will keep looking back and realizing how well you have done and how far you have come. this site has been my mental release and has given me alot of hope ....keep focused and we will be here for you.

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on January 17, 2007, 03:23:09 PM
Just Blogging

Day after my land run...and i have to say my leg feels like it went through a war last night. soreness muscle tightness and ROM in my flexion was difficult to get full this morning. i  iced last night and elevated to lessen the chance of swelling ...and no new swelling which is good i guess. and this morning i massaged heated and stretched and  its starting to loosen up a bit...but still overall a new feeling which also can be a good thing. i think for our run today i may request o do it on a softer surface...not sure if it will help relieve some of the sorness but never hurt to try i guess. also could be because i havent done that type of consistent movement for a year now so. Todays aganeda will be be pool running ..land running and i believe weight trainging we'll see how things go in my daily pre-assessment this afternoon.

Take Care
Andre

Hey Hamis.Good to see you got a date.i know exactly what you mean...your plans to recovery just look so much more reachable once you fix the last piece of the puzzle. After Feb 12th will be the start of a huge progressive recovery.
Have a good day TTYL.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on January 18, 2007, 02:57:13 PM
Hey Andre,

Was you ACLr a hamstring or a Patella tendon graft. They are going to harvest hamstring tendons to create my new ACL and wondering what impact this will have on my hamstring.

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on January 18, 2007, 03:30:44 PM
Hey Hamish

I had a Patella graft....my OS said told me that it would be a more solid repair with the patella graft rather then a cadaver, or hamstring repair. he also told me that it would be harder to get ROM back with the patella repair so i guess that was his main concern. not sure what this will due to your hamstring but i know a girl basketball player who had blown both her acl's in each leg (at different times) and had a hamstring repair on one and the patella graft on the other. she told me that she rather the patellar for both due to some issues she had playing and running on the hamstring. everyone is diferent so you can't really say but if you are looking to get back into activity or competitive sport  i hear the patella is the way to go. are you thinking of requesting a different approach...or just exploring the diiferent options?

Andre
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: daveybc on January 19, 2007, 07:20:42 AM
mom444, they ended up not having to do the graft.  i got lucky. I had my surgery pretty soon after the injury (7 days) so when they cut me open, there was some damage at each end of the completely severed part that they had to "trim" away. but the two pieces were still long enough to meet and sew together.  When I woke up (and for the first 3 days) all of my toes were curled and i couldnt uncurl them. I'm wondering if that's becauase they pulled the nerve too tight or something. I dont know. But now the toes are fine.  the entire thing is just so damn uncomfortable. I get these crazy spasms in my leg and foot that HURT.  Does anyone else get those? or did they after their surgery? i imagine it's the nerve firing away or something..i dont know.

i just cant wait to get this brace off, and the surgery to heal so i can put some weight on my leg and foot and start trying to walk.  right now when i tak the brace off to re-dress the incision, i cant even lift my leg out of the brace. it's so weak. it literally feels like it was just reattached to my leg.  which in a sense (having two nerves, an artery, and a muscle sewn together) i guess it was somewhat.

anyway...i'm a little too affraid to try to dorsiflex my foot because i'm affraid it will tear the sutures inside.  so i havent really tried just in case. cant wait for the 31st!

i can post some pics of the stab wound after the incident and of my leg after surgery if anyone is interested.  they're a little bloody though. but my girlfriend just sent them to me and i just saw them. how crazy that one day you're fine and minding your own business and the next you're in this entire mess and waiting to see if you'll ever walk normal again. :(
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on January 19, 2007, 04:55:17 PM
Hey Daveybc,

Go on lets see the pics? I like that sort of stuff. What actually happened, why did these guys attack you?

Wishing you all the best in your recovery.

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on January 20, 2007, 12:38:29 AM
Hey all just blogging

after my Tuesday run Therapists decided on Wednesday to give the leg a break from running motions and just walk through the movements but with explosive force full strides. We also worked on and walked through agility movements  to fimilarize my body with some of my old ways. This was all done after a intense leg workout.Thursday the knee blew up and was swollen to a point that i lost about 10 degrees flexion. We then went through the normal procedures to rid the joint of swelling and this helped. we then called it a day and i was fitted for the Brace.Today the swelling went down and my flexion is back to normal. i have decided to give it another days rest to full recoop  so i can workout properly with no resistance from the swelling at all. On a some what brighter note i have been invited to a Pro evaluation camp for the upcoming Draft. on March 9th i will be put to the test to see whether or not i will be physically able to play at the next level..since i was written off as "Damaged Goods". The good thing about this is that there expectations will be low due to the severity...so it gives me an upper hand because i believe that i will be very close to normal for speed and strength by March.

Have a great weekend ...and dont be shy to Blog everyone its kind of interesting what day to day therapy can be like and the different things we all go through while on a long or short road to recovery. 

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on January 21, 2007, 01:04:10 AM


Have a great weekend ...and dont be shy to Blog everyone its kind of interesting what day to day therapy can be like and the different things we all go through while on a long or short road to recovery. 



Thanks Ande for encouraging us to "just blog."   :)  Saw your site by the way and watched the video of you running, it was very inspirational.  Keep up the good work.

If I could I would post some pictures online of my daughter's surgical scar, etc. but I dont' think we can upload pictures here...  Or can we?  I still can't find out how to reply to personal messages.

Here is my blog:

I'm just a little worried about possible muscle atrophy in my daugher's left leg where the nerve damage is.  You notice it when she is wearing shorts or tights, but I am trying not to worry.  We let her run around without the brace a lot, she generally only wears it when we go out or when she is at preschool.  The new one is larger and thicker so we have to make sure her pants are wider and that she has wider sneakers to wear with it.

My husband and I decided against trying to get physical therapy from the school district.  It just seems like too much.

I still keep researching nerve regeneration online and in databases.  The general consesus is that nerves regenerate very slowly.  I found this one site that gives a little bit of an overview of peripheral nerve injuries.  It's short and to the point, hope it helps:

http://depts.washington.edu/neurosur/ptcare/periph.html
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on January 21, 2007, 02:30:10 PM
Hi Mom,

I am going to ty and attach. If you click on the 'Additional Options' link below it alos you to attach a file I think. Lets see what happens. I have reduced the size as i see the max size for a file is 128kb. I just reduced the size of the image to 50% and it seems to have reduced the file size to and appropriate size. Hope these images are not too bad but the scar image is shortly after surgery and the staples are still in. Also xray after repair.

I wouldn't worry too much about the muscle wastage as once things have repaired themselves and the muscle starts to work the muscle will build. Andre will probably back this up as he is further along the line of recovery.

Wishing you all the best.
Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on January 21, 2007, 08:10:32 PM
Okay, here is a picture of her surgical scar.  I apologize if it is a little gross.

The scar looks longer than the one Hamish had.  Maybe it is because the surgeon wanted to expose the full length of the peroneal nerve because they were not quite sure where the damage was.  The scar continues along the side of her leg to the fibular head.



Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on January 22, 2007, 07:51:18 PM
OK Ican add to the scar piccies - again hopefully not too gross, but this is my operation scar that did the dirty peroneal nerve thing!  I have another one showing the muscle wastage but the file was too big - it seems muscle wastage goes with it.  Wishing you all a good week
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on January 22, 2007, 07:53:24 PM
ah that wasn't very successful - try again
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on January 23, 2007, 03:00:17 PM
Hey all,

I am "blogging" again...

I reconsulted with my daughter's PT and the PT thinks that we SHOULD go with getting therapy from the school district.

We are waiting a few months before going back to the electrical muscle stimulation to see if there is any more regeneration.  We tried it last month but there was no nerve response yet.  Hopefully we can eventually get a unit for home.

It is now six months past her surgery and there is no dorsiflexion yet.  We keep hoping and praying.

If it really is that "inch a month" timeframe for reneration, then I guess we'll have to do some waiting.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on January 25, 2007, 05:26:15 AM
Hey all,

Great Pics ....i wish i had taken more pics and video of mine ...i really regret not doing that.To all the pics posted how have your cars healed? mine have been pretty nice conversation starters and usually win scar comparison competitions with the boys.

Mom444 you still have alot of time to go with your daughter try not to be discouraged...the waiting is the toughest part and not to compare but i didnt get dorsi flexion until (correct me if im wrong) 8-9 months after. i would guess do to her age that she would probably have a much bigger window for regeneration....im am truly wishing all the best for you and your family.i was thinking of some mental preparation that i did with a doctor....just a different approach...it was just watching yourself as you once were. i had videos and game film that i would sit and watch just to see how i moved then tried to imagine and instill dreams and thoughts of moving like that again.
I have two kids on my own and i was watching old videos with them when i thought of you and your daughter and thought maybe it could be something to try if not tried already.I would see my son just acting out the things in the video..not every kid does that but....but i was thinking maybe  implanting old memories could help produce thoughts and visuals of her walking and playing "normal" again....I dunno ..im just full of hope....but anyway ii will keep you all in my thoughts.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on January 25, 2007, 05:36:56 AM
I have a Question,

I noticed this probably a week after my ACL surgery but discarded the feeling as it went away. now and then when i massage, electrode, or ice the peroneal tendon and muscle i get a feeling as if ice cold water is being poured down my leg...after the surgery i would get it frequently ....but then it wennt away and now it seems to have come back but not as consistent as before......from what i understand Hot and Cold sensations are blood vessell or circulation problems..but the cause and effect dont really make much sense and it seems to be agravated when i hit the peroneal tendon area. Has anyone else encountered feelings like this? and if so have you received any info of this feeling if there is any? One of the things that scared me when i injured myself was Artery damage......i dont think it is but possiblities are endless so i thought i would post to see if anyone can relate.

Thanks Andre
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: stabso on January 25, 2007, 05:21:58 PM
Greetings all

Last week saw a prof of neurology who said that as 2 months had passed since op to decompress root nerve and still no sign of movement, he doubted things would improve.
But would refer me on to someone who specialized in peripheral neurology.
He also wants EMG and nerve conduction tests done to pinpoint location and extent of damage. This is something I wanted to avoid in the early days, as it would confirm my worst
fears which I have now come to terms with, I guess.

Also bought a electro muscle stimulator to keep those dormant muscles ticking over, but I'm a little confused as to whether I'm doing it right.
There is hardly any contraction of the anterior tibialis muscle or of any of the other muscles affected by nerve damage and to get any sort of slight hint of a response I have to really
bump up the power on the unit often causing the electrodes to feel hot and uncomfortable. Eg if on the good leg I get muscle contractions at a setting of 21, on the other leg I have
to set it on something nearer 180 just to get a flicker.
I figure this must be down to the nerve fibres not working as they should, thus only contracting the muscle at around 5-10% of its capacity.
If this is the case and the muscle isn't contracting that much, I'm wondering whether it's worth perservering with it.
Any insights on using EMS with nerve damage would be greatly appreciated.

Saw an AFO expert today who reckons the SAFO is about as effective as the Foot Up which considering the price (£650) is not exactly a glowing endorsement.
http://www.dorset-ortho.co.uk/index.php?page=1000042

Andre, this may not be that helpful, but I've heard that the sensory aspect of nerves is the slowest, stubbornest and the last to heal so the fact that you can tell cold from hot is a good thing
in itself and hopefully not indicative of anything other than the nerve sorting itself out.

Best to all





Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on January 25, 2007, 10:17:06 PM
Stabso, I am sure all of us here are with you in what must be very disappointing news.  I am also waiting for nerve conduction tests and EMG.  I don't have a muscle stimulator so can not proffer any thoughts on that.  A friend of mind had a SAFO from Dorset Hospital (NHS funded) and is happy with it for around the house use. He has permanent complete foot drop with no hope of any recovery.  He has been a rock to me and this week supported me when I took and passed the job related fitness test.  I am so pleased to have another hurdle completed.

Amdre, with the cold water running down the leg - I had that after the arthoroscopy and was told it was the peripheral nerves sorting themselves after being cut and disturbed.  I had the feeling for sometime but it had certainly gone within a couple of years.  No such with any sort of sensation at the moment though.  I was told it was nothing to worry about but get it checked out for peace of mind.

Mom444, I have to concur with Amdre, hang in there as it really is very early days still even if it doesn't feel like it.  Your daughter is young and has that as a definate plus point. 

I wish you all the best.  Take care
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on January 26, 2007, 12:16:35 AM
Hi Stabso,

The information I have gained from this threat is that a EMG test is not a difinitive test. I think Andre has had a couple of EMG tests that showed no response but has since had positive gains with recovery and it all depends on the stage of degeneration of the nerve (which comes first) and then the regeneratio that occurs that will dictate the level of recovery.

Stick with it and good luck.
Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on January 27, 2007, 02:18:56 AM
Thanks everyone for your encouragement.  I really appreciate it and I hope and pray for all of you as well. 

Andre and J_smi, thanks for the advice.  Remember, she apparently damaged the nerve when she was only one and a half and we never were able to pinpoint it because she "walked funny" but we chalked it up to her age.  Then she was misdiagnosed for so long and went through dozens of tests, MRIs and X rays before the EMG proved her problem was nerve damage.  It looks like she had been living with the nerve damage undetected for a long time and a least a year and a half before the surgery.  Still, I hope that because her lesion was incomplete and she is so young that it can buy her some time and leeway with healing...

I have noticed lately that sometimes when my daugher is sitting on the couch she "plays" around with moving her feet.  She still can't lift up the left foot but she likes to use her right foot to push it up by force.  She also IS still able to move her left foot to the sides and I think that may be peroneal controlled?  However, she always had the ability to move her left foot to the side even before she had the nerve damage...  Remember, the lesion was "incomplete" (but I am still confused by all of this.)  Anyhow, for a three year old I think playing around with trying to move her feet is the closest thing she has to processing this whole thing.  But I guess that is actually good becaue at least she is doing something. 

We want to get an EMS unit for home as soon as there are signs of nerve regeneration and movement again.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: stabso on January 27, 2007, 03:05:41 PM
Many thanks for the words of support on this thread and best wishes to all recoverees, especially mom44's little girl.


Hamish, it's partly from reading through this thread that I realized that there's hope after the first EMG test and beyond.
Any idea what the signs of nerve degeneration are, how soon after damage does it begin and again is there anything to indicate the nerve is regenerating?

Many thanks



 
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on January 27, 2007, 04:48:48 PM
Hi Stabso,

To be honest I did't know. I am still at an early stage at the moment!

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on January 27, 2007, 06:16:26 PM
hey stabso

i know the question was not intended for me but i thought maybe i could give you some of the responses i got for your question ...as i to asked those exact same questions.part of the degeneration phase i was told was the intense pain and shocking sensations i was getting through the pathways of the damaged nerve. this happend for a gruling 3 to for months...there afte it slowly diede off and it was in a staggered point of recovery where nothing was happening for about a month or two..then the shocks began again not as heavy or as painful but there was activity again...and also my mind felt able. what i mean by that is when i couldnt move my foot ..i couldn't connect with that part of my body no matter how hard i tried....but there came a point where i just felt able to connect...dont know if it was from therapy or consistent and obsessive thoughts of recovery ...or just time. I am a strng believer in mind over body so making a mental connection would probably be a sign of regeneration and  knowing that you can move it regardless of what tests say or even physically moving it. Sorry to keep on ....i just would like to add that in trying to make a connection i got desperate and tried everything to make that connection ...ultimately compensating for the loss by using other muscles to move the foot. Please be  patient and focus on the proper muscles and pathways to recovery....it was very hard for me to make the transition out of compensating as it felt like my body had given up to the loss.

Hope all is well ..have a good weekend
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on January 27, 2007, 06:48:01 PM
Blog Time,


Had a very productive last week in therapy....well its not really therapy anymore( i guess) we are now just all about strength and retrainiing movements due to the lack of nerve response this past year and a half. This week we picked up the speed alittle ..(still unbraced and should be coming next week hopefully) and added lateral movement and Agility movements at a slow pace. the straight ahed running felt great ...but then when i started to do the lateral and agility movements my confidence seemed to hit a brick wall as i became very cautious with every step and mentally stressing myself out. i think it was partially because of doing these movements without a brace and obviously i injured myself doing these types of movements. I remember just putting my mind in there hands and just reassuring myself that they would not make me do anything i couldnt do or not able to do. With me putting all my trust in them i started through the movements andevery movment that i did i was gaining focus and  mental strength. Also when i began i had the strangest feeling when i went to spin off of the left foot...i literally did not know where my left foot was supposed to go after..almost as if i forgot a move that i had done 100 times. It was weird and also should me that i still have along way to go in recovery and that i need to correct and retrain the sense of the nerve and my balance of where i am when i do agility moves.  After running i lifted weights with the leg and .....the day after it wasn't to bad but the Poterio lateral side had all sorts of new feelings that had me kind of worried. i saw the doc and was informed that it was normal and a good thing as the tendns muscles and ligaments are adjusting to the training and the new movements that i haven't done for almost two years.
This week was a very good for recovery even though when the week began i felt discouraged ...it was a stage in recovery development that i had to go through if i wanted to keep progressing.

Take Care All
Andre

Also....new running footage and lateral and agility movement footage on Webpage...if you want to view click on the world icon ...and the new viedos are located in page blogs under" the road to recovery training sessions".
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on January 27, 2007, 09:16:38 PM
Blogging,

Well what a week........
Tuesday I took part in the job related fitness test and passed the shuttle run element of it.  I did this to satisfy myself that I could do it, but my poor suffering left knee has let me know that it did not appreciate this moment of madness and has been screaming at me ever since.  The good news is that the operated right knee stood up well to this test with no side effects at all.  I also joggrd it without my splint on and used the forward momentum to keep the foot up. 

Thursday in hydrotherapy managed to balance on my right leg (the one with foot drop).  Also noticed a increased stinging sensation down the outside of my leg when exercising.  I have noticed some stinging more recently in the evening.  Does anyone else experiance this?

Friday - heard from the hospital that my surgery on my left leg definately won't take place in March and may be in April depending on my health authority agreeing, as the op is in another health authority area.  Disappointed and need to preserve the left knee as long as possible - note to self, so no more fitness tests!  Also heard that the wait for nerve conduction tests is 18 weeks.  This is going to be another long year.

The ups and downs - but looking on the bright side the delay means I have a bit longer to regain as much strength as possible in my right leg.

With every blessing
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on January 28, 2007, 01:08:07 AM
Best of luck to all of you again.

I don't know if I'm reading too much into this but tonight during dinner my daughter said, "My leg hurts!"  My husband and I looked at each other and I admit I started to get really, really excited.  I don't know if it's too soon but so far I have heard a lot that painful sensatiions could possibly signal recovery.  When we asked her later what the pain felt like she said, "Like a dragon!"  Who knows?

But even if she was just being silly it still felt good to have a glimmer of hope. 

A lot of you have in fact had painful sensations too, correct?  For those of you who did have recovery what did it feel like.

Andre,  did when your nerve was recovering did it feel, as a three year old would say, "like a dragon?"

Bless all of you.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on January 28, 2007, 04:25:25 AM
Hey All

Lol Yes a Dragon is a perfect description as my pain was just as enormuos as a Dragon. in answer to your question mom444 the pain felt like shocks and this was very heavy and consistent shocking running down my leg to my foot this went on for about 3 months and started when i first injured the nerve it then died off for about a month or to and then i started to get pain again in the same areas but not as consistent or as sharp...Doctors said this was the regeneration phase of the nerve and that pain was good. I never thought pain could feel so good...lol...hope is always there you just have to believe which i know you do ....wish you all the best and i hope for more new sensations/movements and plenty Dragons.

Hey Jakcy....are those stining feelings on the posteriolateral side of the knee? i noticed before and now as well (but not as much) when i would balance or balance and rotate i would feel all sorts of activity going on in the posteriolateral side. it felt like stinging,strecthing/ pulling and cracking (dont ask me what cracking means ..it seemed to fit the description perfect) it eventually went away and as i do more and more on the leg it tends to come back to remind me to take it easy.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on January 28, 2007, 05:10:28 PM
Dragons,

I love the description and I am with Andre on this.  I too had significant sharp electric shock pains and burning sensations (could that be the fire from the dragon?) both whilst in plaster and out.  I took Quinnine to stop the cramps in the leg and Amiltriptyline (sp?) to stop the shocks and nerve pain.  This lasted for about four months decreasing steadily until it just disappeared altogether.  I have had no sensations for about three/four months and now have been steadily getting more stinging sensations when exercising but also when resting.  I get this on the outside of my leg at the back of my knee down the outside of my calf.  I also get twitches, like Amdre not as sharp as the original electric shocks.  I also have a dull ache at the bottom of my ankle, the bit between the sticky out ankle bone and the heel.  Since this has hapened I now have quite noticeable dorsiflexion and can lift the foot a bit but most importantly I can now see the anteria tibilas tendon, which has been conspicious by its absence up till now.  I am pleased to have pain and sensation plus movement, I wasn't so happy to have pain and no movement.  I am hoping that this is the start of the nerve recovering and awakening from its long sleep. I don't know whether this description of where I am at, at this moment is of any use.  (I don't get any pulling or cracking feelings, and as for balancing on my bad leg I have only just mastered this trick in hydrotherapy in deep water, next trick is to do a knee bend whilst maintaining my balance, presently I only manage to stick my bum out and knee stays put - needs a bit more work.)
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on January 28, 2007, 06:09:11 PM
Let's hope for more healing dragons!  LOL!   :)

Today after church my husband and I asked our daughter if her leg still hurt her and if the "dragon" was still there.  She said yes, but we are all aware that sometimes three year olds say yes to everything...  But we still hope this is true and a good sign...  When we asked her what the "dragon" was doing she said it was insider her leg.  "Which leg?" we asked.  She held up the leg with the damage. 

She then said, "The dragon is inside my leg.  Sometimes he just scratches me and sometimes he bites me."  Then we said, "Where is the dragon scratching and biting you?" and she said, "Now he is in my toes...  My toes are hot."

Again, I don't know is she is making it up to be silly but it does at least sound like what most of you described as recovery.  You also mentioned that some of you felt pain in your toes...

I really hope this is a good sign.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on January 29, 2007, 12:53:11 AM
Hey all


Jacky thats awesome news ...your "TIB ANT" has joined the party!!!!!!!!!....seeing it move makes all the hard work you have done and going to do so much more gratifying. keep on moving !!!!!!!!!!!!!

Mom444 your daugther deserves some kudos...and i need to be the first one to give them to her...when the dragons were biting me ...i was crying and whining like a three year old(most people would say) but she at 3 is taking the pain far better then i did and iam 25...lol. i believe the words of my wife were.."i already have 2 children i dont need another"..lol. so again i am glad there is a brighter side to her recovery.
 

Hope you all had a good weekend
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on January 29, 2007, 01:08:45 AM
Jacky and Andre,

Yes, I still hope there really is a "dragon!"  It is now exactly six months past her neurolysis surgery, does that sound about right for the recovery to start?

Also, were your "dragons" or the feelings of pain constant or intermittent?  Did you feel it nonstop all day or did the pain come and go?

One thing about my daughter is that she never complained of any pain back when she originally got the nerve damage (although I have read that sometimes there is "painless footdrop.")  If her pain was intense I think she would in fact be crying more or complaining more...  But kids have a high tolerance for pain, at least mine does.  Even directly after her surgery she did not have any terrible pain...    And she had the entire back and side of her leg cut open!  I remember being so scared before her surgery that she would be whining in terrible pain for days and the little trooper was fine.  One of the doctors actually said that maybe she has a high tolerance for pain or maybe she is genetically predispositioned to injuring herself...  I hope not...  But if you think about it the peroneal nerve that was operated on had no feeling because it was damaged so maybe that's why there was little or no pain?

Thanks again to all of you for your messages, thoughts, prayers and support.  We will all keep supporting each other!

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on January 29, 2007, 03:35:01 PM
Hey Mom444,

I am not sure exactly about Jacky's experience...but mine were intermittent.
Ill go into specifics....Mine were very hyper sensitive as well. at the begining(after injury) they would try to touch my leg and before they would put there hands on me
the sparks would and shock in the leg would increase while their hands would just be hovering over the injured area. it seemed like any energy they were conducting was setting my leg on fire... and i say fire because when your daughter said Dragon i can totally relate to that analogy as it seemed like such an intense heat that could be described as sparks or scorching hot surges. it was hyper sensitive like that for about the first month and there after it became unpredictable,uncomfortable and yes painful..and id say painful more from the sense th at you cant do anything about it...i tried drugs and they didnt work ..just made me fall asleep and i would usually wakeup from the sparks at night.(percocet,i refused the gabatentin)....they told me that i should take pain killers so i dont ruin my pain thershold/or sensors by trying to take pain that i cannot manage...and that by taking too much pain could leave me very weak in the areas of the injury.(not sure if i explained it properly). After a about three months it stopped and i was left in a state of nothingness...no sensation no movement little sensation and still numbeness. After about a month of that they kicked back in...not as frequent and not as sharp. and to this day i still get them no and then but it seems like when i get them now i get stronger activity and muscle response ..so i kinda look forward to them now...lol. From my recovery experience she sounds on track ..the first movement i got back was eversion at this point...do you know if she feels like she can move it out words?

I do believe she will get better and just from hearing the similarities in all the posters gives me so much more confidence ...just to have an idea on where she may be in her stage in recovery. that was one thing that i loved about this site and the people in this thread especially is that we keep eachother hopeful and informed when all you get is estimates and unknowing from "specialists"...being here gave me a sense of knowing and peace of mind.(even if nothing is factual ...similarities keep our minds open for possibility)

Thank you all ...and when you do you recover please stay comitted to the Site/Thread for others. Wish you all the best in Recovery.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: stabso on January 29, 2007, 04:11:58 PM
Andre,

Why did you refuse the Gabapentin?

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on January 29, 2007, 05:48:27 PM
Stabso,

I don't know why Amdre refused the Gabapentin, but my GP told me it was a heavy duty drug for epilepsy and if I can tolerate it without the Gabapentin, then to do so, as there were some not good side effects (weight gain for one, being female that is disasterious!).  I hate taking tablets and got off the ones I was takig as soon as possible.  I am and have been for months, completely drug free.

Andre and Mom444,

Same as Andre regarding the description of the pain return.  My foot was so swollen and off colour that there was some discussion that I might of had a condition called CRPS type 2, particulary as it was so sensitive I could not bear anyone to touch it and the burning was so intense.  Through a vey dedicated hydrotherapist and physiotherapist did I learn to put weight on the foot and thereby desensatise it and reduce the swelling.  And I cried lots with pain at that time and not worried about saying it as nerve pain is without doubt one of the worst I have ever experienced in my life.
I had physiotherapy today and showed my new tib ant movement, which does elicite stinging, like stinging nettles.  I don't have this all the time but it does come and go through out the day 9and nigt, unfortunately) Walking backwards posed more difficult than expected without the splint on! but not sure if that is because of the foot drop or hamstring weakness. 
The physio thinks the postponement for the other leg operation is a blessing in disguise as it will give more time to recover although she thinks I will need a wheel chair after the operation to get around as my right leg is too weak to support a non weight bearing left leg.  I feel like I am now in limbo land, I really would like to just get on with the other op  so I can rehab and put all this behind me.  Looks like I will be around for quite a while yet, probably till this time next year!  Got hydrotherapy tomorrow but on holiday on Thursday - yippee
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on January 29, 2007, 10:29:38 PM
hey stabso

Basicallt J_smi001 summed it up....the meds are not geared towards settling the nerve pain and are not even nerve pain related...they would have been giving me a drug that was made for a totally different purpose and to me i didnt think that the benefits of using the drug out weighed the negative side effects. so i just stuck with the percocet for awhile then T3's which did absolutely nothing i guess because i was so used to the percocet.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on January 29, 2007, 10:39:53 PM
Hey All

Just blogging.....i had an awakening day to day in our session today. it was a good developmental workout but i found out that i am subconsciously affraid of reinjuring myself. I have tried to prepare my mind and body for this and worked so hard to tell myself that injury happens in a sport like this and thought i was over beinging scared...but today as we tried to do some lateral explosive movments i was just so protective of the left leg...so protective that i didnt even know ....and thankfully my therapist knew and made me figure out why i kept losing balance...and admit my fear.i tried to ignore it but ignoring doesnt fix or correct the things i truly need to work on. so we decided to take a step back and do some mental preparation due to the extreme demand i will need from my body in march for the combines. Im gald we noticed this now as i feel i was jumping the gun alittle bit and not progressing slow enough to site these problems earlier and correct them ....and then move on to the next stage. The goals are still the same and performing in march is the goal but a better progression is needed to truly become strong stable and ready.

Andre
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on January 30, 2007, 09:30:58 PM
Here's my blog.

My daughter woke up crying last night and my husband went up to check on her.  When he came back I asked him what was wrong and he told me she said "the dragon woke her up."  If she wasn't just being silly we think she meant that the pain in her leg somehow woke her up overnight.

Today however she has barely mentioned it.  She even says "no" when I ask her if she has any pain in her leg today.

Did any of you have pain wake you up from sleep?  But on the other hand did you ever have days at a time when you felt no pain at all?

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: stabso on January 30, 2007, 09:41:42 PM
Mom444

From my own experience and from what I have read about peripheral neuropathy, it's at night that the pain seems to be at it's worst and yes it most definitely does wake you up.
But as mentioned by others too, it does eventuallly ease up.


Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on January 30, 2007, 09:59:13 PM
Hey Mom444

Like Stabso said....the pain was most intense at night and often asissted my knee pains in giving me sleepless nights...and when i finally would fall asleep the "sparks" seemed to increase just so i wouldn't sleep. some days were more bareable then others but at the begining the only times i could bear the  feeling of the "sparks" was during regular day and evening hours.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on January 30, 2007, 11:54:10 PM
Hi Mom444

I have found when your mind is active you tend to forget about that dragon in your leg. It is those times when your mind is in neutral that it wakes up and reminds you that it is there. I have gone through a quiet time with not much happening but am now 5 months since my injury and I have noticed over only the last few days that things might be starting to wake up. I had the most horrendous pains when it first hapened but then it settled. The sensitivity seems to have moved down my leg just a little and have started to get a few more shocks of pain. My fingers are crossed for myself and for your daughter that this is part of the nerve recovery.

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on January 31, 2007, 12:22:27 AM
Thanks everyone so much for you input. 

Again, I am so happy to have found this board!

We'll see how well my daughter sleeps tonight.  If she has the pain again I may want to call and just report it to her neurosurgeon's office.

Tomorrow she has her "psychological evaluation" that she must go through to see if we qualify for PT through the school district.  She'll then have another PT evaluation next week.  It's a lot of hassle but because we're in the US and our health insurance charges us copays and puts restrictions on how many PT appointments we can have it would be nice to have PT for "free" from the district.

We're still praying for all of you! 
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on January 31, 2007, 04:35:17 PM
OK Off on holiday in the morning for a few days, at a great hotel that has a pool, gym, sauna the works - having a massage, going horse riding and basically going to pamper myself.   I feel that I need it to celebrate the small movements and have a good pampering before I am incarcerated in my dining room come bedroom again for a few months.  You all enjoy yourselves and speak later next week.  Don't do anything I wouldn't do and keep the good news coming.  By the way - I think you are all great and an inspiration to all.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on February 01, 2007, 02:21:31 AM
Jacky

i have to say i am jealous...i can only imagine the relaxation, comfort and warmth from the sauna..and all that other good stuff. have fun for me too.

More video footage being posted..this time we had the camera running the whole time instead of breaks ..because you couldnt see progression and or the faults,and imperfections. the footage is kind of long so i need to cut it in to two so i can post them. Basically its retraining lateral movement and strength in my stability..by correction imperfections in my form and the way i have been sheilding my knee.i still hav been protecting it ...and if you watch the footage you can see when i jump on it to balance my left knee automatically buckles in to avoid another outward dislocation....this was consistent almost everytime...until i slowly started to regain some sort of confidence again.I find it very interesting that i know what im doing wrong and want to change it in my mind but for some reason i have stored the off swtich to my cowardness deep in my subconcious...with a lock and key. i have gone through up and down phase where my menatl was more stable then my injury progression and now it seems my injury progression is more stable then my mind. i need to find something or away to awaken my confidence and trust again as it seems so foreign to not rely on your bodies protective mechanisms. Any suggestions? what keeps you confident or even timid about doing "normal" activity on your injured leg?

Thank you
Andre
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on February 01, 2007, 04:41:40 AM
Hey all,

Here's our update.  My daughter had her "psychological evaluation" today that we needed to do before we can be considered for PT from the school district.  She will have a PT evaluation next week.  Turns out she is "off the chart" and has above average intelligence! 

In regard to her leg, we'll still need to see if her symptoms are enough to qualify for school district sponsored PT.

No mention of the "dragon" for the past two whole days now.  I'm still staying calm yet optimistic.  As some of you have said there were times where you went a while with no pain.

Andre,

Thanks for your detailed updates regarding your recovery.  YOU should be a physical therapist!   :)  You are definitely an inspiration in how you are so organized and methodic in your recovery.  Thanks too for all of your enouragment with my daughter  :)

Jacky,

Have fun on vacation/holiday!  Letting your body relax and feel good helps with recovery.  Thank you to for all of you well wishes for my little girl.

I'll check back and let you know if the "dragon" comes back. 
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on February 03, 2007, 05:41:56 AM
Hey all

have a great weekend ....and Go Bears !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! its the SuperBowl(American Football Finals) so basically a national holiday .....and the Bears hopefully are gonna take the big one.
Take Care everyone and hope that you are all doing well.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on February 04, 2007, 01:04:54 AM
Hi Andre,

I have been supporting the New Orleons Saints so not happy they have not made it through. As you are supporting the Bears I will shout for them. It strarts 10pm tonight here so looking foeward to it.

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on February 04, 2007, 04:20:00 PM
Have fun everyone.  We will have a house full of people tonight watching "The Game."  I don't really know much about football but we have the party anyways...  I just like the commericials and the snacks  :)  My daughter by the way is rooting for The Bears to win...  Well, because...  she likes bears.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on February 06, 2007, 05:20:12 PM
Updates...

Yesterday we took my daughter for yet another physical therapy evaluation, this time with a different therapist.  My daugther seemed to do okay with walking up stairs and kicking balls but the therapist still thinks we should be eligible for school sponsored PT.

Also, this new therapist recommended that we "massage the scar tissue" on the outside of my daughter's leg.  I don't know what I think about that.  I'm afraid to manipulate the area...  But have any of you heard this?  Does it help?

Also the scar tissue directly covering the skin over the fibular head, where the builk of the surgery was done, is thick and hard.  The PT yesterday said that hard scar tissue on the surface of the skin could possibly impede the nerve growth.  If that is true that scared the daylights out of me.

This morning, I touched my daughter's leg over the thick part of the scar and she said, "Ow!"  She said it hurt when I touched her on that part of the scar.

I got scared so I called her neurosurgeon's office for a consult.  They are yet to call back.

What do all of you think of this?  Have you had pain over your scar tissue?  Were you referred to massage the scar tissue?  Did any of you have pain on the surface of the skin, scars or no scars? 

Also, there has been no mention of "dragon" feelings in her leg for over a week now...  I was hoping they would be more prevalent and constant...  If that in fact does signal healing.

I'm really getting scared today.  I'm ready to cry and I'm starting to get a tension headache.  I worry about my little girl.

I hope you all are doing well.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on February 06, 2007, 07:33:44 PM
Hey Mom444

i would first just like to say that we are with you 100 percent and it kills me to hear that you are on te verge of tears as it brings back memories of the way i myself felt...but i can only imagine what it must feel like to be the parent and have to deal with something like this...and for hat i commend you and as a parent myself i must also say you are handling your daughters situation flawlessly. try not to be discouraged though from progression...it may seem easy to say from me to you ..but it is honestly the truth. nerves and regrowth are unpredicatble and the only info (as you know) is time. whether that time heals you early or late it will heal and everyone who is suffering needs to stay optimistic and hopefully or there chances to recover will become limited. Vent your emotions anyway you can so you can be strong and ready for anything you may be told from Docs or therapists.

massaging scar tissue....they did do this to me but not that often...i guess they said something about the scar tissue pretty much strangling the nerve(not there words exactly). this was not a direct massage and was not deep to actually hit the nerve it was basically on the surface. and with touching i had pain but nothing that would send me through the roof....i could feel it..and it felt almost like it was sore but with alittle more of a kick. and with surface pain i do not recall any. also with the Dragons(i kinda like this word for the descripttion now) when my became inconsistent there were times when i wouldn't feel them for days and maybe even weeks i can't say exactly how long the span inbetween.

again we are here for you  and your daughter ....i was wondering....does she have any questions for us? does she ever want to know things about her injury or feelings she is feeling? or is she not that vocal yet?
Wish you all the best
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on February 07, 2007, 03:20:20 AM
Hey Mom444

i would first just like to say that we are with you 100 percent and it kills me to hear that you are on te verge of tears as it brings back memories of the way i myself felt...but i can only imagine what it must feel like to be the parent and have to deal with something like this...and for hat i commend you and as a parent myself i must also say you are handling your daughters situation flawlessly. try not to be discouraged though from progression...it may seem easy to say from me to you ..but it is honestly the truth. nerves and regrowth are unpredicatble and the only info (as you know) is time. whether that time heals you early or late it will heal and everyone who is suffering needs to stay optimistic and hopefully or there chances to recover will become limited. Vent your emotions anyway you can so you can be strong and ready for anything you may be told from Docs or therapists.

massaging scar tissue....they did do this to me but not that often...i guess they said something about the scar tissue pretty much strangling the nerve(not there words exactly). this was not a direct massage and was not deep to actually hit the nerve it was basically on the surface. and with touching i had pain but nothing that would send me through the roof....i could feel it..and it felt almost like it was sore but with alittle more of a kick. and with surface pain i do not recall any. also with the Dragons(i kinda like this word for the descripttion now) when my became inconsistent there were times when i wouldn't feel them for days and maybe even weeks i can't say exactly how long the span inbetween.

again we are here for you  and your daughter ....i was wondering....does she have any questions for us? does she ever want to know things about her injury or feelings she is feeling? or is she not that vocal yet?
Wish you all the best

Thanks Andre.  Your words make me feel better.  I tell my daughter about all of you on the board and she knows you by name.  We even pray each night for "all of the other people who hurt their legs." 

This may be good news but I finally got a call back from her neurosurgeon's office.  At first I consulted with a nurse and I told her about all that we had experienced lately such as the "dragons" that appeared about two weeks ago and the waking up in pian and how the other physical therapist mentioned the scar tissue and how my daughter says it hurts when I touch her scar.  Of course the nurse didn't want to say a definite "yes" or "no" to anything, I think they are worried about liability...  But she said that the feelings of pain were "consistent with the healing process."  I asked her if the "healing process" meant recovery and she was extremely careful to reiterate the words "healing process" rather than actual recovery or regeneration.  I hung up with her and then about ten minutes later the phone rung again.  It was the nurse again saying that after she got off the phone with me she had an actual consult with the neurosurgeon and explained the situation to him.  The neurosurgeon said that what we reported actually sounded like good news and that the pain may in fact be consistent with nerve regeneration.  In fact he even said that he wanted to go ahead and schedule another EMG as soon as possible.  Then I nearly CRIED again, but tears of hopeful joy.

Again, I am trying not to be too positive or too negative.  I'm just waiting and keeping the faith. 

Thanks also for telling me that the "dragons" do in fact come and go and sometimes stay away for weeks at a time.  I got really so extremely excited the first time she said she felt them that I kind of got disappointed when they left.  But the nurse did explain that the feelings of pain are often sporadic and that it is normal to not have them constantly. 

So Andre, just to ask you again...  Is it okay if I rack your brain?  When you had the "dragons" they would in fact come and stay for a few days and then they would go away for a while?  Again, how long after your injury did you start to feel them?  I think you said eight months?  Also your injury was sports related and you didn't have neurolysis, did you?  Still, you did in fact get some peroneal regeneration? 

It just helps me so much to get reassurance from people who have been through this before.  This type of injury is not very common and as mentioned before hardly any of the many, many doctors we saw had even seen this type of injury before.

Thanks again Andre  :)  And, yes my daughter is very verbal  :) :)  I'll ask her if she has any questions.

To Jacky, Hamish, Stabsco, Davey, etc...  How are all of you doing?

S
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on February 07, 2007, 03:13:38 PM
Hey Mom444

hey mom in answer to your questions....no i dont mind at all if you ask me questions..feel free to ask me anything you like.in regards to the "dragons" i started getting the approximately a few weeks after the injury and during the day i wouldn't feel them as badly as i would at night. Hamish pointed out when we discussed this earlier that it may have been because during the day or minds my be more ocupied with daily activities. but i could always count on them at night and they would be very intense. it reduced almost monthly (the intensity of the Dragons) until if finally felt as if they went away. this was about three months after the injury.maybe a month or two after they came back but not as intense and consistent. when i say not as consistent i mean they would be very intense one day then dull another ..this two also happend for about two to three months and again went away. now i could just be sitting down having a break or usually at rest and i could get a surge out of nowhere and at this point there is no real pattern to the sugres they just come and go when it pleases.

Yes i injured myself playing sports ....and dont believe i suffered from neurolysis...i had crushed the peroneal nerve when i dislocated the knee which left me just paralysis. and to be honest....i couldnt tell you whether i have regeneration or not.....i had an EMG at the 8th month mark had no readings of nerve regeneration or function of the nerve ...but i was able to evert,invert. i was told that i was compensating. two months after,i believe, i got my dorsi flexion motor skills back and decided i didnt want anymore EMG's mainly because it was messing with my motivation and if i was compensating then i guess it was okay because i had my motor fucntions back and they were and are showing signs of regular strength and stability. i do believe that it has regenerated mainly because the Tibialas Anterior muscle is firing...and the peroneal tendon is also firing and these muscles are controlled by that nerve

so ......clincally i havent gotten a definate answer if the nerves  have infact regenerated..but i believe they have from my progression....hopefully i was able to answered your questions. im off to rehab now take care Mom444 and others ...talk to you later
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on February 07, 2007, 05:37:19 PM
Thanks Andre...  Good luck at rehab.

Well...  My daughter woke up crying again last night.  I immediately wondered if it was "the dragon."  When she woke up I aksed her what was wrong, hoping she'd say her leg hurt...  She instead said she had to go to the bathroom.

But then I asked her if anything hurt and if her leg hurt.  Welll, I shouldn't have said that because she of course said her leg hurt.  So then I asked her to point to the leg that hurt and she pointed to her NORMAL leg.  So, again, she might just be saying things because we are inadvertently prodding her or she says things just off the top of her head.  She wanted me to lie in bed with her then because she was crying so much, so I still wonder if maybe she DID have pain...  But it's hard to tell because she's so young. 

...However last night she was kind of squirming her legs around a lot...  Maybe there really was pain.

My husband mentioned that a few weeks back when she woke up with the "dragon" that she was wimpering and crying in agony, he said she looked and acted like she was very much in real pain. 

It's difficult for us because she is only three and even though she is pretty verbal, three year olds sometimes make things up or they might say "yes" to something just to go along with what Mom and Dad tells them. 

When any of you had the "dragons," especially at night, did you find yourselves squirming your legs around a lot? 

Thanks again everyone.

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on February 07, 2007, 05:44:36 PM
Hello All,

Back from my holiday and had an excellent time.  I made the most of all the facilities and most importantly stayed on the horse.  I have caught up with your posts.  

Just to join the debate, I also got told I was compensating when I was able to invert and evert my foot but now the dorsiflexion is returning I have been told that the prognosis is now looking much more positive.  No one will give me a straight answer to the question, ' Will I get a full recovery?'  I think it is because they honestly don't actually know.  It is frustrating but I just keep concentrating on my recovery and so long as it progresses, no matter how slowly there is always a chance it will fully come back, and if not I actually quite like my splint.  

Andre, your suggestion to ask if Mom444's daughter has any questions is an excellent idea. And Mom444 please I also think you are doing brilliantly and remember we are here for you and your daughter, all the way.  

On the not so good news, at hydrotherapy yesterday my knee cap on the other leg decided to pop out of its groove and is now very sore and swolllen and I am pretty much feeling sorry for myself at the moment.  I still don't have a date for this knee and it is deteriorating fast, soon I literally won't have a leg to stand on.  Still on a positive note I have been excused from physio and hydro for two weeks to allow it to settle back down again, so I am greatful for that (and because the weather has turned very cold, icy and snowy (not condusive to riding a scooter!)

You all take care and speak soon.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on February 07, 2007, 05:50:19 PM
Mom444 most definately I squirmed at night.  Most of the medication I took was at night.  I had amiltriptyline for nerve pain at night, Quinnine to stop the cramps, again at night.  My nurse at the convelecent home described it as restless legs.  The pain I had could be quite severe with shooting shocks and also a constant burning sensation.  But as Andre has said not all the time and it gets less severe as time goes by.  I think the real indicator is actual movement in the foot as some of my pain was described to me as sympathetic nerves (i.e. those responsible for pain, colour, temperature) and noy the same as the main peroneal nerve responsible for movement. 
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on February 08, 2007, 06:28:28 AM
hey all,

good to hear from you Jacky...glad you had a good break. im sorry to hear about the troubles you are having with your knee.was it something that yo did specifically to pop it out of its groove or is it just over used due to compensating for the weakness in the other? why are you feeling sorry for yourself? you are doing a great job and maximizing the potential to heal and that is all you can do. try not to feel sorry for yourself...and i know when someone tells you that ...it kind of does nothing because it may be just the way you feel at the moment but you doing great and in regards to the date for your leg...can you push for one or is it the Docs call? i wish you the best and i posted some video footage of the C.A.T board i was talking about along time ago when we first started talking. the devices that helps strengthen dorsiflexion. Best device for this ...hands down and i use it everyday....maybe you can take alook at it and emulate the device with different equipment if you dont have access to one.

Hey Mom444 in answer to your question......i was squirmish and could hardly sleep when it first started shocking....as Jacky stated ..i too would take my meds at night so i could get somewhat of a good night sleep.when they became not as intense ....it would bother me but i ould slep through it after awhile.

Take care all
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on February 08, 2007, 01:05:21 PM
Hi Guys,

Just an update of where I am! I have been getting a little excited as I feel that there may be some regeneration of the nerve. It is now 5 months since my injury and throughout that time if you touched the site of the injury I would get tingling in my foot but not if I touched my leg anywhere below the injury. It now seems that I am getting a little bit of sensation in my foot if I touch a little further down my leg.

On the down side I go under the knife again on Monday to get my ACL reconstruction so its back to the leg brace and crutches for me but I know this will not be as bad as before.

Take care all,
Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on February 08, 2007, 02:09:16 PM
hey Hamish,
it is scary how our injury experiences are very similar.....when i had no movement i would do the same..touch the injury or anywhere around the injury and i would start sending shock or sparks down the leg to the foot ..jst from touching or rubbing it. and the same with me as i felt the more i touched it ..the better and maybe faster my sensation and feeling would wake up....and that was the first thing i started to notice before i started getting movement and that was sensation and feeling coming back...it seemed to be very spotty as it came back...how is yours? when i say spotty...i mean some areas would feel normalish and oothers numb. good luck with the surgery and you are right ...this set back is going to be a postive one in your recovery....Congrats on the new feelings and ttys.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on February 08, 2007, 03:49:46 PM
Hamish,

The very best wishes to you for Monday, I am sure we will all be thinking of you.  Excellent news about the sensation and lets hope this is the start of a recovery for you.  You will have to keep us informed on your progress.  I was told that most recovery occurs between 3 and 6 months so fingers crossed for you.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: stabso on February 08, 2007, 08:06:17 PM
Hi everybody

Good to hear such positive news on here.
Even I manage to get promoted from a 0 out of 5 to 1 out of 5 grade for dorsi flexion by the physio last week.
I just wish the toes would show some sign of joining in, that way I might be able to get it to lift off the ground instead of just doing it in the air.

Getting an MRI on Monday and an EMG on the 20th, so that should give a better picture of where I'm at now and where I'm heading as the weeks/months go by.

All the best for Monday's op Hamish.

Welcome back from your hols j_smi001

Well done mom444's little girl.

Andre, have you found a work-around for your over-protective sub-conscious in training that you mentioned recently?
I have to say, that it sounds like quite a healthy fear to have and nothing to do with cowardness, just something that time and usage might hold the key to.
Without trying to sound like I really know what I'm talking about, maybe your sub-conscious needs time to get to trust your knee again before it becomes second nature.

I've tried to check out your videos but I keep getting "Page Cannot Be Found" when I click on the arrow. Is it just me and/or any ideas? (using a Mac)

Best to you all


Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on February 08, 2007, 08:52:21 PM
Hey All,

Glad to hear you are all doing well. 

Hamish, I hope you are getting some recovery!

Jacky, hope you are doing well with your recovery and that you did get some relaxtion from your holiday.

Stabsco, congrats on the dorsiflexion!

Andre, thank as always for all you do.

So...  It's so hard trying to get a straight answer from a three and a half year old!

I'm trying not to pry my daughter or force her into answering yes or no to anything...  But sometimes she says she has no pain at all in her leg.  Then other times she says, "It hurted me when I was sleeping."  She hasn't mentioned the "dragon" lately.  Then other times she says she has "pointy fingers" that are inside her leg...  Then again, other times nothing...

But I still get her saying "ow!" when I touch her scar...

I'm so confused!

As mentioned, her neurosurgeon wants to schedule another EMG as soon as possible.  The way they book the appointments is that we just have to wait until they call us...  I'm a little nervous however because I fear how I'll react if it's not good news yet.

I just have to keep the faith I guess.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on February 08, 2007, 11:37:48 PM
Hi everybody

Good to hear such positive news on here.
Even I manage to get promoted from a 0 out of 5 to 1 out of 5 grade for dorsi flexion by the physio last week.
I just wish the toes would show some sign of joining in, that way I might be able to get it to lift off the ground instead of just doing it in the air.

Getting an MRI on Monday and an EMG on the 20th, so that should give a better picture of where I'm at now and where I'm heading as the weeks/months go by.

All the best for Monday's op Hamish.

Welcome back from your hols j_smi001

Well done mom444's little girl.

Andre, have you found a work-around for your over-protective sub-conscious in training that you mentioned recently?
I have to say, that it sounds like quite a healthy fear to have and nothing to do with cowardness, just something that time and usage might hold the key to.
Without trying to sound like I really know what I'm talking about, maybe your sub-conscious needs time to get to trust your knee again before it becomes second nature.

I've tried to check out your videos but I keep getting "Page Cannot Be Found" when I click on the arrow. Is it just me and/or any ideas? (using a Mac)

Best to you all




Hey Stabso,

good to hear things are looking better for you...you said you can lift your foot when not on the ground? that is huge ....have you tried  lying on your stomach and bending your leg and instead of pulling up with your foot ...pulldown with gravity? i found that this would help when i could only dorsi flex in when off the ground.
with your toes can you pick things up with them ...? like marbles...or are they not functional at the moment?...good to hear things are going well...and with regards to me and my mental wars..just as you said ...its going to take time ...i have been getting better as i go along ...and my last session i had my brace and ..having the brace took a load off my mind. but still alot of getting some trust back. Im not ssure why it is not displaying ..its a Myspace.com page not sure if the embedding is not designed for Macs or not...but if you would like to view the page it is on myspace.com or Youtube.com and search Andre Durie. Thank you Stabso...and i wish you all the best on the 20th.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: stabso on February 10, 2007, 11:06:38 AM
Andre,

Switched to a different browser and that solved the video viewing problem.
Hats off to you, as expected, some highly inspirational clips on there, thanks for sharing them with us.

I was particularly intrigued by the CAT board. Was it specially made or is it a commercially available piece of kit? I did a search online for one but no joy.
A brand name, should you get the chance, would be great.

I'm going to try and incorporate the pull downs and the marbles pick-ups with the toes as they are about 35% functional from that aspect so could use some strengthening and who knows it might help with lifting them up too.

Best
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on February 10, 2007, 07:04:03 PM
I have now managed to have a look at the videos of Andre's recovery - I take my hat off to you.  You appear to have very good control over the foot,  and although I am making progress seeing that makes me realise I still have some way to go.  This is no bad thing as my confidence is over taking my ability as I found out to my cost during the heavy snow we have just had.  I know I sould have taken my stick as my leg is still weak from the lack of hamstring strength - still at least snow is a soft landing and no damage done but a timely reminder.  I am also impressed with the dorsiflexion equipment, no such thing that I have seen here.  I have mastered the picking up of a pencil though and what a good idea!  How satisfying is it when you learn a new party trick?  Although probably only people on this thread would truely understand the significance. 

Well wishing you all good luck with recovery and have a really good, productive and joyous week.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on February 10, 2007, 09:06:31 PM
Hi everyone,

Just checking in... 

Congratulations to all of you on your steady steps toward recovery!

We are just hanging on around here...  My daughter has mentioned absolutely no pain...  She still can't lift up her foot.  She even gets a little upset when we try to ask her if she can lift up her foot. 

We still don't know when her next EMG will be.

Just trying to stay positive.  It is now 6 and a half months past her neurolysis...  I know these things take time.

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on February 11, 2007, 02:17:53 AM
Andre,

Switched to a different browser and that solved the video viewing problem.
Hats off to you, as expected, some highly inspirational clips on there, thanks for sharing them with us.

I was particularly intrigued by the CAT board. Was it specially made or is it a commercially available piece of kit? I did a search online for one but no joy.
A brand name, should you get the chance, would be great.

I'm going to try and incorporate the pull downs and the marbles pick-ups with the toes as they are about 35% functional from that aspect so could use some strengthening and who knows it might help with lifting them up too.

Best



Hey Stabso

CAT stands for something specific....i will ask on monday when i go to therapy ...it was not specially made and is sold ...but very expensive.... i do believe the benefits out weight the cost......it is something around 600 canadian. this device also has attachments along the boarder to hook bands on to it so you can strengthen eversion, and inversion as well.. very very useful piece of equipment and i do believe this very simple device has done the best job in progressing my dorsiflexion. again i will find out the exact name on monday...we also have another device called the BAPS board..this helps with balance and finding out how to retrain the new movements in the ankle once,eversion,dorsiflexion,and inversion are somewhat stable.....i will post them once i go back to therapy. Also i will ask about some alternatives to emulate the CAT board if for some reason it is not available where you are.

And thank you for the kind words....Jacky ....i do have control of the foot but not full control...its hard to see in the film because of the quality but..i cannot control the amount of force in my dorsi flexion.....when i pull it up it stays at 90 and i am having trouble on the push off...because as i let go from the 90 position it pretty much flops down.....i need to start controlling all aspects of the mechanics of running if i want to play again. but definately not complain when a year and a half ago i was praying to just feel my foot nevemind move it. So these videos along with the boards have been a good reminder of progression and it doesnt give me an option to give up.

Hey mom444,

We are hanging with you...i was wondering...can she do what Stabso mentioned? if her leg is in the air and her foot hangs past its natural hanging postion ..can she pull it up to its natural hanging position? ( you may have to pull it down the foot when its off the ground) all the best

To Hamsih and Daveybc...i hope you are well with you and your recovery


And to all that view this Thread dont be affraid to share your support,stories or concerns......you are all welcome.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on February 11, 2007, 09:57:44 PM
Hey All

just a summary of last week.

Last week i was happy to finally get my brace. although i was happy to get it i was not looking forward to trying it on due to the numerous amounts of horror stories i have heard.(you lose a step or it to heavy or slides down alot..etc.) i was affraid that having this piece of plastic on would not help my progression (physically). Mentally i wanted it to help me regain some confidence to take the next step in my recovery. so i tried it on and it was terrible....i could hardly flex the leg and it felt horrible lifting it. after walking and jogging around in it.....my therapist called me over ...she reached down and pull to security pins out of it and low and behold my flexion was much easier and it felt as if there was a 10 pound weight lifted off the brace. They were very cruel but i think i need to hate the worst aspect of being braced(again) before i could appreciate the benefits of it and what having this brace on will allow me to do.
Once the pins were out i was much more eager to take it out for a real run.
We headed to the track centre where i now do all my runnig sessions.  Everything seemed pretty good and adapting to it seemed to be be good except for the fatigue. it seems that i am tiring out much faster with the added weight which is expected..so strengthening will again be a huge part in recovery. After the session i was very sore from the brace pads which sit right on top of the bone(not sure what it is called) and added to the sorenss giving me more swelling. as i posted before we are working with the foot and its dorsiflexion to have total control of it during activity.i still lack control even though i have strength and can dorsiflex...i still need to beable to distribute enough force out of the foot and take impact on the foot properly...or i could put my Achilles tendon at risk for rupturing.
That is all the new stuff we have done this week and next week we hope to take it up alittle more as i now feel i have adjusted to the brace.
Hope everyone had a good weekend
Andre
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on February 12, 2007, 02:23:34 AM
Thanks again.  I don't think my daughter can do that yet, she still can't dorsiflex at all.  And for a split second today she was saying that her leg hurt on the front of her shin under her knee...  Again, don't know if she really means it or is just saying it.

Also, Andre I was reserarching peroneal nerve injuries and I found some links that reminded me of you.  There was another football player who injured his peronal nerve.  I think he was from the Philadelphia Eagles and his last name was Reed...  I don't know if you already heard of this or if his situation is at all similar to yours...  I just thought you might find it interesting.  There are a few different hits about it online, if you google reed AND peroneal AND eagles
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on February 12, 2007, 09:32:06 PM
Hi Guys,

That's me home from my op and still feeling a little groggy. Surgeon said it went well and things looked pretty clean inside my knee with no damage to the meniscus. He did show me a picture with a bit of wear to the cartilage but I thing this was normal for a knee that's had pretty heavy usage. Leg feels pretty sore at the moment and I am icing it at the moment. Wlii keep you posted on my progress.

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on February 13, 2007, 03:28:00 AM
Hi Guys,

That's me home from my op and still feeling a little groggy. Surgeon said it went well and things looked pretty clean inside my knee with no damage to the meniscus. He did show me a picture with a bit of wear to the cartilage but I thing this was normal for a knee that's had pretty heavy usage. Leg feels pretty sore at the moment and I am icing it at the moment. Wlii keep you posted on my progress.

Hamish

Good to hear your surgery went well Hamish...hope you start feeling better soon.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on February 13, 2007, 03:49:57 AM
Hey mom444

That was a very inspirational story ...and one that i am trying to live up to. It is sensational what modren medical technology can do now adays to assist in recovery. the person that i pretty much idolized and got the motivation to start a comeback was a player named Robert Edwards. also an ex-NFLer, and now plays in the CFL. his story is just as amazing and maybe just alittle more due to the extent of the injury. Thank you for the search info and all the best to you and your family.

Still searching for the name of the Equipment...sems that the school had ordered it and the name has worn off. so we are going to do some digging to find out where it came from.

take care all
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on February 13, 2007, 04:25:26 AM
THE DRAGON CAME BACK LAST NIGHT!

She woke up screaming in pain and my husband went to check on her.  She said her leg hurt and was writing in pain and was very much squirming!  She was telling us the truth!

I hate to see her in pain but I am happy that the dragon came back because it could mean she is healing!

It had been exactly two weeks since the dragon's last appearance.

He likes to come on Sunday nights, maybe because we tend to pray more on Sundays?

No mention of the pain today during the day time but you all mentioned that pain tends to be worse at night.

Plus, if you think about it, our bodies grow and regenerate at night.

Andre, I'm glad you liked the stories about J.R. Reed from the Philadelphia Eagles.  I only read some of them, but I thought that you might sympathize with him because he was so heartbroken about being out of the game...  But I did look to see if any of the many articles were recent and featured updates on him and I did not find any.  Did you?  What became of him?  Did he heal?
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on February 13, 2007, 06:21:06 PM
Thank goodness for the dragon - I am so pleased that your daughter is getting sensation in the leg and pray that this is the nerve regenerating and all will be well for your daughter.

On a completely different note, how do you all respond to questions like,
'so how long will you have to wear that splint?'- like it is a forgone conclusion that there is in fact an end date.
'that looks painful' - what?, Don't be daft, I can't feel it - at all, it is numb
'I thought you hd an operation on your knee, is it not better yet?'

Ok this is fast deteriating to a full scale whinge but how much longer have I got to endure these questions for?  I know people are just being kind and showing interest, for which I should be grateful but getting close to having a badge made, saying, 'I have foot drop as a result of the operation on my knee, it means I can't lift my foot up, I don't know when it will fully recover or whether it will in fact fully recover, thank you for asking.'  Ok I am just being grumpy, maybe I am having a non- positive day.  Maybe chocolate will help, and if not at least I will feel better. Hope you are all having a good day and I will be less grumpy tomorrow.   :D  ;)
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on February 13, 2007, 06:25:28 PM
Oh woops, so sorry..............well done Hamish and welcome back - pleased it is good news and happy rehabbing.  Remember that old trick with the tray under your heel to help slide into a knee bend.  Keep the ice coming and hope you soon start to feel better from the aneasthetic and the knee settles quickly.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on February 13, 2007, 07:35:18 PM
Thank goodness for the dragon - I am so pleased that your daughter is getting sensation in the leg and pray that this is the nerve regenerating and all will be well for your daughter.

On a completely different note, how do you all respond to questions like,
'so how long will you have to wear that splint?'- like it is a forgone conclusion that there is in fact an end date.
'that looks painful' - what?, Don't be daft, I can't feel it - at all, it is numb
'I thought you hd an operation on your knee, is it not better yet?'

Ok this is fast deteriating to a full scale whinge but how much longer have I got to endure these questions for?  I know people are just being kind and showing interest, for which I should be grateful but getting close to having a badge made, saying, 'I have foot drop as a result of the operation on my knee, it means I can't lift my foot up, I don't know when it will fully recover or whether it will in fact fully recover, thank you for asking.'  Ok I am just being grumpy, maybe I am having a non- positive day.  Maybe chocolate will help, and if not at least I will feel better. Hope you are all having a good day and I will be less grumpy tomorrow.   :D  ;)

Jacky,

We had a similar experience with a lady in the play area at our shopping mall.  Kids need to take off their shoes to play and when I was removing my daughter's brace a lady said, "Oh my!  What happened to her?!"  I decided to be very matter of fact about is and just told her, "She injured a nerve in her leg."  I was a little exasperated too at her bluntness but then the lady and I started to have some small talk and the lady did wish me luck with my daughter and hoped for her to get better.

But in the play area that day there was a little boy who had half of his head shaved like he may have just had surgery.  I could not even imagine being so rude as to go up to the little boy's mother and say, "What happened to him?!"  But some people are just not very tactful. 

I hope you are doing well too. 

The dragon is a strange character.   He sometimes shows up for one night at a time and then disappears for a long time.

I wish you all well.

And best of luck to you too Hamish!
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: stabso on February 13, 2007, 08:02:13 PM
Hamish, welcome back, glad to hear the op went well.

Mom444, welcome back to the dragon too.
These days my dragon has calmed down quite a lot and only sometimes makes an appearance when I try hard to dorsi flex or work the foot.

j_smi001, I guesss I've been lucky not to have had to respond to too many annoying questions, but it's understandable how they might get on one's "nerves"(?).
It was difficult for me to get my head around how I managed to end up with a floppy foot, let alone for others, which is why I'm glad I came across this thread.
Yes, I too find chocolate definitely does help.

Best to you all






Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on February 15, 2007, 05:14:18 AM
THE DRAGON CAME BACK LAST NIGHT!

She woke up screaming in pain and my husband went to check on her.  She said her leg hurt and was writing in pain and was very much squirming!  She was telling us the truth!

I hate to see her in pain but I am happy that the dragon came back because it could mean she is healing!

It had been exactly two weeks since the dragon's last appearance.

He likes to come on Sunday nights, maybe because we tend to pray more on Sundays?

No mention of the pain today during the day time but you all mentioned that pain tends to be worse at night.

Plus, if you think about it, our bodies grow and regenerate at night.

Andre, I'm glad you liked the stories about J.R. Reed from the Philadelphia Eagles.  I only read some of them, but I thought that you might sympathize with him because he was so heartbroken about being out of the game...  But I did look to see if any of the many articles were recent and featured updates on him and I did not find any.  Did you?  What became of him?  Did he heal?

Hey Mom444,
 I read up some more and found out that he Returned to the NFL in 2006. he said he hasnt regained all of his nerve  strength and has been made a special brace engineered to spring his foot up. he was traded from philly to Atlanta and hasn't played enough to relly see how it looks ..but it is his frst year back ..and to play high intensity sport after an injury lik that is pretty remarkable. im tryng to find out what this brace looks like ..it would be very interesting to see what you could dsign for such an injury. And as more people heal from this sort of thing and go back to tere "normal " activitie is pretty encouraging and kind of setting a path for others to follow.

Hope everyone is well and Happy VDay
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on February 15, 2007, 08:09:26 AM
OK grumpy head definately gone and I have overdosed on chocolate.

Andre - I know what you mean about others being inspirational and leading the way.  I have a colleague who also has this injury following a gun shot wound and he is now back fully fit doing his physical job.  He will never regain his nerve as it was blown into the next millenium, never to be seen again but with the right orthotics there is very little he can't do, in fact I am struggling to think og anything he can't do.  He has been a great guide and support for me and was there on the day I took the fitness test (what more could I ask for?) He has also cleared the path for me to also return to full operational duties (I just need to get the other leg sorted and it will be all systems go).  Most importantly I think this thread has been the greatest support, no question is barred, all ideas are thrown in and we have some good banter.  Mom444's questions has helped me to think about how it has been nad recognise how far I have come.  When you live with an extremely slow progressing injury it seems that nothing is happening, and it probably isn't over a number of days, but when you look back in months it really does show the difference being made.

I did loads of ankle and foot mobilisation execises yesterday and said that the dragon was having a nibble (because it was stinging and hot)  Had I not quckly explained I think my physio would to book me in to see a therapist next!  Actually on this queston, how have you all found adjusting to the floppy foot?  Initially I kept calling my foot, IT, but have come to accept it as part of me now, apparently that is common?  Anyway must put my best foot forward, shake a leg and hop to work, have a good day.

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on February 15, 2007, 01:14:35 PM
OK grumpy head definately gone and I have overdosed on chocolate.

Andre - I know what you mean about others being inspirational and leading the way.  I have a colleague who also has this injury following a gun shot wound and he is now back fully fit doing his physical job.  He will never regain his nerve as it was blown into the next millenium, never to be seen again but with the right orthotics there is very little he can't do, in fact I am struggling to think og anything he can't do.  He has been a great guide and support for me and was there on the day I took the fitness test (what more could I ask for?) He has also cleared the path for me to also return to full operational duties (I just need to get the other leg sorted and it will be all systems go).  Most importantly I think this thread has been the greatest support, no question is barred, all ideas are thrown in and we have some good banter.  Mom444's questions has helped me to think about how it has been nad recognise how far I have come.  When you live with an extremely slow progressing injury it seems that nothing is happening, and it probably isn't over a number of days, but when you look back in months it really does show the difference being made.

I did loads of ankle and foot mobilisation execises yesterday and said that the dragon was having a nibble (because it was stinging and hot)  Had I not quckly explained I think my physio would to book me in to see a therapist next!  Actually on this queston, how have you all found adjusting to the floppy foot?  Initially I kept calling my foot, IT, but have come to accept it as part of me now, apparently that is common?  Anyway must put my best foot forward, shake a leg and hop to work, have a good day.




Hey Jacky.

I agree with the support from others playing a big roll in the support system...but i am so Glad that i found this site...mainly becuase ...it is great to see others who have healed but to actually be going through it with others and talk about it and as we talk we record and just as you said we look back in the thread and its a shock ...because you dont see the change ..but its happening. i often go back to some of our first threads and i am just feel so geatful and lucky to have found this site by chance...and then even luckier to have met you and others on this site as well.

I would like to ask an off topic question if you all don't mind.... how did you find this site?...and what made you join a thread? for me ...i was given a nerve specialist site to look at by a doctor..i can't remember the name of it....and in one of the reviews of the site someone had given this site a good review in there recovery...so i decided to take a look at. i then began to read some of the issues and different cases that people were going through ...and i kind of felt unappreciative of my own situation....mainly for being all bent out of shape about my injury ...when there were people going through much worse.i joined a thread because  i then wanted to find out the answer to a question ...and that was....has anyone recovered from peroneal nerve damage?..a question which docs told me rarely happens. i was losing hope and then i got a acouple posts and one from another athlete who had encouraged me to stay in therapy as i was giving up.....i listened to him and never stopped no matter how much i felt it wouldn't come back. and its only people who have been through the same situation that can tell you the importance of certain rehab methods and habits ...and i totally trusted his opinion and stuck with it.

Jacky, the floppy foot sucked ...i wouldnt say i adjusted...i think i just coped with it because i thought i had no choice but to. And i no what you are talking about(calling the foot IT) i felt like it wasnt apart of me ...and that it was just draggin along. and also the way people looked at me when i would take my brace off my foot then start walking ...hiking my foot clearly looking like something was wrong...so others didnt make it any easier...in fact one person asked what was wrong ..i told them and there rsponse was EWWWW...and then apologizing for the blurt. so i guess i never really could adjust to it ...because i hated having it that way.I hope you keep healing in good health Jacky ...you can recovery.

Take Care Andre

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on February 15, 2007, 03:02:26 PM
Hey all,

To answer Andre's question I found this thread by entering the phrase "peroneal nerve recovery" into Google.  I was so happy to find it!

As I mentioned before, I was a librarian and now I teach research skills classes at a small college.  I teach students how to formulate key words and phrases when searching the Internet and I also teach them about "old fashioned" library research.  Believe me, when my daughter was first diagnosed with peroneal nerve damage I researched the heck out of EVERYTHING I could possibly find about the subject.  And not everything is on the Internet, a lot of research articles can only be found in high end medical journals that do not publish their articles for free online.  I just requested a copy of anothe research article that I had to have sent to me by a medical librarian at a local hospital.  I'll read it over and let you know what I find.

Also, it's interesting how we have people from all over the world on this site!  I see Andre is from Toronto, I'm probably closest to him because I live in Upstate New York near the border of Canada.  I think I might be the only one from the US on here?  And the rest of you are from parts of the UK?  Jacky, are you in England?  And Hamish is a Scottish name, are you in Scotland?  Just for curiousity, where are the rest of you from?  It's also interesting to hear how different country's health systems and insurances handle medlical treatment.  As I said, here in the US we have found many restrictions with our health insurance regarding when and how many physical therapy appointments we may have...   We still are yet to find out if the school district will cover it.

The dragon is taking a break this week...

Bless everyone :)
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on February 15, 2007, 05:02:09 PM
Hey Mom444,

Yes I live in Ediburgh in Scotland but originally come from Aberdeen which is further north. The NHS (National Health Service) is free in the UK which is good as I have made full use of its facilities due to various injuries over the years. The down side is waiting lists can be quite long but I have no complaints as things have happened quite quickly for me. A couple of surgeons seem to have taken a lot of interest in my case which has helped I think. Interestingly when we were discussing things before surgery on Monday he was thinking that if I had no improvement in the footdrop he was thinking of taking a tendon from the back of my leg and attaching it to the front to give me some foot lift. I don't see him again for another 6 weeks but will find out more about his thoughts then.

I am now 3 days post ACLR and walking in the house without my crutches. Trying to exercise with knee flexion but this is quite difficult as I have a huge bandage on my knee and was told I had to keep this on for 5 - 7 days.

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on February 15, 2007, 07:27:55 PM
Hello,

Well done Hamish, 3 days and off crutches in the house - just take care and don't run before you can walk - figuratively speaking, obviously!

Mom444 - I am English and live in the Midlands although from the South originally, slowly migrating north - by the time I retire I could live next door to Hamish!

I found this site, long before I had foot drop.  I had an operation to try and correct the tracking of my knee.  I had both knees done at the same time and had it done at the clinic that supports this site - Droitwich Knee Clinic.  I paid privately and although I gained releif for a couple of years unfortunately I started getting significant pain and giving way of the knee again.  The surgeon at Droitwich was excellent and so was the physio services and a derotational osteotomy had been discussed but I needed to get to the position I did before I would undergo such drastic surgery.  There was no way I could afford to raise the funds for that surgery privately and so went into the wait on the NHS.  Although the waiting has been difficult I have to say the health care I have received from the NHS has been excellent and the after care has been second to none.  I am very pleased I had the leg done despite the nerve problems as I am no longer aware I have a knee joint.  My knee was so painful and unreliable that I would not swop my old knee back for my foot and that is quite a comfort.  I am not so sure I would be quite so calm if it happens again and I have two floppy feet - (I could then lose my sense of humour).  Of course I am now on the waiting list to get the other leg sorted and that will be that - particularly as I will have run out of legs to be operated on!  I have apprehension, naturally, but keep telling myself that no one can be that unlucky twice.  I have every faith in my surgeon and I feel for him as I am not convinced it was his handiwork that did the damage - as I am more inclined to think an overtight plaster caused more difficulties.   We will never know and does no good to dwell too long on the what fors. 

Sorry very long answer.  Andre - after you saying about going over previous posts I have done that and it does make for an interesting read and I am so glad that you started this post and I know that we will all answer that question in the affirmative, it may not be complete but , Yes we will recover from Peroneal Palsy, all of us in our own way.  I beleive that is the purpose of us being here.  Take care all and bless you good.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Max Pwr on February 16, 2007, 05:43:02 PM
Hi All, I've been reading the posts on here for quite some time and find them all facinating.  There is such a variant of people and injuries on here but all have same symtoms and similar outcomes.  I check the site everyday for new posts and thought today would be the day I add my story, please bear with me.  I too suffer from peroneal nerve palsy but for a slightly different reason.  I'll give you the Reader's Digest version; October 2005 playing ice hockey (I live in Alberta Canada) I went into the boards with a right locked knee.  The fall caused my femur to smash through my pelvis shattering the hip socket and everything else it its way.  I've had two surgeries to fix things up but when I woke from my second surgery (June 2006) I had had peroneal nerve palsy.  They did't know what happened, whether a bad stretch at the hip or a peice of equipment on the knee compressing the nerve.  I've had subsequent EMG's and all evidence points at damage to the sciatic nerve (peroneal branch) in the hip.  Although my injury is a bit different, I have the exact same "dragons" as well as tingliing when I tap the side of my leg etc.  To this day I have no dosri-flexion whatsoever.  I am a very active 35 yr old male Mountie that was on the SWAT team and had various other physically demanding activities in my life.  Of course everything came to a screetching halt and I'm still trying to get back to where I was physically.  I wear a brace that allows me to walk normally (but is very uncomfortable) and I've begun to start running with it. 

I am scheduled for a nerve exploration next month where they will open me up again and explore my sciatic, including the peronleal below the knee to see what they can do to repair it.  This may include a nerve graft.  Has anyone heard of whether such a surgery has been successful, and if so how long was recovery.  Like many of you there are days I want to give up and succumb to the injury, and there are other days when I want to fight and never give up (thankfully these days are more frequent than the bad days).  I just want to give a shout out to everyone, especailly Andre et. al... thank  you so much for your days and days of encouragement and inspiration.   I look forward to sharing stories of my injury and recovery should anyone have any questions...   

God Bless you all and I'll be checking to see how everyone continues to recover.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on February 16, 2007, 07:14:44 PM
Welcome Max to 'our' and now 'your' thread on peroneal nerve injuries.  I have sent you a personal message to welcome you.

I know what you mean about the brace/splint.  Apparently there is a high incidence of non compliance by patients but then the people who design them probably never have to wear them!

I have heard of nerve grafts and I think the website by DrFoot is quite good at explaining them with video clips. 

I wish you all the very best and please do contribute to the thread as the encouragement has been second to none.  I often wonder whether the Kneeguru ever pops in to see this thread, as it is not strictly a knee problem, although we have found ourselves a comfortable home here. 

Hamish - how are you doing? - thinking of you and praying for a comfortable and uneventful recovery for you.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on February 16, 2007, 07:39:23 PM
Welcome aboard Max! Sounds like a horrific injury and you are doing well to be walking after that. Where about on your leg do you touch it to get the tingling in your foot?

Jackie, things are going well and I am quite comfortable. I took off the bandages this morning and everything looks to be healing well. They used Steri-strips and I have left them in place and put a dressing on top. On the down side I have not had a shower for 4 days now but have been washing and using deoderant so wont smell too bad. I am doing my exercises 3 times a day, heel slides, straight leg raises, and passive bending of my knee. Want to do more but taking it easy at the moment. 1st PT appointment is next Wednesday.

Hamish
 
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on February 16, 2007, 08:05:46 PM
Well done Hamish, sounds like you are doing great and being sensible.  If only I could have been, I also had the shower issue but I couldn't wait, so I jumped into a shower with a plastic bag around my plaster cast, which did nothing to keep the water out, so I had a water logged plaster and off to A&E to have the plaster changed.  It was fair to say that the nursing staff were none to pleased and let me know.  So next time no showers! 

I have some good news, my right foot is definately dorsi-flexing that bit more.  I reckon I am now about 45 to 50% dorsiflexion.  The skin is still l numb to touch though, not that this is a particlar problem.  Have hydro on Tuesday and can't wait to show new movement.  I am a little restricted on activity due to a very naughty left knee but keep practising the foot movements on the right leg, does anyone else have this situation,  the first couple of dorsiflexions are needed to warm up until the third or fourth I have full dorsiflexion for me, then after a few more it quickly deteriates to not much movement like it just decides it has had enough, like it gets tired and I get stinging and throbbing down the line of the peroneal nerve along the outside of my leg ?  I am just wondering whether any similiar experiences of this and whether it does settle.

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on February 17, 2007, 04:20:35 AM
Hi All, I've been reading the posts on here for quite some time and find them all facinating.  There is such a variant of people and injuries on here but all have same symtoms and similar outcomes.  I check the site everyday for new posts and thought today would be the day I add my story, please bear with me.  I too suffer from peroneal nerve palsy but for a slightly different reason.  I'll give you the Reader's Digest version; October 2005 playing ice hockey (I live in Alberta Canada) I went into the boards with a right locked knee.  The fall caused my femur to smash through my pelvis shattering the hip socket and everything else it its way.  I've had two surgeries to fix things up but when I woke from my second surgery (June 2006) I had had peroneal nerve palsy.  They did't know what happened, whether a bad stretch at the hip or a peice of equipment on the knee compressing the nerve.  I've had subsequent EMG's and all evidence points at damage to the sciatic nerve (peroneal branch) in the hip.  Although my injury is a bit different, I have the exact same "dragons" as well as tingliing when I tap the side of my leg etc.  To this day I have no dosri-flexion whatsoever.  I am a very active 35 yr old male Mountie that was on the SWAT team and had various other physically demanding activities in my life.  Of course everything came to a screetching halt and I'm still trying to get back to where I was physically.  I wear a brace that allows me to walk normally (but is very uncomfortable) and I've begun to start running with it. 

I am scheduled for a nerve exploration next month where they will open me up again and explore my sciatic, including the peronleal below the knee to see what they can do to repair it.  This may include a nerve graft.  Has anyone heard of whether such a surgery has been successful, and if so how long was recovery.  Like many of you there are days I want to give up and succumb to the injury, and there are other days when I want to fight and never give up (thankfully these days are more frequent than the bad days).  I just want to give a shout out to everyone, especailly Andre et. al... thank  you so much for your days and days of encouragement and inspiration.   I look forward to sharing stories of my injury and recovery should anyone have any questions...   

God Bless you all and I'll be checking to see how everyone continues to recover.

Welcome Max and good luck with your recovery!

My daugter also needed to have her nerve explored to find out what exactly went wrong.  With her they found a neuroma, a large bundle of scar tissue that was squeezing the nerve.  They did neurolysis to remove it.  (We don't know whatever caused the injury in the first place.)

The surgeon did mention that depending on what he found he might have considred a nerve graft.  He mentioned the sural nerve if I remember and I think...  I think...  (ulness my memory is goin) that the nerve would be taken from the side of her foot. 

If this happened in June of 2006 then it is less than a year since the injury and I'd move to do the nerve exploration ASAP!  The longer you wait the worse it could be so push to have it done fast.

Bless you.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Max Pwr on February 17, 2007, 04:35:56 AM
Hey Guys,

Thanks for the welcome, J_smi001, thanks for the personal message, for some reason I can't sen one back, but it appears we have a gerat deal in common.  Hopefully you'll be back at doing the things you love very soon.

Hamish, it was a bad accident, but I don't think it was much worse than what many of you have gone through; we all have to go through some adversity at some time in our lives, I guess for many of us, that time is now!  When I tap my leg on the side just below the knee joint itself, I think it's the head of the tibula (or fibula?) I'm not sure; but right on the side, I get a electrical shock that runs down the paroneal right to the toes.  I asked my nuerosurgeon if this meant anything significant and he replied "not really" so any hope I had that it meant things were coming back were soon diminished.

Mom, I've read your posts and feel such compassion for you.  When you don't know what the feelings are like I can imagine they are hard to comprehend, and I'm sure if you could take the pain yourself in place of your little girl you would.  They can be hard to put into words but tell your daughter that a lot of us have the same problems, even big strong policemen!  In response about getting it done ASAP, I am.  The neurosurgeon told me that if we do it it's going to have to be before the 1 year anniiversary of the damage or he wouldn't do it at all so I told him "let's get it done".  Therefore March 21st I'm having the exploration done, hopefully they will find out what's wrong and fix it without the graft, as the graft only has about a 1 in 3 chance of success.  The dragons hurt me too, and some days they leave me alone entirely, some days they make me want to cry!

Thanks again for the welcomes and I look forward to keeping in touch with all of you who understand how awkward it is to high step to the bathroom...
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on February 19, 2007, 03:04:25 PM
Hello Everyone,

Just stopping in to say hello.  There have been no dragons at all recently but I am keeping the faith.

Meanwhile my daughter's neurosurgeon's office never got back to us about scheduling another EMG...  And we have not had any other PT appointments lately with the electricial muscle stimulation because of all the craziness with the other PT evaluations.

And I can't make any phone calls today because it's President's Day here in the US and most offices are closed! 

Hmm...  I'm just trying to say calm.

I hope you all are doing well.  Keep praying.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on February 20, 2007, 08:03:11 PM
Please pray!  We have another EMG tomorrow!

We got an appointment for tomorrow... 

I'm so nervous.  I'm nervous about how bad she'll cry when they stick the big needle in her leg.

I'm even more nervous if the news is not good or if there is no sign of nerve regeneration yet.

Yes, it has been exactly 7 months since her neurolysis surgery.  If the "inch a month" theory is true that it's probably too early for any signs of regenration yet.  That is, if 7 months equals 7 inches...  But on the other hand the neurosurgeon said that the dragons could mean that there is some regeneration already...  I'm so confused.

I hope you all are well.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: stabso on February 20, 2007, 09:35:03 PM
Hi mom444,

I had an EMG today and if it's any consolation, only the initial pin-prick caused a little discomfort.
Obviously, a young child will have a different take on it, but in hind-sight distraction and not actually seeing the procedure would probably have helped.


Thoughts and best wishes for you and your little girl tomorrow.

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on February 21, 2007, 07:41:39 PM
Prayers delivered as requested.  Mom444 and Stabso - so what are the results of your EMG's?  I am still waiting for a date.........  Hope all making good recoveries.  No real news my end still just hanging in there.  Take care all
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Max Pwr on February 21, 2007, 07:56:29 PM
Hey Mom, prayers on this end sent as well.... how did it go?  I'm anxious to hear how things went with the EMG etc... I was thinking the other day about you; I waas talking to my doctor sometime ago and asked him about the nerve pain and whether or not it's indicative of healing.  He replied to me that every case is unique and although some that heal report the 'dragons' while others that heal feel nothing before they see the recovery.  As well, many that had dragons, had them for quite some time with no recovery.  Therefore, if your daughter doesn't feel the pain, it does not mean she's not healing.  Every person with this affliction heals differently so keep that in mind, and stay positive!  We're thinking and paraying for you.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on February 21, 2007, 08:46:21 PM
Hello All,

Please keep praying.  I am crying right now.  We just had the EMG and while the rehab medicine specialist saw some sign of improvement there is another issue we have to worry about.  My daughter has a thick mass of scar tissue over the incision where she had the surgery and the rehab medicine doctor was concerned that the scar tissue could be pressing on the nerve and interfering with it healing.  He also said that after seven months he had hoped to see more improvement.

He also said that she may need another surgery, possibly plastic surgery to break up the scar tissue.

The worst thing he said was that if she did not recover that she may need a tendon transfer.  I do not want to have to do that because she is so young, only three.  She's at the beginning of her life.  Plus, those surgeries are more complicated on children.

Every doctor who we have seen throughout this whole ordeal has given us a different story.  It is so frustrating!  We have heard stories about how recovery couild take a few months to a year to whatever...

Please keep praying.  We keep praying for you too.

I'm so worried.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on February 21, 2007, 09:42:23 PM
Mom444
So sorry to hear your news and no pointin saying don't worry because of course you will.  I know exactly what you mean about different doctors giving different information and I really don't think you are alone in that as nerve injuries are not well understood and I bet we have all been given information that has then been contradicted later on.  I was myself initially told, 2 to 4 weeks and it will be OK, then between 3 -6 months you'll see the most recovery, then lets see how it is at 12 months to it is possible to have recovery upto 18 months.  You take care
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Max Pwr on February 22, 2007, 04:17:17 AM
Hey Mom, how would you feel if there had been no signs of recovery?  That they say there's some recovery should be wonderful news, of course we all want to wake up tomorrow and not have drop foot anymore but that's unrealistic; I think it's great that they showed some improvement.  About the scar tissue over the incision, have you tried some massage therapy?  I had a huge rock hard lump under my scar and the massage got it right down, perhaps give it some thought, it may hurt her a little but maybe it might be of some benefit.  As well, I don't know about your daughter but my calf kills me sometimes and the massage feels soooo goooood on it.  I've been scheduled for another EMG Friday, I'm hoping to hear there's some recovery, no matter how minute.  Maybe I'll get the same good news as your little one.  Surgery still scheduled for next month.  I wish I could get a tendon transfer, research it, turns out success rate is like 75% or higher, which would mean no more AFO for her, so don't dismiss that option either!  You stay strong, I think about you guys everyday.  I also saw another neurosurgeon today and asked him about the dragons.  he said that if the pain goes away it's usually a good sign so don't pray too hard for those dragons to return.  In any event, get some sleep and please let us know how you are doing.   
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on February 22, 2007, 04:47:17 AM
Thank you everyone for your comforting words and prayers!  It's almost midnight and I've been frantically researching again!  That is just what I do...  It's like I think maybe I'll find something online that will give me an answer.

Seeing your posts is so comforting.

Thanks Jacky, Max and everyone.  I am so happy you are all here for us.  I would prefer not to have her need a tendon transfer because an orthopedic surgeon said that on a child it is too complicated and that the tendons could not grow properly as she grew and it would require more surgeries...

I am going to start the massages right away!  Yes, it is good that there is at least some iimprovement.  I still don't know if the scar tissue really is causing a problem of if this doctor is just playing another guessin game. 

DID ANY OF YOUR DOCTORS TELL YOU ABOUT SURFACE SCARS ABOVE THE SURGERY INCISIONS AND IF THEY COULD IMPEDE RECOVERY?  I am just so shocked that the neurosurgeon did not think to tell us this... 

Yes, I better get some sleep.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: G_Bronson on February 22, 2007, 08:37:37 AM
Hello Everyone,
I was wondering if i could join in on your Posts.
I recently suffered a knee dislocation while playing football over x-mas this past December.
 I was visiting my friends and family in Newfoundland from Alberta. I had a great job out there, Played every sport you can think of, then on boxing day i fell the wrong way in a pile of people playing our annual game of football. I tore my ACL, damaged my PCL , tore my LCL, and stretched the peroneal nerve. Subsiquently i have foot drop. i had surgery on the 17th of January07 to repair the damage to my legiments and tendons, and tomorrow i start physio. The surgeon told me that the nerve was stretched severly but was intact. I have frantically been searching to see if people do recover from such injuries. I was excited to read the posts that you have all written and hope and pray that you will all heal. I don't care if i play sports again i will settle just to walk. i know it will take alot of hard work and i am no stranger to that. i just need some support from people who have gone through similar injuries. I felt like my life was over to be honest, i could not even fly home to Alberta, i had my operation in Newfoundland and will be starting my physio here, although i am greatfull to have my family and freinds close at this time, i am also anxious to return to work. I had an EMG last week and the nerve was non responsive. However the neurologist did give me hope. i do have some feeling in the top of my foot, it is extra sensitive at times but its there.He said this is a good sign, some signals are getting through.  I also feel lots of heat,tingles, and shocks throughout the nerve.  Also he said that it is still early to say it will not regenerate, it takes time,usually 6 months to a year or more.  I can press down with my foot and move it inward, but not outward and no dorsifexion.

I was wondering if there are certain things I should start to do? I am an engineer and i have been analyising this to death and am quite scared! Yet i am doing my best to remain positive. Any suggestions or knowledge would be greatly appreciated.

I wish you all luck in your Battles with this, and will Pray for you.   


Gordon
 
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on February 22, 2007, 03:48:02 PM
Welcome Gordon and best of luck to you.  It's great to have another member to support and share info :)

My daughter also can push her foot downward and inward but cannot pull it up.

I'm so confused because of all the conflicting information I have heard from various doctors.  As I said I stayed up late last night trying to find all the info I could.  Thankfully my husband and I both work for colleges and we have passwords to some medical databases.  There were a few more research articles I found and many articles do point toward recovery not starting until 6 to 8 months after the injury (or surgery?)  So, why...  WHY did that doctor yesterday scare us so much by saying there should be more healing by now?  That was not what the neurosurgeon or physical therapist told us.  So who is correct?  It's so frustrating!

So your doctor also said "6 months to a year?"  That's what they originally told us too...

Well, best of luck to you all and we will all keep praying for each other. 

I wonder if prayers are what got us the early EMG appointment in the first place.  The neurosurgeon was planning on waiting a few more months to do one!  Who know what thaty could have done...  If we do need to start working on the scar tissue that thank God we go in when we did.

But today I am trying not to cry as much and be calm.  I wonder if the rehab medicine doctor was wrong, I hope he was.  I really hope the he was wrong about both of the shocking things he told us:  that there should have been more recovery by now and that the scar tissue on the surface of the skin is impeding the healing. 

Those two theories almost sound far fetched...  Everything different doctors have told us in contradictory...





Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on February 22, 2007, 08:05:11 PM
Thank you for your prayers...  I was able to get her an appointment with a different physical therapist for tomorrow morning!

Today I was on the phone all day trying to call different doctors...  I'm not just going to sit around and act like nothing is wrong when there are 10 different doctors and therapists telling me different things are wrong with my daughter!

I tried calling her neurosurgeon's office...  They didn't get back to me.

I tried calling the physical therapist.  She was out of town.

...But then the phone rang and it was a lady who I work with at my new job.  She asked me why I sounded so upset so I told her I had been under stress lately dealing with my daughter and her problems after her surgery...

Well the lady from my new job actually had a lot of input to share with me so it may have been a Godsend that she called.  She told me that she too had injured her nerve years ago and did feel "dragon" pain when it healed.  Although her injury did not affect any of her motor control of her muscles but did cause pain.  She also told me that her eight year old son has had health problems and has gone through lots of neurological tests, physical therapy, etc.  (Her son is 8 now and was diagnosed with a brain problem or various neurological problems since birth...  Pray for her little guy too.)  But when I mentioned physical therapy to her I told her that while my daughter loves her physical therapist that the therapist didn't really have any experience dealing with my daughter's kind of problem.  I told the lady I work with that I had a hard time finding a therapist that works with children and was told that the only place that worked with children was at the children's hospital...

Well the lady told me that she knew of a therapist who worked with children and that she had taken her son to him when he was very young.  I got the office number and they were able to get us in tomorrow.

I think that because this type of injury rarely happens with children and most often happens to adults and atheletes it would be much better to see a physical therapsit who works with adults as well as children.  Maybe this new therapist has even seen some of the same type of injury before, which admittedly the children's hospital staff had not.

Also, even the rehab medicine specialist said that we should start with the electric muscle stim therapy right away before the is any more atrophy of the muscles...  And we don't have time to wait a few more months to see if the school sponsored PT will work.

So thank you for your prayers, this may be part of them being answered!

Blessings and best to you all.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on February 23, 2007, 04:30:31 AM
Hey all,

Sorry i have been away for awhile. first off i would like to welcome all the new members to the forum and i wish you all the best of luck in recovery.

Mom444...im sorry that i havent been hear to offer my support...im im sorry to hear about the EMG test results and the worrying and heart ache you have been going through. what can they do abut the scar tissue stufficating the nerve? how would they go about breaking it down? i also had scar tissue problems and my therapists used laser treatment to break it up...but im guessing that your daughters  may be more adhesed if they are thinking of doing surgery again. man i cannot express in words how much i hope and pray for you and your family to overcome this. i just keep waiting for the post that recovery is going well....and i will keep waiting as i truly believe that things will get better. and i was also told by the doctors at my 8th month emg mark that i had 0 chance of recovery due to the lack of progression...we are very different cases but the possiblities are endless so what is said by a doctor is not specific to your child. we are here for you.

I have been away for awhile due to a pretty bad turn of events in recovery which caused about a full week off due to foot and ankle pains. everything was going well in recovery and on feb 12th i believe i went for my normal running session and as soon as i stepped down on my foot...i had a huge thrust of pain ..almost like stabbing the inide curve of my foot. it was so bad that after trying to run it off(stupidly) it got worst and i could not run let alone wlak without limping. ankle swelled and tder to the touch and there were no signs of the cause....i felt that it was or might have been my body readjusting to the better weight distribution i have but it wasnt. also my dorsiflexion became limited and i couldnt not dorsi flex past 90 and you coudlnt even manually pull it past 90. i was scared and thought that maybe i injured something without knowning due to the nerves not being in full recvoery yet. i finally saw my Doctor this week for the new "injury" and it turns out that my fibula has not been moving.do to the lack of use my muscles around the fibula have ceased up. he explained to me that when you dorsiflex the fibula moves to open up the ankle joint.(not his exact words..im trying to explain it myslef).it has been like this for awhile but has gotten worst due to the amount of pounding i have been doing on it. it was an easy fix..as he used tape to tape over the fibula and set it were it is supposed to be...but the bad news i have to do this everytimei am active until we can figure out a way to teach it react with the other motor functions again. im terribly sorry for the bad explaination...i just finhed with him today and meet with him again on tuesday and i will post the medical explantaion just incase anyone runs into the same problem. it s also getting to crunch time and the combines are very close and a week off did not work in m favor so i have to make up for the lost time.

Gald to se you all again...im going to catch up on the thread and i will posting again.
Andre
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on February 23, 2007, 01:37:18 PM


Mom444...im sorry that i havent been hear to offer my support...im im sorry to hear about the EMG test results and the worrying and heart ache you have been going through. what can they do abut the scar tissue stufficating the nerve? how would they go about breaking it down? i also had scar tissue problems and my therapists used laser treatment to break it up...but im guessing that your daughters  may be more adhesed if they are thinking of doing surgery again. man i cannot express in words how much i hope and pray for you and your family to overcome this. i just keep waiting for the post that recovery is going well....and i will keep waiting as i truly believe that things will get better. and i was also told by the doctors at my 8th month emg mark that i had 0 chance of recovery due to the lack of progression...we are very different cases but the possiblities are endless so what is said by a doctor is not specific to your child. we are here for you.



Thank you so much Andre!  I hope you are feeling better too after your setback.

You gave me a lot of good information.  So you too were told to expect more healing my 8 months with your peroneal nerve, but you DID get recovery after that?

And how soon after your surgery did the scar tissue begin to build up?  How was the experience with laser treatment?  Was the procedure done by a doctor or a physical therapist? 

My daughter's scar confuses me.  I'm not sure if it is or is not as bad as they say it is.  It is mildly keloid and the "hard" part sits right at top of the fibular bone.  So it feels hard when you touch it but I wonder if it's actually the bone we feel?

Again, I have dug up every single research study I could find on peroneal nerve recovery and a lot of them say recovery AFTER the 7 month mark...  Some of the article even say recover took up to a year or after a year...  And her "dragons" started 6 months after her surgery, so I wonder if that was recovery just startiing to kick in a the 6 month mark?

Bless you all.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on February 23, 2007, 09:47:32 PM
Thank God the lady from work told me about this new physical therapist!

It turns out he has extensive experience with peroneal nerve injuries so he knows how to treat them and knows what to expect!  The therapists at the children's hospital were simply too inexperienced with this type of injury and had I continued to take her there she could have sustained even more damage!

The new therapist also agrees that the scar tissue could very well be a problem.  I'm terrified but I am glad that at least we are finding this out NOW while we may still have time to do something about it.  Even if she does need secondary surgery hopefull whatever it is that needs to be done can  be done soon enough to not have too much interference with the nerve healing.

We are seeing a plastic surgeon next Wednesday for a consult on possible scar treatment.  Her neurosurgon should be back in won this Monday and the office better call us back!  If not I will call and call unitl they give me an answer!

Regarding "scar revision" treatment, II have already been researching as much as I can find and that too is so confusing!  Andre, you mentioned your scars were treated wtih laser therapy?  I would love if that were all they had to do.  Both the rehab medicine guy and the new physical therapist mentioned possible SURGERY.  I would absolutely hate to have her go through another surgery, but we'll do what we have to do.

The new therapist also recommended massage therapy for the scar so we are doing that right away.  We will do whatever we have to do.  We need to move quickly because we are in the one year window of opportunity for healing.

This is another bump in the road for us, we hoped to be sailing toward recovery by now but it looks like we still have more to do.

The question also came up as to when the actual healing that has happened so far began.  We got the latest EMG report and it does say "remarkable for the ability to record a response from tibialis anterior, stimulating the peroneal nerve below the fibular head and above the fibular head.  On her previous study, this response was not present." 

As for the "recruitment" in the peroneal innervated muscles" it was "slightly improed from her pre-op studies" and they had hoped to see more "recruitment...  particularly in the more proximal tibialis anterior."

The report also says there is an "exuberant scar ove the fibular head region.  One question that arises is whether this is somewho interfering with axon regeneration."  They also wonder if she is not recoering because the delay between her injury to the date when she had the surgery was too long...  But remember, she was misdiagnosed for so long!

The EMG doctor also want to repeat the EMG test in two more months to see if there is any more recovery  if it is going to occur.  He also said to in the meantime consider "scar revision surgery."

This is all so much to digest... 

Again, some of what he is saying goes against what I have read about peroneal nerve recovery.  The part about hoping to see more recovery by now contradicts what one research study I read said about how in one case after neurolysis, "Peronei muscles began to contract by 5 monmths, and signs of recovery in anterior tibial muscles were usuallly seen by 12 months."  Well, then in that case she is getting SOME response from the tibialis anterior...   The same study also says, Average recovery periods from 12 to 30 months were seen after neurolysis.  Most often, eversion innervated by superficial peroneal nerve branches to peeronei muscles recovered before dorsiflextion by anterior tibial muscle."  The citation for the article I am quoting is here:  http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=8832668&dopt=Abstract

I'm so confused and worried I could throw up.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on February 23, 2007, 10:53:17 PM
Interesting article, although I don't profess to have understood all of it.  Different time lines are quoted in this article to the ones I have been given and so can only empathise with the anxiety this causes.  The article quotes grade 3, so does that mean there are different grades of recovery, i.e. not have it don't have it but there are grades of having it in between?  So how many grades and how are they defined?  Don't worry about answering that as you have more than enough to worry about.

Andre - so sorry to hear about your set back and that you are taped up.  Lets hope that this is not long term and there is a way to retrain the muscles to do their bit.

On a personal note I have physiotherapy on monday and so want to show off my new lift and hold on the foot.  It is still not dorsiflexing to anywhere near the same amount as the unaffected fott but I can lift and hold for a bit now.  I find it does make the front of my leg sting though and my ankle area is throbbing more noticably nowdays, although I am hoping that is through hard work that it has not been used to.  The foot feels tight as I start to dorsiflex but when I passively move the foot up and down it is OK - so not sure what that is all about either.  Still not heard a date from the hospital for either the neuro consult or the orthopeadic consult for the op date - I can't stand this waiting........................

Have a good weekend all and try to take it easy and relax. x
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: stabso on February 24, 2007, 08:30:34 AM
Hi all

Can't resist chucking in my 2 pence worth about grades.
According to the powers that be - whoever they are - there is a muscle grading system they use for assessment and this is the info I've come across as to how it goes...

Grade 0 = No evidence of contractility
         1 = Evidence of slight contactillty, no joint motion
         2 = Complete range of motion with gravity eliminated
         3 = Complete range of motion against gravity
         4 = Complete range of motion against some resistance
         5 = Complete range of motion with full resistance 

mom444, I totally understand your frustrations and anxieties when coming across conflicting articles and theories from the "experts".
It's as though you have become an expert yourself as you cut to the chase when answers are sometimes not properly thought out or totally wide of the mark even.
I try to gather the info and question each consultant as I come across them and when the answers conflict I put it to them and then gut instinct also comes into play a little.
But one answer that has been consistent with nerve recovery is the "unknownness" in terms of time to heal and how we're all wired up which goes some way to explaining the conflicting answers.

Talking of frustration and confusion, I had an EMG this week by a girl whose first language was not English and kept referring to me as she.
As much as I tried to get answers, I figured I'd have to wait to see the neurosurgeon next week to get a better picture of what's what from the results although I did manage to get a "not good" for the poreneal.

Andre, good to hear from you even though you've had a rough few days.
Hope you get back on track soon.

j_smi001, with what little lift I have in my foot, I too find it tightens up.
I was lead to believe that the muscles are so weak they tire real quick hence the tightening after a few lifts.
Are your EDLs and EHLs kicking in - the muscles that lift the toes and the big toe?

Also came across these guys for rehab equipment for the ankle.
The Pivot Table looks the most useful form here, but cheap it ain't and shipping fron the US to here in the UK ($129) makes it a non-starter for me.
http://www.performbetter.com/SearchResult.aspx_Q_CategoryID_E_369

Good to hear from G.Bronson and Max pwr too.

All the best for the weekend





 

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on February 24, 2007, 03:16:11 PM
Thanks Stabso,  very clear explanations.  I do have my toes lifting up and normally my big toe fails to join them although it is starting to show signs of life.  I am very happy that I am continuing to make progress, regardless of how slow it may be.  I still wear my splint for work and outside as I think I am a trip hazard waiting to happen.   I have noticed that when I try to dorsiflex the foot the toes now tend to dip down instead of up, but I can lift the toes when not dorsiflexing - not sure if anyone can follow that!

take care all x
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on February 25, 2007, 01:47:46 AM
Hello All,

Hope everyone is well.

Jacky, I just posted the link for the citation to the article.  The full artilce has to be accessed with a password through a medical database.  (Lot's of times you will just find citations online rather than full articles.  For ones not accessible through databases I have had to request print copies from local libraries.)

Well, Mom is trying to calm down and relax!  It's really been a rough week for us.  But I did some research on scar tissue and found that there are some over the counter things you can use.  Has anyone else heard of silicone sheets being used over scar tissue?  I guess this is something they have done for a while, they are supposed to shrink and soften scars. 

I am not sure if my daughter's scar would be a "keloid" scar or a "hyperthrophic" scar.  Both kind of look the same and both are hard.  I have heard that keloid scars are a bit more stubbon than hypertrophics but both still can, as Andre said, strangle the nerve.

I went to a surgical supply store looking for the silicone scar sheets and instead I found a similar product that is not silicone but is still a sheet to be worn over the scar.  it is called Gel Care and it has mineral oil in it, it is supposed to soften up the scar tissue.

I hope there are some kind of topical things we can to do help the scar, even if it is radiation therapy.

I hope she doesn't need another sugery.

The new physical therapist also mentioned ultrasound therapy.  I guess some therapists do that to break up scar tissue.

The new therapist is also going to try other methods on her such as acupressure, nerve stimulation, etc.

Thanks again for all of your thoughts and prayers and ours go out to you. 

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on February 25, 2007, 04:01:08 AM
Hey mom444,

I was discussing some of the treatments that i had under gone with me therapist...and as i said i to had problems with scar tissue bulid up.im nt sure your gender but she said that african americans tend to scar thicker and deeper so i required alittle bit more treatment to break up the scar tissue.the laser was used about 2 months after the surgery because my scar tissue was so bad that i had problems with my flexion and extension(which put me in surgery again to manually break it up) but also before the second surgery i saw another doctor who had performed a technique called "neuro flossing" to break up scar tissue and give the nerve "freedom" from the constant suffication.he was the same doc that gave me the neurosurgeons site where i was searching and found this site.i actually started seeing him again and i will get all the info on tuesday from him about where to get info on this.i have been lucky to know some people that have some history with these types of injuries and i promise i will soak every last bit of info out of them that i can and i will let you know what i can get.

Hey thanks alot Stabso for the best wishes...i am back and running again...but annoyingly i have to keep retapping my fibula head to shift it into position before i run or it will stab my ankle due to the stiffness around it. once its taped its fine but half an hour and i gotta rip some more hairs out.i might as well shave because my leg is al patchy due to the number of tape jobs i have had on it.

Hey hamish...hope things are going well wish you and everyone all the best.also sorry to all for the inconsistent posts i got switched to evenings at work so i train in the morning and work right after so i have been pretty exhausted. if i take i while to get back to you that is why. take care all

Also new lateral movement footage. first time they have allowed me to go 100% and do it laterally planting. i have to admit i was scared like hell when i first started and was very protective ..but after many attempts my brain got tired of protecting and i just started doing. this run i was very pleased with.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on February 25, 2007, 04:16:17 AM
Hey Mom444,
http://www.iaom-us.com/archive/newsletter/nletterOld/news16/n16-appl.htm

 i did a quick search on neural flossing of the lower extremities. this site gives you generic information on the procedure.again i will find out the site my osteopath sent me to way back in the begining stages of recovery.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on February 25, 2007, 03:50:53 PM
Hello Everyone,

Andre, thanks for the scar treatment info.  I forgot to ask, was your scar affecting the PERONEAL nerve or other parts that you injured?  I'm not an expert, but I"m nervous if they have to do surgery near the peroneal nerve because it is SO CLOSE to the surface and I'm afraid of them working too close to it.  Were you able to continue getting recovery after the surgery?  And also, you mentioned that your peroneal nerve started coming back more than 8 months after your injury/surgery?  What did EMGs say?

Remember, the neurosurgeon originally said that it could take months for recovery yet the EMG doctor said there should be more that has occurred by now.

We have an appointment with a plastic surgeon next Wednesday so hopefully we'll get some answers then about the scar.  And we are hoping to hear back from the neurosurgeon on Monday.  I'm still in shock and a little angry that the neurosurgeon gave us such completely different information than the other doctors and therapists.  When I asked him if we should be concerned about her scar he said, "Ah...  no."  And when I called and asked his nurse later on about how the other therapist was concerned about the scar tissue the nurse was kind of vague about saying anything.  I can't believe they didn't warn us about this!  This man is a professional surgeon and it doesn't make sense that he wouldn't seem to be concerned about scar tissue.

Yes, I have heard that darker skinned people are more prone to the keloid types of scars yet I have also heard that younger people are more prone to them.  My daugher is very, very pale skinned so I'm wondering is she is genetically more likely to get the other kind of scar called a "hyperthrophic" scar...  It's so confusing! 

I'm trying not to go too crazy over researching things but I think that finding information is good!

To Jacky, Stabso, Hamish, Max, and everyone else...  Good luck and hang in there!  We're all cheering you on.

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on February 25, 2007, 06:02:08 PM
Hey Momm444,

When i went under a week after surgery my OS said my peroneal nerve was crushed and looked pretty bad and that it should take months to heal if it is going to heal...my terapists felt that it was sufficated from the swelling scar tissue...and my EMG specialist said the exact same thing when i went for my first and second EMG..that they expected more and at my 8th month mark i ad only alittle bit of eversion and he said i had nothing and probaly not walk proper again. So i understand your confusion and anger....i felt like i wanted to pack it in so many times...because nobody knew more then the other person and it seemed like they would just tell me things to get rid of me and move on.until i started showing true signs of regeneration was when i started getting more straight answers. And in ansewr to your question it possibly could affected the peroneal nerve. when they started the flossing it was around the same time i started getting the "Dragons" not sure if it was because of the flossing but i wouldnt rule it out. that was within the first three months before my second surgery.my scar tissue was pretty stubborn as it adhesed to the torn ACL and caused flexion and extension problems. so that is why i think laser and the flossing helped free up any scar tissue....but 6 months...my therapists said the scar tissue might be to think by this point but it still wouldnt hurt to try. hope i answered your question and hang in there.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: G_Bronson on February 26, 2007, 01:10:21 AM
Hello amdre,
I just want to tell you that reading your posts has lifted my spirits. I feel the same way when i see my OS. He is a great doctor and i am thankful for the work he did with my knee. However when i ask him about my nerve he is very negitive and to the point. It takes the wind out of my sales. My injury is similiar to yours except my nerve was stretched not crushed. But just knowing that it is possible to heal is motivating me. i just started physio, and i am a little over a month post op. The injury occured in a football game dec 26th '06. I have had "the dragon now for about three weeks. How long did it take you to feel pains like that. Is it really a positive sign? Sorry to hear about your setback hope you get through it. Can you walk without an AFO?

Momm444,
thanks for the well wishes, I can't imagine how you must feel. But just keep in mind that doctors don't really know a whole lot about nerve recovery and they aren't always right. Most cases like this are unique. Thats why none of them can give you a straight answer. The only factor that remains constant in all recoveries for this type is time. Positive thinking goes a long way in any type of healing. My mother runs the chemotherapy ward at the local hospital and she has helped me alot mentally since this happened to me. Usually the positive people recover. The Young do tend to heal better, always keep that in mind. Millions of people in the world heal everyday sometimes it just takes. I wish you all the best with your daugthers recovery.


take care everyone

Gordon     
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on February 26, 2007, 02:31:45 PM
Thanks Gordon and everyone else!  Andre, I sent you a pm.

Today I should hopefully hear back from the neurosurgeon's office.  I have no idea what he'll say (or rather, what he'll have his nurse call and tell me...  Doctors always have to speak through a filter which makes it even more confusing.)

We have two appointments with the new physical therapist this week.  We'll see how that goes.

Then on Wednesday, the big meeting with the plastic surgeon.

SO MANY DOCTORS' APPOINTMENTS!

By the way, the gel pad that we have had her wear over her scar seems like it may in fact be softening up the skin!  Who knows?

Also, as a researcher I have to promote research  :)  Have any of you taken advantage of the library or other places to access some of the research articles about your condition?  It really, really helps.  Sometimes you can find information in research studies that the therapists and doctors may not have mentioned.  And, after all, doctors themselves often do "literature searches" when they are getting ready to treat patients.  Again, you sometimes need a password to access them (you can ask your local library or local hospital library if you have access to one.)  Other times you may only find a citation online but you will then need to find a library that carries the print version of that journal.  I have found many articles about peroneal nerve injuries.

Gordon there have been many studies that specifically mention stretch injuries of the peroneal nerve.  I'll pm you if I find any more.

Blessings and best to you all!
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Max Pwr on February 26, 2007, 10:58:59 PM
Hi Everybody,

Does anyone have any idea what the best AFO's are for athletic activity?  I have one, plastic, goes up to nearly back of my knee with a hinge at the ankle.  The foot plate goes to the pad of my foot.  There are two velcro straps that keep it in place.  Are there better one's out there?  Amdre, do you know of any better ones out there?  Did you get a chance to run with one at all?  I'd love to start jogging a bit but the AFO I have is just not working for such an acitivity.  I can walk really fast so I up the incline on the treadmill but we all know it's not the same....

I think about you all everyday and hope you are all continuing to cope.  I had an EMG on Friday and although there was no specific information, it appears that things are getting better and that there are 'encouraging signs' (stated by the neurologist) but it's going to take a year!  Blah!  I'm still scheduled for surgery on the 21st to examine the sciatic/peroneal and clear any scar tisu

Take care everyone, talk to you soon!
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on February 27, 2007, 12:44:20 AM
Hello amdre,
I just want to tell you that reading your posts has lifted my spirits. I feel the same way when i see my OS. He is a great doctor and i am thankful for the work he did with my knee. However when i ask him about my nerve he is very negitive and to the point. It takes the wind out of my sales. My injury is similiar to yours except my nerve was stretched not crushed. But just knowing that it is possible to heal is motivating me. i just started physio, and i am a little over a month post op. The injury occured in a football game dec 26th '06. I have had "the dragon now for about three weeks. How long did it take you to feel pains like that. Is it really a positive sign? Sorry to hear about your setback hope you get through it. Can you walk without an AFO?

Momm444,
thanks for the well wishes, I can't imagine how you must feel. But just keep in mind that doctors don't really know a whole lot about nerve recovery and they aren't always right. Most cases like this are unique. Thats why none of them can give you a straight answer. The only factor that remains constant in all recoveries for this type is time. Positive thinking goes a long way in any type of healing. My mother runs the chemotherapy ward at the local hospital and she has helped me alot mentally since this happened to me. Usually the positive people recover. The Young do tend to heal better, always keep that in mind. Millions of people in the world heal everyday sometimes it just takes. I wish you all the best with your daugthers recovery.


take care everyone

Gordon     

hey G_Bronson

Good o hear from you and i was also inspired in the same way that you say i have inspired you..and that i think is huge in recovery ..once you know that it is possible.in answer to your question about dragons i had them for about the first 3 months at an intense spark...then it took  a break and then continured for another two months with less pain and inconsistent sparking. i still get some to this day but it is becoming faded as time goes on.From what i hear it i positive i went through it and when then calmed down i started regaining motor functions....so i think the rumors may be true.Thanks frthe best wishes in regards to my setback..things have picked up again and the ankle is not bothering me for now.i do not wear an AFO brace anymore just an ACL brace. i have posted this before but if you click on the world under my screen name it will take you to a site where i post my recovery..in there i have a dorsi flexion tool that i used and other progression footage good luck in your recoveryand keep me posted...also do you wanna play again...are you competitive playing or just pickup?
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: G_Bronson on February 27, 2007, 01:16:13 AM
Hello amdre,
In response to your question i would like to get back playing sports again. but i don't know if i will risk it as most of the sports i played were phsyical, and i was a physical player. The only competeive sports i have played just before the accident were hockey and softball. The football game where i hurt my knee was just an annual ritual with my buddies on boxing day. It wasn't a tackle i just fell the wrong way on a pile of people. I would settle to recover enough to jog and hit the gym again. It depends on my recovery but i would like nothing more than to play hockey again! I don't think i will chance rugby or football ever again. But right now getting back to work is my greatest concern other than recovery. Thank you for your words of encouragement and good luck to you.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on February 27, 2007, 11:42:03 AM
Hi Guys,

Sorry I have been absent for a while but really been down in the dumps and struggled the last couple of weeks. I thought I was prepared for my ACL surgery and was almost looking forward to in a way in that it was another peice of the jigsaw in place but being knocked back to square one, being back on crutches, the pain and discomfort has been hard to handle. That is me 2 weeks post op now and just walking with one crutch when I have to go out and started Physio. I am still very uncomfortable but not really in pain so much. Maybe I wasn't as prepared as I thought I was but maybe you never are. Anyway thought of my foot and nerve have really taken a back seat at the moment as the concentration is on my knee.

Hi Gordon
Looks like we suffered very similar injuries, I did mine rugby training. The surgeon also said that I had stretched the nerve but it was still intact. I also have a lot of admiration for my surgeon but they will not comitt to how well you will recover from the nerve injury. I believe they will always give you the worst case senario but everyone heals and recovers differently. I think their philosophy is if you give the worst case then everyone will fall above that line and then there will be no comeback. I am now 6 months post injury and believe things have started to happen. I still have no movement but some feeling strating to move down my leg from the site of the injury and believe this is the nerve strating to repair itself. Are you still in a leg brace at the moment or have you managed to get rid of it? Wishing you the best and hang in there.

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on February 27, 2007, 11:49:25 PM
Hello All,

What a day!

We started out this morning talking with the neurosurgeon...   And he was, to put it mildly, vague and almost clueless!  I'm not insulting the man, but he couldn't give us a straight answer about anything!

At first he thought maybe the scar was a problem.  Then he looked again and said, "Nah."  He thinks the hardness of the scar is actually the bone underneath it.  So he doesn't think we need to rush into another surgery to operate on the scar.  But he does want to do YET ANOTHER MRI of her leg.  That means she'll be put under general anesthesia again...

He also is vague and cluless regarding how long the recovery period should be.  He is bouncing back and forth between the nerve growing back from the spinal cord at an inch a month to the nerve growing back from the knee.

...Later one we saw our new physical therapist who did electric muscle stimulation, ultrasound massage and regular massage.  The new physical therapist still thinks we should watch the scar.

Tomorrow night we meet with the plastic surgeon.

But here is the clincher...  Guess who stopped by for dinner?  The dragon!  In fact, my daughter is on my lap right now and she is crying because her leg hurts.

This is all so bizzarre...

I hope you guys are all well. 

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on March 03, 2007, 11:21:39 PM
Where has everyone been?

Do any of you have updates on your healing?   ???   :)
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Max Pwr on March 04, 2007, 02:28:33 AM
Hi Mom,  I've just been eavesdropping so to speak.  No real change on this end, although I managed to break the hinges on my AFO again.  I was plugging away on the treadmill, I heard a snap and my foot got heavy.  I'm still waiting for surgery on the 21st so I don't expect too much until then, I had a dream last night that I woke up and had dorsi-flexion.  Of course it had to be a dream as when I woke I thought I would try it and no go.   The dragon showed up last night too, I thought he'd gone for awhile but he sure bit me hard.  All's good today. 

How about you, still researching the hell out of these things?  I still do occaisionally, but I think I've read everything I could and each study was the same.  "Good chance of recovery, no guarentees, no time limit"...  So I'm just praying it recovers to a point I don't have to wear the AFO any longer.  I think that's the goal of everyone.  I do want to run and get back to SWAT again, but it's going to be awhile, escpecially considering the surgery is going to put me back a few months again.

I think about you everyday and ask the He'll help you out.  There are lots of people with this affliction that lead long and very normal lives so it's not that tragic but it does consume every thought of everyday... "If only I could do this, or do that"  "Geez, I wish I could turn back time and start this over" etc... but alas, there are no time machines yet.   I hope this note finds you, and everyone else doing well and further hoping you are having a good weekend with no dragons.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on March 04, 2007, 02:57:12 AM
Thanks Max :)

We've been exhausted from so many doctors' appointments this past week.  We were a little miffed by how blase' the neurosurgeon was in regard to not answering any of our questions. 

The plastic surgeon was a bit more of a serious communicator.  He says my daughter's scar is "hypertrophic" and that we likely did not have to rush into any surgery to repair it.  He also, as I said before, recommended the Scar Gel treatment patch.  This guy even seemed a little perturbed by how blase' the neurosurgeon was about giving us follow up information.

It turns out that the gel filled scar treament patch is made right here in Upstate New York in Niagara Falls.  The plastic surgeon said that he is familiar with the company and that they are even currently doing a clinical trial on them.

So far the patch has in fact worked very well in softening up the scar.  We also do gentle scar massage daily.

Our new physical therapist has been working well also.   He has extensive experience treating peroneal nerve injuries.  He has been doing massage as well as ultrasound massage and acupressure.  And get this, the DRAGON came back two nights in a row after he did some of his treatment.  Maybe it's just a coincidence but it makes you almost want to believe that the guy "channeled some kind of energy."   :)  My daughter was fascinated the other day in the rehab room seeing so many people doing PT exercises and I told her "eveyone in here hurt part of their body and they are doing exercises to fix what they hurt."  We even met a nurse who also had to wear an AFO, she hurt her spine lifiting a patient.  She said she gets "the dragon" too! 

We are in the US so we have to deal with a lot of red tape with our health insurance.  We are trying to get approval so that we can get an EMS unit for home.  We call the electrodes "tickle stickers."  Our new PT noticed that while she is not dorsiflexing yet there is at least some contraction of the anterior tib muscles which means they did not totally atrophy.

We think of Max the Mountie all the time and hope and pray you are doing well and on your way to recovering.

To Andre, Jacky, Stasco, Hamish, Davey and the rest of the gang...  We hope you all are well too.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on March 04, 2007, 03:06:54 AM
HEY ALL,

sorry i have been away so long....i have been training for the pro -camps that are coming up next weekend from march 9th-11th.
i was actually going to drop out of the combine beause i was losing confidence and faith in myself ..that i would be able to keep up with healthy players. so my therapists decided to give me a pre test to see exactly where i am at. we did the test and not only did i do well i beat some of my pervious numbers and running faster then most of the guys in the combine. this lifted up my confidence immensly as i thought i was going to bomb the test. i have posted the pre test results and videos on the site and will be going all out for this testing even though i am only 5 months post-op. things have been pretty staggered with recovery and no real changes ...which kind of has me worried that i have hit the climax in recovery. maybe my mind is just very occupied with this test so i havent noticed..who knows rally but once it is over i think i will go back to rehab to try and make the foot stronger.hope everyone is alright and not feeling dicouraged about here recovery.if there are or have been no changes that you can notice it doesnt mean your recovery has stopped or taken a break.i will be on and off for his next week as i will be training for this event next weekend ..please wish me luck and i hope all of you the best.

Take care
Andre
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on March 04, 2007, 03:14:33 AM
hey mom444,

good to hear treatment is going well...does this mean she will not have to go under the knife again? i wish you and your family the best and healthy recovery ....and sorry i have been away so long.

Andre
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on March 04, 2007, 04:21:01 AM
Hey All,

We are hoping for more dragons or at least something to prove she is healing.

We will have another EMG in two months.

I forgot to mention that the new PT said that increasing blood flow to the leg will help with recovery.  Has anyone else heard this?

And Andre, if you are still having problems with scarring-- especially keloids-- look into the silicone scar patches or the gel patches.  They have done numerous clinical studies on them and they do seem to work, even on older scars. The plastic surgeon who we just had a consult with seems to believe in them.   Do a Google search...

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on March 04, 2007, 10:46:05 AM
I am sorry I have also not been around for a while but I have some very very good news I wish to share with you..............
Like most of you here, you research and will try anything to see if it makes any improvement.  The fact is my foot has never ceased to continue to improve, even if extremely slowly.  I have tried Reike (relaxing but not sure I beleive in it), horse riding (because horses are intuative and can be very good therapy), praying and of course all the conventional hard work of physio and hydrotherapy.  Well not sure what or which combination or whether it is just the time of mother nature, but I CAN DORSIFLEX AND HOLD.  Not fully up and the party trick is watch closely because you'll miss it and it gets tired very quickly and so doesn't always perform.  The stinging on the outside of my leg and the ache in my ankle can be quite intense but I don't care.  I now don't wear my splint in the house but still do outside and for work as I am still a trip hazard.  This has not happened over night either and has taken time to came back - I just wanted to make sure it was consistant before announcing.  Mom I am so glad there is tib ant contraction because tis was my first sign of recovery.  My foot has become stiff from hanging about for so long so need to really get that moving.  Bless you all and keep that recovery going.  Andre, you are awsome, beating the other guys, what an inspiration.  Max - you'll get back there, I never thought any different and have been given a conditional offer on an operational post - you'll do it.  Hamish - hope you are doing OK.

 :) : :D ;D
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on March 04, 2007, 05:33:48 PM
I am sorry I have also not been around for a while but I have some very very good news I wish to share with you..............
Like most of you here, you research and will try anything to see if it makes any improvement.  The fact is my foot has never ceased to continue to improve, even if extremely slowly.  I have tried Reike (relaxing but not sure I beleive in it), horse riding (because horses are intuative and can be very good therapy), praying and of course all the conventional hard work of physio and hydrotherapy.  Well not sure what or which combination or whether it is just the time of mother nature, but I CAN DORSIFLEX AND HOLD.  Not fully up and the party trick is watch closely because you'll miss it and it gets tired very quickly and so doesn't always perform.  The stinging on the outside of my leg and the ache in my ankle can be quite intense but I don't care.  I now don't wear my splint in the house but still do outside and for work as I am still a trip hazard.  This has not happened over night either and has taken time to came back - I just wanted to make sure it was consistant before announcing.  Mom I am so glad there is tib ant contraction because tis was my first sign of recovery.  My foot has become stiff from hanging about for so long so need to really get that moving.  Bless you all and keep that recovery going.  Andre, you are awsome, beating the other guys, what an inspiration.  Max - you'll get back there, I never thought any different and have been given a conditional offer on an operational post - you'll do it.  Hamish - hope you are doing OK.

 :) : :D ;D


Jacky,

Congrats on the dorsiflexion!   :) 

Just like you we too have been taking "alternative therapies" into account...  Who knows, they may work!  The PT we are seeing also has a Doctor or Naturopathy, which I guess is natural and spiritual healing...  After the first session with him my daughter got the dragon back promptly thereafter...  As I said, maybe he "channeled some energy."  Anything is possible. 

So you think it's a good sign that her tib anterior muscles are contracting?  Good!  There is so much contradictory information and we are still getting over the shock of the rehab medicine doctor who gave us the EMG saying that the recovery was not good! 

She does have SOME recovery and regeneration and that should be a good sign, right?

Keep up the good work and keep us posted on your progress.

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Max Pwr on March 05, 2007, 10:59:17 PM
Well congrats j_smi thats so great, isn't that the goal of everyone?  I think thats the biggest mountain, the holding it and walking AFO-less is soon to come with a little hard work.  I can't tell you how excited I am for you, I hope everyone posts the same header eventually.  Please let us know what goes on with the operational side of your work, as we're the same but different.  Keep up the great work and keep us posted, after all, the header of the whole  subject is "...recovery stories..." 
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on March 06, 2007, 11:47:57 AM
Hi Guys,

Well done Jackie, looks like you are top of the class. sorry I have not been on in a while but been having a really hard time after surgery 3 weeks ago. Had PT today and been told off. I have been over doing it and been on my feet far too much which has caused a lot of swelling and therefore movement and quad control has been inhibited. Infact at the moment my quad feels like someone has hit it with a hammer. Its RICE for me with a few basic exercises to try and move the swelling. No change for foot at the moment but the dragon is alive and kicking.

Good luck everyone.
Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on March 06, 2007, 02:35:23 PM
Hang in there everyone!

My daughter's dragon woke her up two nights ago, I hope that's a good sign.

We are dealing with red tape and runaround from differerent doctors and the insurance company again.

We are hoping to get that EMS unit as soon as possible.

Much good to say about the scar treatment patches.

Hamish, what is RICE?  Is it an abbreviation for a kind of therapy?

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on March 06, 2007, 02:41:12 PM
Hi Mom444

RICE Stands for Rest, Ice, Compression and Elevation.

Good luck with the doctors and insurance.

Hamish

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on March 07, 2007, 02:40:31 PM
After much posturing and bargaining with the insurance company and about three doctors and therapists, we finally got the okay to get the EMS unit for home.  But we have to buy it from the approved medical distributor store.  It costs $395 US dollars and we need to pay for half of it!  I have seen cheaper ones online but...  who knows?

We also may need to push the insurance company to approve more PT appointments, they will originally on give eight.

I haven't even thought about the school sponsored PT, but I'm afraid that they may give us an inexperienced PT who does not know how to deal with this kind of injury.  The new therapist we are seeing is more experienced.

Fun with insurance in the good ole US of A! 

But I can't complain really, my husband does have a really good insurance plan.

I hope you are all doing well.  And thanks for clearing up the RICE abbreviation Hamish, I tought that maybe you were sitting around with some chopsticks and a bowl of basmati!   ;)
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on March 08, 2007, 12:16:47 PM
Hello All,
I saw my GP on the 3rd January and she said she was going to refer me to a consultant neurologist as there was significant wasting in the operated leg.  I had not heard anything and so today contacted the surgery and it turns out that I have been referred to a consultant neurologist and also a seperate referral to a neurophysiologist - so anyone any ideas as to what is the difference and why seperate referrals for the same condition and also what to expect at either appointment?   

Had physio today and showed off lift and hold and walking without a splint.  She reckons 2 out of the 5 hamstring muscles are working but hey, you can't have it all...............  Hope you guys are Ok and any information on the above questions will be very much appreciated.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on March 08, 2007, 01:13:37 PM
Good luck with your consultations Jacky.  I hope you get some answers.

We are still trudging along here.  We finally got the EMS unit yesterday but can't figure out how to use the little bugger!  I'm not sure if the unit came with the correct type of electrodes...  My husband is taking her to PT tomorrow because I have to work, we will need to have our daughter's PT look at the EMS unit and explain how to use it.  I tried to figure it out and got too frustrated  >:(

No dragon for the past few nights, but I hope he returns.  I hope she does in fact get some more regeneration in the next months so that when we have her next EMG we can get some more encouraging news.

As for your questions, I don't have personal experience with either kind of doctor but if you type define: and a word into Google it will give you a list of definitions of a term.  I found:

 "Neurophysiology is a part of physiology as a science, which is concerned with the study of the nervous system. It is closely connected with psychology, neurology, clinical neurophysiology, electrophysiology, ethology, higher nervous activity and other sciences."
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neurophysiologist

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: G_Bronson on March 08, 2007, 01:54:38 PM
Hello everyone,
Sorry i havent wriiten a post in a while. I have been a bit down latley. however i got my ok to start really vigorously working my leg muscles at physio. Felt like i ran a marathon but after wards the dragon was with me for the entire evening. I also had a differnt reaction to the EMS. there were some contractions but it semed to be the wrong muscles. my foot was everting, should have been inverting. But we moved it around and the same thing was happening. i was getting no response before so i will take it as positive. Has anyone used ultra sound and gotten positive results? i was speaking with my PT yesterday but she was hesitant because i have screw right around the nerve damaged area.

Hamish,
thanks for the words of encouragement. our injurys are pretty similiar. Every one i have seen on here though with similar injurys has had there ACL repaired later on. I had everything done at once, LCL,ACL,Bicep femirous, the whole shot. It has me wondering why. Yes i do have the big brace, i am hoping this friday that i will get fitted for an ACL brace. It will be my two month post op check up. Keep working at it my friend and i wish you the best with it.

J_smi001
Congrats on the dosriflexion it must be so good to see it after all the hard work you've done. I hope you continue getting good results in your recovery.

Max
You said your are a moutie and that you broke a spring on your AFO while running. Did you get this AFo here in Canada? I can't even fit the AFO they gave me in any of my shoes, and it is uncomfortable. I mostly use a Dorsi-wedge for now. But i am begining to put weight on it so i have to start looking for a good one.  

Good Luck to Everyone else in your recoveries. Mom444 I wish you all the best!  

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on March 08, 2007, 03:43:04 PM
Hey G_Bronson

glad to see you back..alot of us have been off and on ..guess it has been a busy month. i regards to your inquiry about why the ACL was done at a later date oppose to being done all at once was for healing and stability purposes i was told. i was told that when done seperately it allows the posterio lateral side to heal correctly with less chance of laxity in the repair. same thing for the ACL. the only down side is going through the same process of rehab twice...right after your pretty much mobile and functional again. it can be a drag but some of the people i have talked to seem to breeze threw the second rehab (after the ACL is done).

Jacky congrats on your progression and the ability that you have regained. now that you can hold you have pretty much got clearance from your foot to start kicking its but with strengthening...good luck in rehab and i love the progress.

Hamish..how are you feeling....any better? what kinds of thing are you doing to keep the swelling out or pump the swelling out? also do you take anything for swelling? i was told to but didnt and instead reorted back to natural substances that have anti-inflammatory agents. i found this huge in recovery as i feel i helped keep swelling low for me..so possible it could do the same for someone else..but melons fruit and ginger have natural anit inflm agents in them so i would buy the fruit from the market and blend them up (not with ginger just fruit..the ginger i would use in cooking or tea) about three times a day with a regular meal.if you havent tried it maybe give it a try..who knows i was never really a fruit man ..but now its a regualr part of my deit so kinda glad it was introduced to me. Good luck with Everything.

Max Pwr...hows everything? i know im alittle behind but your dream of instant dorsiflexion is an awesome sign....your mind wants it back and doesnt want to cope. i hope things go well in surgery and i wish you plenty of Dragons..except for at night cause i know its hard as hell to sleep...lol..take care and good luck in Recov.

Momm444
 
hey Mom is it a muscle stim? have you tried it on her already? have they used a NEMS unit on her at your PT? if so did she feel anything and if so at what Frequency did she start to get tinglingy or actual contractions?..sory for al the questions just wondering because i to used this type of machine and others and got alot of kick from them which i think helped alot in keeping the muscles awake. dont get discouraged if she doesnt feel anything right away ...i was put on a machine at my clinic they turned it on max 100 and i felt nothing a usual contraction varing on the person is around 10ish...now im at 15 to 20..so if she doesnt feel anything right away dont worry it can still be working ..dont turn it up on max..i was just a bullet head and wanted to feel something...good luck with it and let me know how its working.


As for me Tomorrow i checking for the combine....Sat we got hit with a virus which has turned into bronchitis but is slowly going down...my events which i have been training for are on Sunday so im not to worried. I have to admit it feels great to be back..and the love and support from people i once played with and against is great as well....they keep asking me how it feels to be playing again but thats not what makes me feel good at all ..its being able to play again. or even run or walk proper this is truly a bonus that just has me pressure less to perform and loving what i am able to do again.
It ends sunday and there have been some things planned for after words...i will keep everything posted on my rehabilitation page...Take Care All
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on March 08, 2007, 03:44:56 PM
Hi Gordon,

How are you getting on with your flexion and extension? To be honest I am not sure why ACLr was done seperately but think they wanted to see how well I recovered from PLC reconstruction to see whether it was worth doing. The good thing from your point of view is that it is a straight road to recovery so all the work you do is now in the bank and there is no pit stops were you go back to square one.

The AFO I got also did not fit into my shoes but fortunately I had bought a pair of shoes that were too big that were hiding in the cupboard that I had never worn and the AFO fitted in them. They fit in my trainers if I remove the insole from it. Is your AFO like the one in the link below? The Dorsi-wedge is no good for walking and it may be that you will have to get a bigger pair of shoes to fit the AFO in and allow enough room for your foot.

http://www.rehabmart.com/product/252.htm

Keep your head up and keep working away.

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on March 08, 2007, 03:57:25 PM
Hey Andre,

The last week or so have been a nightmare and really knocked me back. I have been taking Ibuprophen anti inflamatories and pain killers. Today has been the first day when I have seen an improvement and feeling a lot more comfortable with the swelling starting to ease. I'm off to the shops to buy lots of melons, I do like melons so that is a good thing. Not sure what to do with ginger but will look into it.

Goodluck with the combine this weekend.

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on March 08, 2007, 11:27:49 PM
Hello Everyone,

Interesting posts!  DRAGONS AND MELONS!    :)

Well, we are still waiting for another visit from the dragon.  He was here two nights in a row on Feburary 27th and 28th and then he came back on March 4th.  He usually stops by at dinner or when she is sleeping.  We literally keep tabs on him on a calendar.  Whenever he comes back it makes me feel better because I know it's mostly a good sign. 

Hopefully tomorrow we can get some info as to the proper use of the EMS unit.

I ordered some some smaller silicone scar patches from the Biodermis company.  We will se how those work.  We are still currently using the mineral oil gel scar treatment patches and will have a follow up with the plastic surgeon next week.

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on March 09, 2007, 01:08:39 AM
Hey Mom44,

I just remembered something....to break up the scar tissue i had problems with they used an F.S.M machine. frequency specific microcurrent to break up the scar tissue. just  wanted to post it incase you were still searching for methods
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on March 09, 2007, 01:38:46 AM
i just damaged mine and my doc didnt give me much hope so i was wondering if someone out there can.

thanks
Andre

Blogging,

My very first post and i guess you can say "first step to recovery". when i think back to this time..i try to feel what i felt but can't ...i can only remember that i felt terrible and never thought that i could get this far.it is pretty impossible to retain past mind but when that mind state is a daily reaccurance and linked to the pain the anger and depression it stays for a long time ..so i find it relieving to finally be able to be free from the mental stress the injury had put on me. i also didnt believe i was gonna play again at this point either ...and it wasn't a goal of mine not even a thought.I am leaving tomorrow to go and be apart of something i have dreamed of doing my whole life and failure is even an issue or a pressure as i feel i have already suceeded and accomplished far more then making a team. Being Able........i am able again to participate,walk proper and perform  the activites i used to do regularly at my normal speed. i asked to questions in the thread Any peroneal nerve recovery stories? and is there any hope...and both of those questions ultimately were answered by me and could only be answered by me.. things i didnt realize at the time of injury. I leave Tomorrow morning so i wont be cak until Monday so Take Care all and i will Update you on the weekend..have a great weekend as well.

Andre
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Max Pwr on March 09, 2007, 01:55:38 AM
Wow Andre, you truly are an inspiration to us all.   I pray I'll have half the success you've had, I promise one thing, I'll never stop believing, and maybe even work my way back to SWAT, much like you are getting back to the field this weekend.  I wish you the best of luck and I'll be thinking of you lots.  Maybe you can play for my beloved Riders... if that happens I'll consider it a sign! 

G Bronson - Ya, I'm a mountie here in Canada, and I had my AFO made at a place called cascade.  It remains uncomfortable, even after six months of wearing it.   I've spoken to people that have been wearing them for over a decade and they say that they get easier to wear but so far this one isn't as confortable as I'd like.  As for fitting in the shoes, thats a tough one too but I have a couple of pair of shoes that it fits into OK; but it seems to push my toes into the toe of the shoe which drives me crazy with pain sometimes.  I try to do everything while wearing it, including jogging and my orthotist says I'm too hard on it and I shouldn't do half the stuff I try, but I'm not going to quit living because a piece of plastic won't let me.  It does improve my gait extensively and I walk quite normal when I walk.

Everyone else, I hope you have a great weekend, and let's send Andre some positive energy with our thoughts, its awesome he still visits here even though he's not in tough any more; most would abandon the blogs as healing seems to be almost complete.  Again Andre, give it all you got and we look forward to hearing how things went.     
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on March 09, 2007, 09:01:17 PM
Yes, we will all continue to support and inspire each other.  You have all been an inspiration to me and my daughter, even though she may be too young to say so herself.

Keep up with prayer and positive energy.  I truly believe both of those help.

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on March 10, 2007, 08:36:50 AM
Best of luck this weekend Andre.  It looks like we have continued along very similiar paths throughout this and both continue to make towards recovery and our own personal goals, yours is to reurn to the field and mine is to return to the field (but that is a colloquial term for getting back to being a fully fit and operational British bobby.)  We all have the same result but from very different incidents.  Some also have other complication like needing further surgery for their ACL repair, or scar tissue breakdown or other nerves involved (like the sciatic) as well as the peroneal nerve.

G Bronson - You state that you have been low recently and I just wanted to say that, that is fine and expected and a totally normal reaction.  I think we have all shown times, when posting, when it all seems to be such a long road and no one really knows where the road leads to.  I do know that I have never met such a positive and spirited group of people as the foot drop club.  It seems to be a character trait, and not just here but eslewhere in rehab - we are all members of a very exclusive club.  I have absolutely no doubt that we will all have peroneal nerve recoveries, accepted it will be to different degrees and it is the ability to adapt that is the important thing. 

There are three differnet types of nerve damage, one that heals within days to weeks, one that heals within weeks to months and one that can heal but not always  and is the the most serious type.  That is as about as factual as you will get for nerve damage as it really is a finger in the air and no one will commit themselves (in my experience).

I am so grateful to have dorsiflexion back in the foot and as Andre says, I now have permission from my foot to kick butt and get it strengthened up.  I am seeing the neurologist(s) to see why I still have weakness and sparodic contraction in the hamstring and associated muscle and we need to rule out that it is not associated with the aneasthetic, particularly important before the next operation on the other leg. 

Now I don't know how to put out the fire from the dragons breath, everytime I really work the foot as I get what can only be described as nettle stings under the skin along the length of the peroneal nerve.  A slice of cold melon slapped on the leg could well work!

Any way you guys take care and it is OK to feel sad or low sometimes - if we are honest we have all been there, and in Mom's case vacariously for her little girl.  It is important that we pick ourselves up and keep heading for our own personal goals.

God Bless all.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on March 11, 2007, 12:18:26 AM
Thanks for the inspiration Jacky.  And thank the rest of your too:  Andre, Gordon, Hamish, Stabso, Max the Mountie, etc. 

I definitely do have times when I get worried sick about my little girl.  I frantically count the last days since the presence of the dragon, the number of months since her sugery, worry about how she had the damage for over a year and how it went unnoticed or misdiagnosed, worry about her muscles being slightly atrophied in her left leg, I drive myself crazy.

But I try to keep thinking about the positive:

--We now have the EMS unit for home and we had the PT show us how to use it.  We do the "tickle stickers" three times a day.
--Even though the rehab doctor seemed negative, there WERE SIGNS OF IMPROVEMENT in her last EMG report.
--The PT says that her anterior tib muscles do show signs of contracting when the "tickle stickers" are on.
--We have been having luck with the scar treatment patches, they seem to be softenign up the scar.
--We do "leg massages" daily.
--Her lesion was "incomplete" and there were "still motor units" being detected from the peroneal innervated muscles.
--There are studies out there of people recovering after having surgery over a year past the injury.
--My daugther is young and hopefully the young can recover.

Thank you again all for your prayers.  We still pray for all of you. 

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on March 12, 2007, 01:18:35 AM
Hey All

Im Back and man was it a good weekend to get away and be apart of something so fun and to get back to doing something i love to do so much. the Combine went well we went through a series of tests from physicals to ability to iq tests. to start off the day i had my physical done...lol and let me tell you...the Doctor checking me out couldnt believe what he was reading and that i was testing only 5 months post-op. he did every test and i passed but still did not trust the fact that i was so early and had so much damage. i argued and finally got my way. this went on to look better for me in the eyes of scouts. after the physical test we ran through a series of ability tests which i didnt do amazing in but i didnt do the worst either ..i guess i was right in the middle pretty much or just off the leader. My purpose there was not to test the best but to show teams that i am able again and back on the market. this was done and   
i think what impressed them the most was my motivation ,desire and long hard work...to get back into playing shape. This weekend has given me more confidence to keep going towards the rest of the dream and become a complete player as this struggle will and only can make me stronger.
Thanks for all the support for this weekend i really needed it and it means alot.
Andre
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on March 12, 2007, 08:03:34 AM
Hey Andre,

I am so happy for you it must be great to be running around again. 5 months post op to be able to do what you are doing is so awesome. What is the next step from the combine?

Good luck!
Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on March 13, 2007, 09:55:35 PM
Hey All,

Just checking in.  Still going crazy here!  I am trying to stay calm and maybe to not even obsess over peroneal nerves for a while.

I was researching again and I found some articles about peroneal nerve injuries that were coauthored by a doctor in our city.  I called and tried to get an appointment with him but they "do not deal with children."

That's a great part of our problem, this injury very rarely happens with children so that is why all of the pediatric specialists we've seen have no clue how to handle this.  If were were dealing with someone who works with adults and atheletes, they'd probably know...

Anyways, I was frantically researching again...  Googling "peroneal" and clicked Google news and look what I found.  A fabulous article about our very own Andre and his recovery and his getting back into sports!   :D

Andre, this totally lit up my afternoon and I hope it's okay for me to post this.

http://www.mississauganews.com/mi/sports/story/3907367p-4519109c.html

You are still an inspiration to us all! 
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Max Pwr on March 13, 2007, 10:44:20 PM
Hey Mom, thanks so much for posting that, just when I was having a 'down day' there's some hope in sight yet.  I'm still suffering myself, nine months after surgery and I still can't pull up my toe whatsoever.  When I can't find inspiration I try to tell myself 'don't look for inspiration; be inspirational'  but that's hard sometimes too.  Reading about Andre and what he's been through brings hope to us all.  I hope that one day we'll get back to walking without this damn brace, perhaps running and catching bad guys too, maybe even SWAT. 

It never hurts to be curious and research as much as you can, but every article seems to blend into the other.  The one underlying theme in the peroneal injuries...time.  Unfortunately none of us have the patience for this.  It would be a lot easier if someone were to say "You'll be just fine, give it 12 months".  I could be patient and perhaps life would be more enjoyable but no one has said this, no one wants to say this and although I hope for the best, I concentrate on the worst.  When we wait and worry and there's no change day after day and week after week and month after month despair takes over.  It's through support groups like this, reading articles like the one you've posted, and the power of believing in myself that I get up every moring and hit the gym everyday, eventhough I still get wierd looks at people staring at my brace.  I believe I'm going to get better , I believe I'm going to get back to SWAT, I believe your little girl is going to walk without her brace too.  We need to be patient and we need to get up everyday and deal with the present all the while believing we're going to be OK in the future.

Hope this note finds everyone well and I think it's obvious Andre did awesome.  I pray I'm going to be cheering for him in the stands one day.  Maybe, in a year or two, we can all get together at one of his games and toast him.  Bring your braces and we'll have a cerimonial brace burning!  Then we'll all walk away...normally.

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on March 13, 2007, 11:09:23 PM
Hi Guys,

Thats an awesome article on Andre thanks for finding it for us Mom444. I've always wanted to go to Canada so I'm up for a trip to see Andre play and have the ceremonial brace burning.

Hope everyone is doing well.

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on March 14, 2007, 02:57:55 AM
Hey Mom, thanks so much for posting that, just when I was having a 'down day' there's some hope in sight yet.  I'm still suffering myself, nine months after surgery and I still can't pull up my toe whatsoever.  When I can't find inspiration I try to tell myself 'don't look for inspiration; be inspirational'  but that's hard sometimes too.  Reading about Andre and what he's been through brings hope to us all.  I hope that one day we'll get back to walking without this damn brace, perhaps running and catching bad guys too, maybe even SWAT. 

It never hurts to be curious and research as much as you can, but every article seems to blend into the other.  The one underlying theme in the peroneal injuries...time.  Unfortunately none of us have the patience for this.  It would be a lot easier if someone were to say "You'll be just fine, give it 12 months".  I could be patient and perhaps life would be more enjoyable but no one has said this, no one wants to say this and although I hope for the best, I concentrate on the worst.  When we wait and worry and there's no change day after day and week after week and month after month despair takes over.  It's through support groups like this, reading articles like the one you've posted, and the power of believing in myself that I get up every moring and hit the gym everyday, eventhough I still get wierd looks at people staring at my brace.  I believe I'm going to get better , I believe I'm going to get back to SWAT, I believe your little girl is going to walk without her brace too.  We need to be patient and we need to get up everyday and deal with the present all the while believing we're going to be OK in the future.

Hope this note finds everyone well and I think it's obvious Andre did awesome.  I pray I'm going to be cheering for him in the stands one day.  Maybe, in a year or two, we can all get together at one of his games and toast him.  Bring your braces and we'll have a cerimonial brace burning!  Then we'll all walk away...normally.



Wow Max Very well written as it evokes so many memories and emotions of what i have went through and probably what we all have been going through. It is amazing how our mind states are just as similar as our injuries. you are definately in the right state of mind in wanting and believing you will get better..but what about feeling? do you feel that you will get better?....i dealt with this in my head for so long...i would try and figure out why i felt certain ways and why people say Dragons are good. Not sure if this is fact but it seemed as if the Dragons were the nerves trying to sense the outter stimuli going on whether it was the wind against my leg or a touch..it just seemed like the nerves were trying to regain it senses. i told myself this and not only did i have something to believe but everytime i felt it..it would give me a feeling of reassurance and a feeling of healing. And thank you for the ind words and support and man if you all came to a game ...that would make my year......and hopefully oneday it could happen. That would be great to meet all of you and we could discuss or experience while we ditch or braces.....i still have mine for some reason i cant throw it away..almost as if i keep telling myself i may need it again''knock on wood''.

Hey Mom444 i dont mind at all that you posted the link. also i have a question for you Mom444...can you influence Dragons? when you touch her in cetain areas or rub her leg does she get any sort of dragons? just ...this was another thing we did to retrain sensation and promote regeneration was to get the nerve something to feed off of i guess you can say...hope everyone is well ... Hamish how are things hope ecovery is looking more postive from the last time we spoke.

Take Care all
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on March 14, 2007, 01:32:47 PM
Hey Mom, thanks so much for posting that, just when I was having a 'down day' there's some hope in sight yet.  I'm still suffering myself, nine months after surgery and I still can't pull up my toe whatsoever.  When I can't find inspiration I try to tell myself 'don't look for inspiration; be inspirational'  but that's hard sometimes too.  Reading about Andre and what he's been through brings hope to us all.  I hope that one day we'll get back to walking without this damn brace, perhaps running and catching bad guys too, maybe even SWAT. 

It never hurts to be curious and research as much as you can, but every article seems to blend into the other.  The one underlying theme in the peroneal injuries...time.  Unfortunately none of us have the patience for this.  It would be a lot easier if someone were to say "You'll be just fine, give it 12 months".  I could be patient and perhaps life would be more enjoyable but no one has said this, no one wants to say this and although I hope for the best, I concentrate on the worst.  When we wait and worry and there's no change day after day and week after week and month after month despair takes over.  It's through support groups like this, reading articles like the one you've posted, and the power of believing in myself that I get up every moring and hit the gym everyday, eventhough I still get wierd looks at people staring at my brace.  I believe I'm going to get better , I believe I'm going to get back to SWAT, I believe your little girl is going to walk without her brace too.  We need to be patient and we need to get up everyday and deal with the present all the while believing we're going to be OK in the future.

Hope this note finds everyone well and I think it's obvious Andre did awesome.  I pray I'm going to be cheering for him in the stands one day.  Maybe, in a year or two, we can all get together at one of his games and toast him.  Bring your braces and we'll have a cerimonial brace burning!  Then we'll all walk away...normally.



Wow Max Very well written as it evokes so many memories and emotions of what i have went through and probably what we all have been going through. It is amazing how our mind states are just as similar as our injuries. you are definately in the right state of mind in wanting and believing you will get better..but what about feeling? do you feel that you will get better?....i dealt with this in my head for so long...i would try and figure out why i felt certain ways and why people say Dragons are good. Not sure if this is fact but it seemed as if the Dragons were the nerves trying to sense the outter stimuli going on whether it was the wind against my leg or a touch..it just seemed like the nerves were trying to regain it senses. i told myself this and not only did i have something to believe but everytime i felt it..it would give me a feeling of reassurance and a feeling of healing. And thank you for the ind words and support and man if you all came to a game ...that would make my year......and hopefully oneday it could happen. That would be great to meet all of you and we could discuss or experience while we ditch or braces.....i still have mine for some reason i cant throw it away..almost as if i keep telling myself i may need it again''knock on wood''.

Hey Mom444 i dont mind at all that you posted the link. also i have a question for you Mom444...can you influence Dragons? when you touch her in cetain areas or rub her leg does she get any sort of dragons? just ...this was another thing we did to retrain sensation and promote regeneration was to get the nerve something to feed off of i guess you can say...hope everyone is well ... Hamish how are things hope ecovery is looking more postive from the last time we spoke.

Take Care all



Thanks Andre, Max, Hamish and everyone!

First of all Andre I just have to mention how very lucky you are to have been given the opportunity to work with such wonderful and experienced therapists and rehabilitation specialists.  You truly are blessed to have found such help! 

Thank you also for all of your expertise and knowlege in this area.  What you have been through not only helps you but helps so many others who are rehabbing also.   :D

In regard to influencing her dragons, it's a little hard to tell because she is so young and can't always explain exactly what she feels.  However if you say this works I will definitely start trying to "wake up the dragons" by rubbing her leg.  We do give her massages just about every day, as directed by the PT, and sometimes after a while she says, "Stop rubbing my leg now."  This might mean that maybe she gets some discomfort?  Again, it's so hard for us because she's so young and can't explain everything.

Also Andre, I just wanted to ask you about this quote from the news article,


"Durie attended rehab five times a week, undergoing sessions as long as four hours. Eleven months after the injury the nerve damage persisted. He limped badly. Unable to control his left foot, it flopped when he walked.

Then early last September he felt a twitch in his toe. A few days later he could flex his foot. Shortly after that, for the first time in a year, he could feel hot and cold. "


Forgive me if you already explained this in a previous post and I missed it (my mind is so boggled lately!!!) but from what the article is saying you were injured in September of 2005 and then almost exactly a year later you still had nerve damage...  But then literally about a month or so later you regained functiion and sensation and that it started as a "twitch in your toe?"

I'm just obsessing over the time frames again, which I know I shouldn't because everyone's different, but it does help to know that you too were given "threats" about time frames by doctors and rehab people and still got better after their time frames.

Also, in regard to time frames the most recent articles I found coauthored by a doctor from our city mentioned that many peopl in the study had peroneal nerve palsies (brought on by knee surgery and many other problems) and that time frames for recovery were anywhere from a few weeks to over four years!  The article even mentioned studies done where people had NO SURGERY and eventually recovered, sometimes many years later.

IT IS ALL SO CONFUSING...  But I just want to thank all of you on this board and tell you how much of an inspiration you've been with so much...  I really get sad and anxious and I cry a lot from time to time worrying about my little girl and you have all in many ways helped me to stay sane and stay positive.

And I'm not too far away from Andre being here in Upstate New York!  Andre, if you ever play a game in Upstate maybe we can come and see you...  Bring Max, Hamish, Jacky and everyone and maybe we'll all go to Niagara Falls...   ;D

Bless everyone and keep up the positive energy.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on March 14, 2007, 01:59:12 PM
Hi Guys,

Max. I have to agree with Andre, the post you put up hit so many nails on the head and really sums up the emotions we go through. I have been pretty low lately as my progress after my ACL op has not gone smoothly and I have not been able to go to the gym. Although I still have a fair bit of swelling and still on one crutch PT has given me the go ahead to start going and doing some easy stuff. So I am a little happier now that I can get out of the house. The other good news is that it looks like the Scottish Rugby Union are going to give me some financial help. The timing of the injury couldn't have been worse as I had started a new job just 4 days prior to the injury and lost the job as a result.

Gordon how are you getting on? Are you in the ACL brace now? It makes life a lot easier once you are out of the restriction of the full straight brace and your mobility will improve quickly. You will be able to step up the rehab once you are in a hinged brace and the recovery will start to speed up. Hang in there and be positive.

Thinkng of you all.

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: G_Bronson on March 14, 2007, 02:48:19 PM
Hello everyone,
I have really enjoyed the last few posts. Good show Andre it must feel so good to get back doing the thing you love the most. I am so happy for you. My sister lives in Barrie and is trying to talk me into going up with her just for a change of scenery, so if i get there during the football season i will have to go cheer you on at a York game. although by then i do hope to be back in Edmonton.  I keep thinking how good it will feel to run again. I just hope its a possibility.

Hamish,
I am doing progressively better since physio started to get intense. sessions are two hours long and then i will do some more things at home. I notice the muscles coming back in my legs, so that a start. That was the same AFO i have. I still have a full leg hinged brace that prevents hyperextension. I have decent mobility with it. it locks so you cannot staighten your leg passed a certain degree setting. When i left the hospital it was set at thirty, and my last appointment it was set at 10 degrees. I have to see my Surgeon on friday where i am hoping to get fitted for that smaller ACL brace. Hang in there bud, with your recovery. My old rugby coach was from scotland. So i know you must be a tough guy to play that sport over there where it is so big. 

Sorry i have not been posting more you guys. Like you all do I am sure i have quite alot on my mind. I was two months of work away from getting my cerification and pinky ring when i got hurt and just got a great promotion. I never thought somthing like this would happen on my Christmas vacation. I will get it all once i get back on my feet i guess. I just hope the doctor doesnt crush my spirit like the last post op trip a month ago. I have been doing pretty well as of late though.
I like what you said Andre "do you feel you'll get better". You'd be surprised how much a positive outllook can affect your recovery. I truly feel i will heal with time. although i know it will not be easy.

Hope you all are keeping your chin and your spirits up. I am hopeing for you all to pull through this.

Regards
Gordon

 
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on March 14, 2007, 08:04:51 PM
Great posts everyone and a pleasure to read.  The thought of meeting up and burning those splints sounds wonderful.  I have always wanted to go to Canada as my Grandfather (my mother's father) was from Toronto and emmigrated to the UK just before the war.  I remember he had cauliflower ears because of frost bite.  he died when I was 7 but would love to go to Canada and watch Andre playing - altough someone will have to explain it all to me!

Well I managed half a day at work in normal shoes walking about with NO splint - how pleased am I.  I am desperately practising the heel toe walk movement although it is still nearer the heel slap than the heel toe but we will get there.  Once you get that twitch you believe you are invincable, you know it will just get better and go from strength to strength (well I do).  I am amazed at the speed of recovery for Andre after that initial twitch.  I have got quite a bit of feeling back but there is still a large area over the outside of the knee and down the side of the leg that is still numb but that could just be surface nerves from the operation, perhaps?  Still I can lift my big toe also on command, now and foot flexion and hol becomes more convincing every day.  Of course you will all understand the significance and the enormity of this improvement so when I went to work and was asked by a colleague if I could assist them on a job, I leapt at the chance, only to have my enthusiasm cutailed by the occupational health nurse who still will not permit any conflict and potential confrontational situations......urhhhgggg  still more patience required.  Also a major break through i have taken and passed my response vehicle authorisation - so although I still can't yet break free of the office once I do I will be permitted to drive to respond to emergency calls. I am not sure how you all feel about me sharing my weekly acheivements but for me I am at the most significant and exciting time of my recovery and writing about it helps me to keep my feet on the ground (excuse the pun!), although I am not so sure I would have appreciated hearing about all that perhaps 6 months ago. 

Bless you good all of you.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: G_Bronson on March 14, 2007, 08:12:51 PM
Thats great news Jackie,
I can imagine how good you must feel that you can lift your toe on comand. I am happy for you.
Keep up the hard work. Reading posts like that gives us all hope that recovery is possible.

All the Best
Gordon
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on March 14, 2007, 09:05:30 PM
Jackie,

I am soooooooo jealous...i have been dying to get the big toe moving for months now.that is awesome you are doing amazing ...its great to hear your progression and we all love hearing about it....cause not only does it give us hope as well but it brings a smile to my face just knowing that you are happy in your recovery...and that s the feeling you need in order to keep progressing. and i agree with the invincablitiy part...i  feel that this experience has made me mentally invincable and my approach to life has changed...so for that i am thankful...too bad it had to come with so much sleepless nights and pain...lol. but again ...glad to hear things are going well and you all have given me new motivation to get back into the game with all the talk of coming to watch. now i have to get back and play because that would literally be a dream come true hopefully it can happen.Take Care all
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on March 15, 2007, 01:03:32 PM
Congratulations everyone on your progress so far!   :D

Last night my daughter woke up crying (I get so excited when that happens!).  She didn't come right out and say that her leg hurt at the time...  My husband slept in her bed with her to comfort her.  In the morning I asked her why she was crying, careful not to push her into any answer...  I asked if it was the dragon and she said yes.

However...  Get this...  When I asked her where the dragon was biting her, instead of pointing toward her knee, she pointed to the spot down lower on her leg, on the lower shin...  Could this mean something?  Again, she's three and she may be just babbling.

Jacky and Andre, did either of you notice the dragon moving further down your legs as you were recovering?  Did the pain progress to other areas?
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on March 15, 2007, 07:23:58 PM
Thank you all for your kind words.  Andre best you get back to playing - we are all looking forward to our Canadian holiday!  Best you put your best foot forward and make it happen. 

Mom - It is fair to say that the recovery for me was not a straight down the leg affair.  I seem to have had recovery from the toe upwards and the knee downwards.  I still have numbness at the back of my thigh and at the top and to the side of my knee.  If I think back I remember that it was my toes that ached first and I had quite painful feeling at the end of my big toe but then that disappeared for a while.  It has been throbbing again but with me moving it all the time (because I can!).  I can only speak from my experience but I think my nerve has regenerated from both directions, but that is a gut feeling based on no medical diagnoses.  Even now I have stinging along the route of the nerve, more so at the ankle and lower shin.  Hope this helps.  My four toes all started to twitch then move long before my big toe put in an appearance.  I am sure all the senstions your daughter is feeling is all for the good.  I was also told that the sensations I was feeling was not necessarily nerve regeneration and seeing as it is almost twelve months give a couple of weeks then I suppose that is probably right.  I feel I have to stress that this has not been an overnight success and recovery story and has been a very gradual return.  First it was an involuntary movement then a movement that I could make happen but not always (and never when the physio was looking on!) then I could make it happen alot but it would get tired and just decide not to do it any more to now where I can do the movement almost unconsciously, however, I still cannot fully dorsiflex my foot but it is enough to walk without a splint, until it gets tired, that is when I have to put the splint back on to save me from a fall.  My leg aches and stings quite a bit and tells me when I have done enough.  This is a very long road and teaches patience.  Andre says he is thankful for the menatlly invincability, I am thankful for foot drop teaching me patience and tolerance and most importantly has made me slow down and take stock - something I would not have done without this happening and would probably just burnt myself out.  Sorry very long post..................  Looking forward to the weekend! 
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on March 16, 2007, 02:30:50 PM
Hey Mom444,

In response to your Dragons question....they ran down my leg...it would start from the injured area just behind my knee and breathe fire down my leg. Pain pain generally stayed in the same pathway of the Dragons it never really detoured to another part of the leg..but the Draons felt very fatiguing once they had settled down. Are you noticing changes in her Dragons? hope everything is well..Take Care


Andre
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on March 16, 2007, 04:51:55 PM
Hey Mom444,

In response to your Dragons question....they ran down my leg...it would start from the injured area just behind my knee and breathe fire down my leg. Pain pain generally stayed in the same pathway of the Dragons it never really detoured to another part of the leg..but the Draons felt very fatiguing once they had settled down. Are you noticing changes in her Dragons? hope everything is well..Take Care


Andre



Thanks Andre. 

Another thing about her dragons is that they seem to come at literally almost TWO WEEK INTERVALS.  They started at the end of January where she would feel the pain for one night and then not feel it at all again for two weeks.  Two weeks later she'd feel them again...  Then nothing.   Then two weeks later, again.  I may have already asked you this but you did say your dragons would sometimes come and go too?

Also, on a different note, my research persistence has paid off!  Remember how I said I found an article about peroneal nerve injuries and how it was coauthored by a doctor from my own city?  I had called his office earlier in the week to ask about maybe having a consult iwth him but his secretary said he does not treat children?

Well, the doctor himself called me personally today!  That was so nice of him.  We talked for almost 20 minutes.  He also of course was not able to give me any definite answers but he was very friendly.  He told me that his secretary gave him the message and  he felt that I deserved a response.  He also said that from time to time people would find articles that he coauthored and would come from other parts of the country to see him, so sometimes I guess it's okay to look up someone's research and to go ahead and contact them directly.

The doctor is an orthopedic surgeon who specializes in knee surgery yet he is not a "nerve expert." He did say that he had done probably about 11 peroneal nerve decompressions and that he often saw people recover "quickly."  Yet he stressed that sometimes those nerves were simply compressed rather than damaged or injured. 

I kept trying to ask him if it was true about not being able to put a set in stone time frame on nerve recovery and he more or less did agree.  I told him that the article he coauthored said in its abstract, "At a mean of thrity six months (range, twelve to seventy - two months) postoperatively, thirty (97 per cent) of the thirty-one patients reported subjectiv eand functinal improvement and were able to discontinue the use of th4e ankle-foot orthosis." 

Note:  PM me if you want the citation to the article, I don't want to post it here for privacy's sake and to avoid putitng the authors "on the spot."

He did coauthor the article with at least five other doctors so his input may not have applied to the entire theory.

So, it made me feel a little better to know that this doctor cared enough to call.  I also stressed how pediatric specialists do not as often see this type of injury.  I thanked him and he wished me well.

Now...  We just have to wait.

But we are all different.  The EMG did show SOME improvement and that there was a

"response from the peroneal nerve above and below the fibular head."

Do any of you maybe know what this could mean?  Does that mean the nerve has healed through the fibular head and now we are just waiting for it to reinnervate the anterior tib muscles? 

Jacky and Andre, did you remember hearing about your nerve getting "a response above and below the fibular head?"

Thanks for your help and good luck to all.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on March 17, 2007, 03:10:06 AM
Hey Mom444

For me both of my EMG tests can back with no response one at 4 months and 9 months i believe. so the fact the you got a response is very good in relation to my experience and recovery. also i have no idea what the reading means...it sounds like there is communication going on and the signal may still be to weak to power a muscle. i was told that the EMG can pick up nerve regeneration before your muscles do..even if there seems to be no sign of it communicating....thats why at my 9 month check up i was told i would probably never get my functions back due to the lack of response in the given time frame. i was also told (by the Doctor doing the tests) that once the nerves start to regenerate they usually continue so any bit of response from the nerve is good. And What a great guy the Doctor is to take time a discuss your questions. you did the right thing by soaking up as much information as possible out of him ....you are very inspiring and the way in which you hanlde and have been handling this unfortunate situation has been amazing. you are great and i wish you the and your family the best. have a good weekend.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on March 17, 2007, 09:26:01 PM
Hey Mom444

For me both of my EMG tests can back with no response one at 4 months and 9 months i believe. so the fact the you got a response is very good in relation to my experience and recovery. also i have no idea what the reading means...it sounds like there is communication going on and the signal may still be to weak to power a muscle. i was told that the EMG can pick up nerve regeneration before your muscles do..even if there seems to be no sign of it communicating....thats why at my 9 month check up i was told i would probably never get my functions back due to the lack of response in the given time frame. i was also told (by the Doctor doing the tests) that once the nerves start to regenerate they usually continue so any bit of response from the nerve is good. And What a great guy the Doctor is to take time a discuss your questions. you did the right thing by soaking up as much information as possible out of him ....you are very inspiring and the way in which you hanlde and have been handling this unfortunate situation has been amazing. you are great and i wish you the and your family the best. have a good weekend.

Thanks Andre,

Her PT says he does notice her peroneal innervated muscles contracting (I am assuming or hoping he means anterior tib) when he is doing the electrical muscle stimulation on her, so I hope that's good.  I also asked him if the fact that there is a "response below and above the fibular head" could mean that the nerve has in fact healed throught the fibular area and that we are now simply just going to have to wait for the nerves to innervate the muscles.  He thinks that may be the case. 

And Andre and Jacky you guys are still an inspiration to us! 

It's good to know that you are proof that everyone is different and that everyone heals differently.  Time frames are relative.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on March 19, 2007, 05:25:40 PM
Well just found out that the operation on my left leg, due in March but delayed due to lack of funds (I have been sent out of area and so the health authority where I live have to pay the health authority where the hospital is), is now delayed due to a serious backlog and April is now out and May is not looking too hot either.  I know I should be totally overjoyed at having some dorsiflexion back in my foot, and I am, but feel I am on totla hold until I get the other leg sorted and out of the way so that all rehab is towards full fitness and back to my proper job.  Whinge over.  Hope you are all OK and keep willing that foot.  try this, (with your good foot, obviously)  rotate your foot anti-clockwise, continue to do that then draw the figure eight eight with your finger in the air, the bigger the better, umm what's happened to your foot?
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on March 20, 2007, 12:07:05 AM
Hey Everyone,

Today marks the first offical day that i am done Rehab. i honestly felt abandon when i was given the news from my therapy staff. ive been doing this for so long that it had become routine ...and now its all over....just seems strange but good at the same time. They feel that the only thing really left to do is Strengthening of the body and foot and of course training for Football with specific drills and such. I still cannot believe that i have made it this far in recovery and planning on returning to active sport when a plan like this a year and a half ago seemed impossible to reach. I know i have said this a million times but it definately needs to be said again and that is thank you to the people at kneeguru.co.uk for making this site available and thank you to everyone in this thread and on this site for helping one another through hard times.....i feel that i have had a very healthy recovery (in regards to my mind state) because i could ask questions and relate and get feedback which was the best part gaining information that a doctor may have been restricted to give for whatever reason. this week is my last week of strength workouts and then it is on to getting prepared for the feild again. Dont get me wrong though Playing football is not the best part of this ....the best part is what i have done to play football again and that has given me more confidence and trust in myself then i have ever had before and in a way i am thankful for this to have happend to me. Although with saying that i knock on wood that it never happens again...lol.

Take care all and healthy speedy recoveries to all

Amdre
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Max Pwr on March 20, 2007, 04:14:37 AM
Hey Fellow Floppers,

Well I'm getting a bit nervous too, my surgery isn't getting put off (Like urs jackie) and I go back under the knife, for the third time on Wednesday.  Blah, I'm not looking forward to it; you know, the part when you're laying on the table, just before they put you under and you're talking to the doctors wondering if this is the last thing you'll ever see on earth.  I'm more afraid that when I wake they are going to tell me that there's nothing they can do and I'll have to live with the foot drop forever.  I wanna be like Andre and Jackie, telling everyone that I can dorsi-flex and run and do those things that I love to do the most, that means running and catching the bad guy.  Other than a decrease in nerve pain (dragon) I haven't seen any sign of progression in nine months.  I was hoping that at least Id be abe to wiggle something by now.  The doctor, the head of neurosurgery in Calgary, says that he's going to open me up and do various conductivity tests.  There's one of three outcomes (1) open me up, see everythings healing the way it should, then close me up (2) Open me up, clean all the scar tissue that's compacting the nerve and close me up or (3) open me up and if there's no improvement or no signs of regeneration he's going to try a nerve graft, which is a total last resort as there's only about a 1 in 3 chance of it working.  I'm hoping it doesn't come down to that as I want to believe that it will come back on it's own in another 9 months but who knows?  The rush to have the surgery is this; if I need a nerve graft you have to have it within one year of the injury or there's no chance of revival and no doctors will do it.  Therefore, I was faced with a decision; waiting and seeing with no surgery and if at the end of three years there's no movement I'm out of luck, there's nothing anyone can do.  Then wishing I would have had the surgery.  On the other hand, if I have the surgery now I maybe able to have a nerve graft to save the dorsi-flexion.  A real tough decision for me, as you have all been in my shoes you understand. 
Regardless, I think of you guys often and look to you that are recovering as a real inspiration and I draw hope from you. 

I made a myspace page so if you wanted to have a look at me you can, find it here:    http://www.myspace.com/max_pwr

If you get a chance send some good karma my way, I just want to wake up and the Doctor tell me everything's going to be OK; much like we all hope for with every EMG and every other doctor visit.

-Max- (aka Bob)

 
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: G_Bronson on March 20, 2007, 04:49:13 AM
Hey Max,
i can totally understand how difficult a desicion that must be regarding the nerve graft. They told me the same thing. After my five month emg if there was still nothing then they may try a nerve graft. right now my odds are 50/50 and like you said nerve gafts are 1 in 3. but hopefully you will wake up and they will tell you some good news and that no graft was needed. i am not as far into this as the rest of you guys are so i cannot know how you are feeling after that much time has past.  The human body is really good at healing itselfand you have been healing for 9 months so just think posistive. I hope your surgery goes well Bob, i will pray for you. (I am assuming you are a flames fan) The playoffs will be starting soon my friend so that will make time go a bit faster for you. Maybe the flames will go far and help lift your spirits out there in Alberta. My neurologist told me they have seen numerous people get dorsiflexion back after a year, so don't give up hope. I know personally how tough it must be to be a cop in Alberta so i'm sure your not going to give up.

Best of luck my friend
Gordon 
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on March 20, 2007, 02:38:38 PM
hey Max,

I Can relate with your want and hopes for recovery as we al have been in similar stages in our recovery and i want to help as much as i can whether it is from giving hope to another or ideas and types of theraputic methods i have gone through to assist in the regeneration. i too at 8-9 months had zero function from the Peroneal nerve all i could do is invert and point my foot down with medium strength. Is there anything you can do with your foot? meaning point foot down,invert or anything with your toes? just wondering because you said you hoped to wiggle something not sure if you meant toes , foot or both. when did you have your last EMG test and what were the readings from it?( sorry if you have posted this information already) i hope everything goes well with your exploration and i wish you the best in your reovery and let me know if i can help in anyway...i dont want to come across as a "know it all " or anything just want to give as much information as possible.

Take Care All,
Andre
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on March 20, 2007, 03:49:57 PM
Hello All,

Max and Gordon I wish you both well in your recoveries. 

Andre, I hope you continue to inspire us and continue to post to this board when you can...  Even though you are done with rehab you still are our "cheerleader" and "teacher."  Your experiences very much give us a lot of help, hope and useful information.

Just like all of you I too with my daughter am dealing with the worst part of peroneal nerve injuries...  the UNCERTAINTY. 

There is so much that is just NOT KNOWN and UNCERTAIN about this type of injury and how it heals.  I have been struggling most with the whole TIME FRAME aspect of all this so it's good to hear Gordon say that a neurologist told him they have seen many people get their dorsiflexion back after a year.  And the "numerous people" aspect is good too!  That means they have seen cases before!  We have had so much frustration having dealt with so many doctors and therapist who had simply never seen this before!

I think I'll go massage my daughter's leg now.  It can "increase blood flow" as the PT says and maybe "channel some energy."
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on March 20, 2007, 04:52:24 PM
Max (aka Bob)  best of luck mate - will definately be praying for a good result and positive news from your surgeon. 
Andre - I am absolutely certain you will be fine after rehab but as you say that feeling is quite real when it comes to an end as the whole routine of rehab becomes so much part of your life.  (for some of us it is only a fleeting reprieve!)  I hope you find time to continue to pop in to the thread but not to the detriment of pulling you back to those floppy foot days.
Gordon - you will soon be catching us up time wise, and as our younger brother you will be well looked after by your older brothers and sisters!
Mom444 - keep on massaging - I am convinced that the continual touching and encouragement did make a difference.

Well got to get on my trampet and give it some action - you all take care and good recoverires
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: G_Bronson on March 20, 2007, 09:16:50 PM
Thanks Jackie,
I got some good news regarding my knee on Friday at my 2 month post op check-up. everything is healing good as far as they were concerned with my legiments and such. The full leg hinged brace is gone and i got fitted for a small Don Joy brace. I was told the ball is in my court now as far as physio goes and to work hard. The harder i work at it the better. Good to know i guess. I kinda look forward to each physio sescion now and am doing alot more at home aswell. As far as the nerve goes i do feel a difference in the feeling in the top of my foot. I would not go so far as to say it is normal but it is defineatley more normal. not as supersenstive. At this point i will take any improvement. However i still have alot of time before i can expect a recovery from the foot drop. I am only 2 months post opp and about 2.5 months post injury. i was told i had about 10cm of damaged nerve.Thats 100 days but i am giving myself double that just so i am not disapointed if there are no sign's of life in the foot by then.  My OS did give me a presciption for a EMS i have not gotten it yet but i will have it soon. I am excited about that. How long was it before your tib ant muscles respnded to the EMS Jackie and Andre? I am truely happy for both of you and hope you continue to recover.
Hamish i hope things are well, And Mom hang in there, my thoughts are with you.

Max i wish you all the best for your surgery tomorrow and hope you get the news you want.

Gordon
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Max Pwr on March 21, 2007, 12:22:42 AM
Hey Guys,  just to answer a few questions.  I have great plantar flexion and can move my foot down and wiggle my toes side to side or down (I can pick up marbles with my toes) but any movement upwards is impossible.  My inversion is really weak and I have no eversion whatsoever.  I try to run on the treadmill with the AFO but my ankle gets so sore because it's quite weak so I just set the setting on the highest possible speed I can do while walking, just before I break into a run, then increase the incline.  My last EMG was last month and because it was with a different neurologist than my previous one in November he had some diffferent results as he also did a couple of different tests.  He 'thinks' that there may be some activity but because he didn't have a good baseline he couldn't say foresure (sound familiar to everyone else's?).  He did explain to me that he knew of two Canadian olympic athlete's that won gold medals while they had the palsy, I asked whether they were in the special olympics but he laughed and said no - one was a bobsled and he couldn't remember the other.  Regardless, I thought it was a good statement to say that with the palsy things can still be accomplished.  He also made the mistake of getting my hopes up as he said that I may only need the AFO for another eight months.  I immediately looked at him and by looking at my face he realized what he said and committed himself to, then the back peddling began and he withdrew all such statements.

As we all are before surgery, I'm nervous as hell but instead of looking at the next two weeks of pain and uncomfort I'm focusing on eight months down the line when it's late fall and I'm chasing my daughter in the park.   One more thing, does anyone else hate the term "Drop Foot" or is it only me?  I like  'Peroneal Nerve Palsy' or something a litle more formal.  Drop foot sounds like a slang term for a real crappy condition.  They could make it easier to those that suffer by giving it a cool name like "studmitis (stud-mite-is)"  wouldn't that be a bit better, well maybe for the guys anyway. 

Well enough rambling, take care all and I'll let you know how things went when I get home from the hospital in a couple of days.   I'll be thinking of you all.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on March 21, 2007, 12:41:44 AM
Hey Guys,

Gordon, glad to hear things are going well. It is a great feeling to get rid of that big old brace. Work as hard as you can on the PT. Where are you with your flexion and extension? As far as my knee goes things have improved a lot over the last few days and the swelling had improved greatly. I ahve managed to go to the gym on the last 5 days and this has helped to get things moving. I see PT tomorrow and am looking forward to going to show off.

Andre, good to hear things are going so well for you. When you were telling us about being signed off by your PT it really struck me that it had become just part of everyday life for me and the actual realisation that at some point I will be there almost made me feel sad. Not that it will be great to be fully fit but it would be almost like a divorce or loosing something that is part of your life. Just goes to show how something just takes over your whole being. You can tell I have had a couple of glasses of wine tonight, I'm getting all nostalgic about my physio.

Jackie, my foot did all sorts of funny things when I did the figure of 8 with my finger. Hope your op isn't delayed too long.

Max/Bob, good luck with the op tomorrow and let us know what the outcome is.

Mom444, I keep praying for your daughter.

Hamish

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on March 21, 2007, 02:41:28 AM
Hey All,

Thanks for the encouragments Hamish and everyone!  You are all so sweet!  I truly believe in the power of prayer.  We pray for you.

Today my daughter's PT used a "point stimulator" on her.  Has anyone else had this?  It's a small plastic contraption with a pointy little thing coming out of it.  The therapist dips in in water and then places it on her leg.  It somehow stimulates and contracts the nerve.  There is supposedly some theraputic effect to this.  He says he will use that in sessions now in place of the EMS "tickle stickers." 

Her therapist does say that he is seeing some movement or contracting in the anterior tib muscles.  So that could mean there is in fact some kind of healing going on.  It may just be more slowly than some wouild hope.  But still, there's something going on.  I had to rack the PT's brains and ask him if he had seen people get better and get dorsiflexion back over a year and he of course did have a story about a college football player who injured many parts of his leg and it took him a long time to recover...  But I think that her PT implied that he did eventually improve. 

Also, we have two big events this Thursday.  In the morning we meet with the school district to see if we qualify for therapy from the school district at no cost.  If we do qualify however I am concerned they may put us with an inexperienced therapist with no kind of experience with this injury.  But our current PT says we mgiht be able to petition to have him still give the therapy.  Being here in the United States we have lots of restrictions with health insurance.  Thursday afternoon she has another MRI and she will need to go under general anesthesia again because of her age...  The last MRI showed nothing but maybe there is a chance this will give us some new information.  Have any of you guys had MRIs that did show your peroneal nerves?



Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on March 23, 2007, 03:04:23 PM
Hello Everyone,

How have you all been?  Any word yet on how Max the Mountie did in his surgery?  We are all hoping and praying things went well.

Just updates on us:  We went to the committee meeting with the school district and they would not approve my daughter for school sponsored PT.  They don't think her condition is severe enough to affect her education.  That's fair enough.  We'll just have to hope that we can make our insurance approve more therapy sessions with our current PT.

Also, if anyone has used a point stimulator...  Is this something we could also get for home similar to the EMS unit?  We have another session this afternoon but it will be with a different therapist.  Our regular guy has a meeting.  But I'm thinking this may be good because I'll have YET ANOTHER THERAPIST TO INTERROGATE   ;D  I'm gonna bug him with questions and ask him about everything he knows!  I think the other therapist is a younger guy...  I wonder if he's had any other experiences with peroneals...

The last visit from the dragon was on the 14th.  I am hoping he comes back, if that in fact is a good thing.  During the day and for the past few weeks my daughter claims her leg feels "fine."  I know one of you posted that a doctor told you that healing can still be happening even without pain...  I sure pray that's true.

I'm trying to stay calm and not worry about the next EMG next month.  The doctor said that if he didn't see significant improvement at the next EMG that he thinks she'll never get any better because the atrophy was too severe.  Let's pray not!

Let us know how you all are.  We are thinking of you.

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Max Pwr on March 24, 2007, 05:27:36 PM
Hi Everyone!

Well I made it through surgery, I always worry a bit about the anestesia and everything that's encompassed with it.  I guess it's a control issue as I just have to learn to let go and reliquish my control.  Everything went well in that regard.  I'm obviously at home and sore as hell.  The neurologist opened my peroneal first at the knee to disqualify a double crush syndrome (where damage occurrs both at hip and at knee) and thankfully the peroneal at the knee was fine.  He then opened my up from the top of my right buttock to the back of my right knee.  He said that the nerve was intact and there was no obvious signs of tearing or disection, but there was some discoloration in a few places and there was a mess of scar material that had trapped the nerve.  He released the nerve and closed me up, total surgey time was about three and a half hours.  Before he released me I tried to get him to commit on whether things will return but he wouldn't say.  I wanted to get some odds, you know like 50-50, or 70-30 or something but he wouldn't do it.  All he said is time will tell now.  We've done everything we can and the rest is up to my body.  There is nothing more I can do but hope for the best.  He didn't even give me a time frame.  The foot does feel a bit different, I still have no dorsi-flexion but it feels more 'natural' for lack of better terms.  The pins and needles have disppeared and the doctor said that was a good sign.  As well, the dragon has not made an appearance since the surgery the doctor said another good sign.  So now we are 'guardedly optomistic'.   I came home yesterday and can kind of sit comfortably at the computer.  That's all I can say at this point, I hope things start waking up within the next few months.

I hope everyone is doing well and I certainly appreciate the kind thouights, words and prayers.  Hopefully we can all get through this and giggle a bit at what we've been through.  Maybe even compare scars. 

Good healing everyone, and lets keep in touch!  Thanks again everyone, I'm so glad I met you.
-Max-   
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on March 24, 2007, 05:42:58 PM
Hey Max,

Really good to have you back and very pleased the surgery itself went OK for you.  By the sounds of things it does look like you may win the scar competition.  It reminds me of a walking weekend I went on a couple of months ago with friends where there was a stream  (freezing cold stream, coming off the mountain) and suggested we had a competition as to who could keep their foot in the water the longest - well I was always going to win that one!  ( with such little feeling in my foot). 

So now you need to rest up and let all that heal and see how it goes.  The news sounded positive and that is good.  Bless you good and I am convinced this mountie is going to back on his horse (well patrol car!)
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on March 24, 2007, 11:18:02 PM
Hi Everyone!

Well I made it through surgery, I always worry a bit about the anestesia and everything that's encompassed with it.  I guess it's a control issue as I just have to learn to let go and reliquish my control.  Everything went well in that regard.  I'm obviously at home and sore as hell.  The neurologist opened my peroneal first at the knee to disqualify a double crush syndrome (where damage occurrs both at hip and at knee) and thankfully the peroneal at the knee was fine.  He then opened my up from the top of my right buttock to the back of my right knee.  He said that the nerve was intact and there was no obvious signs of tearing or disection, but there was some discoloration in a few places and there was a mess of scar material that had trapped the nerve.  He released the nerve and closed me up, total surgey time was about three and a half hours.  Before he released me I tried to get him to commit on whether things will return but he wouldn't say.  I wanted to get some odds, you know like 50-50, or 70-30 or something but he wouldn't do it.  All he said is time will tell now.  We've done everything we can and the rest is up to my body.  There is nothing more I can do but hope for the best.  He didn't even give me a time frame.  The foot does feel a bit different, I still have no dorsi-flexion but it feels more 'natural' for lack of better terms.  The pins and needles have disppeared and the doctor said that was a good sign.  As well, the dragon has not made an appearance since the surgery the doctor said another good sign.  So now we are 'guardedly optomistic'.   I came home yesterday and can kind of sit comfortably at the computer.  That's all I can say at this point, I hope things start waking up within the next few months.

I hope everyone is doing well and I certainly appreciate the kind thouights, words and prayers.  Hopefully we can all get through this and giggle a bit at what we've been through.  Maybe even compare scars. 

Good healing everyone, and lets keep in touch!  Thanks again everyone, I'm so glad I met you.
-Max-   

We wish you a speedy recovery Max.  You said you had to have scar tissue removed around the nerve.  Did they mention anything about a "neuroma" on the nerve or if you had "neurolysis," which is removal of scar tissue from the nerve?  My daughter had both.

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Max Pwr on March 25, 2007, 04:07:32 AM
No Mom sorry, , he didn't get into the technicalities of the nerve entrapment, perhaps I should've gotten specifics from him.  I have a follow up in a few weeks, maybe I'll get a little more detail from the surgeon then.

Hope everyone is having a good weekend.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on March 25, 2007, 05:32:48 AM
Hey All

Good to hear that surgery went well for you max...i wish you a qucik and healthy recovery. i have totally faith in you having regeneration and i cant wait to hear the good  you telling us about it in the near future..my thoughts and prayers are with you. and trying to squeezing faith out of docs is next to impossible...the only one you need to squeeze the faith out of is yourself ...and you'll be just fine.Take good care and keep us posted on your recovery. 

Hey Mom444,

You said in your post that the Doc said if the EMG shows no significant change then the atrophy to your daughters leg may be to severe to recover....is that even with using the the NEMS unit? I ask because i was instructed by the doc to keep the muscle alive by using this everyday ..the clinic unit would force a contraction or just shock it..and the home unit would just feed it signals to keep it doing something or then shrinking. hope everything goes well with the EMG.

Hope everyone is well 
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on March 25, 2007, 05:53:27 PM
Hey All

Good to hear that surgery went well for you max...i wish you a qucik and healthy recovery. i have totally faith in you having regeneration and i cant wait to hear the good  you telling us about it in the near future..my thoughts and prayers are with you. and trying to squeezing faith out of docs is next to impossible...the only one you need to squeeze the faith out of is yourself ...and you'll be just fine.Take good care and keep us posted on your recovery. 

Hey Mom444,

You said in your post that the Doc said if the EMG shows no significant change then the atrophy to your daughters leg may be to severe to recover....is that even with using the the NEMS unit? I ask because i was instructed by the doc to keep the muscle alive by using this everyday ..the clinic unit would force a contraction or just shock it..and the home unit would just feed it signals to keep it doing something or then shrinking. hope everything goes well with the EMG.

Hope everyone is well 

Andre,

Thanks for asking.  I don't want to complain or to get upset over things that have already passed, but we unfortunately dealt with many doctors and therapists who were inexperienced or almost clueless about her problem.  Looking back, they SHOULD have told us to start using the EMS unit right away!  I know some of the others on this board were instructed to do so.  We just started to use the unit after with got it a month ago.  Her therapist at the Children's Hospital tried to use the EMS unit to see if we could get maybe get her foot to move but to no avail a few months back...  She didn't think to mention that we should still do EMS anyhow to keep the muscle alive.  Remember, they never recommended scar treatement to us either.

I'm trying to keep blind faith and hope and pray that she can still recover.  I have found research studies where people had peroneal nerve problems and didn't have surgery for over a year or two years after and still had some improvement. 

On the bright side we did meet with the other younger therapist at our PT's office and he too is experienced with this kind of injury because he has treated many footballs players, etc.  He has also treated children.  He said he saw on football player who had some nerve damage for a couple of years, his one leg was much larger than the other.  With therapy, he eventually got some more kind of build up in the other leg's muscles...  I don't know all the details...

Part of how frustrating our situation has become is that we are dealing with so many doctors who are almost cluelsess about this...  I don't want to be a mean person or a complainer...  but that has been so unfortunate that no one knew what to do.  Remember that back when we first took her in to be evaluated no one suspected it could have been a problem in her leg, the doctors immediately thought it was just a "tight heel cord" or something as severe as brain damage!

I know...  I have to keep my faith...  There was SOME RECOVERY at the last EMG...  I have to keep focusing on that.  And even the younger PT agreed that nerves to heal SLOWLY so it could just be taking its time.

I hope the rest of you are well.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on March 26, 2007, 07:40:03 PM
Just to add my 2 pence worth (or two cents worth!) my physio had wanted to use electrical stimulation but unfortunately the physiotherpay department did not have a machine and there was a freeze on the budget and could not buy one either.  I bought a tens machine from Boots the Chemist and although it is really for pain releif I used it on my leg just to give some sensation to the leg in the vain hope it might do something.  I appreciate that my injury is not the same as your daughters but just to say I didn't have an EMS although I can fully understand your disaapointment and probably anger at not being given that option much earlier on.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on March 26, 2007, 08:40:26 PM
Thanks Jacky.  We are still trying to stay positive.  On the possibly bright side, she said she felt the "dragon" last night. 
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: FrankGrimes on March 27, 2007, 06:54:22 AM
Hi from Sydney, Australia.

I only just found this thread. I started to feel like I was the only one who had this problem! ;-)

I have had peroneal nerve palsy for years now. I have unexplained peroneal neuropathy to the peroneal nerve resulting in footdrop.  Had surgery Feb 2006 and Feb 2007 including neurolysis to remove scar tissue around and inside the nerve. Surgeon tested and thinks 50% of fibres work ok.

I can hold my foot at about 90 Degrees against gravity. But I have no strengh if someone pushes down on it. Surgeon doesn't think i'll make much of a recovery. Surgeon also hasn't given me a recovery regime and says I just have to wait.. Does this sound right?

Kinda sucks.. Can't run, can't ski, can't swim properly...
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on March 27, 2007, 05:19:28 PM
Hi from Sydney, Australia.

I only just found this thread. I started to feel like I was the only one who had this problem! ;-)

I have had peroneal nerve palsy for years now. I have unexplained peroneal neuropathy to the peroneal nerve resulting in footdrop.  Had surgery Feb 2006 and Feb 2007 including neurolysis to remove scar tissue around and inside the nerve. Surgeon tested and thinks 50% of fibres work ok.

I can hold my foot at about 90 Degrees against gravity. But I have no strengh if someone pushes down on it. Surgeon doesn't think i'll make much of a recovery. Surgeon also hasn't given me a recovery regime and says I just have to wait.. Does this sound right?

Kinda sucks.. Can't run, can't ski, can't swim properly...

Welcome Frank!  Glad to have you join our group!

It sounds like your problems and my daugther's problems are a little similar.  Your peroneal palsy was also unexplained?  Did you ever have any history of an injury?  Or did it just come on all of a sudden?

How many years or months did you have the problem before your first neurolysis?  Why did you have neurolysis twice? 

If you can hold your foot at 90 degrees is that enough to walk without a brace? 

Hope we can share some infor with each other.  We all help each other here.

Also, did you or do you ever get pains in your leg? 

Jacky, Andre and the gang,

My daughter's dragon may have come back.  Only now she is saying that it feels like "ice cubes."  I think that one of you said that your pains sometimes felt like ice water being poured on you.  Was it you Andre?  Were these pains of "ice" something that happened before more kinds of recovering?
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on March 27, 2007, 10:19:36 PM
Mom, that is great news as I am sure that any sensation is good sensation and lets pray it is a sign of good things to come. 

Frank Grimes, welcome to the floppy foot gang and if you have had chance to read previous posts you will realise that you are a member of an exclusive club of very supportive and people. 

Max - thinking of you as you recover and hope you are not too sore.

Hamish - any update on your progress or are you in one of those static periods?  Hope you are OK

Gordon - How are you getting on with your EMS? 

Andre - any further news following the weekend trials, got any offers?  How is the strength going - I must ask you, if you don't mind, I have been trying to increasingly manage without the splint but find that as the day goes on I tire and start to trip up again, I can manage about four hours at the moment before I need to put my splint back on - how long did it take you to wean yourself off your AFO?  thanks  Jacky
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: FrankGrimes on March 28, 2007, 12:07:23 AM
Quote

It sounds like your problems and my daugther's problems are a little similar.  Your peroneal palsy was also unexplained?  Did you ever have any history of an injury?  Or did it just come on all of a sudden?

How many years or months did you have the problem before your first neurolysis?  Why did you have neurolysis twice? 

If you can hold your foot at 90 degrees is that enough to walk without a brace? 

Also, did you or do you ever get pains in your leg? 

Thanks for the welcome!

No trauma to the knee, but I did have arthritis as a child in the affected knee (I'm almost 25 now). Which could be related. I actually noticed by accident when skiing (I couldn't turn one way because of a weak foot), then alot of things came together, I tended to trip alot on pavement but never thought anything of it.

First noticed in July 2005, they first suspected MS, so in many respects I was quite happy it was only scar tissue!! But many EMGs and MRIs later I had a diagnosis - A tumor. Got operated on Feb 2006, no tumor found, but alot of thick scar tissue which the neurosurgeon removed.

1 year later, no improvements from both EMG and movement so I had another MRI - scar tissue had returned. So I got operated on again Feb 2007. Neurosurgeon said he was more aggressive this time whatever that means.. Saw the  surgeon this week to inspect recovery but he is not expecting much at this stage (Not sure why?)

Absolutely no pain.. Hence why it was hard to notice in the first place
No AFO either, I can walk ok, only with a slight limp! But tend to trip/scuff my feet a fair bit..
But can't run, so I ride a fair bit to keep fit.. Not much else I can Do.. Cycling is good for people with footdrop!!
I have an AFO but find it annoying to wear

My girlfriend is a physiotherapist, so I'm in good company. But I'm really not sure what I can to do help the nerve regenerate quicker! I currently just do stretching and some strenthening.



Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on March 28, 2007, 03:13:10 AM
Frank,

Your story is interesting.  I also am intrigued how you too had no pain yet somehow developed scar tissue.  You had arthritis as a child?  And you are only 25 now?  Hmmm...

My daughter also had no obvious pain when her scar tissue developed.  I did have someone ask me if she had arthritis, but no one ever was able to come to that conclusion.  Many doctors did ask or wonder if she was some way "genetically predisposed" to this kind of injury or to develop scar tissue on the nerve...  The pediatrician first thought that she had a  degenerative nerve disease like CMT but thank God that is most likely not it...  The rest of her body seems to function normally. 

I wish you luck in your recovery...  As you may have seen in my earlier posts, I'm a researcher and I've found many articles about this kind of injury and there have been a few cases where people had peroneal damage for longer than a year and still improved.

On a good note our physical therapist (I noticed that in the UK you tend to call them physiotherapists, I'm assuming it's the same) was doing the point stimulator on my daughter today and said that he saw "good muscle contractions."  Of course he cannot tell how far the nerve has regenerated but it's good to see that he was postive about the contractions...

How have the rest of you been holding up?  Max?  Andre?  Gordon?  Hamish?  Jacky?

Jacy, are you still able to dorsiflex?  Has it gotten any stronger?  You said you can at least walk without the AFO. 

I was telling our PT that from what I have read some people can recover enough just to walk without tripping but that their feet are just not strong enough against resistance.  If my daughter can't "lift weights" with her feet but can avoid tripping we would be so grateful.  Also I have read that some people might not get toe movement back, but again that might not be too tragic.

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: G_Bronson on March 28, 2007, 04:12:34 AM
Hey Everyone,
not much new here, i am using my ems machine everyday and doing my stengthening exercises and physio.  still not getting any muscle contractions with the EMS.I have an appointment tommorow with my physio therapist. i am almost at 110 degree flexion and my extension is getting better. Strength wise i am starting to  really notice the muscles coming back. I can actually take steps now without my crutches. My physio said that they will try to get me on the bike soon. so i am excited to hear that. Not much new on the nerve front. i am feeling some different sensations. but i doubt they mean anything. I feel a cold shot down my leg once in a while. when i try to lift my foot is feels different than before, kinda like its trying to but still not enough is getting through, if that makes any sense.

Frank,
Welcome to our group, looks like we got most of the globe covered now. Canada, the UK, the US and now Austrailia. I wish you the best in your recovery my friend, these are all very supportive and knowlegable people here.

Max
So glad you recieved some positive news from your surgery. Hope you heal up good bud! I was worrying for you, i was so glad to hear it went well.

MOM,
that sounds positive that your daugter was getting good muslce stim. that's a good thing for sure.

Hamish,
How are things going with you?

Jacky, and Andre,
I hope things are still continuing to improve for you. you guys have come such a long way.

Stay postiive everyone and work hard.

All the best
Gordon


 
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on March 29, 2007, 01:35:59 AM
Hi Guys,

Things with me are going reasonably well. Its been a pretty hard time since my ACL recon on the 12th Feb but things are now settling down and most of the swelling has shifted and I am able to do a lot more. Managing to make it to the gym every day now. I have noticed that my dragon is going through a very active stage at the moment. I am now 7 months post injury and seem to be getting feelings in my foot I have not had before but not getting too excited but keep trying to will my toes and foot to move.

Hi Frank, welcome aboard the rollercoaster and goodluck and hope that the surgery will have the desired result. As evryone on here will tell you there is no quick fix as a nerve will only regenerate at 1mm? per day.

Max, glad to have you back after surgery! That must be one hell of a scar from the top of your bum to your knee. Sounds like you will win just about any scar competition unless you come up against a shark attack victim. Hope things are healing well. How many stitches/staples did you get?

Gordon, glad to hear things are improving and the flexion and extention are coming along. 110 degrees is about what you need to manage to pedal. Once I managed to get on the bike my improvement in flexion started to get easier. My flexion at the moment is about 105 degrees and can't quite manage to do it yet. I go on the bike and rock the pedal back and forth but I am not far away. Extention is hard for me at the moment but it is so important to get full extention to be able to walk without a limp.

Andre, Jackie and Mom444, hope things are going well with you!

Going away for a few days to some friends down in Englandshire, just for a change in scene. Will be back Tuesday so will check in then.

Hamish

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on March 29, 2007, 11:28:53 PM
HELP!

DO ANY OF YOU HAVE EXPERIENCES WITH NEURAWRAP?  WAS IT USED ON YOU DURING SURGERY?

We got a somewhat scary phone call from the neurosurgeon today.  They did an MRI of my daughter's leg last week and the doctpr then called to say they found that my daugter's peroneal nerve looked "thick" on the MRI.  I asked what that could mean and the doctor said that in the worst case scenario it could me a tumor had grown on the nerve or it was something more serious.

Or it could be from the product NEURAWRAP they used to wrap her nerve during surgery. 

This neurawrap stuff is a collagen based sheath that they put on the nerve to protect it from growing scar tissue... 

They say it is supposed to be reabsorbed by the body...  But I wonder how long it takes to be reabsorbed.

It's all so confusing.

But on the bright side, she is next to me right now crying in pain...  The dragon is here.

The doctor said the dragons are a good sign.

Hope you all are well...   I'm holding on to my sanity as best as I can.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Max Pwr on March 30, 2007, 10:43:28 PM
Hi Everyone, just checking in.

Recovery goes well, obviously I was very tender for a few days but I am getting better everyday and soon will be walking my dog again.  No real change in the floppiness factor.  It's hard to explain but my foot feels more 'natural' for whatever that's worth.  I do get stange feelings too Hamish, but I'm like you, I try not to read anything into it.  The dragon did make an appearance last night although minor in nature he was still there.  Staples (all 75 of them) are coming out next Thursday so needless to say I'm looking forward to that.

Mom, no one advsied me about anything like Neurawrap, sounds strnage that they would tell you that this late after surgery. 

Gordon, hang in there man, won't be long and you'll be going on some hikes this summer, keep up the good work with physio!

Frank, I know it's been said but Welcome, a new story is always welcome here and perhaps you can share some knowledge that the rest of us aren't aware of.

Jacky, what's it like wearing shoes without an AFO?  I bet its awesome, little things like comfortable shoes was taken for granted, but if I get my dorsiflexion back, I'm going to buy a real expensive pair of really comfortable shoes, I'm already looking forward to it!

Take care guys (and Girls) and keep in touch.  have a great weekend and keep up the hard work!
~Max~
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on March 31, 2007, 03:57:39 AM
Hi Everyone,

I took the iniative myself and called customer service line for Integra, the company that makes Neurawrap.  I asked the rep if she know how long this material stayed in the body...  She wasn't sure herself but she forwarded me to another rep.

A while later the rep called and told me that the Neurawrap material STAYS IN THE BODY FOR 15 MONTHS!  So it sounds like maybe that is what is showing up on the MRI.

What irritates and concerns me however is that the neurosurgeon himself DID NOT HAVE A CLUE about this.  When I asked him if the stuff was supposed to have been dissolved by now he said, "Well yeah...  probably..."  It is ridiculous that the surgeon is using this stuff and doesn't even know a BASIC FACT about it such as how long it stays in the body!  And to call me up and say that there is a chance she may have a tumor that needs a biopsy, or a degenerative nerve disease, or something else...

I was on the phone all morning with different doctors trying to see if there is any place to go for a second opinion, but in our city we are limited with options.  Also because of her age they only want her to deal with pediatrics again.

But our regular pediatricians have  become our allies.  They said they will try to send her test results to the Cleveland Clinic.  I said that we don't have the time or money right or opportunity right now to hop a plane or travel far away to see another specialist...  But they said they could just send her materials to Cleveland...  We might need to take a trip there in person down the road.

Cleveland is only a few hours away from us.

This is all so confusing...

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on March 31, 2007, 04:12:37 PM
Mom i wish I could offer some words of comfort and hope you do get some concrete answers soon, it appears to me that the medics are actually increasing your anxiety through their woolliness (can't think of a better word).  I appreciate that nerves have no real time frame but I wish they wouldn't keep feeding all sorts of possibilities to you.  I feel for you. 

Max - the shoes - oh yes it is great - not being able to find shoes that would take my splint was a real trial - particularly for a social girl.  I have not completely weaned myself off the splint, like today, being Saturday is shopping day and so I wear tne splint around a long shopping trip as I fatigue and start to catch my toe and trip.  I can wear boots (Magnums) at work and can get away with no splint, but could before I had dorsiflexion back.  The real pleasure is being able to wear shoes for work.  I am off out tonight but it is in the city so will wear the splint so I can keep up with my friends.  But as each week goes by I get a little further without the splint.

I have a nerve conduction test on the 14th May to see what is happening.

All the best to you all xx
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on March 31, 2007, 07:10:32 PM
Thanks Jacky.  It's unfortunate that we have been fining out the hard way how physicians and therapists are humans and that they often display poor judgement and make mistakes.  Still, I think it's inexcusable for a surgeon to not be aware of how a material that he often uses in surgery works.

For those of you who are interested, here is the link to the Neurwrap materials's site:  http://www.integra-ls.com/products/?product=198

It has only been on the market for the past few years.  Also, I hear it was originally developed and used in the UK.  So I am wondering if any of you "across the pond" may have heard of it.

In theory, this material sounds like a good thing.  It is supposed to cover and protect the nerve while it is healing and prevent any further scar tissue from forming.  I know some of you have in fact said that you had to have repeat surgeries because your nerves would grow more scar tissue after being operated on.  I just hope and pray this material does in fact help.

We will keep up our prayers and good thoughts for all of you.

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on April 02, 2007, 03:26:39 AM
Hey everyone,

Welcome FrankGrimes and sorry for my late post...life has been kinda hectic the past couple weeks. hey Mom444 i have never heard of the neurwrap before nd i just checked out the site and it kind of looks unneccessary. just from looking and reading about it on the site you posted it looks like it would resistrict more healing agents in the body while scar tissue isnt that big of a concern because thee are different ways of clearling and freeing scar tisue. can Doctors in the staes just use things like that without your knowledge or did you consent? sorry if im being to intruding...i am just finding this new approach very strange and is there or have you found any facts or statistics that support this procedure?

Hello To everyone and i hope that you are all doing well...going to read through the thread to see what ive missed.
Andre
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Max Pwr on April 03, 2007, 06:56:06 PM
Hi Everyone, just a quick question.  Does (or did) everyone wear a night splint or have you simply discarded it in the name of comfort?  I am debating whether to wear mine when I sleep.  I wear it inconsistently at the best of times but Im considering just putting it under the bed for awhile.   Any thoughts?

-Max- 
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on April 03, 2007, 07:05:42 PM
Hi Max,

I wear mine most of the time but I will do a trial tonight and sleep without it to guage how it feels.

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on April 04, 2007, 07:34:58 PM
I did use my night splint as before I got mine my ankle got stiff and I used the night splint to increase the tension on my ankle - it was a devils own job to get my ankle back to 90 degrees and I was just not a high heel type of girl!  I for one would recommend using it.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on April 04, 2007, 08:40:32 PM
Tried not wearing it last night but only lasted an hour before I put the split on and it was far more comfortable.

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on April 05, 2007, 03:35:11 PM
You should wear the night splints to avoid getting a "tight heel cord."
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Max Pwr on April 05, 2007, 06:55:03 PM
Ya, I tried to not to wear it the other night, then last night I wore mine and there was a big difference in comfort.  It's just quite hard and cumbersome.  I've talked to a couple of people that have had the condition for 10 years and they don't wear one; I guess after awhile you just get used to the feeling of having no movement and an inability to stretch the cord.  As of yet neither of them have had any achillies problems eventhough they don't wear it.  I get my staples out today, not looking forward to the actual pulling but am looking forward to getting back on the treadmill and working out.

Hope everyone is contiuiing to heal and is getting their eggs painted for the holiday.  Chat with everyone soon.

Thinking of you,
-Max-
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on April 05, 2007, 07:10:56 PM
Max,

Don't worry about the staples they come out really easily, a lot easier than stitches.

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: G_Bronson on April 06, 2007, 07:04:58 AM
Jackie and Andre
I was just wondering if you could tell me what it felt like when you could invert(outward) your foot. Earlier this week i had a twitch , and my foot went outward. I have not been able to do this since the injury. then tuesday night after my EMS i noticed that i could move my foot very slightly outward( just a couple of centimetres). I dont know if what i am seeing is anything to get excited about but then tonight it seemed to move more. I told my PT about it and she said if it moved then it had to be the correct muscles affecetd buy the nerve doing it. However i am abit skeptical. I can do it much better when i am lying down . It is alot harder when i am sitting or standing.
 
I was just wondering if you could tell me how it was when you first got invertion back.
 
Max i hope the staples weren't too bad coming out.

I hope all is well and you are all continuing to heal. You and your families have a happy easter.
 
All the Best
 
Gordon
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on April 06, 2007, 10:49:09 AM
Happy Easter!

Gordon, what you descibe is accurate with regard to the return of eversion and inversion. I too had a twitch, then I was able to flick it out but not hold it, then I was able to hold but it flickered about abit and now I can turn out and hold that position.  I would guess you are in the very early stages of return.  the fact is the muscle needs the nerve signal to do anything, voluntary or involutary.  Initially my physio was not overly impressed with the flick and made me perservere to the out and hold.  I also practiced lying down as it was easier, I found gravity to be a heavy pull on my foot.  You need to have a positive mind that this is the recovery. 

Max - was it as bad as you imagined or was it OK?  Hope you are feeling lots better now the staples are out.   Max and Hamish, I will say that I did find that the night splint seemed to draw my foot during the night and as I regained feeling in my foot I tolerated the night splint less and less.  If I have had a long day and the foot is floppy by the end of the day (it gets very tired, bless it) I do wear the night splint to give it some support but always manage to remove it in my sleep sometime during the night.  Please try to persevere with it though as I did and still do have difficulty with tightness in my ankle and I am sure wearing the night splint sooner would have prevented it.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Max Pwr on April 06, 2007, 10:18:52 PM
Happy Easter Everyone!

Had the 75 staples removed yesterday, it did hurt but nothing like the pain we've all gone through with our various injuries and horrific nerve pain, at least I knew it would be over soon enough so I just did some grinning and wimpering somehow at the same time...

As much as I hate the night splint I'm going to wear it with hopes in time I won't need it anymore and that it'll help me in the long run.  Glad to hear from everyone! 
Thanks for all the support.
You guys take care and keep in touch!
~Max~
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on April 08, 2007, 05:57:42 PM
Happy Easter All

I wore a night splint as well....i used to take it off because it was uncomfortable and paid the price in the morning. my ankle would be so tight...and i would have to stretch my achilles and calf so much so i just bared with the uncomfortableness..(if thats even a word). G_Bronson....yes i started with a twitch as well..it was spontaneous and inconsistent but each twitch i had gave me new motivation to make it keep twitching and then eventually it turned into movement. Glad to hear about the progression.


We are in the process of moving and internet is up as of yet but when i get to a comp i check ill keep everyone posted.

It was my first day back on the feild this week for my university training camp...they are getting me prepared for the pro camp whcih is in 2 months. my cardio has been hit massively....and on the grass the leg fatigues alot quickers due to the extra force needed to run on such a soft surface with kleets on. so my problem areas are really showing. other then my terrible endurance skill and football knowledge and aility are surprisingly still alive and kicking and i feel gret on te feild ...it doesnt feel like i was injured nor do i really think about it...but i havent started contact yet so who knows what to expect when i start progressing to that. also after all the unning and pounding on the knee at practice...NO SWELLING at all which is great but i do think i am developing alittle patellar tendonitis..which i believe is common..so next week i will be recieving shock therapy to induce healing in this area and posibly rid this annoying distracting pain. ive posted some training camp stuff if you like check it out...and Jackie i have been working hard to regain my big toe movement..no real progress yet but you have given me hope that it is possible so im going to keep trying.....Again Happy Easter and best of luck to all in your recovery

Andre
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on April 08, 2007, 10:21:05 PM
Hello Everyone and Happy Easter!

Well, I have been trying not to focus on the stress right now.  I'll just say I had a bit of a confrontation on the phone with the surgeon who was possibly unaware of how long the Neurawrap material stays in the body.  I hate to argue with doctors, but I'm not sure what happened and why the man didn't know off the top of his head that the material stays in the body and therefore could very well be what was showing up on the MRI.

Andre to answer your question of course I researched the heck out of these "collagan conduits" for nerve healing!   ;D  Most of what I have read says that they are in fact meant to ease recovery and to protect the nerve.  I just pray that it is working.  The dragon has been coming by at somewhat irregular intervals so I hope and pray that's a good sign.  She even said the other day that there was a "two headed dragon" in her leg!  LOL.  One head was breathing ice and other breathing fire!  Sounds like nerve pain and we know that it could possibly be a signal of healing...

I may not be in on these boards as often in the near future.  I have a health issue of my own right now and some family things that I must be attending to.  I don't want to say what it is on the board for privacy reasons, so I'll go ahead and send each one of you a private message (those of you who have been active in the past month) saying what it is.  Again, just please don't mention what it is on the boards, for privacy's sake.  A lot of non users "lurk" on here and who know who may be reading this.

I hope and pray that you all continue well with your recovery and thank all of you for all your prayers and support for my little girl.

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on April 10, 2007, 02:08:29 PM
Hi Guys,

Just a quick question. When I have been icing my knee I get a sensation as if cold water is being pored over my foot. This has only started over the last couple of weeks. Does anyone else experience this?

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on April 10, 2007, 06:37:12 PM
Don't worry Hamish - this is a perfectly normal sensation and is very common where the nerves have been disturbed - well that was what I was told by my GP.  You can sometimes get that sensation when not icing - I still get it. 
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Max Pwr on April 15, 2007, 08:36:40 PM
Hello Everyone,

I'm wondering what are the most comfortable shoes to wear when donning the AFO? I've been transferred to robbery/homicide and I will soon have to wear dress shoes to work everyday and I'm wondering what kind to buy.  I have good days and bad days with the shoes I wear now, seems my big toe just gets sore as hell when I wear a certain type of shoe, does anyone else have this issue or am I unique?  Any suggestions would be great?  By the way, how is everyone doing?  Me, I'm doing well, still a bit sore from the recent surgery but getting better, no sign of dorsi-flexion yet but I just have this tiny voice telling me it won't be long now, I'm hoping it's not lying to me. 

Hope everyone is having a great spring!

~Max~
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on April 15, 2007, 09:16:41 PM
Hi Max,

Most comfortable for me when wearing my AFO is trainers but these are obviously no use for work. I too get the soar big toe thing but this is generally because the AFO takes up room in the shoe and therfore puts pressure on the toe. I remembered I had bought a pair of shoes that were too big for me and had thrown them in the closet and never worn them and they are perfect for the AFO as they give my foot a little extra room in the shoe. Have to be lace up shoes.

Not sure if any of that helps.

Things with me are slowly improving as far as my knee is concerned and now at the gym every day and now able to pedal away on the bike. No movement in the foot yet but like you I have that little voice telling me something will ahppen soon.

Gordon.  Have you had any more movement after the twitches you had?

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on April 16, 2007, 12:30:29 AM
Hello All,

I'm still here for now...

Hope you all are well.

Just a question...

I have noticed that my daughter's dragon is coming at more regular intervals, like almost every three or four days now as opposed to his former schedule of coming every two weeks.

Did any of you experience the dragon coming by at more close intervals and if so how did this line up with your healing?

Thanks.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on April 16, 2007, 04:53:38 PM
Hey All,

Mom444 i sent you a reply to your question.

Hey hamish ..how are things with recovery going? i to was worried about the ice water feeling.....i was told as well that this was a normal feeling and had nothing to do with circulation problems or anything as i originally thought it was. As for shoes to wear wit the AFO....i wore running shoes whenever i went out ..low cuts normally. and my dress shoes were pretty wide and a half size bigger to make space for the brace. Max the toes sorness is awesome.....anything you can feel in the foot and toes is a good thing so that voice in your head is telling you good things.....good to see the confidence and glad to see healing is doing very well.

Hopefully Everyone is doing Well ...i have been very busy with the draft and training camp right around the corner...so my posts wont be as frequent but i will be poping in to see how everyone is doing. i had an assessment the other day and my flexibility in my calf and hips (reconstructed leg) have been unacceptable. the inactivity and the hip hiking i did for the past year has thrown off my mechanics so in oreder to reset this correctly im back in therapy doing Core,Yoga and Strength training. also my knee is fine now...but i still load my right more then my left (compensation and protective) which could result in more damage to my other leg if i keep doing this. So Getting Football Ready is going to be a very hard task. But a task that i am determined to complete.Wish me luck and Keep up te recovery Everyone.

Andre
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on April 16, 2007, 09:14:21 PM
Hey All,

I am not in the hospital yet, so I'm still here.  (By the way, I notice that Canadians and people from the UK say "in hospital" but for some reason we Americans say "in THE hospital."  ???)

Hamish, my daughter says there are two dragons.  There is an "ice dragon" and a "fire dragon."  Maybe you have an "ice dragon."

Also, she felt the dragon last night after dinner and then woke up at two a.m. crying in pain and I had to give her Motrin.

Thanks to those of you also who sent me such sweet private messages.

We hope and pray you all do well.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on April 16, 2007, 09:41:51 PM
hello all,

Well another good week - I have been horse riding which was just fantastic.

Mom - I have sent a pm to you.  The ice is also a good sign in my experience and I still have that sensation today.

Shoes - let me tell you as a lady this is much more of a problem than for you guys.  My AFO chews shoes and has them for lunch.  I, like Andre, too wear trainers when possible but found Hotter shoes (Hotter shoes are the ones that your Grandmother wears)  to be the most accomodating for the AFO once the insole had been removed.  Work provided me with combat boots (Magnums) - not very fetching but practical.   I have found Dr Martin shoes also take the AFO but are very heavy. 

Had a few trips and falls recently as my foot tires then the ability to lift deminishes.  Still I will persevere - this weeks achievemnet was to build the confidence to ride my 125cc scooter without my splint.

Still on the waiting list for the next operation with no date - this is starting to become more of a marathon than waiting for the foot to wake up properly.  I know that once the surgeon does the operation I will have no knee pain and to have to wake up every morning still not knowing when that will happen is getting very wearing - sorry bounded off into a major whinge! and wanting the op but also being very scared in case the same thing happens is so difficult that it will be best just to get it done and over with.  I am one of the victims of no money left at the end of the financial year so the op has been delayed. 

Hope you are all OK and good to hear all your news.  Chins up guys and girls


Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on April 16, 2007, 10:57:06 PM
Imagine trying to wear an AFO with high healed shoes, you would have to walk at a funny angle. Not that I have to worry about that of course, I don't have high healed shoes. Honestly I really don't! ::)

I get both dragons as well. It just seems to be when I ice my knee that I get the cold dragon.

On the knee front I am beginning to pick up some speed with this now after a very poor start. I think the problems were of my own making because I spent too much time on my feet too soon that caused a lot of swelling. However that has pretty much all shifted now and I am back to my daily routine of going to the gym and my leg is getting stronger and flexion and extention are improving.

Hope everyone is doing well.

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: G_Bronson on April 17, 2007, 04:57:47 AM
hey Everyone,
from Reading your most recent posts it seems like you are all keeping your spirits up. i am glad to see that. Not much new here, still going hard at the physio, i got on the bike last week, it felt really good. I am doing well with physio as far as the knee goes. I got extension today of -5 degrees and flexion of 115. My Physio Therapist is really impressed with my recovery. I find it hard to see because all i am worried about is my foot. But i can see a difference when i think back to how bad it was. It has only been three months since surgery i guess. I have gained some strenght aswell.
On the nerve front, not much new. However i am almost positive i am getting a contraction of one of my peroneal muslces when i do my EMS. Although it is very hard to tell which muslce it is and i do not want to get my hopes up. My PT said it may be my solex(or solius not sure of the spelling). How ever the contractions have gotten stronger over the last week. I will continue to watch it closely.
I still get the dragon's both hot and cold.
As far as the shoes i wear, i also wear cross trainers i had to get size larger than normal and really wide to fit my AFO. I am used to them now.
I am kinda excited this week, i am  finnaly getting my truck sent to me. All my belongings are on the other side of the country except what i brought on Christmas vacation. Needless to say it has been stressful to take care of it all. But i cant wait to see my truck again. Alberta to Newfoundland is a long journey thought, so it may take a while.lol.
 Hope all is well with everyone and you continue to work hard and heal. Not many days go by that you are not in my thoughts. Stay Strong!

All the Best!!
Gordon
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on April 21, 2007, 10:56:40 PM
What a releif - I have my date for the final surgery on 11th May - eeeks that is just three weeks away!  The waiting has been hard as I know that as soon as the op has been done I will have no knee pain and the thought of that is excellent - the three months recovery to feel normal again is the not so great bit.  Well I wish you all the very best for your recoveries.  I am sure by the time I am well on the way to recovery all of you will have moved on leaps and bounds.  I look forward to hearing about your progress.  Keep smiling and the world will smile back.

I will endevour to call in but I have one week left at work, which will be hectic to ensure I hand all my work over in an orderly fashion and then two weeks of dentist, pre-op assessment, Dr's appointment for meds, OT appointment to get the aids ordered and ready for discharge from hospital and get the downstairs dinning room converted to a make shift bedroom again. 

Take care xx
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: AmandaC on April 23, 2007, 03:47:21 AM
I am new to this fourm, I have been chatting with Hamish in one of the other topics and he suggested I join in if that is OK with everyone.  I had a serious accident in September 06,was crushed by a horse.  I broke my pelivis ring in 4 places and shattered my left hip joint as well as serious internal trauma to my bowel.  I had life saving surgeory immediatley to remove alot of damaged bowel and was air lifted to a different hospital 4 days later for the pelvis and hip reconstruction.  During this surgeory the surgeon had to stretch my sciatic nerve which has resulted in total foot drop of my left leg, I apparently have damage to the L5 and S2 nerve.  I have no movement and no feeling in the leg from the knee down.  I have read alot of posts about   degrees of  dorsiflexion is this been able to lift the ankle?  I had a MRI scan 3 weeks ago, due to the amount of hardware in my pelvis and hip the images were unreadle.  Any success stories out there?  It has been 7 long long months but I am walking now, very badly.  I am swimming and and at the gym.  My entire left leg is very very week and very painful with nerve pain.  Any ideas how long this nerve pain will last?  It gets you down living with pain day after day.  Look forward to hearing from anyone that wants to chat.  I have read some of the latest posts on the forum and it sounds like there are alot of you out there suffering with this condition. 

Mom - I read your post and really feel for you little girl, it is bad enough a adult having to deal with this but for a young child is just dreadful.  I have a little girl, turning 2 on Saturday

Look forward to talking and hoping we all have full recovery stories in the future.
Amanda
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on April 23, 2007, 08:05:27 PM
Hello Amanda,

I have been reading your posts with Hamish on your other thread.  Welcome to this thread and you are in good company with very supportive and caring people here.  We tend to be a positive bunch too but recognise the very real ups and downs of dealing with nerve palsy resulting in drop foot.  No one here can tell you what recovery is likely or possible and I am sure you have already experienced the very vague suggestions of possible recovery from your medical team.  As you know Andre has made terrific progress so there is always hope and the possibility.  You are right that dorsiflexion is moving the ankle, specifically it is the ability to raise the foot upwards.  I have come to realise that there are differnet degrees of foot drop.  I had near complete foot drop but can now dorsiflex although I still have weakness in the foot and continue to exercise to strengthen the muscles up.  What have you been told by your medical team?  Have you discussed the nerve pain with your neurologist?  I took amiltriptyline for nerve pain and found that to be very effective.  The nerve pain can be very bad and it is important to take the meds to keep it in check.
Best wishes
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: AmandaC on April 23, 2007, 08:12:40 PM
Thanks for your reponse.
The surgeon who performed the surgery gave me a 80% chance for recovery, I never saw him again as I was transferred to another hospital, the specialist at the next hospital gave me a 0% chance is not back in 3 months, we are now up to 7 months.  I take Nurontin 3 times a day for the nerve pain and it does help but the pain is still there 24/7 as I imagine you all know.  Has your pain eased now that you have some movement back?  I am going for a EMG soon, do you know if they are painful.  How long have you had movement for?  Thats great and I guess it will continue to improve.  How long did you have foot drop for before you got movement back.
Thanks Amanda
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on April 23, 2007, 08:25:04 PM
I had no movement for quite a few months, I have had movement for about four months, I suppose - initially it was a twitch of the little toe, then a flick of the foot inwards with no control, then I could move it inwards but not hold it, then I could move it in and hold.  I suppose a diary would have been good.  A friend of mine yesterday said she was please I had real movement as I would say look it is moving and she could barely see anything but felt the need to agree and make suitable positive comments. 

It is important to remember that we all of us here have very dfferent causes of foot drop and to varying degrees so our recoveries will naturally be equally personal.  It is your sciatic nerve in the spine, whereas mine is lower at the peroneal nerve by the knee. 

I had an EMG booked for May 14th although my final operation is scheduled for the 11th May so the EMG will not now go ahead although it does seem a little late now, considering my recovery.  Take care
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: AmandaC on April 23, 2007, 08:44:00 PM
Thanks for your answers, mine was damaged at the hip, not the spine.  They stretched the sciatic nerve which connects to the pereneol nerve so there is the possibility for regeneration but it is a long way to regenerate from.  I can now move my foot inwards and occassionally outwards but this is very unregular.  Good luck for your operation and for a speedy recovery afterwards.
Amanda
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Max Pwr on April 24, 2007, 02:02:43 AM
Hello and Welcome Amanda,

I, like you, suffered a hip injury which left me with drop foot.  Here's a readers Digest version.  October 2005 ice hocley game, I went into the boards feet first with a locked knee, caused my fumer to break through my pelvis, sciatic nerve fine at this time.  Acetabulum reconstruction and a ton of phsio follow.  Alas, Acetabulum fails and I have a Birmingham Hip Resurfacing June 2006, wake with drop foot.  No known cause, most likely a stretched sciatic.  Now, April 2007 and still no significant improvement (ten months), although I do have some movement inwards and outwards but very weak, but movement nonetheless.  No dorsiflexion at all.  I had decompression surgery last month which basically means the neurosurgeon opened me up from sciatic at hip to peroneal at knee to determine where damage was and if it could be fixed.  He cleaned all the scar material that might have been impedeing progress and closed me up.  He could not give me a likelihood of recovery.   I have had three EMG's and no they don't hurt too bad, just a sharp feeling every now and then, but nothing compared to what you have gone through to get where you are now, it'll be  a piece of cake for you.   Living with foot drop is not easy and I have good days and bad.  I just tell myself to be strong and I focus entirely on the positive and try to ignore the negative.  I still hope for a good recovery, but like you said, it'll be sometime.  The doctor that told you the three month story is full of sh**!  I've talked to many specialists who claim that recovery is seen in some patients up to three years after the injury and one fellow I know saw a complete recovery at seven years.  Therefore, never give up hope.  I know those AFO's are terrible, I swear everyday I have to put mine on too.  Keep your hopes up and don't be afraid to ask all the questions you may have, I'd love to answer them.  Hopefully we can get throught this together and look back and shake our heads at how we worried when we didn't have to.     
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: AmandaC on April 24, 2007, 09:18:12 AM
Thanks for your reply Max
Sounds like you to have been through the mill over the past 18 months.  When you had your nerve decompression operation did the surgeon see any obvious damage?  Did he think the nerve was still in tack, if it is my first specialist said that there was a 80% chance within 18 months so lets hope thats both of us.  Do you suffer from nerve pain?  If so has it got better over time.  I have manager to return to work the past month, reduced hours at this stage and am at the gym and swimming, have you manged to return to work.  In my case the surgeon told me he had to stretch the nerve considerably but was a little surprised with the foot drop when I woke up.  Do you still walk with a limp?  How is your hip now?  I still have alot of stiffness and limited movement in mine, my hip was reconstucted with metal ware, looks pretty impressive in the X-Rays.  Thanks for the info about the EMG, I shouldn't be such a wimp but have had enough pain...... and im sure everyone on this Forum has.
Thanks for your replies everyone and hope we all continue to improve.
Amanda
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Max Pwr on April 25, 2007, 02:29:41 AM
Hi Amanda...sounds like we've all been through so much.  Hopefully, we can all look back in awe of how resiliant the human body can be.  With any luck we'll all be walking well within a matter of months.  In regard to your questions.

During the decompression surgery the surgeon didn't see any obvious damage i.e. there were no tears or disections of the sciatic or peroneal branch of the sciatic.  There were places where it appeared that the nerve was trapped between hard fascia (a protective coating on the muscles) and scar tiisse so he was able to release the nerve from any impingement.  As wel,l the nerve seemed discloured and glossy in a couple of places and smaller than it should be but intact nonetheless. Pre-op we spoke of possibly doing a nerve graft (harvesting a good nerve from the good leg and grafting it onto my bad one) but once he opened me up he saw no reason.  With a nerve graft, the success rate would be lower than that of a regeneration with the damaged nerve I already was sporting so I was happy we didn't do the graft.  At the beginning of the affliction I had tremendous horrific nerve pain that would make me literally jump and almost cry.  I refused to take any pain meds thinking it would go away and that I was tough.  However the pain was so bad one night I cried while in bed and my wife made me go to see our family doctor.  He prescribed some gabepentin and it helped a lot, although I was still getting pain it was managable.  Today I don't take any pain meds and I don't need any, I still get an odd shot of nerve pain, a little "how do you do" every now and then, but even these shocks are pale in comparisson and are more annoying than painful.  As for work, I have returned full time.  I'm a 36 yr old policeman and I had to prove to them I could do the job so I went and ran the obstacle course they make the recruits run (while wearing my AFO).  I didn't have a record time or anything but it was enough for them to let me go back to full duties, I was SWAT before I got hurt, I'm hoping one day to get back to doing that as I loved it so much.   These days I'm up at about 5 am and on the treadmill walking as fast as I can for about three miles; I can't run well enough yet to put a serious run in yet, I can run in an emergency etc, but recreationally I still have aways to go.  Again, I hope to get back to jogging seriously when my foot wakes up.  I am still stiff every now and then but I try not to limp, although sometimes I know I just do.  I'm guessing that'll go away too, but it's hard when your foot doesn't work, it's hard to have a natural gait.  My hip now is good, I see my orthopedic surgeon tomorrow for a follow up, I'm not expecting any surprises as the hip has never felt better since I got hurt.

I wish you the very best in your recovery and will pray you too will get back to the things you loved to do before the injury.  Have faith that things will return and stay positive, those are the hardest things to do. 

Sorry the message was so long but when I got hurt I tried to get some answers from people who went through the same things and no one would help, therefore I promised if someone came to me for some help or to share my story I would...at length...this site is great, you'll find some good friends here.

Hope everyone is doing well and healing well.  Meet you at at Andre's game sometime when we don't need the AFO's!

~Max~
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on April 25, 2007, 04:34:50 PM
Hi Guys and welcome Amanda, glad you have come and joined us.

Sorry I have not had access to a pc for a few days so just catching up.

Gordon. Glad to see your leg is getting stronger and the flexion and extention is coming. I was at PT today and she measured my flexion at 115 degrees but my extention has been a problem. I got a good talking to last week about really pushing it to get results. I have been working really hard this week at the gym and really pushing to the limit and my muscles are hurting like hell. Looks like it is working tho.

Amanda. My nerve pain was really bad for the first 3 ot 4 months after my injury but settled down after that. It does come back unannounced at times though to let me know it is still there. Good luck with the EMG test! Still no date for my EMG yet.

Jackie. Goodluck with the surgery and keep us posted with your progress. We will be thinking of you.

Max. Are you up and about and back to work after your decompression surgery?

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on April 25, 2007, 07:29:39 PM
I saw my GP today and told her about the operation date and the fact it is three days before my planned nerve conduction test so won't be able to attend.  She is very pleased with the nerve regeneration I have made but still wants me for a nerve conduction test in three months time to guage what level of recovery has been made as that is probably it.  Not what I expected but hey.  Hope you are all OK
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on April 27, 2007, 05:20:36 AM


Mom - I read your post and really feel for you little girl, it is bad enough a adult having to deal with this but for a young child is just dreadful.  I have a little girl, turning 2 on Saturday

Look forward to talking and hoping we all have full recovery stories in the future.
Amanda

Hello All,

I am back and my "medical situation" went well.  I'll send you all PMs soon.

Welcome Amanda!  I feel for your pain and wish you well in recovery.  We will help each other all we can.

As you have probably figured out by reading the posts, we like to call nerve pain "The Dragon."  :)

This name was invented by my little girl because she often says her pain feels like "a dragon in her leg."  We also know that pain can come about right after an injury but that pain can also come about during nerve regeneration.  Dragons may in fact heal.

We are still seeing frequent visits from the dragon with my daughter.  A few times last week she woke up screaming in agony and we had to give her Motrin, Tylenol, etc.  She one night even said, "The dragon is back!  The medicine isn't working!" 

We still do the EMS unit every day, or "tickle stickers" as we call them.  We are on a break from PT because of insurance.

We are rooting for you Jacky! 

How has everyone else been?

Keep in touch and our thoughts and prayers are with you, thank you all for your thoughts and prayers as well.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on April 28, 2007, 12:20:39 AM
Hey Mom,

Well done! Really happy for you. Things going well for me and really working hard on my knee. It does mean a bit of pain but I can handle that.

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on April 28, 2007, 10:59:33 PM
Hello and Welcome Amanda,

 The doctor that told you the three month story is full of sh**!  I've talked to many specialists who claim that recovery is seen in some patients up to three years after the injury and one fellow I know saw a complete recovery at seven years.  Therefore, never give up hope.  I know those AFO's are terrible, I swear everyday I have to put mine on too.  Keep your hopes up and don't be afraid to ask all the questions you may have, I'd love to answer them.  Hopefully we can get throught this together and look back and shake our heads at how we worried when we didn't have to.     

I hope this is true.  I have also read some cases where recovery can happen YEARS later despite many doctors giving a strict time frame for recovery.

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on May 01, 2007, 12:47:26 AM
Hey everyone

Welcome Amanada C. Wish you all the best in your recovery and hope to see tremendous progression...as we have seen in others.

Hey all the CFL draft is on  Wednesday May 2nd...wish me luck as i now face the hardest hurdle ..proving to the teams that i am fuctional and ready and not a liability to them. i had acouple of workouts for cfl teams this past week one being my home town Toronto and B.C results for T.O: i ran my 40 yard dash in a 4.5 and my lateral test in a 4.45....comparable to avgerage.B.C results: i ran the 40 in 4.3 flat and a 4.31 lateral after tons of technique practicing. i got on the feild and played as if i was never injured. i was brought in for a CYBEX test...this machine if you are not fimiliar test the strength in the joints of the body and was used on me to test my power and strength in knee and ankle compared to the right.

my knee test i passed with just a small deficit in power in my injured leg...nothing to bad as im only 7 months post acl surgery. my foot on the other hand was much weaker then the right. my inversion was about 40 percent weaker in the left......eversion about 60.....dorsi flexion 80 but my plantar flexion in the left was 50 percent sronger then the right ......i was told this was my body compensating for the weaker dorsi flexion...as i use ..my push off and momentum to spring my foot up with the weak "tib ant" muscle. these test were all done under load and with endurance repitions of 20-30...and endurance was stable for the ankle just a strength comparison issue. i am still working hard to correct every aspect of this injury to the best of my ability....but it is functional and capable of handling the demand of high intensity sport.

i will keep you posted on the draft. Keep recovering  Everyone

and i have posted a segment that will be aired on The Score about the injury for draft time.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P-10DQiu0Hw
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: G_Bronson on May 01, 2007, 02:37:24 AM
Hey everyone,
Welome Amanda C, I wish you all the best in your healing and recovery.

Jackie i hope your surgery goes well for you.

I am still doing my physio and EMS Eveyday, my leg is starting to look more normal, i still have a way to go however but things are progressing nicely. My nerve pain has calmed dowm alot. i get one or two shock like feelings a day but the really bad pain had calmed down alot. When i do my EMS i can feel the nerve down in my foot between my big toe and second toe vibrate. That sounds funny i know but that is the best way to describe it. It did ont happen before so hopefully it is a sign that something is getting through and there has been some smalll regeneration.

Andre that quite the video bud, you have come along way. I hope the draft goes well for you my friend ill be watching and wishing you good luck. That link for The Score video that you posted has no sound. You look like you never had any trouble with your knee at all from how good you were moving.

Hamish, Max and Mom444 i hope you all are doing well.

All the Best!
Gordon
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: AmandaC on May 01, 2007, 06:31:01 AM
Hey everyone

Thanks for your welcome messages.
Gordon I to use a EMS everyday and just lately my foot has started shaking slightly which it did not do before, still no sign of the muscle contracting but I keep hoping.

I had a report from my Nurologist arrive on Friday, four pages or big words but the bottom line...
Amanda is likely to improve over time.
Apparently there cases were people get the feeling back the sensatory nerve but not function the motor nerve.  I hope we all get both back, I think I could live without the function if I did not have this nerve pain 24/7.

I dont have a date for EMG yet but they said should be in the month May.

Thanks everyone for answering all my questions.
Great chating with you all
Amanda
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on May 01, 2007, 01:24:40 PM
Andre,

best of luck buddy - hope all your dreams come true, and remember, no pressure but we are all going to watch you play and I intend to come all that way only for a top flight game! 
Amanada - I can so relate to what you are saying, I was remember thinking, no movement and no pain is OK, movement and pain is definately OK, no movement and pain was not acceptable.
Mom - any update on your daughters dragons?
Gordon - good to hear from you and that feeling can only be good news.  I never had the EMS as I was told by my physio that the equipment was to expensive and they didn't have one - maybe I'll do a sponsored run this time next year and raise some money for them as they have been so good getting me back walking again.
Hamish - are you still working that knee?  what progress on your foot?
Max - How is it going?  You say you are back to full duties but I take it not doing SWAT?  I see you did the fitness test with your split on - I took my splint off for the shuttle run as I found the splint difficult for the turns and once I had the momentum, running without the splint was easier, have you tried it on the treadmill without your splint?  Also I bought a trampet and jog on that and found that my calf muscles have really built up as the splint makes the calf muscles weak and lazy.  Just my thoughts.........

Thank you all for your well wishes for my operation, it is very much appreciated - just 9 days to go.....
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on May 01, 2007, 05:52:59 PM


my knee test i passed with just a small deficit in power in my injured leg...nothing to bad as im only 7 months post acl surgery. my foot on the other hand was much weaker then the right. my inversion was about 40 percent weaker in the left......eversion about 60.....dorsi flexion 80 but my plantar flexion in the left was 50 percent sronger then the right ......i was told this was my body compensating for the weaker dorsi flexion...as i use ..my push off and momentum to spring my foot up with the weak "tib ant" muscle. these test were all done under load and with endurance repitions of 20-30...and endurance was stable for the ankle just a strength comparison issue. i am still working hard to correct every aspect of this injury to the best of my ability....but it is functional and capable of handling the demand of high intensity sport.

i will keep you posted on the draft. Keep recovering  Everyone

and i have posted a segment that will be aired on The Score about the injury for draft time.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P-10DQiu0Hw

Thank you everyone for all of your sweet personal messages!  My family and I are doing well.

My daughter had about a week of more consistent dragons, but they have taken a break the last few days.

We have another EMG on May 10th so I'm trying to be calm and hopeful.

Andre, this is interesting how your other muscles are "compensating" for your lack of dorsiflexion.  I'm not sure if my daughter has something similar.  When she walks without her brace she still "flops her foot" but she can maintain balance, etc.

Jacky, Max, Hamish, Amanda, Gordon, et. al, good luck to all of you!

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: AmandaC on May 02, 2007, 02:33:44 AM
Hello all

Mom - Good luck for your daughters EMG on the 10th, I have just got my date and have one on the 16th.  Am really nervous, not about the test but about the results.  Fingers crossed we both get some good news, I will be thinking of your little girl on the 10th.

Hamish, Max & Gordon - hope everything is going well for you and keep your spirits up.
 j_smi001 - Hope your operation goes well.

Had a bad day yesterday and this morning didn't want to get myself organised, but made myself get myself and my little girl dressed and took her to dance to music, it is for little ones.  Felt heaps better afterwards, have to remember life dosent revolve around me and my floppy foot I have others to think about.

Will keep you posted on my EMG results.
Amanda
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Max Pwr on May 02, 2007, 04:07:05 AM
Andre, I'll be thinking of you dude, I wish you the best, the ultimate comeback ... awesome... I hope I get half the success you do in your recovery.

Jackie - I did run the obstacle course with my brace on, and I am full duties but just for Robbery/Homicide, not SWAT; hopefully that'll come when I get my dorsi-flexion back.  I saw my Ortho surgeron last week and he was amazed at how well I'm doing and the work ethic I've got to get back.  He says that the hip will hold no matter what I do so I have his blessing.  I'm now just waiting for the floppiness to go away so I don't have to wear the AFO.  I haven't tried the treadmill without the AFO, I'm scared to even try.  I have no dorsi-flexion at all so I can't see how running without the AFO would be safe for me, unless someone can reassure me that it would be... Oh and if we don't touch base before the surgery please know I'll be praying for you and hope it all goes well.  I know deep down it will and you'll be chasing bad guys really soon, just don't chase them to Canada..wait till I get my foot back at least, then I'll send them back across the pond.

Hamish, Gordon, Amanda, and Mom - I think about you guys everyday and draw strength from your perseverance.  Hang in there and know you're not alone.  I still think in a couple of years you should all come to Calgary when Andre's playing here and we'll all go to the game,  Then I'll take you out to the Canadian Rockies where we'll poke Grizzly bears with a stick and run away, just because we don't have to use the AFO's anymore!

Hope this note finds you all well.
~Mad~

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on May 02, 2007, 05:36:07 AM


my knee test i passed with just a small deficit in power in my injured leg...nothing to bad as im only 7 months post acl surgery. my foot on the other hand was much weaker then the right. my inversion was about 40 percent weaker in the left......eversion about 60.....dorsi flexion 80 but my plantar flexion in the left was 50 percent sronger then the right ......i was told this was my body compensating for the weaker dorsi flexion...as i use ..my push off and momentum to spring my foot up with the weak "tib ant" muscle. these test were all done under load and with endurance repitions of 20-30...and endurance was stable for the ankle just a strength comparison issue. i am still working hard to correct every aspect of this injury to the best of my ability....but it is functional and capable of handling the demand of high intensity sport.

i will keep you posted on the draft. Keep recovering  Everyone

and i have posted a segment that will be aired on The Score about the injury for draft time.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P-10DQiu0Hw

Thank you everyone for all of your sweet personal messages!  My family and I are doing well.

My daughter had about a week of more consistent dragons, but they have taken a break the last few days.

We have another EMG on May 10th so I'm trying to be calm and hopeful.

Andre, this is interesting how your other muscles are "compensating" for your lack of dorsiflexion.  I'm not sure if my daughter has something similar.  When she walks without her brace she still "flops her foot" but she can maintain balance, etc.

Jacky, Max, Hamish, Amanda, Gordon, et. al, good luck to all of you!




hEY mOM444

i used to do the same thing whn my brace was off and found myself walking on my toes(left foot only) so it wouldnt flop. i was told not to do this..but i would do it insticntively.i think alot of it had to do with not being able to sense the bottoms of my feet well enough to balance ..so my toes(which i could feel..except for the big toe) gave me a better sense of space around me and stability. do you find her using her plantar flexion more often ?
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on May 02, 2007, 12:50:33 PM
Hey Guys,

Goodluck with the draft Andre! It is amazing how well you have done and you must be so excited. I have also done the tiptoe walking mainly so I knew I wouldn't trip over my toes when walking.

Jackie, I to have never used an EMS machine for much the same reason that the PT at the hospital don't have/can't afford one. I will have to look into how much one costs to see whether I can get one for myself. I will do anything to aid the recovery and if this will help I will try it unless the cost is prohibitive.

Amanda. I think we can be forgiven for those little moments when we feel down. Keep your head up and all the hard work will be worth it in the end.

Max and Gordon, keep things going!

Me, I'm still working away and knee getting stronger all the time and that has been my focus over the last couple of months. I was on my feet for most of the day yesterday and OMG my ankle was hurting. No movement yet with the foot but feeling positive. Heading off to the gym now.

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on May 02, 2007, 03:23:30 PM
Hello all

Mom - Good luck for your daughters EMG on the 10th, I have just got my date and have one on the 16th.  Am really nervous, not about the test but about the results.  Fingers crossed we both get some good news, I will be thinking of your little girl on the 10th.

Hamish, Max & Gordon - hope everything is going well for you and keep your spirits up.
 j_smi001 - Hope your operation goes well.

Had a bad day yesterday and this morning didn't want to get myself organised, but made myself get myself and my little girl dressed and took her to dance to music, it is for little ones.  Felt heaps better afterwards, have to remember life dosent revolve around me and my floppy foot I have others to think about.

Will keep you posted on my EMG results.
Amanda

Amanda,  thanks for the well wishes.  Good luck on your EMG also.  We'll be praying for you too.

Andre,  I'm not sure if she uses extra plantar flexion when she walks.  What I've noticed that she does do often is that she lots of times prefers to RUN rather than walk.  When she skips or runs I think it offsets the floppy foot.  Again, she is almost four now however still so young and it's hard to get her to talk about what she feels.  It's difficult interpreting her sometimes.

Jacky,  hope you are doing well with your treatment and recovery.

Gordon, Hamish, Max, et al., hang in there.  We're thinking about you.

Also, I LOVE Canada!  We live right near the border.  It would be cool if some day we could all meet for a recovery party. 

Maybe near the Falls?  On the Canadian side, of course! 
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on May 04, 2007, 01:04:37 AM
HEY ALL,

after an almost heart breaking day things worked out for the best....the long awaited draft took place yesterday at 1:00pm and i was predicted to go in the 3-4 round out of 6. as i waited names were being called and none of them were mine.after all six rounds i did not get selected. Then it was brought to my attention that we have a waiver draft.....something like a draft extension for teams to solidify one more player....and i was chosen by my home town the Toronto Argos. the deal went through last night and was officical at 12am..i sign sometime within the next couple of days. This is Truly a blessing and i am face to face with the hardest hurdle of making the team believe that i am very capable of playing pro and that i m just as good if not better then there"healthy" players in my position.


Just wanted to let yall in on the great news....and mom444 meeting up would be a great idea...im game.

Andre
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Max Pwr on May 04, 2007, 03:58:22 AM
Andre, I got home from work yesterday after listening to the draft on the radio (and not hearing your name mentioned) and I ran to the computer to the CFL web site to see if you were called.  Needless to say I was disappointed to not see your name on any of the six rounds.  I was going to write something last night, but wasn't sure what to write.  However, seeing your message tonight was awesome!  Dude, to be spoken for by the Argo's after what you've been through is great, almost too good to be true!  (Maybe you can take Ricky Williams spot...not hard to beat those numbers).  You've worked harder than anyone I've ever known, so it bodes well for you and has finally paid off.  I know you'll go to the show, just have faith and keep workiing like you always do and it will be inevitable.   I'm so proud of you and even prouder to say that I'm an aquaintance of yours.  You continue to inspire me everyday.

Everyone, this is big news here in Canada, especially in the realm of pro sports up here.  Congratualtions again Andre and kick some butt.

-Max-   
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on May 04, 2007, 04:11:47 AM
Andre,

Let us know if you are ever on Canadian TV.  I can pick up the Canadian and TO news where I am.



Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on May 04, 2007, 04:32:47 PM
Well done Andre, but in my mind never in any doubt - you are so cool and set the standard for us all to make the grade in our own ways.  I am particularly pleased as my trip to Canada is looking more likely now - just need to get through round two and I'll be there - actually on that point when is the football season?  I promise to look up about the game whilst recuperating, I have no excuses as I will in incapacitated for a few weeks.  My Granddad was a Canadian but died when I was 9 so didn't really get to know him so it will be good to go Canada to seek out my roots.  Just going to carry on panicking now..................
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on May 06, 2007, 03:57:40 AM
Hey All,

I have no idea if this is something to be excited about or not but...  MY DAUGHTER CAN MOVE HER BIG TOE.  She may even be able to kind of move some of the other toes on her left foot also.

I honestly can't remember exactly if she had ever lost the ability to move her toes on her left foot, but I think she may have. 

This is strange...  But tonight after doing her EMS therapy my husband and I noticed that she was able to wiggle her big toe.  We almost didn't believe it so we told her, "Wait!  Do that again!"  Sure enough the big toe and possibly some of the others moved.

So...  I have taken a break from frantically researching, but does anyone know if this is a good sign?  I know that some of you had before mentioned that even after getting some dorsiflexion back that you still could not move your big toe.  Mind you, that as of now my daughter still has not gained back any noticable dorsiflexion but the big toe can move.  Again...  This is so strange.

I had a wonderful printout that I had gotten off the Web that showed in detail all of the muscles that control dorsiflexion and it showed also the muscles that control the toes, etc.  I lost the printout and I can't find the Website again!   :(

So...  I'm just really confused.  Should I be excited?  Is it something related or unrelated to recovery? 

I hope you all are well.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: footballcrazy on May 09, 2007, 01:05:20 AM
Amdre, Congratulations on your remarkable recovery and on the football draft.  I'm 6'5", 240 and had surgery to remove an osteochondroma (a tumor) off my growth plate. I'm 17 and had this growth since 2000.  I was told that since it wasn't bothering me that I should just leave it alone, but that it could develop into cancer later on in life, but if they took it off too soon that it would just grow back again as I grew. Back on 3/8/08 I decided to get it taken off before my senior year of football to get get it out of the way, little did I know that I would end up with drop foot.  I am currently being recruiited by Division One colleges and I am worried that no one will give me a chance now.  I have peroneal motor nerve injury and have all feeling in my foot and leg and no pain, but I am not able to lift my foot. I can move my toes and move my ankle back and forth and also push down with all my strength and have now had two nerve test done four weeks a part the only difference is that he was able to get a small reading from my foot motor muscle, which is better than nothing. One specialist wants to do another surgery, but I don't want another one. I run two miles a day and lift weights every day and also play basketball. I can put full weight on my foot with no problem, but I just can't lift my foot. Doctors don't know everything and I am going to prove to everyone that I can do it. I'm not missing my senior year. I just wanted to let you know that you inspired me and everyone else on this board. I'll keep you informed of my progress. I know of an almighty physican known as Jesus Christ and he can heal me completely. Keep the Faith!!There is a reason for everything and I plan on using this injury to make others on my team work harder.  If I can do it they can work harder. Good Luck to everyone and don't ever give up hope. I'm not.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on May 09, 2007, 03:33:24 AM
AWESOME NEWS MOM444!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

this is an amazing sign of regeneration....i am so happy to hear the good news!!!!!!!!

for more info on my experience with regeneration.....i was looking at my foot and saw my toe twitch. i thought it was the ability to move my toe(which i cant do) and eventually progressed into dorsiflexion. so maybe it is toe movement or it may be dorsi flexion. the thing i read about the toes is that the extensor hallicous longus muscle is kind of deep and strengthening and nerve regeneration is hard to do because ou cant treat the atrophied muscle due to its location. i have a feeling your toe movement is DF and once your daugther gets her Dorsiflexion back we need to send her some recovery GIFTS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

KEEP US POSTED AS U ALWAYS DO.

Hey Footballcrazy

good to see that you have the right mind for approaching this situation...and i dont mean just wanting to play ..i mean...wanting to get better...you have a healthy mind for this and that alone will take you far in recovery "easy" part. teams also want to see how bad you want to play...how you handle adversity...and mainly how you recovery from injury since 99.9% of football players get injured.....so you recovering from something like this..to me ...is a positive ...and shows health and stability in the mind and thats what they pay you for. anyone can play ball...not eveyone can handle it...i know you can....keep working hard and keep me posted.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on May 09, 2007, 04:44:45 PM
AWESOME NEWS MOM444!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

this is an amazing sign of regeneration....i am so happy to hear the good news!!!!!!!!

for more info on my experience with regeneration.....i was looking at my foot and saw my toe twitch. i thought it was the ability to move my toe(which i cant do) and eventually progressed into dorsiflexion. so maybe it is toe movement or it may be dorsi flexion. the thing i read about the toes is that the extensor hallicous longus muscle is kind of deep and strengthening and nerve regeneration is hard to do because ou cant treat the atrophied muscle due to its location. i have a feeling your toe movement is DF and once your daugther gets her Dorsiflexion back we need to send her some recovery GIFTS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

KEEP US POSTED AS U ALWAYS DO.

at they pay you for. anyone can play ball...not eveyone can handle it...i know you can....keep working hard and keep me posted.

Welcome to the forum footballcrazy!  We wish you the best!  Please let us know how your recovery is going!

Andre,

I hope you are right about the toe.  You said you have kids so I'm sure you know how feisty and non cooperative kids can be  ;)

Sometimes when we ask her to move her toe, she claims she can't.  Other times, she looks like she might be pushing the other toes around the big toe downward to make it look like an optical illusion where the big toe is moving.  Yet other times it does look like the big toe is in fact moving.  My mother in law claims she saw my daughter's toe move also.

Well we have the next EMG tomorrow and I am just trying to not think about it or get too worried.  The last EMG was in February so about three months ago.  Remember how the rehab doctor was kind of negative and alarming with us?  He claimed that she had some recovery but "not enough" in his eyes.  He also said that if she did not get significant recovery in the next few months that he thought she'd never get better?  He is also the doctor who claimed that her scar tissue was so bad that we'd have to rush her into another surgery, and he was wrong there.

With all the "dragons" she's had in the past few months, I certainily hope that some more improvement is seen.  Also, didn't you also say that after nine months some doctors clamed you'd never get better but you still did?

Jacky,

If you are out there, how have you been lately? Are you still recovering?  I know that you said part of your recovery also seemed to start with a toe or two?

Blessings and best to everyone.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on May 10, 2007, 12:25:15 PM
Hello All,
Sorry mom444 - I am about, well for today at least as tomorrow I go in to hospital have my other leg done.  I will update as soon as possible but it did take about a week before i felt with it enough to post.  Even if not around I will be thinking of you all.  I am positive that the toe movement is a good sign.  I do have big toe movement although that was the last one to come back - I first had my little toe (which was very active) then the others slowly joined in, then a bit of flicking of the foot and the the big toe last. 
Welcome to footballcrazy, you have joined a very inspirational and supportive thread that will try to answer any questions through our own experiences.  Take care all - see you in about a weeks time xx
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on May 10, 2007, 04:53:02 PM
Well done Andre I am so happy for you! You will be a great success.

Goodluck with the surgery Jackie we will all be thinking of you and let us know as soon as you can that you are ok.

Welcome aboard footballcrazy to our happy band of floppy footers and those that have recovered. Hang in there and work hard you have a great attitude.

Things with me are going well and my knee is improving all the time and I am managing to do more and more. I am detecting a hint of movement outwards with my foot (I think) and a slightly different sensation in my foot (sort of warm tingle) after finishing my workout at the gym today but not getting too excited. See my PT tomorrow so will see what she thinks.

Will have to add Toronto Argos to the list of teams I support.

Hope everyone is doing well.

Hamish 
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on May 10, 2007, 09:36:05 PM
THANK YOU ALL SO MUCH FOR YOUR PRAYERS!

My daughter had another EMG today.  I made my husband take her because I knew I'd be sick to my stomach...  I was.  While I waited I paced the floor, prayed, and nearly threw up.

Well, it turns out that the EMG SHOWS SOME MORE RECOVERY!  The rehab medicine doctor also said that there's toe movement and that there may be some more innervation in the muscles.  Now mind you that there is still no obvious dorsiflexion but there is in fact some of what he called "progress."

So this is great!  I really believe that all of your prayers helped.  The dragons were so consistent for a few weeks and that most likely was the regeneration.  Now the dragons have not been around for a week and a half now, but many of you have said that they do in fact take "breaks" now and then.

So, I am a little more relieved now.  We are still not out of the woods entirely, there is still more healing and rehabbing to do...

But I feel so much better!

I hope all of you are also doing well and making progress!
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: AmandaC on May 10, 2007, 09:48:29 PM
Mom 444
That is wonderful news am so happy for you.  I bet you slept well last night.
Hamish - Good news all around for you, you are doing wonderful
j_smi001  - Good luck for your op today, am sure you will breeze through it
footballcrazy - welcome aboard

Am hoping someone can help me out?  I had a terrible day yesterday had to travel to two medical appointments and both I felt were a waste of time and have left me feeling depressed.  The first was to have new walking splint fitted ( a toe of) and a night splint as I have never had one.  I have been waiting 9 weeks, they finally rang to say they had arrived but when I got there the wrong night splint had been sent and the toe of splint was no were to be seen.  Can any one tell me what sort of night resting splint they use?  They send me home with one but I had to take it of last night as the straps across the foot had to be done up so tight to make the heel sit in and after 4 hours I had enough and took it of?
My second appointment was with the pain team who told me that nerve pain is the worst pain to try and control - well we all knew that one.  He has played around with my meds a bit but dosent feel it is going to help much.  He told me that in his experience if you have nerve damage that includes motor loss and sensory loss as I do that the chances  of recovery are next to nothing.  Can anyone pass on any information regarding this comment from the doctor.

Sorry to sound depressing and negative - feeling like had enough ready to give up
Thanks Amanda
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on May 10, 2007, 10:54:01 PM
Hi Amanda,

My nightsplint is called a Dorsiwedge and is quite bulky and when in bed never fits tightly. Although it is a pain to wear I have got used to it and it doesn't bother me much now and I know it is quite important to make sure your tendons don't shorten. Try and stick with it if you can.

As for the doctor I think he is talking bullshit and recovery is very possible as people on this thread have proven. My doctors and physios have always said to me that there is a chance of no recovery and I feel they say that to cover their backs so no false hope is given but speaking to other professionals not treating me give another more positive response and nerves do regenerate and recovery is very possible. Try and keep your head up and stay positive.

Mom444
Great news with the recovery, I am so pleased for you.

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: AmandaC on May 17, 2007, 12:58:57 AM
Hello all               
Thanks for that info on Dorsiwedge the orthopedics guys are looking into it for me.
Went for my EMG last night, pereneal nerve showing no response at all, tibial nerve down the back working but shows significant damange as well.  Sciatic nerve at top is responding but very damanged and muscles extremely weak.  The nurologist is not hopeful of a recovery due the state of the nerve up top.  He wants to do another one in 9 months.

Not the news I was after but cant change it.
Hope you are all well
Amanda
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on May 17, 2007, 11:42:22 AM
Hi Amanda,

Sounds like you are  pretty down after the tests but these tests are not definitive and Andre had tests come back negative on  couple of occassions and he made a recovery. Keep your head up and stay positive.

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on May 17, 2007, 01:16:39 PM
Keep the faith Amanda!   :)

I also hope that things get better for you.  We have all learned that doctors are not always right and miracles do happen.

We had mixed messages with my daughter also, but her last EMG did show some improvement.

We had the follow up with the neurologist (I didn't go the appointment, that was the same doctor with whom I got in a fight!) 

The neurologist, who was also so negative, agreed there was improvement.

The dragon still comes now and then.  His last appearance was a week ago and she woke up in intense pain.

Amanda, I apologize if you already answered, but do you get "dragons" or nerve pain?  Remember, the pain can signal the pain from the initial injury but the pain can also signal recovery.

We'll keep you all in our prayers.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Max Pwr on May 19, 2007, 10:39:42 PM
Hi Everyone,

Just checking in, I've been busy at work these days so I haven't been around much.  No real news at this end, I haven't lost belief that my foot is about to wake up any day now.  The only real problem I'm having (besides the no-dorsi-felxion) is my big toe as it still gets quite sore and the fact that my AFO drives me simply mad.  Unfortunately I can't really walk without it, as we all know.  I wish there was something out there that felt and acted a bit more naturally; and I could wear my normal sized shoes too, I would buy it for a months wages ...

Mom - Keep up the good Mantra - your daughter needs it, and I hope you're getting a little sleep these days, rest is so important.  I know things will keep improving, they have to; soon you won't be able to catch her she'll be running so fast.

Amanda - Don't be fooled by these neurologists; some simply say these things because its so easy to say, they don't understand what you're going through and how strong the human body can be.  Look at the people that survive broken necks and others that survive terminal cancer.  It's amazing what the human body can do, as long as you believe.  The minute you give up hope is the minute things won't change for the better.  Our neurologists said the exact same thing to us too but we all believe things will get better.  Andre can attest as his doctors told him no hope, now he's sprinting as fast as guys who never had the injury.  As for the sciatic at the hip, I'm gong through the same thing and it may take longer for us but it'll come around, frustrating as it may be.   

Hamish - Keep up the good work buddy, you're doing great.
Jackie - Haven't heard how recovery is going, did everything go well?  I often wonder how you are.
Gordon - any progress?
Well guys, I'll sign off here, I think about everyone often and hope we'll all be dorsi-flexing soon.

-Max-
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on May 21, 2007, 01:34:51 PM
Hi Max,

Have you seen the Foot-up (see link below). I got myself one of these to wear instead of the AFO. You can wear this with normal shoes as long as they are lace-up shoes. I alternate between using this and my AFO. The good thing is that it is a bit lower profile than the AFO but on the other hand it gives you a little less stability and you have to keep adjusting it as it can dig into your ankle a bit and you have to make sure the tongue in secure in your laces.

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on May 21, 2007, 01:35:34 PM
sorry link!

https://www.storesonline.com/site/986957/product/FTUP

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Max Pwr on May 21, 2007, 08:33:24 PM
Hey Ham, good to hear from you.  I actually have a foot up already, I bought it before the AFO thinking that would be all I neded, but it just deosn't seem strong enough, the AFO seems to correct my gait whereas the foot up doesn't seem to give me enough dorsi-felxion and I end up hiking my hip a bit more.  I was hoping to use it when the dorsiflexion came back but was still weak (I hope that happens soon).  There's another AFO I'd like to try, I've attached the link, I'm hoping someone hear has heard whether or not its any good.  If you have please share your thoughts with me.  It appears that it will fit into your shoes a bit better...

http://www.worry-free.net/rothschildsorthopedics/foot-drop.html

Hope everyone is having a great weekend (It's a long weekend here in Canada, but do you believe it's snowing !!!!)

~Max~

 
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on May 21, 2007, 09:57:16 PM
Hey Max,

That AFO looks great. I wonder how I can get one and how much one will cost. Looks far more trendy than the one I have. Yes I have found the foot-up is not much good for my normal shoes but works quite well in my trainers because the tongue fits well into the laces and far enough forward to give enough support.

Hamish

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: AmandaC on May 22, 2007, 02:45:30 AM
Hi all
Hamish and Max have been reading your posts about braces etc, have either of you seen or used a Dorsi Strap, link below?  I to am finding it difficult to find good products.  I have a Dictus, think it is similar to the foot up you both have, is not practical at all for me, it wiggles down and cuts into my ankle and I walk like a total plonker in it, at least with my splint I only look like a half plonker the way I walk.  Hey Max you said that you can run, I have been trying and trying and just cant do it, my ankle aches after two steps and I pressure through my foot and ankle is terrible, I wonder if this is to do with having more nerve damage in the tibal nerve?  Do you run in your normal hinged splint?

Have had a few bad days after my EMG test results but am feeling a bit better and dragged my sorry back side to the gym again.  I went and watched friends riding in the weekend at a dressage competion, am starting to think about trying to ride again, I think if I was able to it would help me with my mental well being and would be good exercise for me.

Hamish and word on your EMG date yet?
Mom444 how is your little girl, and how are you doing, you make sure you look after yourself as this must have a huge impact on your health and general well being to.

j_smi001 Hope you operation went well, looking forward to hearing how you are doing.


http://x-strap.com/dorsi-strap.htm

Amanda
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on May 22, 2007, 04:34:17 AM
Jacky,

If you are out there...  Just want you to know we are all thinking of you and hope you are well...

To Everyone,

We are still just hanging in there.  The dragon is taking a break, but I hope he returns because his presence means healing.

We need to get a new referral to go back to physical therapy.  (We're in the US and health insurance can be tricky.)

...And I wonder what the PT will have to say about moving forward with treatment now that the EMG shows more recovery.

The first PT we saw tried to stimulate the peroneal nerve to make the foot dorsiflex, but that was not possible six months ago... 

...I wonder if there has been enough recovery to make the foot dorsiflex with electrical stimulation.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on May 22, 2007, 04:12:10 PM
Jacky,

If you are out there...  Just want you to know we are all thinking of you and hope you are well...

To Everyone,

We are still just hanging in there.  The dragon is taking a break, but I hope he returns because his presence means healing.

We need to get a new referral to go back to physical therapy.  (We're in the US and health insurance can be tricky.)

...And I wonder what the PT will have to say about moving forward with treatment now that the EMG shows more recovery.

The first PT we saw tried to stimulate the peroneal nerve to make the foot dorsiflex, but that was not possible six months ago... 

...I wonder if there has been enough recovery to make the foot dorsiflex with electrical stimulation.

Hey Mom444

Just read your recent post and dont be discouraged if the stimlation doesnt dorsiflex your foot....mine barely does to this day with stimulation and it takes alot of wattage to do it. How r u by the way ? i hope things are going well and just by the sounds of things it seems they are with regards to the recovery process and all.

Jacky, How are you ? i read that you have gone under te knife again...good luck to you in surgery sorry i havent been around much but i send you a get better soon hug via air mail...lol

Hey Amanda....i just saw your post on aching while you run. where do you ache in the aknle itself or on the joint of the ankle where it connect to the Tibia? i ask only because i had problems trying to jog after my first surgery and i was compensating by plantar flexing or running on the balls of my feet this would take away from me having to dorsi flex...but ruined my running mechanics.

Max, how have you been ? how was your long weekend?

Hey Hamish  Hope tings are well with you ....how do you feel since your last surgery ? its been about 4-5 months now right?

Sorry again everyone.....for just dropping in and out ....im starting to feel like an outcast....cause ive been gone so much. after this month things should slow down.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on May 22, 2007, 06:17:06 PM
Hey Andre,

I am now 14 weeks post ACLr and it was really hard to start with but doing a lot better now although I have really struggled to get my quads working again but they are slowly coming back. Major problem at the moment is that I get quite a bit of pain in my ankle but getting a lot more sensation down my leg and when I massage my leg below the knee it really sets the fireworks off in my foot. I am hoping this is a good thing. I have not had an EMG test yet despite putting a request in at the end of last November. It can sometimes take that long with the NHS here. I see my surgeon tomorrow so it will be interesting to see what he thinks of my progress and I will be chasing him up on the EMG test.

Jackie. Let us know how the surgery went as soon as you can.

Amanda. Glad to hear you are feeling better and more positive.

Hope everyone else is doing well.

Gordon let us know how you are progressing.

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: G_Bronson on May 23, 2007, 02:56:51 AM
Hey everyone, Sorry i have been absent but i had some problems with my laptop.
I am so pleased to hear that you all seem to be doing well. You are truely inspirational people.

Andre - Good show my friend, you must feel pretty good to have come so far with your recovery to get to the CFL. You are truely an inspiration to all of us and anyone who has faced adversity due to a serious injury. I will have to follow the Argos this season. My boss used to give me eskimo tickets quite often. So when i get back out to Edmonton in August i will have to start hounding hiom for some more and come cheer you on. Congrads man!!

Mom444- that is such great news that your little girl can move her toes. You have endured so much it must ease your mind aliitle, that is a definate sign that things are progressing positively.

Jacky- how did your surgery go? I hope it went well  for you. Ive been thinking of you and wish you all the best!

Hamish and Max- sounds like you guys are still working hard at it, keep it up, i am pulling for you.

I have been working really hard at my physio in the last few weeks. My leg seems to be doing well, range of motion is still improving i haventy got many degrees left to gain. The muscles have come back very well thus far so i will continue to work hard at it. I am still doing my EMS and have two appoinments next week. One is with my Surgeon and the second is with the neurologist, i am due for my second EMG it will be the five month mark since the injury and 4 since my surgery so i am not expecting much at this point, but hey you never know. The last time he tapped my nerve below the damaged are and i felt nothing but now when i do it i can feel it shoot right down to my toes, so hopefully that is a posotive sign.

AmanadaC-- I hope you are doing well, work hard and stay positive!!

Take care and i hope you all enjoyed the Vicotia day weekend!!
Gordon
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: desag on May 23, 2007, 03:12:18 AM
Hello all,

Thanks for posting all of your success stories and how you got thru the tough times!  I have been dealing with knee issues for about 6 years or so and I am determined to continue playing ice hockey and other sports and playing sports with my kids when they start  

Andre,

 I work out with my legs once or twice a week, depending on swelling and pain.  Do you have a routine you could recomend?  I would love to apply as much of your work out exercises as possible.  Good luck with the CFL!!!!!!!!
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: footballcrazy on May 23, 2007, 06:34:11 PM
Hello Everyone,
Amdre, Mom444, and Amanda. I just wanted everybody to know that our God is an awesome God and has healed my foot.  I was at school today and started trying to lift my foot like I always do and all of a sudden I was able to dorsiflex my foot two inches. I couldn't believe it. Everybody that I know has been praying for me and God has performed a miracle on me.  Do the electronic stimulation like they tell you to and most of all keep working out and being active.  I ran two miles a day and worked out twice a day. I recovered after having an exotosis removed off my growth plate and the peroneal motor nerve was apparently stretched and refused to work.  It took eleven weeks for my nerve to come back and the peroneal nerve surgeon wanted to another surgery on me before that, but he couldn't guarantee me that it would work again or that he would do more damage so I refused and just kept up the faith that my God could do anything if he wanted to and believed whole heartedly that he would heal me.  Don't always listen to doctors who give you no hope, because they don't know everything. The specialist said that most cases that he had seen would not get any better unless he did surgery again.  It takes a lot of patience that I didn't have, but I  kept on working out and was determined to play my senior year of football.  I'll keep you up to date on how the season goes.  :DJust don't ever give up hope and keep the faith.  May God heal everybody on this forum in Jesus name. AMEN
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on May 24, 2007, 09:26:58 PM
Hey all,

Had OS appointment yesterday and he checked out my knee and it seems to be in good order and ACLr seems to be sound. To continue with the rehab.

Checked my foot out as well and I have definately gained a little bit of aversion but no dorsiflexion yet. It is a bit strange as it appears that the part of the nerve that is giving me the movement is not giving any sensation but the other part concerned with doriflexion is not giving any movement but some sensation. Weird or what! I take it that both branches of the nerve are regenerating but have decided to do it in a different order.

He is chasing up my EMG test as he thinks I must be at the top of the list by now.

Gordon. Good to hear you are doing well. The positive tap test has now reached my ankle when for a long time after my injury it didn't go anywhere below the injury area. I'm at 9 months post injury.

Hope everyone is doing well.

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: AmandaC on May 25, 2007, 01:57:24 AM
footballcrazy - thats great news, you must have had a bruised nerve, great that your recovery is going to be quick and based on the short time taken should be complete - awesome news and hope your have a great year with your football

Hamish - Thats great news, sound like your recovery is going well.  HOw is your nerve pain these days?  Have you gained back some sensation since the injury?  I think I am getting changes in sensation at the side of my leg?  not really 100% sure though.

Hope everyone else is good.
Amanda
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: G_Bronson on May 26, 2007, 07:51:13 AM
Thats good news footballCrazy. I am very happy for you. good luck with the football this year.

Amanda- i have found the sensation has gotten better in my knee and foot. It was so bad efore that i could not even let sheets touch it. i still cant feel hot and cold very well but it has definetly improved. dosent hurt at all to put on shoes or my AFO. so hopefully that is a positive sign for you. It cant be a bad one thats for sure.

Hamish- I am happy to hear that you recieved some positive news from your doctor. Keep working hard and you will come through. What position did you play in rugby? i used to be a flanker myself.

Mom444- has your little girl gotten anymore movement?

Max- How are things progressing? Are you healing up good from your last operation? That is a nice looking AFO, i am going to order a foot-up so that i can wear shorts this summer, how did you find it?

Jacky- Thinking of you and hope your surgery went well and looking forward to hearing from you.

Andre hope all is going well with you.

i have an EMG on Monday morning and an appoinment with my OS on Tuesday so i am looking forward to it. keeping my fingers crossed for god news.
I hope everyone has a good weekend. Stay strong Stay Positive!

All the Best!
Gordon
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on May 26, 2007, 07:07:46 PM
Hey guys,

Footballcrazy. Thats an amazing recovery you have made, good luck and I hope you keep making progress.

Gordon. I was a scrumhalf, the brains of the operation, or the little annoying one, depending on your point of view. I used to stand on you flankers but I imagine you have managed to collar a few scrumhalfs. I have put a link below for the 'Foot-up'

Good luck with the EMG and your OS visit.

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Max Pwr on May 26, 2007, 10:22:16 PM
Hi Guys/Girls:

Just checking in; footballcrazy guy, congratulations!  I'm sure you're faith helped you get through such a difficult time; 11 weeks to most of us would have been a walk in the park and suffice to say, we probably wounldn't even be in here so the fact that you gave us an update was great, I hope you have a long happy, healthy life now.

To answer a few questions from the last few days:  I found the NFO (the web link that I posted about the AFO) by surfing the net.  It looks a lot more comfortable than the one I wear now.  As for price and availability I wish I knew these answers; but I'm hoping someone knows someone that tried it and can advise the rest of us whether or not it's worth the investment.

I am running but not for very long periods of time, I've found that jacking up the incline (10%-15%) on the treadmill at about a 4.5 - 4.7 mile an hour pace gives me just as good of workout and burns a lot of calories.  Running was hard at first and it did (and kinda still does) hurt my ankle.  Additionally, it's tremenously hard on my new hip and since I've had three surgeries where they've taken my right butt cheek off then put it back on the muscles are still trying to develop and I find running perhaps a bit too hard on it yet.  I'm hoping that when my foot does wake up the glutes will be almost 100% and then I can get back to SWAT.

The long weekend up here sucked, can you guys believe it snowed three inches?  Wow, so needless to say I wasn't outside too much.  I alos have a foot-up and I just find it not quite strong enough on my dorsiflexion to make me look like I walk proper, but it may be an option when the 30 celcius hits here and I don't want to wear my non-breathing hard plastic AFO.  Man I hate that thing.

Welll, keep me up to date everyone, I love hearing how everyone is coming along.  It's exciting when someones going for an EMG and we all wait in anticipation.  I still reamin hopefull that I'll be OK by Christmas. 

Keep in touch,

-Max-

PS JACKI -  WHERE ARE YOU, WE NEED TO KNOW HOW YOU ARE ?!?!?!?!?
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on May 27, 2007, 01:29:47 AM
Hi Max,

I too hate my AFO and also find that the foot-up does not give me enough support. It is not too bad with my trainers as I can position the tougue far enough forward but not with shoes. It would be very interesting to hear from someone who has used NFO and hear about availability and price. From looking at the website I got the impression it was not that available but I might be wrong.

Major developments for me this week are that I have started jogging on a trampete, so quite the happy wee chappy about the physio room. Saw my OS on Wednesday and he is very impressed with my progress considering the injury but we took an xray and one of the pins in my fibula has moved by 6mm so we will look at that again in a couple of months and decide whether to remove it or not. Still working very hard at the gym (about 2 hours a day) and my quad is being very stubborn and doesn't want to cooporate but slowly is it starting to build.


Hope everybody is doing well.
Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: AmandaC on May 29, 2007, 12:35:32 AM
Hamish - thats great news, I can imagine you have a smile from ear to ear being able to jog, does it hurt your ankle at all to run?  What AFO do you wear day to day.  Great news all around for you.

Gordon - How did the EMG go?

No news from me this week still waiting on an appointment with my Nurologist to give his opinion on the nerve situation after the disappointing EMG.  I have managed to stop the nerve pain medication the last 4 days, I have not noticed any difference, the pain still the same so don't see the point of taking meds that dont seem to be helping.  Does everyone else still have constant pins and needles, burning sensations and electric jolts here and there?  I have also started getting an incredible burning sensation on the top of my foot which is totally numbe when I stretch out my sciatic nerve, very strange feeling.
Also I feel when I try and move my toes of D/F that is wants to move, does everyone else feel this, very frustrating when it dosen' of course.

Hope everyone is doind well.
Amanda

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: G_Bronson on May 30, 2007, 12:30:58 AM
hey Everyone,
My EMG showed no signs of improvement. The neirologist said that he thinks i should get a nerve graft at this point. I am not to enthused about that idea i have an appointment with the neurosurgeon who had a look at my nerve while i had my knee surgery. I saw my OS today and he told me that the nerve was stretched really badly, it looked like spagetti were his exact words.has anyone else gotten a descirption like this? i wanna give it some more time and see if it will regenerate on its own but if it is damaged that bad then maybe i should think about a nerve graft. but i really do not want to think about it. My new PT i visited seemed pretty positive though. he really knew his stuff and has seen foot drop before And seemed optimistic.
I hope everyone is doing well
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: AmandaC on May 30, 2007, 01:02:04 AM
Gordon - sorry to hear the news wasn't good with your EMG.  I know you must be feeling pretty down and disappointed, I was really depressed for a few days, I pulled myself out of it and told myself it could be worse at least I can walk.  Is your specialist saying that there is no chance of regeneration?  Its only been 5 months for you which isn't very long.  I have read alot about the nerve graft surgeory and of the understanding that it is about a 1 in 3 chance of being successful and also the pereneal nerve is one of the nerves that does not have a very high success rate, this info may be wrong.  I would think long and hard before making any dicissions. 

Keep your head up and think positive.
Amanda
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Max Pwr on May 30, 2007, 02:10:25 AM
Hey Gordon,  as many know I faced that same dilemma, I was looking at a nerve garft as well.  I went ahead with the surgery but they opened me up and thought that it would be better to just leave alone as there's still a chance it'll come on it's own.  Amanda is right when she states that it only has a 1 in 3 chance of being sucessful. And once you do it, there's no turning back.  On an up side the neurosurgeon may open you up, see that the nerve is actually repairing and close it back up again. You would have a good idea of how recovery (if any) is coming.  You also have a window of a year to do the surgery so 5 months maybe a bit premature.  Maybe you can book it for the 9 or 10 month mark and have another EMG just prior in case you see improvement and you can still call it off.  These are the things to consider.  Any questions please ask away because I researched the procedure pretty well and went through the surgery as well.  In any event, keep your head up and don't give up hope.

Amanda, have you tried gabapentin for a medication?  I used it and it worked pretty well, I still had some pain (and still do now and then) but it drastically reduced the pain in the leg.  It took about a good 2 weeks before it did reduce the pain though, it's not like percocet and immediate.  But it's also not a narcotic and won't have other adverse effects.  I don't have to take anything now as the pain is more of an annoyance as it's not as dibilitating as it was when I first experienced it 11 months ago.

Everyone else, I still think about you often and hope that dorsi-flexion is coming sooner rather than later.  For me it's almost month number 12 of no dorsiflexion and I'm getting a bit worried but still hopefull.  I had a dream the other night that I could move my big toe up and down and its was such a joyous occaision.   

-Max-

Take care all and keep in touch.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on May 30, 2007, 03:52:35 AM
Max, Gordon, Amanda, Hamish, Andre, et. al.,

I hope everyone is well.  And for all of you, don't give up hope no matter what the doctors say.  We have all proven to each other that time frames are relative and everyone's situation is different.  My daughter's one EMG made the doctor give gloom and doom yet he ended up being wrong. 

Footballcrazy,

Thank you for your prayers!  I really do believe that Faith does play a huge part in the healing process.  Things weren't looking well for my daughter for a while, then the last EMG showed recovery.  I believe that people praying for her helped.

As for now, The Dragon is on vacation...  it worries me a bit.  I actually feel good when she gets the dragons because it shows healing but when we go for a few weeks without the dragon pain I get worried.  As mentioned before, we need to get another PT referral and then go from there.  I pray she is still healing.  She turns four soon.

Also...  JACKY?  WHERE ARE YOU?  ARE YOU DOING WELL?

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: ellis143 on May 30, 2007, 08:54:29 PM
Hello all --
I am so glad that I found this site...I have spent many hours reading all of your posts and have to admit that they have all give me such great comfort. Even though I don't have the same type of story (and it isn't really anything to do with my knee) I hope that I can join in and tell my story -- just incase someone else like me is out there...

16 weeks ago I was rushed to the ER after my right leg went totally numb. It was like someone turned off the lights! Very Scary!! MRI was done and I was in Surgery to have a diskectomy that afternoon. Apparently the disk at L4L5 had herniated and mashed my nerve. I was in the hospital a week with no improvement of the leg or foot. Of course they sent me Phyiscal Therapy -- which I have been doing 2 to 3 times a week ever since. I have drop foot and numbness in my right leg. Of course you all know what I was told -- "It might get better, It might not." "It could be a year before we know anything." --- GREAT! At 36 - this wasn't part of the plan.

Reading your posts I have found comfort that I am not the only one that has/is going thru something like this. I am getting a little movement back in my toes but the doctors and PT don't seem very incouraged. In Fact -- they always seem to be rather discouraged when they see me....They have never done a EMG or anything -- but I am not sure if that is bad or good -- any ideas?

 
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on May 30, 2007, 09:28:26 PM
Hey guys,

Ellis welcome aboard and don't despare! Did they tell you whether the nerve was stretched? If it was stretched and still intact, mine was stretched quite badly when I dislocated my knee and the surgeon said it was almost at breaking point. The nerve will degenerate before it regenerates and that is from the point of injury. I think the regeneration rate is at about 1mm per day so it has some way to go. It seems pretty positeve that you can more your toes. Stick in there and keep your head up.

Amanda, I wear this orthotic most of the time and at the moment http://www.ankleshop.com/proddetail.asp?prod=0%2D110127&cat=608 but also have a Foot-up http://www.ankleshop.com/proddetail.asp?prod=FTUPX&cat=608. The standard AFO gives me more stability so I have used that exclusively since my last op. The foot-up I used more to go to the gym as it is more low profile and I don't feel so conscious of it. I will start using it again as I feel more confident with my stability now. Ankle pain I am getting now as I am able to do more and therefore putting more pression on that joint and it aches quite a lot at night.

Gordon, don't feel too down about the EMG test and I wouldn't rush into getting a nerve graft. Five months is a bit too early to be making that decision and I feel you should give the nerve a bit more time to show its hand. As Max said you have a bit more time up your sleeve. I am now 9 months and am just getting a little hint of and outwards movement in my foot and the surgeon seemed quite positive about it, however I have still not had an EMG test but he is chasing it up.

Mom, I'm sure she is healing quietly away and the dragon is just hibernating.

Hope everyone else is doing well.

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: ellis143 on May 31, 2007, 02:44:47 AM
By the way -- My AFO drives me crazy too-- and as a female trying to find anything "dressy" that it will fit into is impossible.
I did find a new product that slides over the AFO try looking at it -- www.afoliner.com -- it makes the AFO a little more bearable since the plastic is not right next to your skin...
They are from the US so I don't know if they send them "across the pond" but I am sure it can be done. The lady that "invented" the liner is very nice and has responded to my emails personally. They have both adult and child sizes and I can vouch that they work with an articulated AFO (it has a hinge at the ankle). I also love the AFO socks - they are the first socks I have found that actually will go over my calf to my knee and STAY there without cutting off the circulation.

Thanks for the warm welcome!
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: AmandaC on May 31, 2007, 06:08:33 AM
Welcome Ellis143
Hamish - Thanks for your post about your AFO, mine is very similar to this.

Do any of you know much about the tendon transfer operation?  I am not giving up on the nerve yet but am thinking I would like to explore my options if it does not heal.
Thanks Amanda
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on May 31, 2007, 09:38:20 AM
Hi Amanda,

I found a website that had a summary of the procedure with diagrams etc. Can't remember where I found it but will have a trawl around to see whether I can find it.

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on May 31, 2007, 04:01:26 PM
Hi Amanda,

In the attached article there are details regarding tendon transfer and you can click on the images which give a idea of what is involved.

http://www.emedicine.com/orthoped/topic389.htm

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Max Pwr on June 01, 2007, 04:45:35 AM
Hey Guys, this one too, very informative...

http://www.drnathfootdrop.com/

Hope all is well.


~Max~
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: ellis143 on June 01, 2007, 03:29:22 PM

can anyone tell me about the EMG? I think they are going to want to do one the next time I visit the surgeon's office - but I am not even sure of what it is, how it is done, and what it shows.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on June 01, 2007, 07:38:32 PM

can anyone tell me about the EMG? I think they are going to want to do one the next time I visit the surgeon's office - but I am not even sure of what it is, how it is done, and what it shows.

Welcome Ellis and good luck in your recovery!  I hope and pray that things soon get better for you.

I'm not a medical expert, but an EMG is a test where they check to see how much of your nerve is responding and how and where the nerve is responding.  They often do it by inserting a needle into the muscle/limb.  You could google EMG and find more info I'm sure.

We are still just kicking away here.  Not much change since last time, still no "dragon" lately.

I'm starting to worry about Jacky.  Has anyone heard from her?
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on June 03, 2007, 10:48:30 AM
Hello All,

I am so sorry I have not been able to be in contact - this is my first few minutes on line and so you guys are the first to hear.  I had the operation at 8.30am on Friday 11th May.  After the operation, which went well and I was told it was a total success, I was on four days bed rest due to very low blood pressure.  From that point all went a bit hazy - I was very poorly.  Well any way I am back now - I was released from hospital after a fortnight and have spent two weeks at a nursing home but have been extended for a further two weeks to make sure I am well enough and safe to be at home.  I will catch up with the posts over the next few days and thanks all for your good wishes and prayers.  I am still on morphine for pain so not sure I will make total sense.  I have turned the corner and headed for total rehab now. 
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on June 04, 2007, 09:23:34 AM
Hey Jackie,

Its good to have you back and it sounds like you have had a really hard time over the last month. Keep us posted on your progress and good luck.

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: ellis143 on June 04, 2007, 06:51:52 PM
Hello All :)

I am not sure whether to be excited or aprehensive -- or how I am supposed to feel. Had and appointment with my surgeon (the one that fixed the herniated disk and said that my peroneal nerve was CRUSHED) -- I see him every couple of months just for him to see how things are going. Anyway -- he told me today that he expected a full recovery for me!  ;D :o :o :o ;D -- I don't know whether to believe him or not ....He continue to say that I would have to stay in PT and the progress would continue to be slow -but he didn't see any reason that I wouldn't be back to TOTALLY normal in time. What do you think? I am happy -- but at the same time I guess I know how many times they tell you the badest of the bad and it turns out not to be as bad as they told you --so -- I guess I am just scared that this might work the same just opposite....
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: AmandaC on June 04, 2007, 08:56:22 PM
Jackie - welcome back I bet you are glad the op is all over, now back onto the rehab road - you can do it.  Best of luck
Ellis143 - I dont think your specialist would have been so confident if he didn't belive it to be true - I can understand you feeling a bit aprehensive but positive thinking helps the body to heal so keep thinking positive.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: ellis143 on June 06, 2007, 05:36:48 PM
Oh dear-- for the past 2 days I have had quite a bit of low back pain - which I haven't had since the surgery. I know all of you have had knee surgerys and such...so I was wondering if any of you have had the oddity of pain coming out of the blue like this. My surgery was Feb. 5 and have not had any pain (in my back) since then..Maybe it is being caused by the change in my gate as my nerve recovers and the muscles start to respond? I don't know just looking for reassurance I think....Dr is out of town for the next week -- so no luck trying to get info out of him.
 
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on June 06, 2007, 10:56:04 PM
Hi Ellis,

I'm sure the whole machanics of the body are knocked out with these sort of injuries. Are you getting any PT as part of your rehab?

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on June 07, 2007, 06:33:36 PM
Hey Guys,

I hope you all are well.

For Jacky, Andre and anyone else who as any input, I have some questions for you.

We are in a bit of a conundrum here.  We are in the US so we have a healt insurance plan and that means that we are limited as to the number of physical therapy appointments we can get.  We filled all of our appointments last year and now we have used up all of our availabel appointments for this year.  I'm not sure aobut all of the details, but it looks like we used all the appointments available to us for "this type of problem."

To qualify for more appointments, we'd have to petition for medical necessity and then see if we are approved.

The question is this:

My daughter has had SOME reinnervation but not total recovery.  She still cannot dorsiflex her foot.  The dragon still comes and goes she apparently is still healing and hopefully recovering.  (He made an appearance yesterday, thanks for the prayers!)

I'm wondering if it wouild be better to wait until she can dorsiflex again before we try for more physical therapy or if we should continue with it right away no matter what.

If we don't go back to PT right away, do any of you have advice for what we could be doing to help things along in the meantime?  Of course we are still doing EMS daily, but not much else.

I'm so confused.

Hang in there Ellis, Amanda and everyone else.  We keep thinking of you and praying.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Max Pwr on June 09, 2007, 08:55:07 PM
Hi Everyone,

Just stopped in to say keep your hopes up and don't give up; I had a hard week convicing myself of that but I'm getting through it.  It's almost been a year now with the drop foot and no sign of dorsi-flexion, but I'm staying hopeful.

Jacki, great to hear from you and sorry it's taking so long to come around but you know as well as I do these things take time.  Everyone else, keep in touch I love hearing how everyone is doing.

Amanda - I found this article while surfing, seems that's all I do sometimes.  It's applicable to those of us that the affliction is a result of pelvis/hip issues.  Share it with your doctor and maybe he'll get you onto a good neurosurgeon that will clean it up for you.  I had it done and it's a big reason I'm hoping things come around.

http://www.ejbjs.org/cgi/content/abstract/78/6/863

Take care everyone, have a great weekend!

-Max-



Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: AmandaC on June 09, 2007, 08:56:49 PM
Hi Mom444

Sorry I cant give you and advise about how the medical system works over there.

I have working with an ostiopath (sure thats not spelt right) and he tells me that the best thing for helping nerve damage in the leg is water theraphy in warm water.  We have a plunge pool in town, it is really deap and you put on a vest so you dont sink and you walk and run in the water, of course your feet dont touch the ground.  I find it very relaxing, good physio on the legs and for about 3 hours afterwards have no nerve pain, apparently it stretches out the nerve really well and the heat from the pool helps circulation with helps regeration as well.  Hope this helps.

Has your little girls muscles in her healing leg wasted away.  I didn't realise until the other day that my ankle is so skinny it is the same size as my wrist.
I had a bad week, I went of my Gavapentin drug and went into drug withdrawl, was very sick.  They started me on it again but it really upset my stomach, which I dont need as this is bad enough from my bowel operations.  I lost 5kg in 4 days it had taken me 4 months to put that weight on so am back to 20kg lighter than before my accident, I get sick of people commenting on how skinny I am. :(
Hope everyone else is doing well.

Thanks Amanda
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on June 10, 2007, 04:11:06 AM
Thanks for the advice Amanda and I hope things soon get better for you.

It's interesting what you said about heat and possible exercise therapy.  As I had mentioned, the dragon disappeared for a while but came back the other night when she lay down for a nap after running and playing with her little cousins.  So, I wondered if the exercise brought it on.

Her physical therapist had also mentioned heat therapy, we used heating pads or warm waashcloths...  But finding the time to do it every night with a feisty oddler is hard   :o

So far we have not found access to a physical therapist who is willing to do water therapy, but I wish we could! 

As for her leg muscles, they definitely were starting to look a lot thinner in the leg with nerve damage, but my husband and I are starting to think that the leg muscles may be filling out again a bit.  We still do EMS every day.

I haven't gotten in touch with the therapist again, I'm not sure what we'll do next.

All the best to the rest of you all  :)
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on June 10, 2007, 04:27:50 PM
Hi Guys,

Thanks all for your blessings - I have been back in hospital - I won't bore you all with it all now as I still feel very weak and has nothing to do with peroneal nerves.  I hope you are all well and still making progress.  God Bless
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: AmandaC on June 10, 2007, 10:50:39 PM
Jackie - So sorry to hear you have had a rought time - you are tough and will get through it.

Mom - Do you have access to pools close to you?  Our pools here have instructors that take Aqua jogging lessons and they are the ones that got me started  -  I do my own water therophy not with the Physio if you have access to do it give it a shot, you might really enjoy getting in the pool and just helping her kick and stuff, anything is worth a try.
Amanda
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: G_Bronson on June 14, 2007, 03:49:44 AM
Hello everyone,
Just checking in to see how everyone is holding up. Jackie i am so glad to see you on here again, i hope everything goes well for you in your recovery. Sounds like you have had a rough time , i hope the worst is behind you now.

NOthing new to report on my front, i am still doing my physio and EMS everyday hoping and praying that things will come back.

Max and Hamish- How are you guys doing? I hope you are keeping your spirits up

Amanda- i am going to try the pool therapy, how long do you run for?

ellis143- Welcome ,I am sorry to hear about your situation and wish you all the best in your recovery. That is good news if your doctor seems that optimistic about your recovery.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: cat on June 14, 2007, 08:13:29 PM
Jackie,
How are you doing? I'm scheduled for a femoral derotation in Sept. I'd love to hear about your recovery when you're up to it.
Sending hugs and healing thoughts your way,
 ;D cat  ;D
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: AmandaC on June 14, 2007, 09:25:25 PM
Gordon - I usually spend 30 minutes in the pool.  I start of with a say 5 minutes light jogging and then do some sprints etc, its great for getting heart rate up to and no impact on the body and the jogging action is great because when you push your leg down the water pushes your foot up so it dosent get sore hanging down all the time.  I also do some side stroke etc for my hips which you dont have that problem.  It is important to stretch your legs afterwards I didn't to start and the cramp was really bad.  I really enjoy it and think it helps with my nerve pain to.  Good luck

No news from me, I saw my nurolgist yesterday about my EMG and he is not hopeful at all, is going to look into surgeory options for me, what ever that means.  Sometimes I think every doctor I see has had different training from the last, no one seems to say the same thing.  I know that nerves are very diffucult to diagnose - bloody things.

Anyway have a great weekend everyone
Amanda
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on June 14, 2007, 10:57:11 PM
Hey guys,

Amanda - I sense a little strop at the end of your post there. How deep is the water you do the jogging and sprinting in? I am getting a little bored of my endless gym routine and am looking to diversify.

Gordon - keep working away and I'm sure things will come good. How is your knee doing and have you got full flexion and extension back yet? I am planing to start jogging at PT pretty soon but not sure about it. I have had to hurry across the road a couple of time to avoid getting run down and it appears to be some strange hybrid freaky looking effort at a run. :-[

Hi Cat - I had a look at some of you pics (not all of them as I have just had my dinner) looks like you have had some pretty major work done.

Andre -  I have found the Toronto Argos website so will be watching your form.

Jackie - keep us posted on how you are doing.

Hope everyone else is doing well.

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: cat on June 14, 2007, 11:53:16 PM
Hey Hamish,
Quote
[Hi Cat - I had a look at some of you pics (not all of them as I have just had my dinner) looks like you have had some pretty major work done./quote]

LOL! I'm afraid that was just a warm up. The really big boo boos happen this fall.
 ;D ;D
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on June 15, 2007, 04:18:31 AM
Hey All,

Just checking in...

We still have not straightened out the issues with getting my daughter back into physical therapy.

We are able to use our EMS unit at home but the therapist had also been doing ultrasound and "nerve stimulation" therapy.  I worry a little that we have not been getting those treatments  since the referral from our insurance expired.  If the ultrasound and "nerve stimulation" therapy were in fact helping to promote her recovery then I hope we can get her back to PT soon!

Not much else here...  Is Andre really on the Toronto Argos site?  Every time I search the word "peroneal" in Google News I end up finding online news articles about Andre!  :)  He gets quite a lot of press in local Toronto papers!

Hope everyone else is doing well.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on June 15, 2007, 06:55:55 PM
HEY ALL!!!!!!!!

I am still at camp...we have one more week here then the final roster will be selected ...we dont have an internet connection on the campus we are on so i had to walk miles to get to the library to post today...lol.....hope everyone is well and recovery is getting better everyday. i played my first game in two years last week saturday and man did it feel good to get back out on the feild and do what i loved. i didnt even remember i had an injury until my coach asked me how it felt....then i replied"how does what feel?"...lol...then i remembered he was reffering to my knee.ill be back online tonight to catch up with what has been going on around the site. i have clips of the game here.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gPn_5WSN-2s

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fl-nNxF_OUk

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vP-QRDTLbSk

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TdNiolh1avA
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on June 15, 2007, 08:39:17 PM
Hey Andre,

Great to hear you are doing well and enjoying yourself. To be honest I am really jealous but my reahab is going well and I am working hard and the muscle is coming back. I have a hint of an outward movement in my foot and am confident this will keep improving. I have no dorsiflexion yet but the feeling has moved all the way down to my ankle so am again pretty confident about this.

I will watch out for your success. Keep working hard.

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on June 16, 2007, 12:09:48 PM
Hi Guys,

Well this is definately the best day I have felt - the swelling in my leg and foot have subsided to a comfortable level and I am at very long last mobilising on crutches over short distances.  Thank you for all your prayers and thoughts as it is a great comfort that to know you are not alone.  I have a final two weeks at a nursing home / rehabilitation centre when I will return home - 7 weeks after leaving home expecting to be home after two weeks - but hey surgery is not an exact science.  The big benefit to all this is that my right leg and right floppy foot have HAD to pull their weight - and the weight of the left leg and I am sure that has done it the power of good.  Good to hear how you are all doing. 

(Cat - I will PM you soon about what happened with the second derotational operation if you really want to know)
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: cat on June 16, 2007, 12:36:12 PM
"really want to know"? Was it that bad? Oh now, I have to know. You've got me curious.
 ;D cat  ;D
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: ellis143 on June 16, 2007, 02:12:56 PM
Hello All-
I was wondering if any of you had any core strengthening exercises that you could recommend. I do all the usual Bridges and Ab Bracing and the dreaded superman - but I am looking for a few exercises just to add to the routine. I have been doing the same thing for months and while I do continue to see improvement - I think it might be nice to add a little something extra. The core is the main focus since it is my back that has caused the problems -- but I think I might like to work on the rest of the muscles too -- anything you guys can think of I would be happy to try.

 
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: AmandaC on June 16, 2007, 08:53:18 PM
Jackie - that great news its been a long haul for you
Hamish - The pool I use is a dive pool so is about 2.5m deep, you need the water to be over your head so your feet dont touch the ground - give it a go if you can I really enjoy it.

Hope everyone is doing well.
I dont want to sound like I have given up hope as I haven't but have any of you considered the tendon transfer operation if you dont get any recovery?
Thanks Amanda

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Max Pwr on June 18, 2007, 04:39:28 AM
Hi All,

I too am just checking in.  Nice to see everyone still keeping in touch.   I had an appointment with the neurosurgeon that did my nerve clean up a few months back.  He wasn't surprised by my lack of progression in fact he said it'll take up to two years sometimes sooner, sometimes later.  We also talked about the tendon transfer that Amanda mentioned.  My inversion continues to improve and is now rated at a grade 3.  Apparently to do the transfer you have to be at a grade 4 so Amanada, perhaps see what your inversion strength is and see if you're a candidate.  For those with complete foot drop it's not an option.  What they do is take the tendon that turns the foot inwards, split it and put half on top of the foot.  The success rate is good and those that have had it declare it works.  The bad thing is that it has to be strong and practically undamaged for it to be a 100% success, therefore, if you have no or weak inversion right now you won't qualify  thats not to say that as it strengthens you obviously will.  The surgeon and I remain 'cautiously optomisitic' as there are signs that it is recovering but, as we all know, at a snails pace.

Jackie - hang in there, we've all been throught the tough stuff too and we know what you're going through.  The worst is over and things will only get better; stay strong.

Andre - Dude, you're doing awesome, love to see the highlights.  Keep the spirit alive and break a few tackles for us. 

Hamish - like you my inward outward movement seems to be imporving but no dorsiflexion yet, I'm praying one of thse days.

Gordon - Keep working dude, good to hear from you every so often. 

Mom - I too am in that conundrum of whether or not to get acupuncture etc right now as I'm not seeing any progression and am thinking I might just wait until I can wiggle something.

I hope everyone read that article I posted, if not I'll attach it again.  I had mentioned it was for hip/pelvis damage but I was wrong it appears it would be more for those of you with knee injuries; have a look and maybe dicuss it with your doctor next time you see him.  The success rate is too good to pass up if you have the opportunity.

In any event, keep in touch guys and have a great week.     
-Max-

http://www.ejbjs.org/cgi/content/abstract/78/6/863
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on June 19, 2007, 04:43:48 AM
Hi All,

I too am just checking in.  Nice to see everyone still keeping in touch.   I had an appointment with the neurosurgeon that did my nerve clean up a few months back.  He wasn't surprised by my lack of progression in fact he said it'll take up to two years sometimes sooner, sometimes later.  We also talked about the tendon transfer that Amanda mentioned.  My inversion continues to improve and is now rated at a grade 3.  Apparently to do the transfer you have to be at a grade 4 so Amanada, perhaps see what your inversion strength is and see if you're a candidate.  For those with complete foot drop it's not an option.  What they do is take the tendon that turns the foot inwards, split it and put half on top of the foot.  The success rate is good and those that have had it declare it works.  The bad thing is that it has to be strong and practically undamaged for it to be a 100% success, therefore, if you have no or weak inversion right now you won't qualify  thats not to say that as it strengthens you obviously will.  The surgeon and I remain 'cautiously optomisitic' as there are signs that it is recovering but, as we all know, at a snails pace.

Jackie - hang in there, we've all been throught the tough stuff too and we know what you're going through.  The worst is over and things will only get better; stay strong.

Andre - Dude, you're doing awesome, love to see the highlights.  Keep the spirit alive and break a few tackles for us. 

Hamish - like you my inward outward movement seems to be imporving but no dorsiflexion yet, I'm praying one of thse days.

Gordon - Keep working dude, good to hear from you every so often. 

Mom - I too am in that conundrum of whether or not to get acupuncture etc right now as I'm not seeing any progression and am thinking I might just wait until I can wiggle something.

I hope everyone read that article I posted, if not I'll attach it again.  I had mentioned it was for hip/pelvis damage but I was wrong it appears it would be more for those of you with knee injuries; have a look and maybe dicuss it with your doctor next time you see him.  The success rate is too good to pass up if you have the opportunity.

In any event, keep in touch guys and have a great week.     
-Max-

http://www.ejbjs.org/cgi/content/abstract/78/6/863


Hi Max,

Hope things are looking up for you.  I'm glad to see that your neurosurgeon gave a year's plus time frame for recovery.  Next month my daughter will be four years old and it will have been a year since her surgery.  She has made some improvement as shown by her EMGs but still cannot dorsiflex her foot.  Her surgeon originally gave a year time limit but then recanted and said that things may in fact improve after a year.

Also, I have read the complete article in the link that you posted.  (You need to access the full text through a subscription database.)  I'll PM you with a few more details.

I hope everyone else is well.  Keep hanging in there and keeping the faith!
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: G_Bronson on June 25, 2007, 05:19:22 PM
hello Everyone,
 Just wondering how everyone is progressing?

mom- has your little girl gotten any more movement back?

Tommorow will be six months to the day since my injury. Still woring hard and trying to stay positive. Hope you all are doing well!
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on June 25, 2007, 11:58:59 PM
Hey Gordon,

Tomorrow will be 10 months to the day since my injury! What time of day did your happen? Mine was 7.30pm. Things with me are going pretty well and I started a little bit of jogging last week so it was a bit of a milestone. Not much mind you just up and down the corridor at PT but it went pretty well. It wasn't a perfect jog as my foot was searching for the floor a bit and I wasn't planting my foot the same as the good side but it will come I'm sure. Knee is pretty good and getting stronger all the time. Where are you with your flexion? have you got it all back. I am geting about 130 or maybe a little more but not the whole way that I just about managed pre ACLr.

Hope everyone else is doing well.

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on June 26, 2007, 04:33:04 AM
hello Everyone,
 Just wondering how everyone is progressing?

mom- has your little girl gotten any more movement back?

Tommorow will be six months to the day since my injury. Still woring hard and trying to stay positive. Hope you all are doing well!

Thanks for asking Gord  :)

Well, we are back in PT, going broke paying the copays, but back.  Her therapist said that he is definitely getting more muscle contractions when he uses the point stimulator on her leg.  He says that includes the tibialis anterior.  As of yet still no obvious dorsiflexion, but occasional movement from the big toe.  She will not try to move the toe on command or try to move the foot...  It is very hard to get a feisty four year old to be cooperative!   ::)

Therapist also suggested vitamin B supplements because those are supposed to help in nerve recovery.  I was worried about finding something that could easily be given to a four year old seeing as how swallowing large pills would not work.  I was almost going to do an online search for chewable B complex pills but instead I found some LIQUID B complex at a health food store.  You simply drop some into her juice and she takes it that way.  She now reminds me to put her "leg vitamins" in her juice  :)

The therapist also does heat therapy and ultrasound therapy...  We can't do any more involved exercises until dorsiflexion returns.

Have any of you tried the following therapies or had your therapist use them or suggest them?

--Heat therapy?
--Ulrasound?
--Point stimulator?
--Vitamin therapy?

By the way, we have pretty much given up on active scar treatment methods, as the scar seems to be a non issue now.

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on June 29, 2007, 10:37:10 AM
Toronto Argos 22 - 24 BC Lions

Toronto Argos first game was last night and unfortunately they lost. Watched the first half but not the second as it was on pretty late here but recorded it and will watch today. Not sure if Andre got a run or not. There was an amazing 129yd missed field goal return by one of the Argos players.

Things with me are going pretty well and I have stepped up the speed in the running and almost doing short sprints and the knee feels good. My accelaration stage is pretty good but the problems come when I decelarate as my foot plant is a little unsure and my foot seems to be almost searching for the floor. I am wearing the foot up brace when doing this but am going to try the AFO to see if it makes any difference. Andre did you have this problem.

Our rugby pre-season is just about to start and I have been doing a strength and conditioning course and am going to help as a fitness coach. Really looking forward to seeing the pain when all the guys are busting a gut and not me.  ;D I think I have had my fair share of pain!

Hope everyone is doing well.

Hamish

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on July 02, 2007, 10:37:34 PM
Hello All,

Well I am finally home - 7 weeks and 3 days later (I have so milked this!) - saw the surgeon today and he is pleased with the scar and rotation on the left leg.  The bone is showing signs of healing and suffiecient to be out of plaster as I have a plaster sore that is being very stubborn.  I have had an infection but that is subsiding although it was a bit touch and go on going home today but made it.  So I am well on my way - all the hard work now starts, I can start to do some knee bending.  I can start to touch toe and build up over the next few weeks to full weight bearing as the bone should be healed in another 7 to 10 days.   The staples will hold firm in any case.  I have been referred for physio so we start again on that little treat - oh what joy.  I am just so pleased I only have two legs and will never, ever, ever have another operation again (if I can possibly help it)  I clearly don't respond well to medical intervention and anesthetics are a real no no for me.  Now here's a question - have any of you had to use crutches when non weight bearing on your non foot drop foot - it is very difficult as the normal use of crutches have people hopping and that is somewhat difficult,  still I have some very well developed arm muscles (not a particularly good look on a lady!)
On the foot drop front = well no real change and starting to think maybe there will be no more, but I am managing with it well and it doesn't stop me doing too much.

So that is my update - sorry it has been so long.  You all take good care and I will continue to follow your progress, highs and lows. 
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on July 03, 2007, 03:23:03 AM
Welcome back Jacky  :)  I was getting a little worried when I didn't hear from you for so long.  Glad to see you are slowly getting better.  We are all cheering you on!

My daughter is getting some more improvement bit by bit.  Her physical therapist says my daughter is getting muscle contractions further down the leg.   

Still occasional dragon pains.  Still no dorsiflexion yet.

Glad to hear you will not be needing any more surgeries.  We hope you take it easy, you are in our prayers.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: G_Bronson on July 04, 2007, 01:24:53 AM
Hi Jacky,
Glad to here from you again! I hope you make a quick and full recovery from your latest surgery. I was just wondering if you still have to wear an AFO?  Sorry i have not had to use crutchs in that way. it must be  aliitle different i can imagine.

I am still doing my physio everyday. still no dorsiflexion. I havent gained any new evertion movement in a while either. It is getting pretty frustrating epesailly now that summer is here. All i want to do is go for a run or  go fishing and the things i used to do. Hopefully next summer will be much better.

Hamish that is great that you are running! 130 degrees is very good for flexion. Most people cannot do that when they have  a healthy knee.   

I hope everyone is doing well

Take care
Gordon
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on July 04, 2007, 07:17:19 AM
Hello,

Thanks Mom for your prayers.

Gordon - I do still wear an AFO called a 'toe off' splint especially while non weightbearing and on crutches.  Just prior to the op I was padding around the house with no AFO as I preferred to flop about.  I have noticed that the foot has got lazy again being in bed for so long and always in a splint so a bit of work required there also.  Unfortunately the foot has been somewhat neglected with the other leg taking priority for a bit. 

I havent gained any new evertion movement in a while either. It is getting pretty frustrating epesailly now that summer is here. All i want to do is go for a run or go fishing and the things i used to do. Hopefully next summer will be much better.

I know the frustration but keep going - even with foot drop you will be able to go running again.  This summer will be OK too as you will continue to get stronger - both physically through physio and home exercises and mentally as you come to terms with foot drop and the very slow progress of it all.  Best wishes to you.

 
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on July 06, 2007, 03:38:15 PM
Hey everyone,

The date has finally come! I have a date for my nerve conductive and EMG test. Monday 16th July and I am a bit nervous to be honest. Other things are going well and quads and hamstrings are getting stronger all the time. I have started using free weights again to try and get my body back in shape and doing sqata as well but not really heavy weights.

Hope everyone is doing well.

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on July 07, 2007, 05:22:17 AM
Good luck with the EMG Hamish.  I hope and pray you get some signs of recovery.  I apologize if you have already mentioned this, but are you currently doing EMS treatment?

As for us, my daughter has recently been complaining of pain when we do her EMS treatment.  She says the stickers (electrodes) hurt and she often cries and says she wants us to take them off.  At first I thought she was just being a feisty little girl again but when I mentioned it to her physical therapist he said that there may be some increased sensitivity to the EMS electrodes as the nerve heals.  So, in other words, the pain is a good sign.  However, he instructed us not to let the pain stop us from continuing EMS treatment.

Have any of you who are doing or have done EMS experieced pain?
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on July 07, 2007, 01:40:14 PM
Hi Mom,

No I have never used EMS treatment. I think it is somethig I may follow up on.

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: G_Bronson on July 08, 2007, 09:17:23 PM
Good luck with you EMG Hamish i hope you get some positive feedback!!

Hope everyone is continuing to work hard and remeber that everyday you are healing!

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on July 09, 2007, 06:27:31 PM
Just a reminder...

Take vitamin B complex vitamin supplements!  They are supposed to help nerve recovery.

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on July 11, 2007, 03:32:22 AM
Hey All

Hope everyone is doing well and that recovery is is progressing.after training camp i was put on a practice roster and today i was officially put on the roster and will be starting on special teams and backup Running Back ..WOOOOOOOOOOT....im pretty excited for this ..the game is on Thursday at 7pm we play the Calgary Stampeders. should be a good game.

i wanted to ask everyone something......has anyone tried electrode accupuncture before? not sure if thts the proper name but an accupuncture therapist puts the needles in your muscles and connects electrodes to them and precisely stimulates the muscles which need to be stimulated.....i tired it on my EHL and Extensor Digitorum and Brevis muscles to see if i can start to wake up the toes and big toe in my foot. but when the therapist puts the needles in my leg the hyper sensitivity of the nerve send my leg into spasms and its very uncomfortable.....wonder if this method is worth taking the pain for and if anyone has had positive results with any other muscles.

Also Max do you live in Calgary?if so we play there on the 21st next week sat ..if so there will be a ticket there for you ...let me know.

Take Care everyone
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on July 11, 2007, 04:38:09 AM
Hey All

Hope everyone is doing well and that recovery is is progressing.after training camp i was put on a practice roster and today i was officially put on the roster and will be starting on special teams and backup Running Back ..WOOOOOOOOOOT....im pretty excited for this ..the game is on Thursday at 7pm we play the Calgary Stampeders. should be a good game.

i wanted to ask everyone something......has anyone tried electrode accupuncture before? not sure if thts the proper name but an accupuncture therapist puts the needles in your muscles and connects electrodes to them and precisely stimulates the muscles which need to be stimulated.....i tired it on my EHL and Extensor Digitorum and Brevis muscles to see if i can start to wake up the toes and big toe in my foot. but when the therapist puts the needles in my leg the hyper sensitivity of the nerve send my leg into spasms and its very uncomfortable.....wonder if this method is worth taking the pain for and if anyone has had positive results with any other muscles.

Also Max do you live in Calgary?if so we play there on the 21st next week sat ..if so there will be a ticket there for you ...let me know.

Take Care everyone


Hey Andre  :)  Glad to hear you are back at doing what you love.

I don't think it's the exact same thing, but my daughter's therapist said that the point stimulator he uses on her leg is similar to "acupuncture without needles."  We've been getting the therapy twice a week, at least until our insurance referral runs out.   ::)

Also, if you've seen my recent posts, my daughter now complains of pain during her EMS therapy and her PT says that is another symptom of the nerve recovering...  I seem to remember you mentioning something similar, about how you were able to "bring on the dragons" by stimulating your leg...?

Also, have you done any vitamin therapy?
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on July 11, 2007, 08:37:51 PM
Hey Mom444

Ya i could and still activate the Dragons on the muscle stim...and is partially the reason why i am holding back from this accupuncture therapy. i know pain is good and the fact that the nerve is still in recovery mode and giving off the Dragons is good...but i still don't want to fight pain if positive results dont out way the uncomfortable pain.

i haven't done vitamin therapy before ...but i did see our sports Doctor and while i was in rehab he would check my blood once Monthly to find out what vitamins nutrients i needed/didn't need to put me in the best position to maximize my chance of healing...he called it a basic top up.kinda like servicing your car. if i was low in iron,b12,calcium,etc...i would get an I.V with the necessary nutrients and amount i should be at.and i would have to maintain it by eating well and staying active.

Any developments in movement with your daughter's foot?
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on July 12, 2007, 11:33:59 AM
Hey Andre,

Well done mate, I am so chuffed for you. Good luck! It is not on live here but they are showing the game in full tomorrow afternoon so will watch it then.

Things with me are going well and I am increasing the running and speed. Go for my first EMG test on Monday and hoping for a positive test and I expect a positive test result. I am getting some outward movement in my foot but no dorsiflexion yet but I can feel the tendon firing at the front of my ankle so don't think it is far away.

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: NEWFIE on July 12, 2007, 05:43:13 PM
Hi all,

I am new to this forum and would appreciate any input you all can give me! I am a 38 year old male and I sustained an injury to my peroneal nerve. I race motorcycles professionally and in may I crashed at very high speed(approx. 180KMH). I sustained acl, pcl, mcl, and a broken peroneal nerve in the crash. The ortho in Halifax,NS did the repair on the acl,pcl,mcl and did a tibia plateau 1 week after the crash. 2 weeks after the crash the plastic surgeon in Halifax harvested the sural nerve in my leg, disected the damaged part of the peroneal nerve and grafted a 10cm piece of the harvested nerve into my peroneal nerve along the underside of my knee. I have foot drop and I am very concerned! The doctors aren't giving me much to go on but I don't think they would have done the surgery if they did'nt think they had a chance to save the nerve. Have any of you, or know of anyone that has had a successful story with the same type of injury??? PLEASE HELP!!!!
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Max Pwr on July 12, 2007, 06:25:48 PM
If you hate wearing an AFO in 30 degree (around 90 F) heat please raise your hand!

Hi Everyone,

I'm just checking in, sorry I haven't been around lately, work has been crazy, but I check the forum evryday hoping someone has some good news.  Today I have no real progress to share; no dorsi-flexion yet but hope lingers that maybe next summer I'll be OK.  Andre, I'm so glad to hear you made the roster, I'll be watching the game tonight to hopefully catch a glimpse, maybe even see you touch the pig skin a bit.  I know you probably won't see this before the game but in any event know that we're behind you and take that strength to break a few tackles.  I have tried that electrode acupuncture and you're right it hurts like hell, I too have had little success with it so I think it's a matter of cost vs benefit.  I quit doing it for now but am hoping when I have signs of flexion I'll start it up again hoping it'll stim the muscles into gearing up.  I do live in Calgary and would definitely come to the stadium to watch, but no pressure to get me any tickets I'd do it on my own dime too.

NEWFIE, welcome to the forum, unfortunately I have no success stories for you, I know that the nerve transfer is about 33% successful so there is hope, never give up.  I know I've read a couple of stricles on the same surgery you endured.  One who had the same type of injury (severed nerve) had a tendon transfer, and it may be an option for you down the road... quoted...

"I recently had a tendon transfer surgery to fix a foot drop to my right foot. I had the surgery...as my nerve was severed durring an ACL reconstruction surgery resulting in my dropped foot and finally now after 2 years I have movement back. They did an awesome job at the Institute within 3 months i was walking almost normal. I am a 19 year old attending college and it has made my life so much better. So for anyone is doubting the surgery it really does work."

So don't give up on being 'normal' again one day. There's another few articles if you Google the same affliction.

Mom - I have the same pain when I'm doing the electronic therapy and I am hopeful that the pain is a good thing.  The physio therapist says that one of the first things to return is the sensory part of the nerve, so if it's increasingly sensitive maybe thats a good thing.  Lets pray.

Hamish - Big EMG coming up eh?  Well I'm sending some positive energy your way and am hoping it'll drum up some good news for you, I'm sure it will.  I'm still looking into that AFO I posted about awhile back and am hoping I can get it made and tried here in Calgary Canada.

Everyone else that suffers from a floppy foot, I hope it comes around; Jackie & Gordon, lets feed off each other and hope by Christmas we can wrap the AFO's up and give them to someone else.

Thnking of you guys,
-Max-



 
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: G_Bronson on July 13, 2007, 05:06:50 AM
Andre- way to go on the touchdown bud! i just saw it on TSN. You are awesome, a true inspiration. when i get back to Edmonton in august i will have to come watch the Agros play the eskimos at Commonwealth stadium.

Newfie- welcome to the forum. What are the odds of two newfies being on this forum?lol. I am also from the rock. I have found that doctors have not been the best source for positive feedback, but it is out there. This forum is a great place to get it my friend. People do recover  from injurys such as yours but it will not happen over night. Stay positive and work hard and take it day by day. Are you currently on the rock? A good physio therapist will make a big difference. If you are in Newfoundland i have found a really good one.

I have some very positive news to report my tib ants are finally showing some signs of life. Very Faint but its there. I still cannot dorsiflex but last week at physio my PT did an assesment and told me he could feel something when i tried to pull up my foot. He did it again and again just to make sure it was me doing it and not a normal relex. He told me i had a grade 1. Then this week he said it felt stronger to him and he did not need to double check then he got me to really try to dorsiflex and got down to check for movement and he said he saw a flicker. he said there was definate movement, very very slight but it ws there He was pretty excited and told me that me made a mistake the week before and that is was actually a grade 2. So hopefully it is starting to come back.

Max- I totally hear you i hate wearing an AFO this time of year. I am kinda glad to be in Newfoundland in that regard. It does not as warm here as it does in the rest of the country. Especially when compaired to Calgary. I ordered a foot up that should be here soon hopefully it will work for me.

Hamish- good job on the running, it must feel pretty darn good ill bet. Good for you keep up the good work and i hope your right about the feeling your getting and it comes back soon. Good luck on your EMG. Im hoping you get some positive news.

I hope everyone else is doing well and staying strong.

All the Best!
Gordon
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on July 13, 2007, 11:17:19 AM
Andre you are awesome! Watched it last night (yes we can get it in Scotland) and I was so excited when you came on, but first touch of the ball. You are not going to spend time teasing people are you just BANG! there you go.

NEWFEE. Hang in there and be positive. I feel it is always the way that doctors always give the most catious prognosis and that is certainly my experience. It will take time so work hard on your rehab for your knee to get that right first.

Gordon. Way to go with the recovery, it sounds very positive and I feel I am at about the same stage and quite excited about my EMG on Monday.

Max. No problems here with wearing the AFO in hot weather for the simple fact we don't get hot weather. Lots of rain though and my AFO has got wet on a few occassions.

Just on another note I am beginning to think that Canadians must have some sort of genetic defect with a predisposition to peroneal nerve injury. How many of you are there. Last count there was Andre, Max, Gordon and now Newfee. Have I missed anyone?

Hope everyone is doing well and boosted by Andre's success.

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: AmandaC on July 15, 2007, 04:00:27 AM
HI all and welcome Newfie.
Sounds ike there is some exciting things happening for many of you, Gordon you are making awesome progress, Hamish best of luck for tomorrow I am sure you are going to have some exciting news for us all.

Max I have some questions for you about your hip resurfacing.  I broke the acetabilum (hip joint) as well as my pelvis in several places.  I am having alot of trouble with pain in my hip and limited movement in my hip which is stopping me from riding horses again and as I say giving me a lot of pain.  Since you had the hip resurfacing operation do you have full range of movement back?  Were you given any idea of how long it would last?  Thanks heaps

No news from me on the nerve front, 10 months now and thinking that nothing is going to improve for me now.

Anyway will keep hoping and working
Amanda
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Max Pwr on July 15, 2007, 06:42:59 AM
Hi Amanda, (and everyone else)

I'm going to explain my surgeries to you just so you have a frame of reference.  October 1st, 2005 I too fractured my acetabulum (I'm not sure if I told you that) and they attempted a restructuring first; that is, they tried to put the broken pieces back together with plates and screws.  They also tried a new surgery whereby the surgeron cut off my greater trochanter, then fixed the acetabulum, then put the trochanter back on with 4 inch screws.  After 12 weeks of non-weight bearing I was able to put weight on it (January 1st, 2006) and started heavy on the physio.  Weeks and weeks went by and I wasn't getting better, in fact things got more painful and at one point the pain was so bad while walking my dog it made me cry.  Range of motion was minimum.  Finally, I had an appointment with my surgeon on May 17th, 2006.  He looked at the x-ray and was amazed I was even upright.  Apparently I had managed to not only break all the screws and bend the plates I fractured the acetabulum again and half of it had dissolved in my blood; the hip was dislocated and had been for quite sometime.  He wondered how long I was in pain, I advised him the pain never went away.  At that point he told me that he would have to get bone from the bone bank to restructure my pelvis and acetabulum with someonele's bone.  He further stated that he would try to do a Birmingham resurfacing but he could make no promises as he wouldn't be able to make that decision until he went in and saw what he had to deal with he may have to do a Total Hip Replacement (THR).  June 20th, 2006 I had the surgery.  Luckily, he did the Birmingham and I'm glad he did.  The only downside is that I have the drop foot (13 months now), he doesn't know why I have it, no surgeron does.  My range of motion is really good, not 100% of where it was but enough to enjoy every activity I did before the injury (except for what the disappointing drop foot limits me to).  I stradle chairs and swing my leg around with little difficulty so I imagine riding a horse would be comfortable, I wouldn't hestiate if I had a horse.  The lifespan of the resurfaced hip will apparently last a lifetime, that is, they advised they will have to keep an eye on it but I was not given a definate time frame.  Apparantly a THR is about 15-20 years, this could last three times as long.  I'm glad I did it, I'm 36 and if it wasn't for the palsy I would be running triathlons again.   The THR would've put an end to everyting physical in my life as there's limits to range of motion, crossing legs and bending hips past 90 degrees.  Birmingham has no such restrictions.

Now about your drop foot.  I've read several articles concerning injuries like ours and many (about 75%) have recovery anywhere from 12 to 36 months so waving the white flag at 10 months is unacceptable.  You stay hopeful, believe you're going to get better and just maybe you will.  You give up on recovery and recovery will gve up on you.

That's all I got to say about that,
-Max-

Sorry about he length of this note but I thought you may recognize some of the things I went through and you could learn from what I've been dealing with.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: NEWFIE on July 15, 2007, 01:23:10 PM
Hello all,

I will start with saying I am very happy with finding a forum that has so many positive stories instead of all the "doom and gloom" stories that I read on other forums which of course brought my spirits down very low. I am now on page 14 of this thread and I am already uplifted by you stories so everybody please keep up the good work!

After my crash, I lay in a hospital two days later with a broken thumb, colar bone, ribs, cracked schaphoid, blown out knee with of course the dreaded foot drop and then to add to that a doctor tells me I probably won't walk again which totally blew me away. Well I didn't know where to turn! Since then I have gone through 2 surgeries to put the knee back together(May 17/2007) and a peroneal nerve graft(May 23/2007). I am now a little more then 7 weeks post op and I am getting alot of tinel sensation in my foot when I tap on the nerve around the knee where they did the nerve graft. The doctors are saying that is a very good sign because it tells them that the nerve sheath is in tack and NO MORE BROKEN WIRE!

I am not a "can't do" type of person but I am a "CAN DO" person and I am going to walk, and I am going to get rid of this foot drop with alot of faith in god and alot of hard work. Just this past week I started with the aid of my PT to bear weight on my leg and were up to 80 degrees flexion with the knee.

If there are any different things I can try to get this nerve working such as foods, excersises, or therapies I can try please let me know!

PS. This is one way I will learn to have patients!
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: AmandaC on July 16, 2007, 03:52:00 AM
Max, thanks for all that info and your words of encouragement.  I have not given up hope or rehab and am still working hard but I have to move on with my life and to do that I have found I have to be happy with what I have and who I am and if I get soemthing back with the foot great but I have come to terms with the possibility of this been permanent.  I will continue to work hard and intend to investiage the tendon transfer operation say 18 months down the track.  Some exciting news is my husband and I have decided to try for our second child soon, I kept thinking I couldn't have another one until I was over this foot drop etc etc but im not going to let it stop me, I think planning the rest of our life will be good to start living for the future not for the day of my accident.  Its going to be hard work but I can cope (not looking forward to another operation, has to be a c section delivery).

Newfie  -  Yes you are going to have to be very very patient, but you are young and fit so have very good chance of recovering from this.  Dont let them tell you that you cant walk again, be strong and you can do it.  Best of luck

Hamish - waiting eagerly for your results.

Mom - Hope all is well with you and your darling little girl.

Thinking of you and hoping for good things to happen for us all.
Amanda
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on July 16, 2007, 02:16:04 PM
My foot has moved  :o

Just back from my EMG test and everything is very positive. Before the test the doctor asked me to dorsiflex my foot and there was a movement. It was only probably about a millimetre but it did move and that is the first time I have had a movement since the injury. He then went on to send electric shocks through my muscles and then stick needles in (not nice but didn't cry) and yes messages are getting through. So there has been regeneration and it is just a matter of time and work to get back movement. There is no guarantee of how much movement will return.

Amanda. It will be 11 months next week since my injury and that is me just getting a flicker of movement now and the point of injury was at my knee. I know it is not a very comforting timescale but your injury was Hip/pelvis and the length of the nerve to regenerate is longer and therefore will take longer. Keep your head up.

Hope everyone is doing well.

Happy Hamish  ;D
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: G_Bronson on July 16, 2007, 08:33:18 PM
Hamish, - I am very happy for you, that is very positive news. I have another EMG at the end of this month hopefully i will get some positive news. But i have lost alot of faith in the neurologist im seeing so i dont really care if the news is not positive. How much of your nerve did they tell you was damaged?
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on July 16, 2007, 09:19:49 PM
Hi Gordon,

When the surgeon explained the damage to me after my initial opertion back in September I think he said there was about 5cm where the nerve had been stretched to almost breaking point in places.

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on July 16, 2007, 11:11:14 PM
Welcome Newfie and good luck on your road to recovery!  We are very supportive on here with both information as well as moral support and spiritual guidance.

Still no movement with my daughter's foot but the therapists do get muscle contractions during stim therapy.

Congratulations on the movement Hamish!

Hang in there Amanda, Max, Gordo and everyone else.  We are thinking of you and praying!
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: NEWFIE on July 17, 2007, 03:17:28 AM
Hi all,

Amanda  -  Try to keep focused and don't give up! Yes, life does go on and trying for another baby I think would be a great idea. Me and my wife are going to start again in the near future and I'm not going to let this foot drop put our lives on hold either.

Hamish  -  Great to hear you got some movement, I am so happy for you!

Gordon  -  Looking forward to the end of the month when you get your EMG! If you want the phone number for the plastic surgeon in Halifax give me a call ,I know he is in his clinic every Monday.

Mom  -  Please say hello to your little girl and let her know we are all thinking about her.

I pray and have faith that everyone on this forum will have positive returns as long as we keep focused on success!

NEWFIE
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: AmandaC on July 23, 2007, 01:52:45 AM
Hamish - Thats great news, I am sure you will get it back as you are working so hard
Newfie  -  Thanks for your words on encouragement

I had X-Rays last week on hip and pelvis and neither was good news, I have considerable wear on the hip joint already and my pelvis bones in the front have moved a noticable amount, am waiting for report to come back once all my previous X-Rays have been reviewed, I am sure I must be due for some good news soon.

Keep working hard everyone
Amanda
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on July 25, 2007, 03:28:43 AM
We'll keep you in our prayers Amanda  :)
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on July 25, 2007, 09:28:28 PM
Amanda,

Good luck and let us know how the results come out.

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: AmandaC on July 25, 2007, 09:52:32 PM
Hamish & Mom
Thanks for your encouragement, I got results back yesterday and it has been confirmed as athritus, because of the short time frame that it has happened in it is quite serious, waiting to see a specialist at the moment, apparently the unstable pelvis is not a huge concern at this stage.
Will keep you all posted.
Hamish - anymore movement?  I hope so.
Amanda
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on July 25, 2007, 10:14:32 PM
Hi Amanda,

Thats not great news but hopefully they can do something for you. On the movement front outward movement is improving slowly but dorsiflexion is just a flicker at the moment. Can't move it sitting as gravity is too much for it but lying down I can get a little movement.

Good luck
Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Max Pwr on July 25, 2007, 11:36:22 PM
Hi Everyone,

Amanda, I went through the same thing so I know how frustrating it can be.  Hang in there and they can do amazing things to pelvis' and hips these days.  A quarter of my pelvis is some dead guy's that I'll meet in the next life, I'm sure he'll want it back. 

Ham, Mom, Gordon, Andre, Newf and anyone else I've miised  - I think of you often and include you in my prayers.  No dorsi-flexion here at all still but am still getting by one day at a time.

Jackie - haven't heard from you in a bit, how's recovery going?

Take care all, will write more when I get a chance.

~Max~
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Max Pwr on July 26, 2007, 03:56:31 AM
Hey Guys,

I saw a news article the other day on the effect of injecting botox into the calves of people with stroke symptoms and MS.  Interestingly enough studies have been done for those with foot drop as well (common symptoms of MS and stroke sufferers).  I've pasted a study, interesting reading ...

" Ten patients with spastic drop foot were treated by local injections of botulinum toxin A (botulinum toxin A haemagglutinin complex). The purpose was to improve stance and gait and/or to facilitate physiotherapy and patient care. Various calf muscles were injected using EMG guidance. The average dose used was 23 ng. Prior to and 4 weeks after treatment, positions of the upper and lower ankle joint at rest and the corresponding end positions of passive and active movement were determined. In addition, changes of spasticity and pain, the transmission phenomenon and stance and gait were evaluated. Most patients showed improvement of some aspects of the spastic drop foot. Positions of the upper and lower ankle joint were improved in most of the patients, as were the other para meters examined. Except for weakness of the injected muscles no side-effects were observed. The results appear promising and may be optimized in further trials by using higher doses of the toxin."

Thought I'd share.

-Max-

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on August 01, 2007, 05:16:49 AM
Just checking in...  Noting new to report here.  Worried about Jacky, she wasn't in the flooded part of England, was she? 

If you're out there, let us know... 
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on August 04, 2007, 04:53:49 PM
Please guys, let's keep this thread alive!  Post away and let us know how you are!  Please  :)
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on August 04, 2007, 08:20:16 PM
Hello All,

I am so sorry I have not been on line for such a long time - after I last posted I said I had an infection - well I had a real bad infection and it literally knocked me off my feet and confined me back to bed. Consequently I have alot of muscle wastage on both legs and now really have some hard work in front of me.  I have been very fortunate to get the the physiotherapist and hydrotherapist I had last time back again - I am really happy about - although I am not sure they share my enthusiasm!  Still I got into the hydrotherapy pool and had a right shock as I honestly thought the water would be enough to stabalise me so I could walk in the water.  I had a rude awakening!  Still I have been that far back before and can get back to where I was before.  Mom444 - I was in an area affected by the flooding 15ft in the High Street in the town but I escaped any real damage although I have had a water leak whilst in hospital that pulled the dining room ceiling down (which was to be my temporary bedroom) so have had that to contend with as well.  The works on that were delayed because of my infection.  Still all that is now behind me - next week I have two weeks R&R at the nursing home again to try and build up my strength and body weight again so I can start physiotherapy in earnest.  Sorry about the long post  - but that is my update.  I am pleased to here hamish's news and that everyone continues to look in. 
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on August 05, 2007, 05:39:37 AM
Jacky,

We missed you!  Glad to know you are still around  :)  So sorry to hear about your infection and also the flood damage.  Hopefully things will improve soon and you can relax.

The latest news with us:  Well it has now been exactly a year since my daughter's surgery and her therapists seem to think that the roughly "one inch a month" theory of regeneration is true.  During point stimulator therapy, they say they see muscle contractions on the front of her leg going about 10 INCHES down from the point of the injury/surgical site.  So that's good!  No dorsiflexion yet.  The one younger therapist says that it will still take probably at least six months until the nerve could recover onto the top of her foot and then allow for dorsiflexion.  So let's pray that things progress.  The dragon, sneaky little bugger, not as obvious lately.

Hope you all are well!  Post!  Post and tell us!   :)
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: SunnyK8 on August 05, 2007, 07:01:15 AM
Thank god for this website.  My sympathy goes out to everyone who is suffering and I pray for all of you to recover. 

About 2 weeks ago I went through my own injury-stretching and high sugar led to left foot drop.  I just went to get my EMG yesterday and the results say that it will take 6 months to a year for recovery-that I actually had a mini-stroke of the nerve and that it was heavily damaged.  Needless to say I'm terrified in my own way of having to be patient and the whole "one inch a month" theory still is hard to believe-sometimes i wish I had broken my leg rather than done something like this.  I have a temporary ankle brace but will be getting a custom one in the upcoming week or so-walking is a challenge but it could have been worse im sure. 

Any advice from anyone out there?  anything would be appreciated...
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: NEWFIE on August 05, 2007, 02:37:11 PM
Hello all,

I am so happy to have found this forum and like Mom444 said, DON'T LET THIS THREAD DIE!

I just want to update everyone and start by saying I am 2 1/2 months post nerve graft surgery and I am getting the dragons in my foot and the right font of my right leg sometimes feels like it is on fire. My peroneal nerve graft was done with 10cm piece of harvested sural nerve from my injured leg and grafted on the outer side of my knee on May23/07. I am know able to tap on the underside of my leg almost halfway down my calf muscle and feel sensation down in my foot which lasts for about 5 - 10 seconds. I sometimes feel a bug bite or needle sensation at the top of my tib anterior muscle and I was wondering if this was some sort of sign that the nerve is trying to conect the muscle.

I go for my EMG aug 21 and I am quite nervous.

I pray and hope all is well with everyone and look forward to hearing from anyone with any input.

Thanks, NEWFIE
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: John42 on August 05, 2007, 05:17:58 PM
Hi

Well - at this stage, all we can say - be patient - listen to your knee and dont do anything stupid -  it`s going to be a long haul - but it should all turn out for the good at the end.

Best wishes

JohnK/ Manchester UK
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on August 06, 2007, 01:56:30 AM
Hey everyone,

Welcome to all the newcomers to the thread...i hope and know that you will find this thread very helpful in the recovery process and look forward to sharing our experiences with you.

I feel like a newcomer as well...and kind of disappointed in myself that i haven't been on as much as i feel i should. How are things with everyone? i think about everyone here all th time and pray for the best. momm444, i see that there is alot of positive results coming out of the therapy approach you are taking. i never lost hope and never will and i know that your daughter will overcome.

Hamish and Max how are you guys doing?

Jackie hope you are doing well...i read that you encountered some bumps in the road...how have you been?

I keep you all in my thoughts and prayers and hope that recovery is going well.

How is everyones progression? are we noticing Positive changes Negative changes? or nothing at all? i remember when i was going through the stages of recovery (which i still am) i used to try and keep track of of the all the changes and my feelings about each "change" i thought i was going through. so how have you all been viewing your recovery?

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Max Pwr on August 06, 2007, 03:18:01 AM
Hi Guys,

Andre, good to hear from you, I saw the TD the other night, looked great; I'm so proud of you man, congrats on all of your success.

Jacky, thanks for checking in, I know things are rough but you'll only get better, keep that in mind as progress continues.

All others, I'm so happy you're checking in and contributing, I draw a lot of strength from our common injuries and it's nice to know I'm not alone out there.  Eventhough I still have no dorsi-flexion I have started to train very hard again (including running, not jogging but running with my AFO).  I have set a goal to get back on the SWAT team by the fall so I'm forcing my body through the pain in hopes I can get back.  So far so good, I'm sore as hell but I was able to run for twenty minutes straight today, making it about 2 and a half miles.  No time or distance records but the only competition for me is the clock as I have to run a certain distance in a certain time.  It's obviously not easy but as we all know it's mostly a frame of mind.

Please keep checking in and sharing, no need to share progression as I haven't had any for months but share what's going on upstairs and when you feel down let us know, we all have those days.  Seems recently though when I've been trying to flex my shin gets tired, which is kind of new for me as I had no feeling in my shin before, I hope this is a sign of progress.

Take care, keep in touch!

~Max~
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on August 06, 2007, 10:42:48 AM
Hi Everyone and welcome to SunnyK8,

Sunny sorry to hear about your injury and unfortunately you just have to be patient. This month I will be my 1 year anniversary of my injury and I am just starting to get some movement back. It is only a little bit of movement but is getting stronger all the time. Outward movement is getting quite good but dorsiflexion is very weak at the moment.

Jackie, sounds like you have had a hell of a time and the water damage on top of everything as well. I hope you are beginning to recover now and starting to make progress.

Andre, good to have you back, and I have been keeping tabs on you and was delighted to see your TD with the first touch of the ball. You got one last week as well but ddin't see that one. When are you guys going to start winning games again? My rehab is going very well and I have started running now. My running was pretty tentative to start with but now I am going great guns and almost up to a full sprint. The only down side at the moment is that the pins they put in to repair my fibula have moved. When I saw the surgeon last it was by about 6mm but I am sure they have moved more now. I see him again at the beginning of September so I will find out then what the story is. They are not giving me a problem at the moment but if they continue to move they will and they will have to taken out. Don't think it is a major op but could do without it.

Mom444, great to hear positive things are happening with your daughter and fingers crossed the improvements continue.

Gordon, Max and Newfie keep working hard and let us know how you are doing.

Amanda, any update on your hip? We are thinking of you.

Hamish



Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on August 06, 2007, 01:40:34 PM
Hi everyone,

Thanks to you all for your kind wishes and I will no doubt be back in full swing again soon.  Good news is - I have actually ained some weight this week - I lost just over a stone in weight and really didn't have it to lose I have now put on a couple of pounds so that is going in the right direction.  Consequently I feel fitter and stronger.  I have been exercising my floppy foot to wake it back up again - as you know I had got tib ant movement and started to dorsiflex (and I had the shin skin stinging as well) - after the last three months the foot made the most of the vacation and dropped off to sleep again so it has rudely and abruptly been woken up again.  Actually there is a thing to think about - if laid up in bed the foot will quickly deterioate (I my humble experience)  so I can now stand on floppy foot and partially weight bearing on the othere recently operated leg.  Max - I like the target and I have no doubt you'll acheive it - I also wish to be back on operational duties but set the target for January 2008. 
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: AmandaC on August 06, 2007, 10:20:28 PM
Hi All
Mom444 - I agree with you yes lets keep posting and supporting each other
Andre - Great to hear from you again
Jackie - You sound like you are tough so you will get through this and im sure you will make a great recovery
Hamish - sounds like you are doing great, hears hoping those screws stay in place for you.
Max - YOu to are making great progress and sound like you have a great desire to achieve your goals.
To everyone else keep working hard

Anyway no news for me feel like I have come to the end a bit - I know I havnt.
Have not been to the gym for three weeks now as have to rest the hip - hip is feeling better but as soon as I do to much it hurts again.  No one in New Zealand is willing to discuss the hip resurfacing operation with me as they claim im not bad enough yet and they say there is to much unknown about the procedure and its long term effects.  New Zealanders are very conservative.  So this leaves me unable to do much of anything active wise, I will not be able to ride, I cant run and I walk with a worse limp now than 4 months ago - feeling a little frustrated.

Anyway some good news the feeling in my leg is returning slowly - I now have feeling about three quarters way down my leg although it is still altered feeling but feeling so that positive sign

Keep working hard all
Amanda
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: G_Bronson on August 07, 2007, 04:35:12 AM
Hello Everyone,
I hope you are all doing well with your recoveries. I had an EMG last monday and although it did show a very slight sign of life on my peroneal muscles(which i took as being very positive and still am) the Doctor was not positive and still thinks i need a nerve graft at this point. The last two showed nothing and my last EMG was on May 28 which wasnt that long ago. I also saw a surgeon on the same day and he told me that i shouldnt get a nerve graft. It is very frustrating, which i am sure you all know. Feeling wise and color wise I think it is healing, it has improved alot in the last few months.
I also may go to see another specialist in Ontario, i will find out in a few weeks.
The knee is coming along great otherwise its getting stronger everyday, i get out walking and swimming almost everyday in the last two weeks and i am curling 5 times the weight i started with. I just hope i get some signs of the nerve coming back soon
Andre- Good to hear from you again. HOw long before you stoped wearing a night brace? I hope you continue to heal!
mom444- It sounds like you are getting some good results with your thearaphy. I hope your little girl continues to heal.
Jackie- I am terribly sorry to hear of your struggles since your last surgery with the flooding and the infection. I hope the worst is behind you and you have two heathly legs sooner than later.
Hamish- it sounds like you doing well lately, i hope you keep working hard and keep seeing progression.

Everyone else i hope you are doing your best to remain optimistic even though it is not easy. my orthopedic surgeon told me of a woman who had an injury similar to mine and after 18 months she started to get function back. So it may take a while but we wer all reach our goals it we work hard and stay positive.
Take care Everyone! Your all in my thoughts everyday
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: AmandaC on August 17, 2007, 04:20:32 AM
Hi everyone

Just a quick question - Hamish you have said your feeling is returning down the leg, is this totally normal feeling? I think I have some feeling coming back but it is not totally normal.

Any progress from anyone?
Thanks Amanda
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on August 17, 2007, 11:55:13 AM
Hi Amanda,

Just done a bit of an inspection and can report the following:

1. Below injury site (just below knee) most bits are still numb. Feeling I described was doing the TAP test to indicate at what point I felt tingling in my foot when tapping down my leg. This had been moving down my leg as time went on. Does that make sense.
2. My outward movement of my foot has been getting stronger, and strapping 2 kg ankle wieght round foot to exercise, but not really noticable yet to show when walking without brace.
3. Dorsiflexion is still very weak and ankle weight too heavy to lift so balance my trainer on end of toes.
4. NEW THIS WEEK! Second biggest toes has moved for first time. I have quite perfectly formed feet so this is the one next to my big toe. I know some people have quite odd feet so second biggest toe can be somewhere else on their foot. This toes strangely seems to have normal sensation but big toe still numb and not moved yet.

In summary feeling has not really returned but sensation in my foot has been triggered at an increasingly lower point in my leg until some movement started to happen and this movement is still weak but working hard to strenghten.

Next week , 26th 7.20pm, will be my first anniversary of injury! going on holiday to stay with some friends in Paris for a couple of weeks. Cheap flight and no accommodation costs, think I might splash out on a cake!

Gordon - If there was an improvement between EMG test in May and your last one then that is surely a good sign of recovery so keep positive on that one. Good to hear your knee is getting stronger. have you managed to do any sort of running on it yet?

Hope everyone else is doing well.

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on August 18, 2007, 03:33:43 AM
Just stopping in to say hello.

Not much new here with us.  I'll admit we've been busy and have been slacking off on doing the "tickle stickers" (EMS) every night and we should be doing the heating pad, but we've hardly had a chance to.  Days are so busy and a four year old wants to just go to sleep at night.  But we are still going to physical therapy twice a week and having the point stimulator therapy, etc.

We have another EMG at the end of the month.  "Dragons" have been pretty much gone but the therapists do say there has been definite recovery and muscle contractions showing all the way along the top of my daughter's calf, but the nerve needs to grow more to get dorsiflexion.

Gordon, I'm glad your doc told you about a person getting recovery after 18 months, because again that seems like a more fair time frame than 12 months.

Hope the rest of you are all doing well.  Keep checking in with updates on your progress.  I still check the board all the time.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: AmandaC on August 19, 2007, 08:35:14 PM
Hamish
Thanks for that info, I have altered sensation returning down the outside of my leg and when I do tap test I get that feeling in the foot, feeling stops about half way down bottom leg, this is also were I go totally numbe from.  I saw surgeon last week that did the surgeory and he thinks there are signs of recovery? to date he has been the only on with positive feedback. I also received a letter from my nurologist with an update that new research says up to 3 years for the peroneal nerve.  My hip has settled considerebly since stopped at the gym, rode a horse in the weekend, was OK but muscles struggled.  i then fell down  4 steps that afternoon, couldn't believe I do something so silly.  Am feeling very sore today.

Anyway better go clean house.
Good to hear from everyone and keep working hard.
Amanda
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on August 20, 2007, 10:52:10 AM
Hi Amanda,

That sounds very positive with the rocovery and that is the same as happened with me. On a horse again and managed it ok, well done! Glad to hear that your hip has settled but please do be careful with steps!

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on August 20, 2007, 10:00:03 PM
I also received a letter from my nurologist with an update that new research says up to 3 years for the peroneal nerve. 

Anyway better go clean house.
Good to hear from everyone and keep working hard.
Amanda

Best of luck to you again Amanda.

Did your neurologist say from where he or she got the information about the new research?  Three years for peroneal recovery?  That it interesting.  I would love to see the research.

Take care again,

Mom
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on August 26, 2007, 10:43:52 PM
Hello All,
Also a quick sign in - I have just completed another 12 day stint at a rehab centre and due to return in three weeks time so just have enough time to settle at home before I am off again.  The lost movement in my floppy foot after being bed bound for so long is slowly returning back to normal levels.  Please remember that if you are confined to bed for any reason then make sure you wear your night splint to save the calf from tightening back up again and even wneh really poorly get someone to passively mobalise the foot to keep it going - lesson learnt on my behalf as it's hard work and demoralising seeing how quickly it can deteriorate.  I am now putting a good deal of weight through both legs so hoping to be weaning myself off crutches over the next few days.  God Bless you all and praying for good recoveries or the strength to deal with what you have.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on August 29, 2007, 04:13:42 PM
Please pray for us!

We had another EMG study and while it showed more improvement with the nerve itself the doctors is concerned for the muscle.  He says there has been no or little muscle reinnervation in the past four months since her last EMG.

Do any of you know of any other therapies to encourage muscle recovery/discourage atrophy?  Other than EMS?

Some of you have mentioned water therapy but our therapist does not offer that service. 

What about other more intensive muscle treatments?

Hope you all are well.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on August 29, 2007, 07:12:09 PM
mom,
My prayers are with you.
I had and still have hydrotherapy - not sure it particular helps with stopping muscle atrophy but did help with the circulation issues that also occur with peroneal palsy.  Not able to offer any alternatives though, sorry

with every blessing

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: AmandaC on August 29, 2007, 09:20:21 PM
Mom - How long ago was it now that your Daughter first developed foot drop?  I know how upsetting it is when you get bad news but dont give up.  My prayers are with your little girl.
I dont know were my nerologist got his research from regarding his comment up to 3 years for recovery?  I am not aware of any alternative treatements for the muscles but I will ask around for you.
Jackie - Glad you are back on track and sounds like you are making good progress now.

No news from me.
Keep up the hard work everyone.
Amanda
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: klippr on August 30, 2007, 05:57:01 PM
Hi to all. I'm new here and eading the stories how we all came to be and find myself in the same boat as Max Pwr.  I was a cop until I did a beutiful job of dislocating my knee, along with all the tendon that torn/ruptured/seperated I torn/stretched the nerve and now have foot drop.  I would like to see or find out about running again with the afo but everytime I try I end up with a bloody heel. Currently using a hidged plastic afo.  Should I just continue adjusting or does someone know of a better afo. 
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on August 31, 2007, 03:13:50 AM
Welcome klippr and good luck in your recovery!

Amanda, as for timeframes I just requested the latest article about peroneal nerve injuries and no new info in that.

However I found a few sites online that stated brachial plexus nerve injuries can continue recovering for up to four years.

So nerves in general may heal for longer than one year as many doctors sometimes say.

Meanwhile we are stepping up therapy here.  We are back in physical therapy and we do EMS stickers four times a day now...  no more slacking as we have been lately.  Also we do heating pads, massages, etc.  Also vitaman B therapy.

Ah...  It's upsetting but we keep at it.

Best to you all.  Thanks for the prayers too!  We are praying for you also.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: sil on September 03, 2007, 05:33:03 AM
Hi everyone,

It took me a few days to read thru all the posts but I'm glad I found this thread.  You have all been through so much and for many still are.  I wish I had a magic wand to wave and make everyone one better. 

I didn't know whether I should post or not as I was told by my GP that I have peroneal nerve damage but I don't have foot drop.  Actually I have had a few different diagnosis.  Initially my knee only hurt at night if I slept on my left side and moved my knee down the mattress a bit I would get a real bad zinge feeling (pins and needles) or if I lifted my knee up and out more than a 90 degree angle when standing and putting on my jeans it would hurt. I went to the gym one day and rode the recumbant bike and noticed it was sore a bit doing this.  My knee starting hurting more so I saw a PT who thought it might be an irritation of the sonovial sac.  The next time she thought it was an irritation of the LCL.  I saw another PT who I think said it had something to do with the fat pad and the knee capsule.  Finally went to my GP who said it was the peroneal nerve at the head of the fibula.  When I last saw the PT he pressed up fairly hard with his fingers and it hurt somewhat (felt like pressure) on the outside of my left knee cap.  A few days later that area went numb and still is.  I think he made it worse.

Saw GP again 4 weeks after I first saw him and he said he wasn't concerned about the numbness and burning but was concerned that it still hurt.  Sometimes the area to the left of my knee cap burns, sometimes it aches, sometimes I get a zinge or short sharp pain.  But for a good portion it doesn't hurt at all.  But if I squat or lift knee above 90 degrees it hurts.  Sometimes get a very mild tingling sensation.  GP sent me for X-ray to rule out any cartilage damage or arthritis.  Talked about sending me to an OS and possibly having an MRI done. 

The only thing I can think of that started this was at one point I was balanced mostly on my left knee and the outside of my knee was pressed up against something hard and plastic for awhile.  Was told this was enough to damage the nerve as I am thin and therefore don't have a lot of fat to protect it.  I mentioned that I googled peroneal nerve damage and all the sites mentioned foot drop and could it still be peroneal nerve damage and was told yes and that I didn't have foot drop as the tibial nerve was not affected. 

Lots of people have mentioned the dragon and I am wondering where you feel it?  The foot, down the leg or at the knee.  Does anyone have numbness at the knee or just the foot?  Does it sound like I have peroneal nerve damage?

Will talk to doctor this week to see what showed up on the x-ray.  I hope you all don't mind me telling my story as I know it is nothing compared to others but Mom444 (hi) mentioned she wanted to keep the thread alive.  Sending you all healing thoughts.

Rosa
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on September 03, 2007, 05:45:45 AM
Welcome Rosa!

Welcome to the thread and definitely keep posting with info on your treatment and progress.

There is not really a lot of information out there about peroneal nerve damage, especailly first hand accounts, so this thread is even more important.

My daughter's younger physical therapist says that he's not too horrified by the lack of nerve reinnervation in the past four months.  We have had nerve growth in the past four months, just not muscle reinnervatin.  The younger therapist said that healing, like all kinds of growth, may go in "spurts."

Who knows?  But these kinds of injuries are so mysterious and confusing.

We'll add Rosa and klippr to our prayer list.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: sil on September 03, 2007, 08:35:47 AM
Thank you Mom444.  You are very kind.  I think about you and your daughter often and pray for her recovery.  She's a very brave little girl with a wonderful and vivid imagination.  I live on the West Coast of Canada and the dragon at times seems to have made an appearance here as well.

I do have a recovery story although it is a second hand one.  When I first saw my doctor he was telling me about a patient who had been up all night studying for exams.  He either had his legs crossed or the knee was pressed up against the wall.  By the morning he had developed foot drop.  It took either 6 or 9 months but my GP said he had a full recovery.

It had gotten to the point where I could walk at a decent pace 1.6 miles or 2.7 km with no pain whatsoever so I decided to try the stepping machine at the fitness centre.  I had done it the night before for 15 minutes with no problem and the next day it seemed like the numbness was better.  I used it for 10 minutes today and it didn't hurt but after that it started to hurt in the area where it is numb.  I only used it for another 3 minutes but then decided it was best if I stop.  Today sometimes walking hurt and and it feels red hot and burning sensation.  It think it is slightly swollen.  Even just sitting I'm getting sharp little pains.  I hope I didn't damage it more.  I want to be getting better not worse but I did read in one of the posts that it can take up to 6 weeks for the nerve to denervate.   Indeed it is very frustrating not knowing exactly what is going on and different people saying different things as you well know.  I feel all the poking and proding and making me squat and duck walk and lift leg this way and that to try and figure out what it is have just made things worse.  I will ask my GP for an MRI.  Do you know if nerve damage shows up on an MRI?

I told my doctor that I read that the peroneal nerve heals about 1 mm a day and he said probably slower as it is farther away from the blood supply than other nerves.  I am not mentioning this to discourage anyone but rather I bring it up so you don't get discouraged if you don't seem to be healing fast enough.

Amanda, Kippur, Max and others how are you making out?  Take Care everyone.

Rosa
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on September 03, 2007, 02:41:27 PM
Thank for your prayers and input Rosa  :)

As for the MRIs we have had conflicting results there.  We did NOT get my daughter's nerve injury to show up on an MRI and they weren't able to find the neuroma until they opened her up in surgery.  However, it's still good to have one in case there is a cyst or something else causing the problem.

I try not to overobsess anymore but I do still find a lot of research articles and things online.  I just found a posting about nerve regenerationa and the subsequent muscle reinnervation, albeit in rats!   ::)  But if I am deciphering the medical talk correctly it could be saying that reinnervation happens more slowly than you would think as well.

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: sil on September 05, 2007, 02:15:13 AM
Hi Mom444,

How are you and your daughter doing?  Has the dragon been around lately?  She is very lucky to have such a loving and concerned mom.  I saw my GP today.  He said there is nothing to be concerned about on the x-ray so that's good news.  He is referring me to a specialist as he doesn't know why I am still having pain.  Will phone back in a day or two with an appointment time but said it could be a 2 month wait.  Sigh!  I asked about having an MRI and he said wait until you see the knee specialist as he can speed up the wait time for an MRI.  I asked if nerve damage would show up on an MRI and he said "no".

I am still suffering from overdoing it at the gym.  I wish I had stopped doing the stepping stairs when it started hurting but I only did it for another 3 minutes but that was enough to really flair things up.  GP didn't really know why my knee should hurt doing that piece of equipment but said most likely I had irritated soft tissue there.  I am icing it and taking Advil in the hopes that it will settle down soon.

GP said is was the superficial peroneal nerve that was compressed up against the bone that it causing my symptoms. 

Hope all is well with your family.

Rosa
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on September 05, 2007, 04:03:56 PM
Hi to all. I'm new here and eading the stories how we all came to be and find myself in the same boat as Max Pwr.  I was a cop until I did a beutiful job of dislocating my knee, along with all the tendon that torn/ruptured/seperated I torn/stretched the nerve and now have foot drop.  I would like to see or find out about running again with the afo but everytime I try I end up with a bloody heel. Currently using a hidged plastic afo.  Should I just continue adjusting or does someone know of a better afo. 

Hey Klippr Welcome to our group. Have a look online at a support called a 'Foot-up'. I have the same problem with the AFO and find it really unsuitable for running. I still wear my AFO when I wear shoes but if I am wearing trainers I wear the Foot-up and it is far more comfortable and easier to run in. Be careful though and be sure you don't turn your ankle as it gives a little less support. Have a look at the link below.

Hamish

http://www.kneeandjointbraces.com/site/986957/page/454869?gclid=CLXSq6LLrI4CFSgVEAodqnXWRQ
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: klippr on September 12, 2007, 03:56:30 PM
Thanks Hamish I'll give it a look at.  I know I tried one similar, it basicaly was shoe laces with velcro ends and a wrap for the ankle.  It wasn't strong enough.  That one you sent looks pretty durable, do you notice your foot slapping down on heel contact?
My well wishes to all
Klippr
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on September 13, 2007, 09:31:27 PM
Klippr. The foot-up is pretty robust and I have no problem running with it.

How is everyone else doing, Max, Gordon, Jackie, Amanda, Mom and Rosa and those that I have missed.

Things are good with me and saw my surgeon last week. Everything seems to be OK but the pins in my fibula had moved and I see him in December and he will assess it then but at the moment they are not giving me any problems. I was running around the other day and my knee felt almost normal. Foot movement is frustrating but feel it is getting better. I strap an ankle weight around my foot and try and move it. Dorsiflexion is very weak but outward movement is much stronger.

Let us know how you are doing!!!

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: sil on September 15, 2007, 04:37:34 AM
Hi Hamish and everyone else,

Hamish, I'm glad to hear that your knee is doing so well. 

I have to wait 6 months before I can see the knee specialist.  I still have numbness on the outside of my left knee.  I think it has gotten a bit better or maybe I am just getting more used to it.  I'm not so thin anymore (lol - gained about 10 pounds) as scared to really work out after I aggrevated my knee at the gym last time.

Andre or others did you find that as healing and movement came back i.e. foot or knee that the numbness went away?

It does my heart good to hear about people's progress so everyone keep us posted or if you're feeling down or frustrated and want to gripe that's fine too.

Rosa
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on September 17, 2007, 10:25:15 PM
Update:

We are now trying TES, that stands for either THRESHOLD ELECTRICAL STIMULATION or THERAPUTIC ELECTRICAL STUMULATION.

It's like a low level EMS unit that you wear overnight.

I discovered this through my own research, no doctors or therapists near us had heard of it.  We found a specialist an hour away and we started on the therapy.

NOTE:  The new therapist says that sometimes regular EMS does more harm than good!

Can't talk long now but I'll post more links soon...

You can do a web search on the treatment...

Stll praying for all of you.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on September 30, 2007, 04:47:42 AM
Just checking in...

How is everyone doing?

The dragon came back for a visit tonight.

We are still prayer for all of you.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Max Pwr on October 01, 2007, 03:55:49 AM
Hi Everyone,

No real news here; SWAT put on hold as I've been advised by doctors to wait a few more months, which is discouraging but I'm learning that some things are just out of my control.  The drop foot is still at the same stage it was months ago, and although I remain hopeful; things again are discouraging.  If only I could get a little glimmer of hope every now and then but alas, no dorsi-flexion no matter how hard I grunt and try.  Went and tried a number of different AFO's the other day in an effort to find something that fits in my shoe a bit better but the AFO I have now seems to be the only answer for a close to normal gait.  I've run out of research material and am beginning to research the tendon transfer as it may be  my only hope of losing the AFO next year sometime.  Doctors remind me to be patient but its been 16 months with the drop foot now and no signs of recovery other than a decrease in that dragon (which still bites every now and then).  If I don't see a marked improvement by Christmas  / New Year's I don't think it'll come around.  Frustrating as hell because the origin or my troubles (right hip) feels better every month and I'd be doing everything I ever wanted to but the drop foot prevents me from feeling and acting normal.

Well I Better let you go.  Drop a line tell us how you are, we've been letting go of this thread and it's been a good outlet.  Hope everyone is hgaving a good fall and you're having a little more success than me ............

-Max-
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on October 01, 2007, 04:43:50 AM
Max,

Look into the TES stimulation to condition the muscle while the nerve hopefully grows back.

Google "therapeutic muscle stimulation"...  Sometimes the T is threshold.

Our American insurance doesn't want to pay for it but maybe Canada and the UK are better.

Also, do the vitamin B supplements.

Best to you all.

With love...
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on October 01, 2007, 02:30:45 PM
Hey Guys,

Glad to hear from you. Things with me are going well and I continue to see inprovements with the movements in my foot although it is very slow and fustrating. I still wear my AFO  as my dorsiflexion is very weak. Max, I started to see movement coming back after about 11 months from the time of injury and my injury site was my knee. I also have the added benefit of being very short so regeneration didn't have to go that far. I have spent my life thinking of good things about being short and this is another one. Your recovery has to travel a bit further so don't give up yet.

Hope everyone is doing well and keep us posted.

Cheers
Hamish

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: sil on October 02, 2007, 02:07:26 AM
Hi Mom444, Max Pwr, Hamish & everyone else:

Not much new at my end.  Still have to wait until middle of March before I can get in to see the knee specialist.  Area to left of knee still numb.  I read in another posting of someone who had an ACL reconstruction and ended up with about 5 inches of numbness on shin.  They noticed that no goosebumps formed in the numb part.  Also their numbness is down to about 2 inches now so that is encouraging for us that the nerves did regenerate.  I decided to check my knee the next time I was cold and noticed that goosebumps formed even on the numb part so I hope that is a good sign.

A few weeks ago when I went for a walk I quickly lifted my left knee up as high as it could go a couple of times.  It hurt each time.  Last nite my cat attacked my foot while I was sleeping (maybe thought it was a mouse LOL).  As a reflex reaction, I quickly yanked my left leg up to get it under the covers and prevent further bites and scratches.  And to my amazement it didn't really hurt.

In another bulletin board someone mentioned that one of the top doctors in the US for peroneal nerve damage is Dr. David Klein in New Orleans.  I know nothing about him as to recommend him or not recommend him but I just put the name out there if someone is interested to do some research on him or contact him.

Max - sending you healing thoughts and hoping you see improvement soon
Mom444 - hope your daughter gets good results with the TES
Hamish - so glad to hear of your ongoing progress

Anyone:  I am wondering the numb areas of your foot or leg do you feel any sensation at all (say for example if you rubbed your fingernail over it) or is feeling just dead to the world?

Rosa
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on October 07, 2007, 07:37:58 PM
Hello All,

So sorry about the very long delay but i have been back into rehab away from home and very inyensive - good news is that i am getting stronger and off crutches and on sticks outside only now.  Bad news is I have a splint for both feet at the moment although the other leg is moving and has dorsiflexion and is only numb along the outside of my leg but i do have feeling on the top of my foot. I think it may just be weak muscles at the moment.  I see a neurologist fairly soon to find out whats going on.  Also my reflexes in my knee and ankle are very weak - does anyone else have this as a symptom?  Best wishes to you all
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Progressive on October 15, 2007, 02:52:19 AM
Hi.  I'm new to this forum and am in need for answers.  I suffered a hang gliding accident on July 7, 2007 where I nose dived in from 150 feet and broke my tibia plateau and had a plate installed.  I broke my pelvis in five places and have plates put in on the entire front and left buttocks.  I have a compression fracture on my L1.  Broke my ribs.  Punctured my lung and lacerated my liver.  I have paralysis below my knees with some feeling.  I have nerve damage, but no spinal cord injury, per my EMG.

Question:  What can I do to regerate, or repair my nerves in order to walk again without AFOs, or foot drop, and have feeling back in my calves and feet?  I do have needles and pins type of feeling on the bottom of my feet from time to time, especially after having sex, or going to the bathroom.  Strange.

Pete
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: sil on October 15, 2007, 03:32:27 AM
Welcome Pete,

Wow, you've been through a lot.  About all I can tell you is that nerves heal approximately 1 mm per day or 1 inch per month and possibly even slower if further away from the blood source.  My doctor told me that physiotherapy wouldn't speed up or help my recovery and that it should heal on it's own.  Told me not to sit cross legged, wear tight boots or apply pressure to the area i.e. have it resting up against a wall, etc. and be very careful not to bang it.  Told me not to rub damaged nerve area for example don't rub moisturizer into the area.

You may find it helpful to read the posts from page 1 especially from Andre as he has given a detailed description of his treatment and progress.  I wish you well in your recovery.

Rosa
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: AmandaC on October 15, 2007, 04:42:15 PM
Hi All
Sorry it has been so long since I have been in contact but do I have story for you all.
Firstly welcome Pete - I thought I had been through alot but nothing compared to you.  Hang in there the body is an amazing thing at healing.  In regard to your questions I have both tibial and peroneal nerve damage, tibial is the nerve that is giving you the pins and needles feeling under your feet I believe and it is also the nerve that controls your bladder and your sexual organs hence the feelings after sex and using the bathroom.  I have foot drop on my left side as a result of broken pelvis and hip joint 14 months ago now.  Hang in there it is a long road and I wish I could find away that we didnt have to wear that terrible AFO´s I look forward to the day I can burn mine.

Anyway I am currently in Germany Cologne hence my absence from the forum for a while.  I have been here for 1 month and am due to fly home Thursday, cant wait to see my little girl.  I have friends here that put me onto a Professor Pennig who specialises in nerves, I sent him my records and he said he thought he could help.  After several long weeks I made the decision to spend the money leave my family and come give it a shot as I could not find anymore help in NZ.  It is 2 weeks since my surgeory.  He performed surgeory on my sciatic nerve, repositioning, decompression and microscopic neurologist sorry about the spelling.  When he went in he found that my sciatic nerve at the hip was stretched around one plate in my hip and then rubbing on the second plate so every time I flexed my hip it was getting compressed agains the plates.  His opinion is if I had not had the surgeory in time I would have lost full use of the sciatic nerve not just the two parts that are already damaged.  Since the operation my nerve pain has reduced significantly and I have more feeling returning.  They have been doing electronic physio everyday and my foot and big toe are moving with the shocks.  I saw the professor today and he thinks he can feel a little flutter from the muscle when I try and move my foot up - early days yet.

So now I will return to NZ with my photos, reports and experience and do battle with my medical insurance to get some money back.
I will be back in NZ Saturday so will be back on line.

To everyone else I hope you are all well and I am thinking of you all everyday.
Kind healing thoughts to you all as always
Amanda
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on October 16, 2007, 12:13:36 AM
Just saying hello.

Welcome Pete.  As was said, reading over old posts on this board should be helpful.  Good luck in your recovery.  Take vitamin B supplements and try electric muscle stimulation if your therapists think it will help.

Not much new here.  We are still doing TES.  I haven't had time to call our insurance company to protest their denial of treatment.  Oh well...  There IS a lot written about it in the medical literature.

My daughter still cannot dorsiflex but the dragon pops in now and then still so I hope that's a good sign...

How is everyone else?
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Progressive on October 16, 2007, 04:57:38 AM
Thanks for the input.  Nothing new here.  I forgot to mention I also broke my shoulder in two places as well.  When they life flighted me into the U of U hospital, in Salt Lake City, Ut, I remember looking up at the doctor and he simply said, "Your Humpty Dumpty, and we're going to put you back together again."  I was so doped up on Morphine, that when I heard this, I realized very clearly that I was seriously messed up and I was going to be there for awhile.

Thank God I survived!

Pete
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: jcblank on October 16, 2007, 06:11:23 AM
I too have peroneal nerve injury from knee surgery in june resulting in drop foot with no dorsiflexion.  I have eversion and inversion but have been told that I am wired differently so that is why I can do those motions.  I have severe pain everyday/all day.   I am currently waiting for doctors to decide about surgery to explore the nerve and fix if needed i presume.  Has anyone had their nerve reattached or grafted?  I am hoping to get rid of the pain.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on October 18, 2007, 01:58:25 AM
Welcome again Pete and welcome JC.

I see Pete is American, that makes two of us now  ;)

Where are you from JC?

There could be a chance you may only need neurolysis (removal of scar tissue from the nerve) if your nerve was not completely ruined...  Grafting or reattaching, from what I have read, is only for extreme cases.

If you read the earlier post you will see that myself and the others have done a lot of research on this.  There are a few articles about people who had these problems after knee surgery.  If it just happened this past June, have them explore the nerve ASAP!  There is a better chance for recovery if they catch it sooner.

Good luck to all.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: sil on October 18, 2007, 03:28:20 AM
Welcome JC,

I had severe bad pain due to an injury years ago.  It was so bad I couldn't sleep at nite.  I thought it would never go away but eventually it did.  I am hoping and praying your pain will go away also as I know how it can wear you down and drive you to the brink of insanity. 

Rosa
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: jcblank on October 18, 2007, 06:36:52 AM
i am from the US.  i have my ortho doc and emg doc both agree that i need the nerve explored.  they will probably send me out of state to have it done by a specialist.  i am waiting for the phone call.  we are not sure if the nerve was cut or what as i had knee surgery and woke up with the nerve damage.  i am having excruciating pain most hours of the day and walking is almost unbearable.   according to the emg i have no muscle nerve innervation to pick my foot up.  i just cant wait until the pain is gone --or i will be happy if it eases up.  i cant work as i was on my feet most of the day and lost my job because of it as my medical leave was up.
i was just wondering what an exploratory surgery entails.  i dont want further surgery but i may have to to help.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: sil on October 18, 2007, 06:28:37 PM
Hi Mom444 and everyone else,

Amanda good to hear from you.  I was worried about you cuz you hadn't posted in a long time.  So glad your surgery is giving you some positive results and pain relief.

I went to physio yesterday as mid March just too long to wait to see specialist.  She had me lie on my back and then she pushed in on the outside of my left foot and asked me to resist her pressure.  She said it had improved from 2 months ago.  Then she did the right side which was stronger than the left but it's encouraging that left is stronger than it was before.  Gave couple of exercises to  do to further improve strength.

She also tested my left knee and said I almost had full ROM.  When she pushed for the last bit it felt wierd.  It's not a sharp pain just feels like the knee is going to give out.  Physiotherapist said it most likely is the superficial peroneal nerve over the head of the fibula which hurts and then the muscles just relax as a defense mechanism cuz they don't like it when it starts to hurts.  This is what is causing the feeling that my knee is going to give out if I was to squat, sit on my heels, when I start to stand up when I get out of the tub or if I pull my knee to close to my body.  Physio said this is not causing any damage which is very reassuring and puts my mind at ease to finally know what it is.

I've also noticed that the numb area is less sensitive than it used to be.  Physiotherapist said I should notice an improvement in the numbness over the next 3 months.  Yeah!!!  I hope these are words of encouragement to you all and that improvement can happen but that these nerves are just so darn slooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooow that if you focus on day to day, improvement may slip by unnoticed but if you look back weeks, months ago progess has been made.  I believe Andre kept a day to day journal so he could look back and see how far he had come with all of his hard work.

Rosa
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: G_Bronson on October 18, 2007, 10:27:24 PM
Hello everyone!
I see there are a few new faces here since my last post. I'd just like to say welcome and i wish you all good luck in your road to recovery. I havent been on here in a while. I had a consult with a specialist about a possible nerve graft. I had to travel a half way accross the country to see him but it was well worth it. He was very positive about my signs of regeneration and told he in his opinion he did not think i needed a nerve graft. Needless to say i waas releived. It has not stopped improving but it is a very slow process as you all know. I am still working hard at my physio and this week at my phsyio appointment i actually saw my foot move. it was slight but it moved. Before my physio therapist saw it move but he had to get down really close to see it. The feeling is alot better as well.
The tenile test(tapping) is down as far as my ankle now. I have an EMG on the 29th of this month so hopefully i will see some improvment from my last one.

For all the newcomers My advice is to be patient and find your self the a good physiotherapist.

Mom, Max, Hamish, Amanda and Jackie and everyone else stay strong and my thoughts are with you.
   
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on October 25, 2007, 02:26:25 PM
Good luck Gordon!

Yes I wouldn't recommend a nerve graft either if you do have some signs of regeneration.  (But I'm not a doctor, of course).

My daughter has been having some midly painful dragon visits, but not as bad as they were a few months back.

Her physical therapist says that he sees her foot everting outward a bit more and big toe movement during point stimulation.

Still no dorsiflexion (yet, we hope) however the pain and the little extra movement is good we guess.

We still pray for all of you.

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Max Pwr on November 10, 2007, 07:18:36 PM
Hey Everyone ...

Can anybody move anything yet? ... Me, no but just wondering about everyone else.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: AmandaC on November 13, 2007, 07:12:26 AM
Hi Max,
Ten days ago my little toe started to move.  As none of my toes move at all this has been exciting for me.  My physio explained that this movement is controlled by the tibial nerve not the peroneal nerve but this is still a good sign that the nerve is responding from the recent operation.
Hope everyone else is doing well.
Amanda
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on November 13, 2007, 12:19:15 PM
Hey Guys,

Great news Gordon and Amanda!

Glad to hear that movement has started to happen. Mine is slowly improving but it is so slow you hardly notice it. Couple of little problems, last week I was bounding over little hurdles at the gym and went over on my ankle and there was a real crack! Seems Ok though but at the time I was almost in tears. It seems to have weakened it as I have almost gone over on it again a couple of times. Also broke my Foot-up and have had to order a new bit. This did however mean I had to do without it for a session at the gym and this sort of highlighted the progress I have made. I still need it but the control of my foot has improved.

Gordon, how did you get on with your EMG test?

Max stick in there!

Hope everyone else is doing ok!

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on November 13, 2007, 06:22:07 PM
Hamish excellent news but please be careful as you dont want to undo all the good work!  I call my toe off splint Ethal and I have broken two in 18 months well broke one within two weeks but I think it was a manufacturing fault and the other wore out so I think that is just something that happens - only problem is the NHS doesnt let you keep one in spare.   glad to see you are OK otherwise.  hang in there
Hope everyoone else is OK
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on November 14, 2007, 12:47:35 AM
Hi Jackie,

Ethal! LOL! Hope everything is going well with you. I have decided to call my Foot-up Philip.

Philip the Foot-up sounds good.

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: G_Bronson on November 14, 2007, 04:18:42 AM
Hello everyone,
Hamish i am glad to here that you are still improving. I know exactly what you mean by it being such a dam slow process.
My evertion has not really changed much and the signs of life from the tib ant are still very slight, but there. My EMG did not show anything new. my knee however is greatly improving each week. I am not giving up hope that i will gain close to normal movement back in my foot as will all of you.

Take care everyone!
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on November 15, 2007, 12:35:43 AM
Hello All,

Our insurance coverage ran out for the year so we haven't been taking my daughter to PT.

We are taking her to see the pediatric physical therapy specialist from out of town next week.  (Who incidentally is suffering from a rare form of cancer.  Please pray for this woman too.  She's a specialist who deals with injured children and she is a sweetheart.  We pray that she can keep her health.)


The other physical therapist mentioned that there may be a little bit more movement in other parts of the foot, no dorsiflexion yet.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on November 29, 2007, 05:06:31 AM
Anyone still here?
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on November 29, 2007, 11:58:05 AM
Hi Mom,

Yes still here! Had a bit of a disaster on Tuesday when I sprained my ankle pretty badly. Got an Xray yesterday and no break but my ankle is up like a balloon. Pretty annoyed as things where going quite well and really could have done without this. Was just walking on uneven ground and my ankle folded in under me. Just rest Ice and elevation for the moment.

Hope everyone else is doing well!

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: AmandaC on December 03, 2007, 02:27:13 AM
Hamish - thats disappointing for you, hopefully it wont slow you down for to long - glad there is no serious damage.
Mom - Yes we still here, thats sound promosing that the Physio thinks theres a bit more movement, any movement improvement is better than none.
Gordon - I think its funny when these EMG's results come back as no change etc when there is obvious recovery happening, there seems to be alot of people had similar results on this site.

No change from me, I think that sensations are changing slightly but its so hard to tell.  My archilles tendon which has contracted significantly is slowly and painfully getting stretched out with Physio, stretches and maniplulation.  I saw a nother specialist about my hip last week, need a hip replacement but they wont consider it until I have another baby or decide not to, he said that my nerve needs a year also to settle down before they attempt to go in again.

Hope everyone is doing well and keeping there spirits up.
Amanda
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Max Pwr on December 03, 2007, 04:24:47 PM
Hi Mom (and everyone else),

I'm here too and check the site regularily but don't post because I'm showing no improvement over the past many months and I feel I don't have much to add these days.  This time of year I feel a bit disadvantaged because I was an avid hockey player and loved the fall and winter because it meant being on the ice.  If I didn't have the drop foot I'd be back no question.  Although the hip is still healing it would hold up in a pick up game of friendly hockey.  It makes me think about the things I can't do rather than the things I can.  Therefore, I thought it would be a good idea for us (if you'll play along) to make of list of things you can and can't do (as well as things you wonder if it can be done).  This way we can kind of gauge how we are all doing and perhaps someone is doing something we thought impossible.

Can Do (when wearing afo): walk, run (kind of), dance, jump, climb stairs, bike, elliptcal trainer, swim (w/o afo that is), Christmas shop, housewok (unfortunately).
Can't Do : jog long distance, ice skate
Wonder about : downhill skiing (will boot work as afo?), SWAT-ing

I'm sure there are others I'l think of as soon as I post.  If you can think of something please add it so we can all see what can be done and maybe we'll be surprised!

Hammy - I can feel your pain with the ankle, I think we push ourselves a bit thinking that we'll be OK and snap.  Your story is a reminder that we'll have to be vigilant in our recovery.  Luckily it sounds lilke a spain and will heal well.

Have a great week everyone and let us know how you are doing.
-Max-
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: NEWFIE on December 04, 2007, 02:34:26 AM
Hello everyone,

Just figured I would stop in and update you all on whats happening. Well since my nerve graft in May I am getting alot of feeling sensation and tinel sign back on the lower leg about midway down. I had a EMG done a few days ago and they did find a small response from the tib anterior so I have to say its a start. The neurologist said it is very early (6 months) but he was very happy and I was just elated just to get something positive. My physio told me today that she thinks she can feel something when I try to evert so after the past few days I am just smiling from ear to ear and my hopes, prayers and hard work seem to be working. I know what everyone is going through and when this all started after my crash I thought my life as I knew it was over. Well these past couple of months I have been working very hard on my recovery and have been looking up instead of down concentrating on my foot. Doctors told me I probably would not walk again but now I walk without any aid for the exception of my foot-up and with very little limping. The ortho that I go to now said after looking at my MRI's and X-rays that the only thing keeping my leg together was the skin and he is amazed that I am able to walk. My injuries were ACL, PCL, MCL, Tibia Plateau, Complete tears to my hamstrings and complete tear to my Perroneal Nerve and they said I was very close to severing the artery in which they would have amputated my lower leg. I now have 135 degress of flexion in my knee and my aim is 145 to match my good one.

I now take lots of vitamins and am keeping focused on a full recovery. I spend alot less time concentrating on my foot-drop as when I did i got depressed and I know this took away from my healing.

EVERYONE! I know its hard but keep focused on life and not "what ifs"

My Prayers are with you all!
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on December 04, 2007, 02:44:41 AM
Thanks for the prayers Newfie and everyone else. 

It's comforting to check in with you guys because from time to time I still get sick with worry for my little girl.

We are still doing the overnight TES (threshold stimulation) unit and hoping and praying for the best.

We will see the therapist one town over this Friday. 

Keeping you all in my prayers and count your blessings and don't get discouraged.

Remember also, a lot of those research studies I found about this injury said full healing could take YEARS.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on December 14, 2007, 04:48:31 AM
Anyone still here?
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: NEWFIE on December 14, 2007, 05:04:44 PM
Hi Mom,

I saw your post and figured I would drop a few lines. By the way Mom I just started taking Omega 3 fish oil capsules and apparently there is a benefit from some of the ingredients. In the capsules there is Eicosapentaenoic Acid (EPA) and Docosahexaenoic Acid (DHA) which for me a minimum dose is 500 Mg of EPA and DHA. A friend of mine who is a Anistesiologist said he learned this at a seminar that taking this at the minimum 500 Mg doses of each can help in nerve repair. I am now taking a super concentrate 4 capsules a day which gives me 1600 Mg (EPA) and 800 Mg (DHA).

Hope this helps not only your little girl but anybody that is reading this.

God bless and a big "MERRY CHRISTMAS" to all!
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: sil on December 15, 2007, 03:30:45 AM
Hi everyone,

I have noticed a lot of healing these past couple of months.  I no longer experience the pins and needles sensation and the heightened sensitivity to the nerve damaged area has gone away.  The area is still somewhat numb but I really only notice it when I shave my leg.  I have almost full ROM.  I can ride the recumbant bike and do the elliptical machine at the gym with no discomfort.  I can also lie on my back and bring my knee up to my chest with no pain. 

It seemed like nothing was happening for about 3 weeks at a time and then next week I would notice that it felt less numb and less sensitive.  Sometimes when I test out my knee with a squat it hurts and other times it doesn't.  The other day at the gym I slowly tried to sit on my heels to see if it would hurt and it started to so I stopped.  I asked the physiotherapist about this and she basically said it was because I hadn't been doing those movements and things had stiffened up and gave me an exercise to do to eventually get full ROM. 

I think of you all often and wish you successful recoveries.   :)

Rosa
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: jcblank on December 16, 2007, 04:40:20 AM
I had an MRN study done which revealed nerve damage requiring surgery again post op meniscal transplant 6 months ago. Had had EMGs with no electrical activity and the md had no reason why the nerve damage had occurred.   I am to have surgery again to explore the nerve and free it up with possible nerve grafting this week.  I still have no dorsiflexion motion with no "dragons" or anything happening.  The MRN study was impressive--new technology so im told.  It shows exactly where the damage is.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on December 18, 2007, 09:05:28 PM
Just wanting to wish you all a Merry Christmas and happy New Year. 
I see the neurologist early next month.  I have made amazing improvements having had a real slow start.  I have my final physio appointment tomorrow.  In a way I feel somewhat dunted by the fact i am on my own now but I am sure that will soon pass as I get into my own routine.  I have good dorsifelexion in both feet now and need to justbuild up strength. 
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: sil on December 19, 2007, 02:17:13 AM
Congrats Jacky on your improvements.  I'm very happy for you. Wishing everyone a Merry Christmas and a great New Year.

Rosa
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on December 21, 2007, 01:14:36 PM
Hi Everyone!

Wishing you all a very Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year!

Jackie, glad to hear things are going well for you as it has been a really hard year for you. Lets hope you go from strength to strength in 2008.

Hope everyone else is doing well.

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on December 23, 2007, 01:37:59 AM
Just wanting to wish you all a Merry Christmas and happy New Year. 
I see the neurologist early next month.  I have made amazing improvements having had a real slow start.  I have my final physio appointment tomorrow.  In a way I feel somewhat dunted by the fact i am on my own now but I am sure that will soon pass as I get into my own routine.  I have good dorsifelexion in both feet now and need to justbuild up strength. 

Congratulations Jacky!  Glad to hear of your recovery!  So how many months after the damage did it take for you to now have good dorsiflexion?

And Merry Christmas (US) and Happy Christamas (UK) to the rest of you.

You are still in all of our prayers.

My little girl is still chugging away with no dorsiflexion yet.  Only occasional dragon visits and now oddly the pain has moved to the BACK OF HER LEG.  Did any of you experience this?  We still drive her an hour and a half away to see a specialist in another city.  The specialist did some biofeedback work and thinks that she saw some ability for my daughter to contract her anterior tibialis muscles, just not dorsiflex yet.

Let me know how you are doing
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: AmandaC on December 23, 2007, 11:31:37 PM
Jacky - Thats great news you have made awesome progress
To everyone else - hang in there and keep working hard
A very merry Xmas and happy new to you all I hope you all have a great day and hope one day that we all get what we really want for Xmas.
No change from me.
Amanda
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on December 28, 2007, 03:44:42 PM
Thank you all for your wonderful messages.  Please never give up hope - I think at times I did, no I know at times I did and wondered whether all this would ever get better.  Mom - in answer to your question I have to say that this started in April 2006 - I have had two operations and differing degrees of foot drop in both feet.  There is now some debate as to what caused the foot drop in the first place.  I know that I have been very lucky and not everyone gets back dorsiflexion.  I was making good progress with the original foot but I slipped backwards when so immobile again.   I still wear a splint for my original leg as I dont always fully clear the ground and have had a few spectacular tumbles and bruises to match.  I use a splint for the other leg when out for long periods, like Christmas shopping.  I am more confident of loosing that splint than I am of loosing the original one but need to build up as much strength as possible. 

I pray for good recovery for you all.  I will let you know how the neuro appointment goes to see why my nerves in my legs object so much when messed with.

Happy New Year and here's a toast to all floppy feet
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on December 28, 2007, 09:58:24 PM
Thanks for the response Jacky.

Happy New Year to everyone.

Please pray for my little girl, the next EMG appointment is January 2nd.  I scared silly.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on December 30, 2007, 07:18:02 PM
HEY EVERYONE,

been M.I.A for awhile ...how is everyone doing?

Happy Holidays to you all...wishing everyone healthy recoveries in the new year.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on January 02, 2008, 03:06:39 AM
HEY EVERYONE,

been M.I.A for awhile ...how is everyone doing?

Happy Holidays to you all...wishing everyone healthy recoveries in the new year.

Hello Andre!

It's great to hear from you again.

Glad to see you are still checking the board.

Actually, I have a question for you...

I seem to remember you mentioning in a previous post that you used to get "dragon" feelings while you were massaging your leg and/or that you could almost "make the dragons pop out" by rubbing your leg.

I'm asking because my daughter has been having similar events lately, sometimes when we rub her leg she tells us that it's hurting her and that the dragon is back.

Tomorrow morning is another EMG and I'm terrified.  I'm afraid the doctor will be negative again.  It can take very long for nerves and muscles to heal yet the EMG doctor is always so negative with his input.

Just staying calm...

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on January 02, 2008, 03:10:12 PM
Hello all,

Please pray for us.

We just got the last EMG back and there are no more signs of improvement.  The last small bit of improvement was back in May.

I am just trying to stay calm and not cry.

Meanwhile, we are still doing threshold electrical stimulation.  We pray it helps some.

I don't know what to think or feel.  She is only four and a half.

What else can we do?

Did any of you have long gaps of time in your EMGs where no recovery was shown? 
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: AmandaC on January 02, 2008, 11:48:26 PM
Firstly - Happy new year to everyone
Mom - I am very sorry to hear that the EMG test results were not positive, but please try not to get upset.  There was someone that posted earlier on that they had two EMGs that showed no recovery but they had actual movement coming back so maybe they are not 100% indicative of recovery???
It must be so hard for you - I know as a mother that you want the very best for your children and would do anything to protect them.  Your Daughter is young and young kids adapt very quickly to physical changes and limitations.  Never give up hope but know that your Daughter will live a complete and full life even if she has to live with the foot drop.  Keep up the treatement and hope for great things for your litte girl. 
I started riding my horse again a few days ago, my hip seems to be holding up OK and the foot drop dosent seem to be to much of a problem.
Is anyone out there thinking about tendon transfers?
Amanda
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on January 03, 2008, 07:27:01 PM
hey mom444 ,

i sent u a PM as well.

im sorry to hear about your EMG results i know the feeling of not having good results come back to you after these tests and all you can do is stay strong and positive. The results are only telling you what is going on right now and does not telegraph what is in store for your daugthers recovery. you have been doing a great job in informing yourself understanding and being apart of the issue 100 percent and even though the results are negative it does not reflect how your daughter heals regardless of the time estimates the doctors tell you.i had gaps as well within my EMG tests one at 4 months and one at 9/10 months. both negative with 0 improvement we all heal at a different pace... keep her mind fresh with a healthy thought process and keep her spirits high about her injury(not coping...but a confidence of movement in the future) ...i am also going to reschedule another to see how much recovery has gone on and to compare the readings to the first two that i had now that i am fully functional on my foot.

In answer to your question abut the "dragons" i still get them to this day sometimes pins and neddles and on rare occasions i get the shocks and as well. It's weird sometimes my tib ant and peroneal tendon will feel really tight....so i will stretch it and massage it myself....and it will feel like i just cracked open a sack full of Dragons and they will flow right down the damaged nerve path to my Big Toe which i currently still do not have full motor control of(slowly creeping back). i truly believe that this feeling is regeneration because my toe is moving more and more each day...the more i do nothing...the more those areas stay tight weak and unused....the more i massage move and stretch it the more movement i notice out of the effected areas. i bet your Daughter's nerve is regenerating well but her muscles may have experienced atrophy and without muscle movement they wont get good readings. my second and first EMG test i could evert and invert my foot ..(just the motion no strength in my eversion)...and they still said i had no improvement and 0 nerve conductivity.

Another weird thing is that even though massaging can start the Sparks it also takes them away if i do it long enough and this makes my leg feels brand new ...still weak but it feels "normal".


sorry for the run on ......hope i answered your question ...if theres nething else i have noticed that i didnt wrte i will send you another message.

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: G_Bronson on January 07, 2008, 12:00:13 PM
Hello Everyone,
Happy new year to all of you, sorry i havent posted in a while, ive been trying to remain positive but it was a little difficult during the holidays as it was one year on boxing day since my injury. i still feel lots of twitches and sparks but no real new muclse movement.
I am still working hard with my physio and can feel lots of positive sensory changes.

Sorry to hear about your results mom444. I hope your little girl gets some good news soon. I can't imagine how hard it is on you.

Hamish, max, Newfie, Amanda, Jackie and everyone else, i hope you had a merry christmas and the new year is full of healing for all of you.

I hope you are able to stay more positive than myself lately. But i am not about to give up yet.

Great to hear from you Andre, you are an inspiration!

Gordon 
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on January 07, 2008, 05:34:03 PM
Happy New Year Everyone!

Gordon sorry to hear you are feeling pretty down at the moment. Do you have any foot movement at all or is it just changes is sensation at the moment. It wasn't until a year that I started to get any sign of movement. I am now 16 months since injury and my aversion it starting to get stronger but had a bit of a set back when I sprained my ankle quite badly but that is imroving now. Dorsiflexion is still very weak. Don't give up and I am sure movement will start to come back soon.

Good to hear from you Andre! I managed to watch a couple of the Argos games on the Tv. How did the season go?

Good to hear you are back on the horse Amanda and hope your recovery continues.

Mom, I keep thinking of you and your daughter.

Hope everyone else is doing OK!

Hamish

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on January 10, 2008, 10:51:47 PM
Amdre,

I read your post and had to register for this site and reply.

I had a similar injury as yourself.  On Dec 11 1993 (12 years ago) I dislocated my left knee in a wrestling match.  The Popliteal Artery along with the peroneal nerve were crushed.  I had no pulse in my leg below my knee for nearly an hour, until the ER doc reduced the dislocation.  Luckily the pulse returned otherwise amputation could have been a result.  Diagnossis was a blown ACL, PCL, LCL a torn MCL and a fractured Fibula as well as the peroneal nerve damage.  I was told the same thing you were Post op.  All the Doc's said I will be lucky if I were to ever walk remotely normal again.  It was predicted that my wrestling career was over and that I probablly would never be able to run as I use to for wrestling practice.  The tests showed no to little peroneal nerve regeneration would ever occur and I would have to wear an AFO for the remainder of my life.  I was refered to one of the best OS in the pacific Northwest Dr. Peter Mandt who has worked with the U.S. ski team, seahawks and many other teams and such, luckily for me.  Dr. Mandt conuslted many renowned Doc's and even flew one in from somewhere (cant remember where). After ~ 8 hr's in the OR the "global reconstruction" was complete and I had 2 alographs done from 2 different donor's for my ACL and PCL.  After many months of painfull rehab and many phycological bouts I was able to walk with crutches.  I rehabed very rigorusly and was able to return to Wrestling the following year, with the AFO for the remainder of high school (I never returend to football though b/c it was too risky with all the cutting thats done).  I was never my self again on the wrestling mat but at least I was back doing what I loved.  I had to ride the stationary bike while my temates ran for the remainder of my high school career.  I was unable to lift my foot without the AFO until my Freshman year in College, the nerve had taken 3 years to regenerate enough to walk without the AFO.  But the Point here is it did regenerate.  If you do you physical therapy until you cant stand to do it any more, then do it more you can over come this.  I didnt even do my therapy enough, I wish I had b/c I may have even more dorsiflexion if I had.  My frshman year in college I was recruited by the track coach while lifiting in the weight room, he wanted me to throw the shot, javilin and discus.  The following year he wanted me to run x-country to train for track and I was actually able to run with success, I was awarded 2x's as the most improved male athlete on the team once my College running carreer was over and at nearly 180 lbs (a huge runner) had recorded a 6.13 min/mile average over a 10k race.  12 years down the road I have yet to have another knee surgery and I can walk, run, snowboard and just about anything I want.  Ive heard of and have friends that have only torn thier ACLs that have had numerous surgeries.  With hard work and dedication you can over come anything.  Yes I still have some pain and I still have drop foot but hey I cant even remember what it was like to have a normal knee.

Jake

Hello all,

I was just reading this OLD post from a guy who responded to Andre.  It looks liek globalrecon is gone but the things he said still have me hopeful.

"I was unable to lift my foot without the AFO until my Freshman year in College, the nerve had taken 3 years to regenerate enough to walk without the AFO.  But the Point here is it did regenerate.  If you do you physical therapy until you cant stand to do it any more, then do it more you can over come this.  I didnt even do my therapy enough, I wish I had b/c I may have even more dorsiflexion if I had."

This guy had his nerve/function eventually come back, but after THREE YEARS.

I was researching some things online and I found something that may or may not have to do with us, but there is some theory about "orphaned muscle fibers" in people with nerve injuries are "adopted" by other still functioning muscle fibers.  A scenario like this was often seen in people with polio who semi recovered (although the people with polio had problems with weakness returning.)

I'm still in a tizzy over the doctors saying "it's over" and the time frame issues.  I still say the studies I have read give time frames of up to three or sometimes seven years for recovery.

Hmmm..

Here are the positives:

--It's only been 18 months since her surgery, and recovery times of up to three years have been reported.

--As of late August of last year (about 4 or 5 months ago) there were signs of at least NERVE recovery, even if the muscle showed no more recruitment.

--There were signs of muscle recruitment 8 months ago, 8 months is 8 months...  Long time?  Maybe, but there is still history of recuritment within the past year...

--She had "the dragon" last Sunday and Monday nights.

--The TES overnight stimulation will hopefully build up the remaining muscles and improve their health so that maybe the existing regenerated nerve will be "picked up" by them.

I keep all of your in my prayers.  Please still check in with me.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: jcblank on January 11, 2008, 07:36:46 AM
amandac
   i too have been given the option of a tendon transfer--but at this time i am opting to wait and see if i get any regeneration.  i had surgery again 3 weeks ago for a peroneal nerve decompression and they found the cause of my drop foot-a stitch through my nerve from my meniscal transplant.  the best thing is i am now pain free since the day i had the stitch removed but still unable to dorsiflex the foot 7 months out now.  my nerve was not looking good where the stitch was and was starting to die so we are unsure when/if regeneration will occur.  only time will tell.  tired of waiting but will have to.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: AmandaC on January 12, 2008, 07:16:37 PM
jcblank,
Im not sure how but I had not read your last few posts.  I am so pleased that you are out of pain, I understand what a relief it is as my operation in October has given me a similar outcome.  In regard to your nerve been stitched is that not neglegence by the surgeon?  Are they liable for compensation?
Can you turn your foot inwards at all?

I have some news - no foot movement but I am pregnant - only about 6 - 7 weeks so I wont be telling friends and family for a while yet, I made that mistake a few years ago and we lost our first at 14 weeks.  It is fairly exciting and a bit scarey.

Hope you are all doing well.
Amanda
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on January 12, 2008, 08:51:47 PM
Amanda,

Good luck with the baby.  I know your pain, I had a loss too at 14 weeks a few years ago.

In the meantime, we've been referred to a specialist in Pittsburgh for my daughter.

I hope you all are well.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: jcblank on January 12, 2008, 10:12:23 PM
amanda--yes there is "liability" on the docs part.  i have looked into that but a lawyer wants $50,000. to pursue it and the outcomes would not be more than that at this time.  he said it is hard to sue an md as it goes on there permanant recort so they try to avoid it thats why it costs so much.  i have researched it also and got the same thing that it is hard to do.  right now i am waiting to see if/when i get any return and if i dont get any then suing may be a better option.
as for my foot i can invert and evert but weakly--cannot dorsiflex at all--no muscular action according to emg.  i am now 3 weeks post op from the stitch removal and they said there was a 2-3 cm section that was damaged so according to regeneration rule of 1 mm per day i should start to see things happen soon possibly.  if i dont get return he has mentioned a tendon transfer to hold my foot up as i have so much laxity in it.
good luck on the baby--hope all goes well.

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: sil on January 13, 2008, 06:23:31 AM
Amanda,

Congratulations on the news of your pregnancy.  What an exciting time for you. 

Mom - still praying for your little girl and hoping improvement will happen soon.

Rosa
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on January 17, 2008, 06:21:33 PM


Mom - still praying for your little girl and hoping improvement will happen soon.

Rosa

Thank you so much Rosa!
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on January 18, 2008, 07:49:58 PM
Just blogging.

I am so stressed out about going to Pittsburgh next week.  I never thought it would come to this.

It has been over two years now of tests, surgery, consults, etc. and, above all else, WORRYING about my little girl.  ...All because of something that we never even noticed happening.  No accident, no injury, no pain.

We have no idea how her peroneal nerve ever even got injured.

Just want to thank all of you for your support and especially prayers over this past year or so.  I always go to this site when I feel upset about my daughter and your words and advice help so much.

So, we will spend over six hours driving to PIttsburgh to see this specialist.  We'll miss work, pay for a hotel and rearrange our schedules to do all this...  Sigh.  I hope it's worth it.

There was another study I found last week where a guy had foot drop and it didn't improve ove  a year and they went and did a tendon transfer on him, that gave him bad scarring nonetheless.  The guy had a recovery THREE YEARS later and had to have the tendon transfer reversed.

I am so confused and drained by all this. 

Love you all.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: jove on January 21, 2008, 01:59:06 AM
Hi, I'm new here, and also have the peroneal nerve problem. It was torn in June 2007; repaired with a 3" (7 cm) graft in September 2007. As expected, nothing much to report yet.

 I have a question that maybe some of you can answer. What is Tinel's sign? How does it work, what does it mean? I do know that you are supposed to tap on the surface where the damaged section of the nerve is, and then (if positve) you feel a tingling, or shock, sensation down-stream (distally) from where the tapping is done. I tryed this on myself out of curiosity. It's easy to know where the nerve is, because of the scar there. So when I tap on the scar where the graft was done, (above the back of the knee), I do feel the tingling or shock feeling down the side of my leg, down to the ankle (positive). But if I tap below the graft, I feel nothing (negative).

So I assume (GUESS!!!) that a positive Tinel's sign means the nerve is alive down to the point where the tapping produces a positive, but not below that point. If the nerve regenerates in time, then will tapping lower down (below the grafted section) produce a positive sign?

Thanks in advance if any buddy can provide more information on this.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on January 22, 2008, 01:33:25 AM
Hi, I'm new here, and also have the peroneal nerve problem. It was torn in June 2007; repaired with a 3" (7 cm) graft in September 2007. As expected, nothing much to report yet.

 I have a question that maybe some of you can answer. What is Tinel's sign? How does it work, what does it mean? I do know that you are supposed to tap on the surface where the damaged section of the nerve is, and then (if positve) you feel a tingling, or shock, sensation down-stream (distally) from where the tapping is done. I tryed this on myself out of curiosity. It's easy to know where the nerve is, because of the scar there. So when I tap on the scar where the graft was done, (above the back of the knee), I do feel the tingling or shock feeling down the side of my leg, down to the ankle (positive). But if I tap below the graft, I feel nothing (negative).

So I assume (GUESS!!!) that a positive Tinel's sign means the nerve is alive down to the point where the tapping produces a positive, but not below that point. If the nerve regenerates in time, then will tapping lower down (below the grafted section) produce a positive sign?

Thanks in advance if any buddy can provide more information on this.

Welcome jove and best wishes in your recovery!

It's funny you ask that, because I've always wondered what a Tinel's sign is also.  Each time I've attempted to look it up, I've never seemed to find anything that truly explains it.

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: jenswin on January 22, 2008, 02:42:57 PM
Hi,

I'm new on here - in fact I've never used a forum in my life!!  Anyway I found this site by accident just looking for some info on the nerve decompression surgery I'm having soon.  I decided to write mainly to encourage mom444 with your daughter. 

I'm probably quite a unique case on here but very sound much like your daughter. I'm 26 years old and have right foot drop since about the age of 7 or 8. We have no idea when or how it happened, I had no pain I don't remember noticing anything or ever tripping or even learning to walk differently, I just noticed I couldn't flex my right foot one day. I had numerous doctors appointrments and EMG tests (this was before the days of MRI), I think the diagnosis was that is was a deformity that happened in the womb but they didn't do anything about it other than was sent to a physiotherapist and was given a splint. I then saw a paeditrican once a year up until being 16 and was then discharged.   He did recommend a tendon transplant on my last visit but said I was too young at the time so nothing ever happened.

Although this might not be the encouragement you're after I just wanted to say that even if your daughter does not recover it really is not the end of the world and she can lead a completely normal life - in fact reading some of these stories I think the best time to get it is when you're young as you learn to do every moment with the foot drop and don't have to relearn everything.  To be honest I don't think I could walk normally if I tried! I wore a splint for a couple of weeks when I was 7 but then stopped - I didn't need it and found it restrictive, plus could wear the shoes I wanted to!  I've never used anythign since.  I was a very normal busy active kid and in fact was the most sporty of all my family! I went horse riding, did dance, I took PE at GCSE and was on my school badminton and hockey teams.  I drive a normal manual gearstick car, have a good job, have a masters degree, and have travelled extensively.  My foot drop has hardly restricted me in anything. there are of course some negatives and it has been frustrating at times.  I can't always wear the shoes I want - I'm unbalanced in high stiletto heels cos of the lack of muscle, and shoes without ankle straps just come off my foot. As a fashion-conscious girl that's quite a problem!!!  I struggled on the steeper slopes when I went skiing (but would definitely go again), again cos of poor balance on my right foot - also means I would never be a great ice-skater or ballerina!! It was also quite a funny site when I tried to walk in flippers when I went snorkelling - needless to say I ended up walking backwards  ;D  I also am more likely to go over on that ankle and did tear the ligaments in my ankle when I was 15.  I did get teased a little bit at high school but hardly at all, and now people don't even notice it till I tell them  - at least that's what they say!!  Luckily I have very small feet which does make it less noticeable :)

Your daughter is having tons more treatment, therapy and care than I ever did so I'm sure she has much greater chance of recovery. And being so young it will just seem normal to her the way she walks.

Anyway after 10 years of seeing no one about my leg I managed to get a referral last year to a neurologist, as I have started having pain in my knee, i think becasue I use it and the thigh muscles to balance and it was starting to get sore, and wondered whether I coudl talk about a tendon transfer.  I had all the nerve/EMG tests done all over again where the guy said I may have caused the foot drop by crossing my legs as a kid and that I had to stop doing it now - weird as I'd never heard that before!! I got referred to a top peroneal nerve specialist, had an MRI of my leg and finally got a definitive diagnosis after 20 years!!! There is a swelling on my nerve near the tibial head, am going in for surgery next month to have it removed and a biopsy taken.  He said it might help but after 20 years there is a very small chance it could recover.  After so long it would be quite a weird feeling if it did...!

Which brings me on to the point that I was looking for when I found this site - does anyone know how long recovery is after a decompression surgery and if I'll have a cast on for weeks or anything?  The highly efficient NHS have given me no clue about anything other than a date for admission and what to pack!!!

Hope that helps mom444, of course if I could choose I wouldn't have foot drop but for the most part I don't really think about it.  I totally undertand you being worried about her and really hope that she  does improve, but I hope this reassures you that it won't really hinder her in the future if it doesn't get better.   

Hope all you other people suffering with this manage to recover well, I'll be looking on here for post-op tips for trying to regain muscle/nerve functoin if it's possible.  I didn't get chance to read through all the posts on this section but if there is anyone else out there who is or was in a similar situation to me I'd love to hear from you!!
 
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Rhonda J on January 23, 2008, 03:02:07 AM
Hello Everyone...

I am sooooo relieved I found you. I had a TKR 2 months ago with the other knee replacment pending. During surgery or while in recovery my peroneal nerve was injured leaving me with no feeling in my leg and foot. My knee is doing great, but I am devistated. Ironically, I had to wait 4 long years for the replacement (with my life on hold) because they kept saying I was too young. I am now 53.

Although I am so sorry to hear your stories, it brings me comfort that I am not alone. My OS is nationally known for treating professional athletes for knee injuries and came highly recommended. However, when he realized there was a complication he quickly stated while running out my hospital room door that it could take months for the feeling to return. There was no explantion of any kind. When I came home from the hospital I began researching TKR complications and became educated on peroneal knee palsy. I could not believe my eyes as I read through the information.

I do have a leg brace which helps me walk more normally. Prior to the brace, I kept tripping and even fell a couple of times. I realize each case of peroneal nerve damage is so different. However, I was wondering if anyone else has had this happen during TKR surgery. I am curious to hear how everything turned out. I am so frustrated, but I am greatful it wasn't worse.

I will continue to follow your stories and I do hope each and everyone of you have success.

Kindest regards,
Rhonda



Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: jove on January 23, 2008, 03:58:08 AM
"Which brings me on to the point that I was looking for when I found this site - does anyone know how long recovery is after a decompression surgery and if I'll have a cast on for weeks or anything?"

After my nerve graft I had a soft cast, (brace) for maybe 10 days or so. I was on crutches/crutch for a few weeks, no weight bearing for the first 3-4 days, then gradually bearing more and more weight. If you don't get a graft, I'd guess it should be less than that.

good luck with it.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: jcblank on January 23, 2008, 05:53:33 AM
i just had peroneal nerve decompression dec 20.  i was wbat and only used the crutches for 3 days.  i used pain meds x 2 days.  after having excrutiating nerve pain for 6 months this barely hurt.  i am still waiting for nerve regeneration and wondering if/when it will occur.  the md wasnt sure if i would recover or not.  my doc found a stitch through my nerve from my meniscal transplant 6 months previous and removed it. i am walking so much better now, still with my afo, due to being pain free.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: NEWFIE on January 24, 2008, 08:51:52 PM
Hi Jove,

I also had a nerve graft in May 2007. It has been a long process and I have gained alot of patience as I am sure you know. My perroneal nerve was severed in a motorcycle crash and repaired by harvesting the surel nerve in the back of my leg and grafting it into the perroneal nerve. Is this the same type of graft that you had? I am getting some feeling back and am able to distinguish hot and cold to about the mid part of my lower leg, after I had the graft I could not feel anything from the knee down so this is a positive for me for sure. I am not able to dorsiflex or evert my foot YET! I had so much damage to my leg that the only thing holding my leg together was the skin and I was very lucky not to have lost it. One of the doctors told me that I probably would not walk again but of course that only gave me a reason to fight harder and to show them that I would walk again and I have been walking with an afo since october. DETERMINATION, Now that is a great word! Let me know what stage and what results you are getting so maybe we can compare notes.

I hope you are all doing well!

NEWFIE
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on January 25, 2008, 03:55:18 PM

Hi,

I'm new on here - in fact I've never used a forum in my life!!  Anyway I found this site by accident just looking for some info on the nerve decompression surgery I'm having soon.  I decided to write mainly to encourage mom444 with your daughter. 

I'm probably quite a unique case on here but very sound much like your daughter. I'm 26 years old and have right foot drop since about the age of 7 or 8. We have no idea when or how it happened, I had no pain I don't remember noticing anything or ever tripping or even learning to walk differently, I just noticed I couldn't flex my right foot one day. I had numerous doctors appointrments and EMG tests (this was before the days of MRI), I think the diagnosis was that is was a deformity that happened in the womb but they didn't do anything about it other than was sent to a physiotherapist and was given a splint. I then saw a paeditrican once a year up until being 16 and was then discharged.   He did recommend a tendon transplant on my last visit but said I was too young at the time so nothing ever happened.

Although this might not be the encouragement you're after I just wanted to say that even if your daughter does not recover it really is not the end of the world and she can lead a completely normal life - in fact reading some of these stories I think the best time to get it is when you're young as you learn to do every moment with the foot drop and don't have to relearn everything.  To be honest I don't think I could walk normally if I tried! I wore a splint for a couple of weeks when I was 7 but then stopped - I didn't need it and found it restrictive, plus could wear the shoes I wanted to!  I've never used anythign since.  I was a very normal busy active kid and in fact was the most sporty of all my family! I went horse riding, did dance, I took PE at GCSE and was on my school badminton and hockey teams.  I drive a normal manual gearstick car, have a good job, have a masters degree, and have travelled extensively.  My foot drop has hardly restricted me in anything. there are of course some negatives and it has been frustrating at times.  I can't always wear the shoes I want - I'm unbalanced in high stiletto heels cos of the lack of muscle, and shoes without ankle straps just come off my foot. As a fashion-conscious girl that's quite a problem!!!  I struggled on the steeper slopes when I went skiing (but would definitely go again), again cos of poor balance on my right foot - also means I would never be a great ice-skater or ballerina!! It was also quite a funny site when I tried to walk in flippers when I went snorkelling - needless to say I ended up walking backwards  ;D  I also am more likely to go over on that ankle and did tear the ligaments in my ankle when I was 15.  I did get teased a little bit at high school but hardly at all, and now people don't even notice it till I tell them  - at least that's what they say!!  Luckily I have very small feet which does make it less noticeable :)

Your daughter is having tons more treatment, therapy and care than I ever did so I'm sure she has much greater chance of recovery. And being so young it will just seem normal to her the way she walks.

Anyway after 10 years of seeing no one about my leg I managed to get a referral last year to a neurologist, as I have started having pain in my knee, i think becasue I use it and the thigh muscles to balance and it was starting to get sore, and wondered whether I coudl talk about a tendon transfer.  I had all the nerve/EMG tests done all over again where the guy said I may have caused the foot drop by crossing my legs as a kid and that I had to stop doing it now - weird as I'd never heard that before!! I got referred to a top peroneal nerve specialist, had an MRI of my leg and finally got a definitive diagnosis after 20 years!!! There is a swelling on my nerve near the tibial head, am going in for surgery next month to have it removed and a biopsy taken.  He said it might help but after 20 years there is a very small chance it could recover.  After so long it would be quite a weird feeling if it did...!

Which brings me on to the point that I was looking for when I found this site - does anyone know how long recovery is after a decompression surgery and if I'll have a cast on for weeks or anything?  The highly efficient NHS have given me no clue about anything other than a date for admission and what to pack!!!

Hope that helps mom444, of course if I could choose I wouldn't have foot drop but for the most part I don't really think about it.  I totally undertand you being worried about her and really hope that she  does improve, but I hope this reassures you that it won't really hinder her in the future if it doesn't get better.   

Hope all you other people suffering with this manage to recover well, I'll be looking on here for post-op tips for trying to regain muscle/nerve functoin if it's possible.  I didn't get chance to read through all the posts on this section but if there is anyone else out there who is or was in a similar situation to me I'd love to hear from you!!
 

Thank you jenswin for your post!  There ARE quite a few odd similarities!  Some doctors still wonder if something happened to her in the womb or if something internal caused the damage.

We took my daughter to Pittsburgh and saw the specialist yesterday.  To be honest, I have a hard time remembering what he told us because by the time we got to his office I was so stressed and drained.

He was very concerned by how long she had had the nerve damage and muscle disuse, but he did... I guess somewhat say that we still needed to "give it another 12 to 18 months" to see what happens.  He also said we should continue aggressively with the e stim and get a surface EMG machine.

He also, I think, said that at this point we may have seen all the nerve regeneration we'd get but that this point now would involve possible recovery through SPROUTING.

Now, as I mentioned before, I just started researching this sprouting phenomenon.  I think it's like what happened to people who recovered from polio.  Apparently, healthy nerves from undamaged muscles can somehow sprout into damaged muscles and "adopt the orphaned muscle fibers."  Or something like that.

I can't think straigt right now but I thank you so much for your input. 

Best of luck to you too in your recovery jenswin and to all of you!  DON'T GIVE UP.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: 1knee4me on January 26, 2008, 12:18:19 AM
i hurt my knee playing football this year partially tore the acl,pcl and tore lcl. also have drop foot from the peroneal nerve. doctor told me it was stretched. it's been 3 months since i hurt it and got surgery on the lcl.  i feel some sort of tingling or electric shock when i flick the back of the calf. what does that mean. and what was the quickest anyone ever was able to regain the movement of their foot after injuring it. I'm really hoping to play football again in college.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: jove on January 27, 2008, 03:38:14 AM

yes, Newfie, I think it is the same type graft. Mine was 3" (7 cm) long, just above the knee. They took 3 pieces from the back of my calf to use as the graft. I hyperextended my knee in a grappling match (like wrestling sort of), and also tore the ACL and some other stuff in there.
I don't notice much progress in the nerve yet, but remain hopeful. Otherwise, the leg is getting stronger. I like to ride a bike, and swim. I have not tried wrestling or jiu jitsu again, yet, though I'm still hoping....I did go back to kick boxing class, and I can still hit a heavy bag, but I don't like to kick, or spar, yet. My ACL is torn and not repaired, so......I want to be careful there...
Newfie, it aounds as if you are making some progress there, with the sensations coming back. Keep it up.

Mom444; sorry you didn't get better news from Pittsburgh...maybe after you're all rested up, and had a chance to digest the new info, things might look more hopeful. I've read that brachial plexus palsy can happen during birth - but never read anything about peroneal palsy happening during birth. Maybe you mentioned it before, but I don't remember, did your daughter ever show normal peroneal function? or has she always had the palsy (from birth)?

1knee4me; have you been evaluated yet by a good neurologist? If not, then you need to see one, they will be able to give you answers. Many people do eventually regain normal movement of the foot, but I have no idea what the all-time-record-quick-recovery time might be. The tingling or shock you mention may be what's called Tinel's sign, all I know is- that is the response of an injured nerve when you tap on it. If some one else can explain what it means, I'd also love to hear more about it. Anyhow, 1knee4me, if you haven't seen a neurologist yet, you really should do so, they can assess your injury and explain your options.

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on January 31, 2008, 06:27:24 PM
Hey Everyone,

Just went to my third EMG test Yesterday....and got some pretty interesting news from my doctor...

first off the nerve has grown back from the crush injury i had recieved 2 years ago....the thing about it tho is that the nerve is still showing sign of injury he said...i am getting full transmission of signals through the nerve to the muscles but at a slower then normal pace...this he said should get better over the years as it seems to be healing in good health. the other thing he noted is that my Tib Ant muscle was abnormally oversized....he compared this to a patient who had been suffering from the viral disease Polio.....he said the strength is still significantly weaker but the size is over grown and not growing in in the proper path as a normal would...hes said this should not effact anything i do but may give me problems later on in the future. he also noted that the Brevis muscle has experienced alot of atrophy but is still active and functioning...needs more aggressive treatment to help strengthen the rest of the ankle.

so pretty much...to conclude the nerve has regenerated but signals are still relearning the proper patterns on transmission to te muscles it once controlled.....this whole process needs to be retrained and the muscles need to be feed information to keep the alive enough to read and process the weak signals from the damaged nerve....the neat thing was this doctor who once told me id probably never walk proper actually had faith that i could regain much more normal functioning in these areas with proper therapy.

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on February 02, 2008, 04:35:13 PM
Hey Everyone,

Just went to my third EMG test Yesterday....and got some pretty interesting news from my doctor...

first off the nerve has grown back from the crush injury i had recieved 2 years ago....the thing about it tho is that the nerve is still showing sign of injury he said...i am getting full transmission of signals through the nerve to the muscles but at a slower then normal pace...this he said should get better over the years as it seems to be healing in good health. the other thing he noted is that my Tib Ant muscle was abnormally oversized....he compared this to a patient who had been suffering from the viral disease Polio.....he said the strength is still significantly weaker but the size is over grown and not growing in in the proper path as a normal would...hes said this should not effact anything i do but may give me problems later on in the future. he also noted that the Brevis muscle has experienced alot of atrophy but is still active and functioning...needs more aggressive treatment to help strengthen the rest of the ankle.

so pretty much...to conclude the nerve has regenerated but signals are still relearning the proper patterns on transmission to te muscles it once controlled.....this whole process needs to be retrained and the muscles need to be feed information to keep the alive enough to read and process the weak signals from the damaged nerve....the neat thing was this doctor who once told me id probably never walk proper actually had faith that i could regain much more normal functioning in these areas with proper therapy.



Andre,

Thanks for keeping us updated on your progress.  It's interesting that you made the polio comment, because, as I mentioned in a previous post, recently in my researching blitz I have come across a few things that do compare peripheral nerve injuries and recovery to recovery from polio.  Don't quote me too directly on this, but I guess that when people recovered from polio it was from the healthy nerves from nearby healthy muscles "sprouting" into the damaged muscles and taking over for them.  Only when this happened it seemed that the muscles had to get bigger and work twice as hard; that could explain your larger anterior tib muscles...?  The term "post polio syndrome" refers to what polio survivors experienced years later after the muscles "wore out" after years of having to work twice as hard.  That could be what the doc meant by "causing problems in the future?"

Anyhow, it's good that you are still getting some recovery and that you got messages how things could be getting better still over time. 

Thank you again Andre and all of you for your continued input and support.  WE NEED EACH OTHER!  We need to continue sharing information and cheering each other on.

Meanwhile, my daughter is now four and a half.  It's been just over eighteen months since her surgery.  There have been some minor dragon appearances but just on and off.  Incidentally, the Pittsburgh doc mentioned how "burning pain is bad" and "pins and needles pain is good" in regard to indicating muscles either getting better or worse.  It's hard to get a four year old to tell you the difference.  Yet I have heard so many of you on this board and people in other sources mention "pain is good" so I'm taking that.

We are going to the pediatic nerve injuiry physical therapist next week.  We may use a new kind of EMG machine on my daughter, it's called (I think) EMG triggered biofeedback.  Somehow it uses surface EMG to pick up minor muscle contractions and then triggers an electrical stimulation to make a contraction.  They have used it in brachial plexus kids, but it's still experimental.

And I swear I do see my daughter's little muscles trying to move when she tries to lift her foot.  She can somehow make her big toe move, or maybe just LOOK like it's moving, but it's something.  The thing is, that when she tries to move her foot and that toe either moves or just looks like it, THAT'S when the little leg muscles seem to contract, the anterior tib.

I still think about that one study I read where a 43 year old woman had complete peroneal nerve palsy and didn't have decompression surgery until about 21 months later.  She did get better after three years.

I still keep hanging in there and hoping and praying for all of you too.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on February 04, 2008, 04:26:56 AM
Hey Mom444,

u said u see small twitches in ur daugther toes when she tries to dorsiflex? when i first started noticing signs...i would get the same things...i should my doctors they thought i was seeing things but i knew it was different and something i never saw before...this could be very good step in her recovery....always praying her. hope everthing goes well with pediatric nerve therapists
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: AmandaC on February 14, 2008, 12:39:08 AM
Hi All
Thought I would drop you all a line to see how everyone is doing.  There has been no change for me regarding the foot drop although my inversion is getting stronger and the amount of movement has increased since December.  Does anyone have problems with there AFO rubbing the bottom of there foot especially betweent he ball of the big toe and ball of the foot.  Im not sure if I am more uncomfortable as my toes do not move at all and they feel like they are pushed flat in the AFO all day?

Well in now 10 weeks pregnant, will be going for a scan in a couple of weeks, getting a bit nervous as i lost one at 14 weeks a few years back.  I have been extremely sick, the Doctors were going to put me on a drip last week to rehydrate but I managed to get a bit of fluid down so got away with it.  I have had 3 and half weeks of constant vomitting and nausia, no fun.  Especially hard when we are trying to hide it from everyone, some people have guessed already.

Well I hope everyone is doing well and keeping there spirits up - remember never give up but also we can all still live a full life with our floppy foot - keep smiling :D

Amanda
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on February 14, 2008, 03:47:39 PM
Amanda,

I hope and pray that everything goes well for you.  I went through some fertility issues too a while back so I can understand your nervousness and pain.  But keep the faith.

We took my daughter to the out of town physical therapist Tuesday and tried the EMG triggered stim and it seemed interesting.  There ARE in fact contractions in my daughter's anterior tib muscles but the muscles that can control dorsiflexion are still not responding.  The big toe it turns out is controlled by a different muscle, so the fact that she can move it now is good but not a groundbreaking as we thought. 

The therapist is probably a great contact for us though, because she is part of a network of doctors and physical therapists who work specifically with children with nerve injuries.  She even has connections to the famous Dr. Nath from Texas. 

Another interesting thing she told us is that the anterior tib muscles are up high on the shin and the dorsiflexion is actually controlled by the lower tendons that act as pulleys.  I was under the impression that my daughter had to have "regrowth all down the front of her shin" to recover.  Some therapists told us this also.  But there is something...  yes SOMETHING going on in the anterior tib,  just no dorsiflexion yet.

The EMG triggered stim machine will cost us a whopping $1,600 dollars (American) to buy!  I'm sure that our health insurance company will laugh at us if we ask them to pay for it  :P 

How have those of you in Canada and the UK fared with getting coverage for equipment?

Also, HAPPY VALENTINE'S DAY.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: jove on February 15, 2008, 02:38:13 AM
Congatulations, Amanda.
As far as the AFO irritating the sole of the foot, mine does that also, at the edge where it is cut back. Mine irritates the outer edge of the foot near the little toe. What I do is, take an insole from a running shoe and cut it back just slightly (maybe cut 1/2 " off the front toe, maybe 1/4" off each side) just so that it fits inside of the AFO. It protects the spot where the AFO interface (cut edge) irritates my foot.  I also cut the heel out of the insole, otherwise it raises my heel just enough to hit the wrong spot in the AFO heel pocket, then my heel hurts instead!. Cut the heel out of the insole(fair it in at an angle) so that won't happen. You may have to try a few different insoles, or sacrifice a few insoles to get it cut just right.

mom444, any progress is good. Keep us posted.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: ej_dlvga on February 17, 2008, 12:58:23 PM
Hi...

I was in a vehicular accident just last December. I suffered from burns and my left leg was pretty beat up. My peroneal nerve was apparently injured during the accident, but my doctors were confident that it was neurapraxia and that it would recover on its own. I finished all the procedures for my burns and we began focusing on my leg. I had an MRI and apparently, it wasnt just neurapraxia. My 2nd EMG showed no improvement, and MRI confirmed that i have a partial tear on my peroneal nerve. My neurologist gave me 2 weeks of rehab and therapy before another EMG but if nothing else happens, she's going to recommend nerve graft surgery.

Has anyone recovered fully from something like this? A partial tear? My other doctors would tell me that the success rates of nerve grafting are low. But recently, technology like active EMG during the graft have improved the success rates for the nerve "taking" the graft. I'm wearing an AFO now but the thought of an all-or-nothing surgery scares me. They say that I should wait 6 months before any drastic action but knowing that there's a partial tear has led them to suggest grafting as my eventual option. If chances of any recovery are slim, I've been thinking that I just wait it out... give my body time to recover. Any advice?

Thanks.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: ranthony on February 17, 2008, 03:15:45 PM
Hi All

[This is the first time I am on any sort of message board or forum or whatever it is called. In October 2006 I had a motorcycle accident and the doctors also thought I am going to lose my leg. Everything was severed at the knee. Today, 1 year and 4 months later my leg is fine except for peroneal nerve damage and after my 2nd visit to the neurologist he said there is no nerve regeneration and do not expect any recovery for my drop foot. Weird thing though is that I can now slightly pull my toes straight (not the big one though) and when I flick the back of my calf then I feel sensation down in my foot and toes. Have you guys heard of anyone that recovered from drop foot after an open wound injury in which the peroneal nerve was severed? Amdre you seem to be doing well and I sincerely hope you have full recovery. Can anyone of you make any suggestions as to what can be done to help the situation or at least better the chances of recovery?   ]
Quote
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on February 18, 2008, 02:43:35 AM
Welcome ej_dlvga and ranthony and best wishes for both of your recoveries!

We hope you find lots of interesting and helpful input here.

Keep us posted and we'll try our best to give you advice.

The only thing I can advise for both of your right now, and I am not a medical professional but I am a teacher and a researcher who has ready MANY studies about this injury, is to keep the faith.  Also, I highly recommend that you both do some kind of electric muscle stimulation to keep your muscles from atrophying and to increase the blood flow to the area.  My daughter does low level overnight stimulation but for adults they also have EMS units and other stimulators. 

Also, you will find here from all of us that timeframes for recovery and patterns of recovery differ for all.

We wish you both the best and send prayers and love.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: ej_dlvga on February 18, 2008, 09:41:46 AM
Hi mom444 and thanks..

I've also been doing the electric muscle stimulation as part of my physical therapy sessions which i have thrice a week. I told my therapist about my recent MRI results and she found it odd that although no progress was recorded, she says she's been able to get more contractions from my foot with less electric intensity or something like that. i hope it's a good sign. I'll be seeing my neurologist tomorrow and I hope everything goes well.

I wish the best for your daughter and for everyone. It's only now, after such a life-changing incident, that I realize how much i took my body for granted. I too, see how my mom is doing everything possible to help with my recovery, If she could give up her own nerve for me, I bet she would. I'm sure you would do the same for your daughter if you could.

Thanks again, I'll keep myself hopeful.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: jove on February 21, 2008, 04:22:58 AM
ej dlvga;
The best report I've seen about the chances of recovery is by Kline, Kim, et al.....Of course I don't have access to all the reports, maybe Mom444 knows a more recent paper...but anyhow here is the abstract, it gives you the general idea..also it was completed in 1999, so who knows maybe now almost 10 years later the success rates are up???? I dunno.

Neurosurgery  2004; 54 (6): 1421-8; discussion 1428-9

Management and outcomes in 318 operative common peroneal nerve lesions at the Louisiana State University Health Sciences Center.
Kim DH, Murovic JA, Tiel RL, Kline DG

OBJECTIVE: This study analyzes 318 operative knee-level common peroneal nerve lesions managed at the Louisiana State University Health Sciences Center between 1967 and 1999. METHODS: Each patient was retrospectively evaluated for injury mechanism, preoperative neurological status, electrophysiological studies, lesion type, and operative technique, i.e., neurolysis, suture, or graft repair. All lesions in continuity had intraoperative nerve action potential recordings. RESULTS: There were 141 stretch/contusions without fracture/dislocations (44%), 39 lacerations (12%), 40 tumors (13%), 30 entrapments (9%), 22 stretch/contusions with fracture/dislocations (7%), 21 compressions (7%), 13 iatrogenic injuries (4%), and 12 gunshot wounds (4%). After neurolysis, 107 (88%) of 121 knee-level common peroneal nerve lesions with recordable intraoperative nerve action potentials recovered useful function. Nineteen patients underwent end-to-end suture repair, and 16 (84%) of these achieved good recovery by 24 months. Graft repair was performed in 138 peroneal injuries. Thirty-six patients (26%) had grafts less than 6 cm long, of which 27 (75%) achieved Grade 3 or greater peroneal function. Twenty-four (38%) of 64 patients with 6- to 12-cm grafts, and only 6 (16%) of 38 patients with 13- to 24-cm grafts, attained good peroneal function. Longer grafts correlated with more severe injuries and thus poorer outcomes. Thirty-two (80%) of 40 tumors were resected with preservation of preoperative clinical function. CONCLUSION: Surgical exploration and repair of peroneal nerve lesions achieved good results with timely operations and thorough intraoperative evaluations. Useful function was achieved in 27 (75%) of 36 patients with grafts less than 6 cm in length and in only 88 (44%) of 202 patients with grafts greater than 6 cm in length.

PubMedID: 15157299


Now I am not medically trained, but the thing I gather (from what I've read) is that you don't want to wait much past 3 - 6 months to get the best results. You might consider visiting a neurosurgeon, and asking them what their success rate for similar injuries has been.


Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: ej_dlvga on February 21, 2008, 12:26:19 PM
Thanks jove... I also heard about an alternative to grafting using a nerve conduit called Neurotube. A well referenced article about it, written in 2006, showed that it has shown better results than nerve grafting. It also eliminates the need to harvest a donor nerve. The Dellon Institute of peripheral nerve surgery uses it and you can read about it here:

www.dellon.com/publications/ipnsbrochure73pp_Nerve.pdf

The 2006 article that says that recently, this has had better success than nerve grafting is here:

 http://www.pubmedcentral.nih.gov/articlerender.fcgi?artid=1201001

If anyone's heard about it, please let me know. Thanks and best wishes to all.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on February 22, 2008, 03:21:17 PM
Jove and ej_dlvga,

Very impressive research skills!   :) 

I am a librarian and teacher and it's true that you will often find only the citations and abstracts to articles or reserach studies from medical journals.  To get the full text of the study you either need a password to a medical database or you need to contact a medical library to get a copy of the article.

By the way the dragon has been back the past two nights.

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: jove on February 23, 2008, 04:37:02 AM
Thanks Mom444, and thanks ej_dlvga!

ej_dlvga,
I have heard about the neurotube, but don't know anything more than you have mentioned.
I think the neurotube is useful for short segments - Mine was 7cm, which is kind of medium , I guess.
How did the visit to the neurologist go? do they think your nerve is stretched as well as torn? Mine was both stretched and torn all the way thru.

mom444,
thanks for the help. Good to hear the 'dragon' is visiting again.
I have not done any electro therapy yet, but am going to look into it. I signed up to attend a Dr. Nath "outreach clinic" in my state, hoping I might find out more info/ details about the electro therapy options.
(has anyone been to one of those "outreach clinics"? if so, recommend it, or no?)
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on February 24, 2008, 08:02:03 PM
Hello All,

just catching up with all your posts and pleased to see old and new friends here.  I had a NCS abd EMG.  The sural nerve was being naughy and hiding so had to be stimulated by rubbing it to see if it would show itself.  I dont think it is much of a problem though as that nerve only does sensory and is commonly used for grafting.  Good news is that like Andre my peroneal nerve is making it all the way down to the toes, and again like Andre, the muscles are regaining strength at differing stages.  I dont have an over large one though.  Please do keep supporting eachother - reading back I dont know how I would have coped without all yu good people and it is great to be able to be part of a thread when there seemed to be no hope to there being a near normal recovery - even if at a very much inflated timescale to the one originally quoted!  I also appreciate not everyone will make a full recovery but my prayers are with you and I also pray for being ale to do all you want to do even if a full recovery is not forth coming.  best wishes to you all.

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on March 24, 2008, 02:24:02 AM
Hello All,

Hope you are all continuing to recover and do well.

Just a quick question for Andre, Jacky and anyone else who has had or is having recovery.

My daughter has recently had "dragons" again only this time she says she feels like they are "squeezing" her rather than burning or biting.

Did any of you have squeezing sensations?
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: jcblank on March 24, 2008, 04:56:44 AM
has anyone here had split posterior tibial tendon transfer to correct drop foot?  any information would be helpful on outcomes, rehab etc would be appreciated.
i have been recommended by my md for this surgery and wondering if the outcomes is worth the surgery, long rehab process etc.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: laxkate22 on March 25, 2008, 05:30:40 PM
Hi jcblank!

I have actually has a posterior tibial tendon transfer.  I have been meaning to write a post on here for a while now and as soon as I saw your post, I figured now was the time!
Here is my story:
On August 17th 2006, I took a bad fall and dislocated my knee, tearing my ACL, PCL, LCL, meniscus, entire posterolateral corner and my peroneal nerve.  Oh what fun.  At first, we were not sure if the nerve was torn or not so I was instructed to just wait it out and get an AFO in the meantime.  My primary focus was recovering the knee and getting my ROM back, so I let the nerve take a back burner, even though the nerve pain was sometimes worse than the knee pain!  After about 6 months of testing on the nerve (EMG's) and realizing that there was still no signals getting down to my toes, my doctor suggested doing a sural nerve graft to the damaged portion of my peroneal nerve.  Originally, my doctor thought that the nerve was only stretched/compressed, but when they opened me up to do the nerve graft, they saw that my nerve had actually torn somewhere in my mid-thigh area and had since migrated down to a bundle behind my knee.  At this point, there was nothing they could do.  The nerve graft would have had to be a minimum of 13cm, which has basically a 1% change of working.  My doctor had warned be about this and said that if the graft would have to be too long, he would not do it and do the tendon transfer instead.  Much to my dismay, I woke up in the recovery room with a 10inch incision behind my knee (for nothing) and a cast on my foot from the tendon transfer.  The recovery was not bad AT ALL compared to what I had been through ith my knee.  I was in a soft cast for 2 weeks, then a fiberglass cast for 6 weeks, followed by a walking boot for another 4 weeks.  I know it seems like a really long time, but it is TOTALLY worth it.  The surgery was on 2/14 2007 and just over a year later I must say that I am way farther along than I ever thought I would be.  It is truly a remarkable surgery.  I can walk with absolutely no problems.  I can run as well, but not for long distances yet.  I am working on that.  My muscles have already adapted to the new way of walking and I dont even have to think about it when I walk now.  I have the occasional trip up when my toe catches (I can only dorsiflex my foot to neutral) but it is WAY better than wearing an AFO.  I highly recommend this surgery to anyone who has drop foot with no chance of recovery.  I am sure I left a ton of information out of this post, but PLEASE email if any of you have any questions.

Have a good day everyone!

Kate
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: j_smi001 on April 09, 2008, 09:10:22 PM
Mom,

Sorry no squeezing feeling for me but that is not to say that is not good as clearly everyones recovery is different, especially when it comes to time scales. 

Kate, good to hear about your recovery following a nerve graft.  I know what you mean about the occasional toe trip - I also still occasionally get that - a little reminder as to what happened all that time ago, I suppose.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: embose319 on April 11, 2008, 03:55:22 AM
Hey everyone,
  My name is Emily. I'm 18 years old and was in a skiing accident Jan 16th.  I went over an embankment into a woody part of the mountain.  It took about 2 hours to get me back on the slope  and to the ambulance.  I fractured my left fibula near my ankles and right tibia near ankles as well. I fractured my pelvic bone too.  I tore my acl, pcl, and mcl on my left knee.  I tore my acl, pcl, and lcl on my right knee as well as damaged my peroneal nerve.  It was still intact and not severed but pretty beat up so the doc says. I came across this board when searching on yahoo.  I read a lot of the first posts and it really helped me stay positive.  I have been walking again for about 5 weeks.  The physical therapist says I still have trace activity.  Recently i have noticed if i tap the side of my leg directly to right of the center of my knee i feel tingling in the whold side down my leg.  I was wondering if this is good news? Also I was wondering when people started to see some return pulling your foot up?
                                                                                                                                 Thanks
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on April 14, 2008, 03:30:45 AM
Welcome Emily and Good luck to you!

Hopefully the people on this board can share some good advice ")
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: ej_dlvga on April 14, 2008, 12:34:25 PM
Hi Emily,

The tingling sensation you feel when you tap your leg is Tinel's sign. According to my doctor, it is used to identify the parts of the nerve that are damaged. Also, they say that this is also a sign that your nerve is trying to recover. I also experienced this, and before going into surgery, my surgeon used this to identify where to make his incision, together with the results from my EMG-NCV tests.

Also, I wanted to update everyone else as to what happened recently.

My neurosurgeon, after 4 months of my EMGs saying there arent any signs of reinnervation, decided to go ahead with surgery. He wanted to visually identify the damage done to the nerve and from there, decide on the action. What happened was, upon opening up my leg, he saw that the nerve was anatomically intact, and was not torn, as the MRI initially suggested. However, the nerve was obviously very badly damaged as it had swollen to twice its normal size. Also, what was preventing the nerve from regenerating properly was all the fibrosis or fibrous tissue or scar tissue that had built up around the nerve. The blunt trauma that my leg received during the accident was supposedly the cause for all this damage. After deciding I didn't need a nerve graft, it took my neurosurgeon took 4 hours under the microscope to slowly remove the fibrous tissue from my nerve, around 20cm of it. Now, i'm just waiting again. It's actually the 4th day since surgery and i'm back to school on crutches again, as the long incision made on my leg is making it hard to walk. I should be off crutches and walking with my AFO by the end of the week though.

So now i'm just waiting again. My doctor said that chances of recovery by the nerve could be as low as 40% and as high as 70%. I'm positive however, and I'm hoping that in 6 months to a year, It'll come back. :D

Anyway, best wishes to all and I'm hoping for the best for everyone. Be strong.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: embose319 on April 17, 2008, 07:29:54 PM
ej dlvga,
  Thanks for the information. Best of Luck to you and I hope you have recovery to your nerve. 
 
  I was wondering if any of you have normal sensation on your leg with the nerve damage? I can tell if something or someone is touching my leg, however i don't have normal sensation. It almost feels numb. I have heard or people not being able to feel touch at all. Also I was wondering if you all could feel the EMS on your leg? I can feel it and my therapist says that the tib ant is contracting but i cant see it or really even feel it and i can still not pull my foot up towards me.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: ej_dlvga on April 18, 2008, 09:56:12 AM
Emily,

In my case, it felt numb from my big toe, across my foot, til the lower part of my leg. I think what you mean is that you can feel pressure against your foot, but not soft touch (something sharp rubbing against it for example). Im not so sure about the others, but that's how it is with me. Also, it's a good thing if your therapist says that, even if you still can't pull it up voluntarily. How long has it been now, anyway? All my doctors say that recovery of nerves is gradual and is a slow process, so it probably won't just come back instantly one day. Just keep up with your therapy and make sure you get the opinions of the right doctors.

Hope this helps.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: embose319 on April 18, 2008, 08:06:05 PM
Thanks,
   It has been about 3 monthes since the accident.  I have not yet seen a nuerologist no one has directed me to see one.  I have read that a lot of people see a nuerologist and I'm sure the sooner the better.  Should I contact one myself or just wait until someone directs me to.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: ej_dlvga on April 20, 2008, 04:00:52 AM
Have you had EMG-NCV tests? You definitely should, if you haven't. These tests can show if your nerve is regenerating properly. If by now, after 3 months, the tests aren't showing any positive results (this is what happened to me), i would definitely suggest going to see a nerve specialist.

In my case, I wish I had seen a neurologist and a neurosurgeon earlier because then they would've identified the problem sooner and the surgery, done earlier, would've had better chances of success. Before I saw a neurologist, most of my doctors were telling me to just wait for the nerve to recover on its own. We decided to see one anyway. Had I not seen a neurologist, I wouldn't have known that I needed the surgery ASAP. In your case, at 3 months, I suggest you see a one at least, it won't hurt, after all. It would at the very least give you peace of mind, knowing that you went to see an expert. If they suggest you see a neurosurgeon, why not? From what I've read about nerve injuries, timing is very important when it comes to treatment.

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: jcblank on April 24, 2008, 11:13:52 PM
I am finally starting to see trace movement of my anterior tib with the use of a TENS unit.  This finally started 10 months and 10 days after surgery that damaged my nerve.  I just cant wait until I can use my foot hopefully soon.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: jove on April 30, 2008, 05:33:16 AM
embose319;
yes you should see a neurologist. ej-dlvga's advice is right on. It's been 3 months with no apparent recovery. In this case you need to take the initiative, & see a neurologist, and get all the information that you can about your injury, so that you can make the right decisions in a timely  manner.

As ej-dlvga mentioned, don't wait too long, because IF you should need surgery, much after 6 months your chances of success, and options, are decreasing. If the neurologist recomends seeing a neurosurgeon, then see one - just to get all the information before you decide what to do (or to just wait). If you wait too long, you won't have the option. Sure it may cost a lot to see the specialists, but look at it as an investment in your future.

 People think that surgery is risky, and of course it is- but, doing nothing and waiting too long is also risky! All I'm saying is, just see the experts and get all the info from them, before you choose which risk you want to take.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on May 01, 2008, 03:42:35 PM
To everyone,

Just checking in to say hi and wish you all continued success and recovery. 

Again, keep this thread going!

My daughter has been having "dragons" on and off, but none for the past two weeks.  When the dragons are there they "bite" her below her knee right in the space of the anterior tib muscles, so we hope and pray that is a good sign.  We are now at almost 21 months past the surgery.  Still no obvious dorsiflextion yet, but now that she's almost 5 she is more aware of what's going on and can actively "try" to move her muscles.  Sometimes she says it hurts.

We are looking into beginning "surface EMG triggered biofeedback" on her anterior tib  muscles.  As I said, we found a therapist one city away who is originally from Denmark and she has experience working with children's nerve injuries.  We'll likely see her again soon.

Keep us in your thoughts and prayers, as you are all in ours.

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: embose319 on May 07, 2008, 12:51:44 AM
HI all,

 Hope everyone is doing well with their recoveries. I have a new question sorry for all the questions i am new to all this and feel very uninformed.  I have been having "jolts" in the side of my leg where the nerve damage is.  I have had this pretty much from the begginning several times a day, however lately it is getting much stronger.  Sometimes it's so strong i have to jerk my leg because it is like a shock. What is this feeling im guessing it is the nerve but what causes this and is this a good thing or bad.?
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: jove on May 14, 2008, 04:53:35 AM
Here is an excerpt of an interesting article about 'phantom pain'. Actually it was written about amputees, but (my guess) is that some of the ideas may still apply to a nerve which is damaged or torn:
http://www.cripworld.com/amputee/painmanagement.shtml

"You need to know that, despite intense research in this area, there is still very much that is not known or understood about human neurophysiology. .....
Pain is actually felt in the sensory cortex of the brain. The sensory cortex receives messages from the rest of the nervous system and organizes them into a pattern that the body can experience, either feeling them, seeing them, tasting them, smelling them or hearing them. The sensory cortex acts much like a television set, which picks up information, organizes it, and then displays it so that it can be understood.
When an amputation occurs, the nerve trunks are cut at the site of the amputation and the sensory nerve cells die and are discarded along with the amputated limb. This is the equivalent of the television transmission lines being cut and the camera being destroyed. The television screen, antenna, cable hook-up and television station may still be present and working. They are just no longer getting a valid input from that particular remote television unit. Since the sensory cortex of the brain, and the spinal cord, as well as all the intermediate connections, are still working, signals still come to the sensory cortex, even if they are not valid, real signals.  Some of the signals are like static, some are from other neural circuits, and some of it we have no real idea about. The fact remains-the person still can feel the limb that is no longer present because the part of the brain that does the feeling is still alive and well.
The cut nerve can generate sensations of its own. Any sensation that could be experienced by the nerve prior to injury can still be perceived by the brain, even if the limb is no longer present.  If the cut end of the nerve is squeezed or pinched, the nerve may be highly stimulated and send strong signals that appear to originate in the amputated part because this is where the nerve cell originally was located. Sometimes the feelings are electric tingling, like when the funny bone at the elbow is struck and electricity runs into the little finger. Other times the sensation is a deep, slow, burning pain.  Anything that the limb could have actually experienced when it was intact can still be experienced by the cut nerve and sensory cortex that is attached to it. Sometimes the experience may seem more intense because the sensory cortex is bored by having nothing to do and may seem to make a lot out of a little.""

source-Editor, InMotion
Magazine, 900 E. Hill Avenue,
Suite 285, Knoxville, TN 37915
or e-mail to
G. Edward Jeffries, MD
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on May 16, 2008, 08:59:13 PM
HI all,

 Hope everyone is doing well with their recoveries. I have a new question sorry for all the questions i am new to all this and feel very uninformed.  I have been having "jolts" in the side of my leg where the nerve damage is.  I have had this pretty much from the begginning several times a day, however lately it is getting much stronger.  Sometimes it's so strong i have to jerk my leg because it is like a shock. What is this feeling im guessing it is the nerve but what causes this and is this a good thing or bad.?

If you read through some of the old posts you'll see that many of the posters, including my daughter, have similar pains.  My daughter calls hers "the dragon."

Just today we almost were going to take her to the emergency room because the pain was so bad.  She has had the pain for nearly two years now since her peroneal nerve decompression surgery.

From what I and others have researched, sometimes the pain is a bad sign because it means the nerve is experiencing degeneration.  However, the pain can also be a GOOD sign because many have had such jolts when the nerve is reinnervating the muscle.  So it could be either.  But we hope and pray it's good.

Update on my daughter:  We got insurance approval for the EMG triggered biofeedback machine!  We will need to travel to see the out of town therapist for training on how to use it, but we hope it's positive.

Remember, many therapists say that after a long standing injury, even after one gets recovery back there still needs to be a period of "retraining the brain" to "remember" how to use the muscles.

I pray for you all.  Keep the faith.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Tanya8 on June 03, 2008, 07:40:59 PM
Hi...
I've been reading all of your peroneal nerve pain and surgery stories and would just like to relate my own story...I awoke with foot drop after surgery to repair a broken femur bone 6 months ago...recently I had nerve decompression surgery. Before the surgery, I had a continual "hit the funny bone" pain behind the knee and felt as if my ankle and knee were being strangled. Post surgery, the pain behind my knee is gone, the knee no longer feels strangled and the ankle feels about 40% better as well. Also, my foot, which looked smooth and kind of spooky because no veins were visible, now has normal veins and contours again. While I don't have pain pain in my leg, I do have an odd sensation of electrical current cursing through my leg...it feels most odd...not really jolts, but a steady kind of stimulation ???
It has only been a few days since surgery, but it seems to me that I have more movement in all the toes of my foot...also, before surgery I could dorsiflex up about 1 1/2 inches...now is seems like a little more, perhaps 2 inches. I don't know where all of this is going, but of course I'm keeping my fingers crossed and will keep you posted about any progress...
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Tanya8 on June 06, 2008, 04:42:05 AM
Hi Jove,

I noticed from you previous posts that you had nerve decompression surgery last January, and I was wondering how you're doing. I just had this surgery last week, and although I'm hopeful, one never knows how nerve problems are going to work out...so far it seems as if I can lift my toes higher than before, and as I mentioned in a previous post, the horrible pain behind my knee is gone. No electric jolts yet, but plenty of tingly sensations down to my foot and toes. I had the decompression surgery 6 months from the date of injury, so I guess it just a matter of waiting to see what happens. Have you noticed any improvement so far?...my doc said it could take up to a year or longer...also, have you been doing any electrical therapy or physical therapy to help it along? 

Feel better, and I'm looking forward to hearing from you...

Best,
Tanya
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on June 06, 2008, 05:48:16 PM
Best of luck Tanya!

Keep us posted on your progress.

My daughter had the "squeezing" dragon pain last night.  When I ask her to try to move her foot, she can tighten up her muscles with a lot more force now.  Still no visible dorsiflexion yet, but you can see and feel the muscles on the top of her leg at least TRYING to work.

Bless you all.  And keep in touch!
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Tanya8 on June 07, 2008, 04:20:36 PM
Hi Mom444,

Thanks for your good wishes, and I will keep you posted...in your post you mentioned that you daughter had the squeezing dragons last night, and I think I know what she's talking about...I had and still have that squeezing sensation around my knee and ankle, which seems to change in intensity at various times. Before the nerve release surgery I felt this odd pain at both my knee and my ankle...now I just feel it at my ankle ...I don't know what it means, but if I notice changes and improvements I'll let you know. These squeezing pains feel as if someone is tightly squeezing your ankle or leg and preventing it from moving...I'm just trying to put an adult spin on this so you can better understand what your daughter is trying to say...Has your daughter had nerve release surgery, and if so how long has it been...

Take care and keep in touch as well...you and your daughter are also in my prayers...
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on June 08, 2008, 12:08:18 AM
Thanks for the prayers Tanya, you are in ours too :)

It has been almost TWO YEARS now since my daugther had the nerve decompression surgery!  But often, from what I have researched, it can take a few years for people to get recovery.  Even though many doctors seem to think that recovery should happen right away, a lot of the research studies do say it could take years.

Thanks too for the adult input on the dragon pains.  Again, she has had these off and on since six months after her nerve decompression surgery...  How often do you have yours?

Take care and keep us posted!
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Tanya8 on June 08, 2008, 02:38:50 AM
Thanks Mom444

I've had the squeezing pains in my knee and ankle ever since the drop foot started in November 2007. The pain in my knee would radiate down the front of my leg from behind the knee and both the knee and ankle would feel as if I had tourniquets on them. Also, I had a pain behind the knee that felt as if I had hit a funny bone there 24 hours a day...as time progressed the knee discomfort did become better, but it was still very annoying. Also, when I walked, I would feel my knee catching like something was caught inside of it...one of doctors said that it could be arthritis because I have had some problems with this knee. Since the decompression surgery last week, however, I have my knee back...no more squeezing pain, and I can walk more normally now...so much for the arthritis theory.

As for the squeezing pain around my ankle, I still feel it, but just not so intense since the surgery...if you want to know how it feels, have someone with a strong hand just grip your ankle really hard, and you will have some idea of what your daughter feels. You also mentioned that your daughter has electric jolts as well, and while I don't have this feeling yet, I do feel some kind of electric current going down my ankle to my first 3 or 4 toes...not really painful, but it does feel odd. I really have the squeezing in my ankle all the time, but it's just the intensity that changes...unfortunately it's more noticeable at night...I would have to say the intensity becomes really annoying 2 or 3 nights a week. Before my knee pain disappeared, it also would happen 2 or 3 nights a week. During my research I've read that VitaminB6 is helpful for this  nerve discomfort, and I've noticed that it has helped me...perhaps this will help your daughter as well...
Although it's only been a week since my decompression,  I've noticed that I can lift my toes upwards more now...sometimes the differences are so slight that I'm afraid I might be imagining them...you know wishful thinking.  It's hard to be objective in matters such as these, but I do believe there has been improvement with the toes...only time will tell, however.

Since your daughter has had this condition for some time, I assume that she has to wear some type of brace...I was tortured in a custom plastic brace in the beginning, but when I rebelled, the orthotist recommended another one and perhaps your daughter could benefit from it...It's made by Otto Bock, and I know they have a children's version...certainly it would be great if your daughter could be more comfortable while she's healing. If you want the particulars and web addresses, just email me and I'll give them to you...By the way, I read somewhere on the Internet that it took 3 years for someone to heal after a decompression...they just basically forgot about it after a while and then one day noticed that they were better...in the meantime, God Bless, and may every minute of every day bring your daughter closer to recovery... :)
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: jove on June 11, 2008, 03:20:03 AM
Hello to all, Hi Mom444 and Tanya,embose, jcblank, and all,
hope your recovery is progressing....it's been exactly 1 year and 1 day now since my accident.

(Tanya said:)"I noticed from you previous posts that you had nerve decompression surgery last January, and I was wondering how you're doing. I just had this surgery last week, and although I'm hopeful, one never knows how nerve problems are going to work out...so far it seems as if I can lift my toes higher than before, and as I mentioned in a previous post, the horrible pain behind my knee is gone."

No, it's been a year since my accident and the nerve graft surgery was 8 months ago. Tanya, I believe that a nerve graft is somewhat more extensive than only the decompression, as in my case a 3" segment was cut out and replaced with a graft. (Maybe you are thinking of someone else's post?)
Tanya, I'm glad you are seeing some encouraging progress already! Good for you!
I'm fortunate that I never had much pain from any of this. But however, total lack of any feeling at all is not good, either.....

In my case there is not much tangible progress yet(surgery was Sept.2007). There is still no movement or muscle twitching at all that I can see, and the last EMG report was discouraging. There are some recent very subtle signs that I like to take as encouraging- an occasional mild shock, sting, or tingle now and then. A few times it felt as if someone was stomping on my foot! That was weird. So far I don't find it painful or bothersome at all because, well, "anything" seems better than the last 10 months of "nothing". I'm so happy to feel anything at all, it's progress! But it's been very mild and infrequent. And now I THINK the Tinell's sign has advanced from my thigh, a few inches above the crease in back of my knee, to an inch below the crease in the back of the knee. But this is just my guessing, I'm not really trained to do that test, and I'm not sure if I'm interpreting things correctly. I do believe it is a good sign, but I'm not telling anyone yet (except y'all!!!).

I've not done any electro-therapy. We tried it and had to turn the power up too high- my Neurologist did not recommend it UNTIL there is more sign of regeneration. I do try to keep the hamstrings and achilles tendon stretched out, it's important to not let the Achilles tendon shrink or contract, so you have to keep stretching, every day is good. When I drive to work I remove the AFO and try to move the foot, usually by (trying to) tap my toes in time to some loud country music playing on the radio. I imagine that it is moving, and as long as I don't look at it (and see that it is NOT moving) sometimes I really think it IS. VISUALIZATION is a technique that a lot of elite level athletes use, and swear to be very effective. (I imagine this to somehow help 'guide' the regeneration of the nerve to the correct location on the muscles...)

I'm still working to get full flexion in my knee joint, which also has a ruptured ACL and who knows what else. I now can come about 1 inch from touching my butt with my heel. Goal is to be able to sit on my heels, so that I can do yoga and jiu jitsu. Otherwise , I swim a  lot, bicycle, yoga, boxing, and kickboxing. For kick-boxing, I remove the AFO and put on a knee brace, ankle brace, shin guards, and hi-top wrestling shoes. Then I tie the laces at the bottom of the hi-top shoes to the top of the ankle brace, which holds my foot up. I can jump-rope for several minutes that way now, which I absolutely despise, But do it anyhow because it's part of the training.
I miss roller blading, jiu jitsu, and wrestling, which I can't do YET...

Any how, good luck again to everyone out there. and thanks for the support and encouragement.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: jcblank on June 11, 2008, 05:15:14 AM
well unhappy anniversary jove.  i too have my 1 year unhappy anniversary this week on the 13th. i still cannot dorsiflex my foot but i do get very minimal contractions in my anterior tib with the tens unit.  i also have been having increased ankle and foot pains but am unsure if it is nerve regeneration or my ankle collapsing.  i dont see the md until august.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on June 12, 2008, 06:50:44 PM
To jove, JC, tanya, et. al.

Remember, if you are looking for an alternative treatment based on electrical stimulation, we have been using what is called "threshold electrical stimulation" on my daughter.  It is a low level stim unit that you wear overnight.  This is because some studies show that overly strong stim that causes strong contractions can actually hurt or impede progress!

If you are interested in learning more, send me a PM.  It is considered "experimental" but it does show promise...  Also, the units are hard to find. 

We are STILL waiting for the surface EMG biofeedback machine to come in from Canada

Bless you all,

Mom
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Tanya8 on June 12, 2008, 10:38:51 PM
Hi Jove, mom444, Icblank and everybody,

Thanks for setting me straight about your graft surgery Jove...I went back to read your other posts and realize that someone was asking you about nerve decompression. In my case, decompression was the recommended treatment, and I can only hope that it works...in any event, I'm glad I had the surgery because now I at least have my knee back...before surgery the knee was very weak and I felt as if something was stuck in it preventing me from taking a full stride and walking more normally...I also had a "hit the funny bone pain" behind my knee, but now it has returned to normal...a real relief after 6 months of pain, but according to my doctor, many people express this kind of relief after decompression surgery.

I've also noticed that I can lift my first 3 toes up off the floor better now, but they are weak and can easily be pushed down with a little pressure...it is progress, however. As for ankle dorsiflexion, I don't know what to say about this...watching your peroneal nerve heal is sort of like watching a glacier move...the scientists tell you that it should move and that it is moving, but you really can't say for sure what you're seeing. As for treatments to help the nerve heal, my doctor said that keeping active is the best medicine...natural everyday movements and activities are the best stimulation for the return of nerve function...so Jove, it looks like you're on the right track to recovery.

Well, my best wishes for your full and more speedy recovery, and let me know how you're progressing...

Tanya
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: ah51416 on June 22, 2008, 06:47:03 PM
I have also past my one year anniversary.  I injured my knee a little over a year ago and I lost all dorsiflexion and eversion.  I thought I had no hope,  but a couple of months ago I regained a little eversion.  I noticed a small twitch when I was doing my nightly visualizations.  The last two month I am seeing more and more progress in the movement.  There is not much strength, but I am getting more range of motion.  I am still optomistic about regaining dorsiflexion.  Being a personal trainer and training in Jiu Jitsu, Wrestling, and Muay Thai,  I have to keep a positive attitude.  I am learning how to get around this SMALL OBSTACLE and continuing to do the things that I love.  I truly believe that keeping a positive attitude will help with everyone's recovery.  One of my wrestling coaches once told me  1. "Don't sweat the small stuff." 2. "Everything is small stuff."  Don't look at this injury as a problem.   Look at this injury as a small obsticle that we have to overcome.   This injury has made me a stronger person by giving me a challenge that may take years to conquer.  Stay strong and never say die.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on June 22, 2008, 10:50:16 PM
Welcome ah!

Please continue in the discussion and share with us your advice and progress!
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: jove on June 26, 2008, 03:39:44 AM
Thanks, everyone, for the encouragement!

ah51416 , I'm interested in details about how you manage to do the jiu jitsu, wrestling, & M.T. ?
Do you wear an AFO? knee brace? or ????

I don't like to wear the AFO for Muay Thai, I tie my foot up with shoelaces instead. I will kick the heavy bag or thai pads lightly  with the 'bad' leg, but I'm afraid to kick anything full force with my bad shin, because I doubt all that impact would be helpful to a regenerating nerve? And I will not spar any one with kicks, but I will spar boxing...I do 'ok' even tho my footwork is clumsy.

I'm still afraid to do wrestling or BJJ because (for one thing) I never got my torn ACL fixed. Did you get the ACL repair? My Dr. seemed to think it was pointless to fix the ACL,  so long as the nerve is not working. But then, the Doc has no clue what BJJ is all about, so I don't expect that he understands what I am wanting to do......I don't want to risk another dislocation, thinking with no ACL, it might be a possibility.... But I am thinking perhaps I may be able to start doing just some very basic BJJ reps or drills, without resistance.

As  far as wrestling, I can sort of shoot on one side, but the bad side I still can't bend the knee enough. Still working on that. I can sprawl and pop back up on one side, but the other side I can sprawl, but can't get my foot under me to pop back up on...

Anyhow- I'm interested in how you do these things? and what kind of afo or brace do you use for each activity?
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: ah51416 on June 30, 2008, 11:17:45 PM
Hey Jove,

I use an ASO brace and a hinged brace for Muay Thai.  I don't have too many problems pivoting on my bad foot.  The biggest problem I have is jumping rope because the rope hits my toenail on one toe and it hurts very badly.  I have no feeling on the top of my foot, but it feels like my toenail has super sensitivity.  I still kick the bag with my bad shin, but maybe I shouldn't?

I use a hinged brace, an ASO, and a very supportive wrestling shoe for BJJ and Wrestling.  I have wrestled since a very early age and takedowns used to be my strength.  This injury might be a blessing in disguise because it is teaching me to be more comfortable on my back.  I am just starting to drill takedowns, but I am still afraid to go 100%.  I still start on my knees when we are actually rolling.  I still have not had surgery on my LCL or ACL,  but I plan for it in Sept.  I still plan on achieving my goal which is competing at a professional level of MMA.

I do a lot of balance exercises that have really improved my strength and balance.  I couldn't even balance on one leg for 5 secs when I started.  I am now balancing on one leg while standing on a balance pad and performing an exercise for at least a minute.  It is neat to see how the body adapts when the anterior tibialis stops functioning.

What are you doing for rehab and what braces do you use?  Do you stretch your calves daily?
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: 1knee4me on July 08, 2008, 07:27:09 PM
I tore my ACL, PCL and LCL playin football. not to mention i stretched my peroneal nerve. doc said it was beat up and bruised really badly but not torn. Whats the best thing i should do, doctors are tellin me to get nerve grafts. Is nerve decompression surgery better? Or should i just wait to see if they will regenerate by themselves. Emg's have been negative so far, it been 8 months since the injury and im tryn to play ball again in college.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: jcblank on July 14, 2008, 06:39:30 AM
has any of you had problems with you ankle after nerve damage?  i am seeing the doc now for ankle pains-have foot drop from peroneal nerve damage and my ankle feels like it is falling apart.  i cannot strengthen it and he possibly thinks my ligament is loose and getting caught in the joint.  if its not one thing its another.  i am surviving with my nerve pain from foot drop and now my ankle has decided to come to the forefront and take over in the pain problems--it hurts more than my nerve pain now.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: ziggy on July 15, 2008, 05:22:13 AM
Hi

I  have just read your post.  I have foot drop for the last 3 years following TKR surgery 4 years ago.  I have had 2 nerve releases the first was successful for 6 months and then got progressively worse until now.  I get lateral ankle pain which I think comes from the natural inversion of the foot after peroneal injury and also from the foot being in extension all the time.  I have little knee ROM left so cannot use an AFO but try to wear a night splint to help keep my foot flexed at night to stop contracture deformaties from developing.  I think that we all tend to toe walk after peroneal nerve injury which also puts immense pressure on the foot which is not natural and all these things can cause pain.  Toe walking can cause plantar faciitis which can make the arch and heel of your foot extremely painful so stretching your foot is really important. 

I was also impressed to read on previous posts how many people had had some results afte nerve injury.  I was thinking about having a tenodesis done to pull my foot up but maybe I will just continue exercising foot and having PT to the muscles and who knows maybe even after all this time.  I was given a time limit of 2 years for 10cm of damage and now am told to accept defeat but that is not a word used on any of the boards on knee guru.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: jcblank on July 18, 2008, 05:57:31 AM
they say my damage was 2-3 cm and it has been 13 months with no return.  my original injury was from the doc sewing my nerve up--so actually it only had a hole punched through it but due to the stitch being there 6 months before removed that is where the damage occurred.  the docs had hoped i would have gotten return way before now--i see him again aug 6.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: cwalukevich on August 12, 2008, 05:50:15 AM
Hey JC-
how did you make out at your appt?

To all-
I had foot drop as a result of ruptured L5 disk. Used NEMS unit, did
therapy, wore AFO for 20 months with no seeeming change in the
foot drop.

Had a posterior tibial tendon transplant and am in month 4 and
in a walking cast. Nice straight foot! Still have recovery pain from
learning to walk again. Can't tell if nerves are still doing any recovery
but excited about this new foot position and looking forward to Sept.
when I should be out of the cast and into shoes.If anyone is contemplating this surgery,
I am willing to share my progress and answer questions.

C.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: jcblank on August 12, 2008, 06:25:17 AM
cwalukevich--i am getting referred back to a neuro surgeon for a possible nerve graft.  i havent heard anything from them as of yet.  hopefully this week.  my doc has discussed a tendon transfer but i am taking other options before that as that is a permanent fix.  hopefully i can get some answers from the neuro surgeon.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: AmandaC on August 13, 2008, 09:36:05 PM
Hello to all the new comers and to all the old ones to.
Well its been a while since I posted so I thought I had better give everyone a update.  I am not 35 1/2 weeks pregnant and will get date for my C-Section delivery tomorrow.  Have had few problems with pregnancy as expected, my hip and back are not holding out the best fairly painful, I have also developed an Anti Body in my blood that can affect unborn baby so am getting monitored very closley, baby is quite little at this stage but I wasnt expecting a big baby after what I went through, I count myself lucky to even be having a second child.

In regard to my nerve recovery it will be a year since my operation on 2nd October and 2 years since accident on 16 September.  I had thought nothing else was happening but this week I have two more toes that are moving - downwards not upwards.  This is showing signs of improvement in my tibial nerve which was significantly damanged but some muscles continued to work, my peroneal nerve has to date not shown any signs of improvement in regard to movement but I think there are a few changes with sensation.

Any way please keep posting I do read updates at least once a month but didn't think I had much to post.  Max, Hamish & Gordon are any of you guys still watching and if so how's things going for you.
Keep posting - next time I post I will probably be sleep deprived and up to my neck in dirty nappies and washing.
Amanda
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on August 15, 2008, 10:56:55 AM
Hi Amanda,

Sorry it has been so long since i last posted on the forum. Hope everything goes well for you over the next few weeks. Things with me are going pretty well and although I do not have full movement back in my foot (and it is still numb) I am no longer wearing my AFO. It broke and I decided to do without it and see how I got on. I wear my foot-up when I go to the gym. I do occassionally catch my toe but generally I am walking pretty well. Other happenings are that I managed to ski a couple of times this winter and my knee came through it great so chuffed to bit.

Gordon, Max, how are things with you? I will keep poping in from time to time to catch up.

Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on August 20, 2008, 01:28:30 PM
Yes, please keep this thread going.

My daughter is now two years past her peroneal nerve decompression surgery. 

She is five now and starts kindergarten in a few weeks!

She is  still wearing the threshold electrical stimulation stickers to bed every night.

We are also using the surface EMG triggered biofeedback machine.    She is able to move her big toe, which some doctors told us is not connected to the peroneal nerve, but not her small toes.  However, she can at least contract those muscles in her leg and can do so with some good force, no dorsiiflexion yet.

I thank all of you still and appreciate all of your input.  We keep cheering you on and I still come back and often check this board to see how you all are doing.

Again, KEEP POSTING!

Amanda, I hope and pray that everything goes well for you especially.

And for the rest of our friends, keep the thread going.  I show my daugther a globe and tell her where all the different countries are where people hurts their legs like she did.

We pray for all of you.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: ej_dlvga on August 27, 2008, 03:22:55 PM
I have good news.

It has been almost 9 months since the car accident that injured my leg, leaving me with foot drop on my left foot. Last April, I had surgery done on my nerve, complete interior and exterior neurolysis of my left peroneal nerve, about 20cm of which was swollen to twice its normal size, with fibrosis all around. of it. At 6 months after the accident, and numerous EMG-NCV tests, I began consulting with ortho specialists, for a possible tendon transfer. Most of them, when asked if my nerve had a chance to come back, said that aside from a miracle, it really isn't likely to come back, specially since it had been more than 6 months since the injury and such a large part of the nerve had been injured.

But about 3 or 4 weeks ago, during a physical therapy session, that miracle happened. While icing my leg after some gymwork, I noticed slight movement at my ankle. I had my Pt feel my leg, and she thought she could feel slight contractions of my TAs. I wasn't really sure if it was something, I didn't want to get my hopes up. But as the weeks went on, even I could feel my TAs contracting and could physically see my foot moving up and down, maybe just a half inch at that time.

My neurosurgeon was completely surprised when I showed him, he didn't expect it at all, even he had begun to accept that perhaps the surgery hadn't worked. My PT contacted my rehab doctor and she didn't even believe it at first, as all my EMGNCV results were the same each time for so many months -- negative.

I had another EMGNCV done last week, and the results were the best news I've heard in months. My nerve wasn't dead. I had reinnervation, finally, of my peroneus longus and tibialis anterior muscles, but none yet in my EHL(not really sure what that is, i think it's for the big toe. the order of reinnervation is usually PL, then TA, then EHL i think). They weren't completely innervated yet, but the fact was they were getting there. Hopefully with time, I regain full movement.

Right now, when fully rested and my leg is bent, the most i can lift my foot is about two inches more or less. My TA muscle is very weak, and after continuously lifting my foot to exercise it, gets tired very easily. I still walk with an AFO while waiting for my muscle to regain strength and full reinnervation, and I continue to go therapy thrice a week.

All my doctors had given up on the nerve, even I had. But apparently, we were all wrong. I pray for all of you, and thank you for the support and prayers. This site gave me hope even when I knew there was little chance, and I hope my story brings that hope to others as well. God Bless. Never give up.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on August 27, 2008, 03:50:39 PM
That is wonderful!   :)

It goes to show that doctors are often more on the negative side and willing to write things off too soon.

Again, we too have been written off my the rehab doctor with the EMGs and the neurosurgeon, but at least our out of town physical therapist still believes that my daughter could get a bit more recovery.

I refuse to give up hope.

It has been two years since here neurolysis, after a long standing undiagnosed injury, and she still cannot quite dorsiflex her foot but here has been some consistent activity in the TA for over a year.  We still are doing our aggressive therapy with EMG triggered biofeedback and overnight threshold electrical stimulation.

Remember, at least a few of the studies I found-- and one guy who posted on here a few years ago-- have reported recovery after even three years.

God bless and keep us posted!
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Tanya8 on September 02, 2008, 05:45:43 PM
Hi mom444 and everybody…figured I’d stop by and give you a progress report…It’s been 3 months since my nerve decompression surgery and 9 months since the broken bone that caused the dropped foot. As far as I can see, my foot is just doing more of what it started doing before the surgery. I was able to evert somewhat before, and now the eversion is stronger…I had a little dorsiflexion in the ankle, and now I can raise the ankle a couple of inches even in the most difficult position. Also, all my toes can move upward, although not as strong as they would normally. It’s very slow going, and I don’t know how much I will improve given more time, but I keep on hoping for the best. If I’m careful, I can walk without my brace, and when I do, I can feel a pulling and stretching along the peroneal nerve and muscle…so part of my own home made therapy is going without a brace at home for a few hours a day. When I wear the brace I can walk just fine, but I don’t feel as if anything is getting exercised, and I think this is important for nerve regeneration…to actually try to use the muscles that are affected by the peroneal nerve…this is just my wacky idea…
I’m still going for PT as well, and my therapist has also seen improvement, but we still have to work on more upward ankle motion…that’s where the problem is. I still feel the numbness and the tingling, but instead of my whole leg feeling like this, the feeling is now mostly in the foot, and not as bothersome as before. Mom, how is your daughter doing? Is she still experiencing her dragon pains? I hope not…take care and be well everyone...
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on September 07, 2008, 09:10:37 PM
Hello Everyone,

I hope you all are well.  Please keep posting.

I just wanted to thank you for your continued prayers.  Last night may be part of an answered prayer.

My daughter had a MAJOR dragon attack.  She woke up cryhing and said that no matter what she did her leg kept hurting.  She said it hurt right near her tibialis anterior and it was a combination of, "Fire, ice, burnign and some squeezing."  It as a "red dragon," the worst kind with "two heads."

The dragons have been appearing sporadically for two years now since the surgery.

Again, many reports say neuromuscular recovery comes with pain.  So let's hope this pain is a good sign.

How are all of you?
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: zyx979 on September 10, 2008, 02:01:18 AM
I am new here and am looking for anyone that has peroneal neuropathy for more that 10 years?  I am interested in anyone that had the peroneal decompression surgery and if you are any better off after the surgery.  Thank you.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on September 10, 2008, 07:46:32 PM
I am new here and am looking for anyone that has peroneal neuropathy for more that 10 years?  I am interested in anyone that had the peroneal decompression surgery and if you are any better off after the surgery.  Thank you.

Welcome and best of luck to you!

You are lucky enough to have joined a thread that has been going on for over two years.  Read through some of the older postings and you'll see how we have discussed various therapies, treatments, etc.

My daughter, who is five now, had her peroneal nerve decompression surgery after at least 18 months of symptoms and is now two years past surgery.  We are still hoping and praying for her recovery.  If you problem has been for over ten years, how serious is it?  Do you have partial movement of your foot?  Did you have the decompression surgery already?  If so when?  And have you had any pains in your leg?

Keep posting and we'll all try ot help you.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: zyx979 on September 11, 2008, 04:13:51 PM
I was hurt in Desert Storm in 1991 and was discharged from the Marine Corp because of it.  I have worn an AFO brace for about 8 years and then all of a sudden I got some feeling and a little movement back and since then was able to adapt and kind of walk normal(ish).  Recently I had an EMG done and was told that the nerve damage had gotten worse and that the peroneal neuropathy was getting worse. Recently I was working out on a treadmill and I believe I did something because I have lost almost all the muscle mass in my right calve and my ankle has become extremely unstable, I don't have any movement in the toes and have distorted feeling in the foot.  I think I have developed a tolerance to the nerve pain becuase I don't really notice it.  After reading some of the messages here, they gave me some hope that even now after all this time that surgery could help.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Tanya8 on September 13, 2008, 01:56:25 AM
Hi zyx979,

Although I have only had drop foot (peroneal neuropathy) since November 2007, I have had the nerve decompression surgery, and it has helped. Before the surgery, my knee used to feel as if it was being strangled to death...now the knee feels fine and most of the tingling sensations are in my ankle and foot, and they are not severe. In general, I also feel as if my foot and lower leg are stronger now, and I seem to be getting around better. Eversion, or outward movement of the foot is stronger as well, and I have regained some upward movement of my ankle...although there is room for a lot more improvement  in upward movement---dorsiflexion---I am encouraged that there is something happening there...in my mind, if something little happens with the nerves, then perhaps more improvement is possible in the future as well.  The one thing I did notice right away after this surgery was that I could move my toes upward again...not a lot. but this little difference has made the difference between my tripping and not tripping.

As far as my case is concerned, a neurosurgeon was the  best person to determine if a decompression surgery was appropriate and could be helpful. Although neurologists do a lot of testing and are very knowledgeable, the neurosurgeon was really able to zero in on the most effective treatment. I would try to locate one to find out what can be done in your particular situation...

Over the course of the past 10 months, I've "graduated" from a custom plastic brace, which was horribly painful, to a carbon brace, which was really great, to some sort of device which attaches to the shoelaces and is then hooked to an elastic around the ankle, and it feels like the best thing yet...since you have already managed to walk kind of normal(ish), perhaps it would help you too...please post again if you have any questions about the above post...by the way, the release surgery is not a very big deal, and in most cases you go home the same day...feel better...
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: jeanrod on September 21, 2008, 09:24:33 PM
Hi, I'm new here.  After 7 months of searching for a diagnosis, in October last year I had surgery to remove an intraneural (inside the nerve) ganglion cyst in order to remove pressure on the peroneal nerve (with resulting foot drop).  Dr. also did arthroscopy.  Have recovered about 200% from ZERO (which is 2 out of 5 levels) and physiatrist said probably no more.  I have used the X-strap ankle brace to pull up the toes.  Now I wear MBT shoes which have a rocker bottom and so I don't wear a brace at all (dr. doesn't like that, but I do).  Was doing electro-acupuncture to stimulate the nerves and I think that helped (insurance co isn't so sure and doesn't want to pay for any more).  As with many of you, it's exhausting to have to fight the medical establishment for encouragement and assistance.  If time doesn't take care of more improvement, there may be an AFO leafspring brace in my future, but for now, I like walking more freely.
I wish you all well in your recoveries.  Patience, time and effort seems to be what's required.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: jcblank on September 22, 2008, 05:01:37 AM
well im just back from the doc again--i am now to consider a nerve graft in hopes for restoring function.  does anyone have any thoughts on this?  i was told there is a 50/50 chance for some recovery with the graft.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Tanya8 on September 23, 2008, 07:00:52 AM
well im just back from the doc again--i am now to consider a nerve graft in hopes for restoring function.  does anyone have any thoughts on this?  i was told there is a 50/50 chance for some recovery with the graft.

Hi iceblank,

Just to be on the safe side I would get another opinion...great online research sites for peroneal neuropathy are the New York University Medical Center and the Columbia University Neurological Institute. I would post the websites, but I don't think this is allowed...good luck to you and the best of health...

Tanya
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on September 30, 2008, 05:04:06 AM
Keep this thread alive!

I"m just checking in.

My daughter has been a champ with her efforts in working with the surface EMG triggered biofeeback.  We think that she may be able to...  maybe...  just ever so slightly...  move the foot up a bit.  Let's hope.

We still think of all of you and please do let us know about your progress. 

We keep you in our prayers.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: jcblank on October 06, 2008, 06:13:46 AM
well i recently posted about a possible nerve graft that is scheduled in nov.  and now 16 months after my injury i am able to slightly pick up my foot as of yesterday.  hopefully i be able to become one of the success stories.  i dont know what this means about the surgery i assume i will now wait but i havent spoken to the doc yet.  if anyone could say when this occurs about how long before you start to see more regeneration?  i know this is just the start of hopefully a lot more recovery.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: bermudezfamily on October 06, 2008, 09:53:22 PM
Hello, new here! I have an 8 month old son who was born with a mild clubfoot, never seen on ultrasound, surprised us at birth. Mild in terms of it only needed one cast, usually they need 7 casts changed weekly. Anyhow, after his first cast was off at 3 weeks of age it was noticed that he does not have active dorsiflexion of the right foot. Well, several docs later, we now see a good ortho doc and neuromuscular neurologist. We live in New Mexico and travel to St. Louis Chidlren's Hospital.

We did have an EMG/NCT done on the baby when he was 6 months old. It basically said that peroneal nerve could be stimulated at the popliteal fossa, but not at the fibular head. His official diangosis is neuromuscular clubfoot and peroneal nerve palsy. He can move his toes on that foot, but has no dorsiflexion, minimal inversion, and eversion. The ankle is quite static honestly.

He wears a foot abduction brace at night which is the standard protocol for clubfoot, it's AFO's with a bar between them to prevent relapse of the inversion clubfoot, though honestly he doesn't sleep well in it and he just wears the AFO on this right foot to bed.

His right leg below the level of the knee is smaller in circumfrence, as well as the foot is smaller (though keeping up at the same growh rate) and there is a slight leg length discrepency. I've managed to find 5 othe rmom's who's child have the exact same symptoms. My son also has had ultrasound as part of a research study and they were able to see all of the nerves (so we know they are there) but not sure why they aren't firing. Yes, they were smaller again when compared to other side. He will likely have an MRI of legs in future. He has had MRI to rule out tethered cord, also have ruled out muscular dystophy, etc.

We are ready to start PT, though this is rare, and having a hard time finding a PT who knows what to really do with him. He is developmentally appropriate as of now, though once he starts weightbearing and walking he will wear an AFO for daytime to help with the foot drop. Have seen an AFO with a dorsiflexion assist to allow for the calf muscles to still plantar flex on their own. Have also read about e-stim that stimulates the tibialis anterior during a certain phase of gait...never seen one though. Would like to try e-stim with him now, though again, haven't found anyone who seems ready to do that on a child this age. I am an OT so have some knowledge, but a little out of my league too.

So, any thoughts, suggestions, I'm all ears. Thanks. Jamie

P.S. Forgot to sat that a posterior tibialis tendon transfer is possible when he is 3-4 years. Also ultrasound showed movement on the peroneal muslces, but did not see movement on the tibialis anterior.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Tanya8 on October 07, 2008, 04:28:15 AM
Hi There Bermudezfamily...

I'm so sorry to hear that your little one has to deal with such problems at such a young age. I've had dropped foot for almost a year now, and after decompression surgery I am starting to see a lot of improvement. During this span of time I've worn the traditional plastic brace and also the carbon brace, and for me the carbon was far superior, being much lighter and allowing a more natural walking pattern. During my travels on the Internet I came across a children's brace called the KiddieGait by AllardUSA. I don't know if it would be appropriate in your son's case, but perhaps this could be another option for you and for him...

My very best wishes for health and healing to both your son and you...

Tanya 
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: G_Bronson on October 14, 2008, 07:47:12 AM
Hello Everyone,
I have been absent in my posts now for far too long, and for that i apoligize. I was cleared to go back to work in february still having zero contractions in my tib ant or peroneous muscles. my knee is feeling pretty good depite the nerve damage. It is very stable and strong.
I had an emg done in august and the doctors were blown away. I kne something was going to show up due to the fact that i could see some slight movement in my toes. It was the first of 5 emg that showed signs of life. The doctor said i should see someting substantial happen in the next 6 months but didnt want to give me false hope. But from what he was seeing on the screen he couldnt see how i wouldnt. i still cannot dorsiflex or fully evert but i can notice the contractions getting stronger.
I have gotten my life pretty much fully back to normal except for the althetic things i used to do, hockey, jogging etc. but other than that i an doing everything. I wear my foot up pretty much everywhere( just got back from a fishing trip with my friends in the Rockies in BC). I wear a plastic afo while wearing my workboots at work. I still curse every morning when i put the darn thing on. but i am confident i will not need it forever.
I truely believe this experience has helped me see life in a better way. When i dislocated my knee i was pretty much in the prime of my life. had a great job, i was about to be promoted, in the best shape of my life, doing evreything a 26 year old man would want. then everything i worked hard for was gone, i was told i may never walk again and the only place i found any postive news was on this post and from my physio therapist. You people were the only ones who could really understand how this affects a person, my feinds , family , doctors didnt thats for sure. Then again i dont think i would because the sensaton is so difficult to decribe.
I was in recovery for 13 months before i returned to work and for someone in my line of work it is an awful long time. i was petrified to return, i did not think i could ever get back to being as productive as i was before the accident. I have gotten promoted since returning and am doing the exaclty what i was trying to do before i injured my leg. I work in the Alberta Oilsands as a senoir project coordinator so i am not out on the tools and alot of my days are spent in meetings and behind a desk. But i do alot of walking with a heavy workboot which i know has helped my leg to some degree. Getting back to work has helped me mentally more than anything else which as you all know is the most important part of dealing with injuries such as these. the fact that i am so busy keeps my mind off this terrible affliction called foot drop we are all battling. I still do my ems everynigth but i work such long hours that most nights i do not have time to do much else when i work. i work a 14 or 20 day shift then fly home to newfoundland and see my PT who tells me he is seeing improvements everytime i see him , even if i cant. They are so slow i guess that you have to look back a month to really notice them.
I am getting sensations in my leg such as cold water being poured on it, shocks, tingles and other things i cannot really put into words. I hear that these are signs of regeneration but who knows.
I truely from the bottom of my heart wish you the best of luck in your recoveries and will try to check in when i can.

Gordon

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on October 28, 2008, 03:19:34 AM
Hello Jamie and welcome to the thread!

I am so sorry that you have to go through this with your son. 

I too am a parent of a child with peroneal nerve issues.

Read through some of my previous posts and you'll see my daughter's issues.  She is five now.

You can PM if you'd like.  We have tried many treatments.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on October 30, 2008, 05:34:26 PM

I am getting sensations in my leg such as cold water being poured on it, shocks, tingles and other things i cannot really put into words. I hear that these are signs of regeneration but who knows.
I truely from the bottom of my heart wish you the best of luck in your recoveries and will try to check in when i can.

Gordon



Hi Gordon!  Thanks for keeping in touch and for your inspiring and encouraging words.

My daughter crawled into our bed three nights ago with the "dragon" pain.  She has had these pains for now a consistent two years, at least one "dragon attack" every few weeks it seems, a good sign we pray.

Do you feel these pains mostly in your tib ant, upper shin area too?

Oh, and as for your muscle contractions.  I swear I too see my daughter's muscles contracting more.

Good luck.  God bless.  Keep posting :)
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: AmandaC on November 12, 2008, 05:17:26 AM
Hi to everyone.
Well I dont have anything new to report regarding my foot drop but I do have another little girl.  Her name is Regan Elisabeth and she was born on 3 September - elective C-Section.  she was born at 38 weeks and was 5.14 pound (2.6kg) jus a little dot. She is a very good baby and is doing wonderfully.  I have just read through the latest posts and am so happy everyone is keeping the forum going.  I will post again soon.
Amanda
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on November 12, 2008, 10:09:24 PM
Hi to everyone.
Well I dont have anything new to report regarding my foot drop but I do have another little girl.  Her name is Regan Elisabeth and she was born on 3 September - elective C-Section.  she was born at 38 weeks and was 5.14 pound (2.6kg) jus a little dot. She is a very good baby and is doing wonderfully.  I have just read through the latest posts and am so happy everyone is keeping the forum going.  I will post again soon.
Amanda

Congratulations Amanda!

God bless you and your family!

I'm glad we keep posting and "checkign in" too. 

My daughter is still doing all of her neuromusular therap, namely the

EMG triggered biofeedback

threshold electrical stimulation (electrodes worn overnight)

My husband and I swear that she may be getting a teensy bit of movement on the foot and you CAN see the antierior tib muscles contracting.  Here's hoping we can still get more improvement.

How are all the rest of you doing? 
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: god will help on November 18, 2008, 03:46:00 PM
hey every one......
am 17 years old and i had a nkee injury (right)on 06.03.2008 during a footeball game with severe pain.i was not able to stand and to move.later i treated in the hospital using a whole leg bandage(?)which was to tight.5 DAYS LATER THE BANDAGE WAZ REMOVED by myself becauseof the severe pain that results drom the banage.later i had treated by gibs bandage,and i had a peripheral peroneal paresis(right).i had treated by electrotherapy in the hospital(threshold carrent treatment according to me(?)).on 42.07.2008 exploration and neurolysis of the nerve were done in hospital.....
my (q) is!!!how much did my nerve recoverd till now!!!!! ??? ??? ??? ??? ??? ???
thank you....
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on December 10, 2008, 05:12:42 AM
Hey everyone,


Hopefully everyone is doing well and that people are still recovering and sharing there stories with each other. i wish everyone well and apologize for my absence. RL has been busy and i have been in rehab constantly since i have returned to sport. for the past two years since i have returned from injury....my leg seems to be functioning properly be unable to take on the same demands it once did...leading to alot of muscle imbalances and compensation issues leading to other injuries that limit my play and effect my daily physical actives.

i wanted to ask a question to those who have returned to regular activity since there injury....have you noticed any changes in your body mechanics...the way you do things....like walking,lifting .....running ....distributing weight from one side of the body to another, jumping and landing...etc.



hope to hear from you soon,
Andre durie
[email protected]


Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: dunez on December 10, 2008, 12:35:18 PM
Hi all,
Thank goodness I found this site, I have read through most pages and just through reading your experiences I feel better. I had an accident in Vietnam at the end of October. I collapsed on myelf for a long time...I am guessing about 8 hours. I have damaged the nerve and muscle in my left forearm and the nerves in my leg from the knee downwards. I little movement of my fingers but it is improving through p.t, my whole hand is numb except just under my thumb on the back of my hand. I have foot drop and part of my leg and foot is numb and part of my foot has strange sensation, often burning and intense pain. I also have daily pain 'attacks' where I get sharp electric shock type shooting pains which go right through to my left shoulder. I was treated with a fasciectomy (I think that's right) on both my leg and arm. My leg has since been closed through stitching and I have a skin graft on my arm which was put on 5 days ago. I flew back to England 3 weeks after the accident, the doctors in Vietnam told me in broken English that my arm was more seriously injured than my leg, there was evidence of necrosis on the muscle and I went in to OT 3 times to clean the wound. They didnt close it before I cam home. My leg was closed and very little information was given except 'it will be ok'. No testing of nerve function etc. Since I have returned to England the doctors conducted an MRI on my arm and advised me that there nerves weren't severed and will regrow. They gave me a final debridement and grafted me. Regarding my leg, the consultant gave it an examination through touch and asking me questions: 'Can you feel this?' etc. The general consensus was that my leg is fine at this stage and P.T is required to regain function. I am worried, I can put very little weight on my ankle. I can just about point my tows down but no upward movement whatsoever. It doesn't seem fine to me and having read your posts I feel the doctors should be conducting tests to assess nerve function and put us all in the picture of whats going on in my leg. Or am I over worrying and through a physical examination they can tell whats going on and it really is 'fine'? I am hitting the physio as hard as I can and I am noticing improvements - I couldn't even get out of bed 2 weeks ago and now I can walk with my ACO and crutch for a while. The pain is a major burden, although it has too improved, before it was all day and all night in my leg - now I can feel a constant ache and slight tingling but the pain doesn't kick in until just before I go to bed (I don't know how it knows!) I am Gabapentin, anatryptalin, tremadol and morphine. I would love to hear from anyone who can offer me advice or tips. I thank you all in advance and wish you all a speedy recovery! PS I am a 26 y/o male if it makes any difference!
dunez
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on December 10, 2008, 02:33:13 PM
WELCOME TO GOD WILL HELP AND DUNEZ!

Please keep posting and checking in with us.  We are all here to lend support and help and prayers.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on December 10, 2008, 02:38:32 PM
Hi all,
Thank goodness I found this site, I have read through most pages and just through reading your experiences I feel better. I had an accident in Vietnam at the end of October. I collapsed on myelf for a long time...I am guessing about 8 hours. I have damaged the nerve and muscle in my left forearm and the nerves in my leg from the knee downwards. I little movement of my fingers but it is improving through p.t, my whole hand is numb except just under my thumb on the back of my hand. I have foot drop and part of my leg and foot is numb and part of my foot has strange sensation, often burning and intense pain. I also have daily pain 'attacks' where I get sharp electric shock type shooting pains which go right through to my left shoulder. I was treated with a fasciectomy (I think that's right) on both my leg and arm. My leg has since been closed through stitching and I have a skin graft on my arm which was put on 5 days ago. I flew back to England 3 weeks after the accident, the doctors in Vietnam told me in broken English that my arm was more seriously injured than my leg, there was evidence of necrosis on the muscle and I went in to OT 3 times to clean the wound. They didnt close it before I cam home. My leg was closed and very little information was given except 'it will be ok'. No testing of nerve function etc. Since I have returned to England the doctors conducted an MRI on my arm and advised me that there nerves weren't severed and will regrow. They gave me a final debridement and grafted me. Regarding my leg, the consultant gave it an examination through touch and asking me questions: 'Can you feel this?' etc. The general consensus was that my leg is fine at this stage and P.T is required to regain function. I am worried, I can put very little weight on my ankle. I can just about point my tows down but no upward movement whatsoever. It doesn't seem fine to me and having read your posts I feel the doctors should be conducting tests to assess nerve function and put us all in the picture of whats going on in my leg. Or am I over worrying and through a physical examination they can tell whats going on and it really is 'fine'? I am hitting the physio as hard as I can and I am noticing improvements - I couldn't even get out of bed 2 weeks ago and now I can walk with my ACO and crutch for a while. The pain is a major burden, although it has too improved, before it was all day and all night in my leg - now I can feel a constant ache and slight tingling but the pain doesn't kick in until just before I go to bed (I don't know how it knows!) I am Gabapentin, anatryptalin, tremadol and morphine. I would love to hear from anyone who can offer me advice or tips. I thank you all in advance and wish you all a speedy recovery! PS I am a 26 y/o male if it makes any difference!
dunez




hey Dunez,

Thanks for posting and i wish you the best in your recovery.....without the people on this thread i dont know where i would be in my recovery today....but with regards to your leg and not being satisfied with the information that the doctors are giving you with a physical assessment is an issue most of us have faced. if your truly satisfied with what the diagnosis is then there would be no need to get the tests done....but just to be safe and to have information of what is going on neurologically in your leg couldnt hurt you. hope you recovery strong and healthy and look forward to hearing from you....Also....from what i have heard age should give u an advantage....but everyone is different...try and stay as mentally strong as you can and we are here to help if you need someone to vent,relate and learn through experiences.

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on December 10, 2008, 03:16:23 PM
Hi to everyone.
Well I dont have anything new to report regarding my foot drop but I do have another little girl.  Her name is Regan Elisabeth and she was born on 3 September - elective C-Section.  she was born at 38 weeks and was 5.14 pound (2.6kg) jus a little dot. She is a very good baby and is doing wonderfully.  I have just read through the latest posts and am so happy everyone is keeping the forum going.  I will post again soon.
Amanda

Congrats on the Newbie!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! aday after my sons bday...lol
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: dunez on December 10, 2008, 05:23:17 PM
Thanks guys, I just returned from the hospital to change the dressing on my skin graft which is getting aired as i write...feels allot better than it looks mind but I am told that's normal. I also pressed for the nerve analysis examinations and have a consultant appointment next thursday who can refer me. All in all a good day - and I can finally take a shower! Thanks again team.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: dunez on December 30, 2008, 01:25:40 PM
dear everyone, happy Christmas et al I hope you all are having a lovely time. How are your recoveries going?   I seem to be slowly improving on the physio side but no regeneration whatsoever. I cannot dorisflex my foot 1mm! I still don't know exactly where or to what extent the nerve is damaged but I think it is all in the knee which is a point of my body which was being compressed when I was out cold, because my other knee was on top of it. The nerve pain basically runs alng a line up to my bottom and down to my foot, from the knee. I am sure I have compressed the nerve, from what I've read decompression surgery is quick and straight forward butmy doctors haven't even mentioned it. Does anyone have experience of this? Also do you wear your ankle supports all day and all night? Any tips for walking without it on? I am trying to walk as much as I can as my leg is getting very skinny but it's so cold out that I last about ten minutes. (My hand injury is extremely sensitive to the cold). Anyways, please keep in touch as I really need all of
your support through this difficult and incredibly fustrating period. Happy new year everyone.
dunez
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Tanya8 on January 01, 2009, 06:14:15 AM
dear everyone, happy Christmas et al I hope you all are having a lovely time. How are your recoveries going?   I seem to be slowly improving on the physio side but no regeneration whatsoever. I cannot dorisflex my foot 1mm! I still don't know exactly where or to what extent the nerve is damaged but I think it is all in the knee which is a point of my body which was being compressed when I was out cold, because my other knee was on top of it. The nerve pain basically runs alng a line up to my bottom and down to my foot, from the knee. I am sure I have compressed the nerve, from what I've read decompression surgery is quick and straight forward butmy doctors haven't even mentioned it. Does anyone have experience of this? Also do you wear your ankle supports all day and all night? Any tips for walking without it on? I am trying to walk as much as I can as my leg is getting very skinny but it's so cold out that I last about ten minutes. (My hand injury is extremely sensitive to the cold). Anyways, please keep in touch as I really need all of
your support through this difficult and incredibly fustrating period. Happy new year everyone.
dunez

Hi dunez,

I've been dealing with drop foot a little for more than a year due to a broken leg, and have progressed from no movement at all in dorsiflexion ...moving my foot upward...to being able to lift it more than halfway up at this point. Like you, I also experienced the pain from the knee around the ankle to the foot. In the beginning I wore an AFO when walking, and couldn't walk without it, and also wore a brace at night in order to keep the foot at 90 degrees. After my doctors waited a few months to see if I would regain function on my own, I underwent decompression surgery and it was really no big deal...in and out of the hospital the same day. Slowly, function has returned, and although I see tremendous improvement, I am not all the way healed yet...but I'm really happy to be where I am today. I no longer wear the heavy duty AFO, but instead wear a small elastic brace around my ankle, which attaches to my shoelaces...this is a big improvement, since I found the AFO most uncomfortable.  Right now I'm noticing that I can walk without this elastic brace for a couple of days at a time without tripping, so there is continued progress...when I'm really tired, though, I put the brace back on again. The only thing that has remained more or less unchanged is the feeling that someone is squeezing my leg at times, but I don't take any medications for this.  It's become like background noise that's always there, but which I can ignore most of the time. I hope this information has been helpful to you, and if you have any further questions just post again....by the way, I still wear a night brace to keep my foot in the proper position, but it's just something that I do that I don't pay attention to anymore.  My best wishes for your speedy and full recovery!

Tanya   
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: amdre on January 01, 2009, 06:45:35 PM
HAPPY NEW YEAR EVERYONE....WISH YOU ALL THE BEST IN RECOVERY FOR THE NEW YEAR!!!!!!
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: sports06 on January 17, 2009, 04:46:38 AM
Hello!

I am SO glad I found this post. I am a college student who has had two peroneal nerve releases as well as on anterior tibilias hernia repair. I was injured during an athletics game several years ago. Since then I have had many ambulance rides, pain management treatmetns, hospitalizations, and surgeries. Currently I  am several months out from my latest surgery. This surgery has been a really tough one to recover from. I am still fighting footdrop. There is still some hope that the movement could come back, but no guarantees. I would love to hear from others who are going through similar things.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on January 20, 2009, 04:09:03 AM
Hello!

I am SO glad I found this post. I am a college student who has had two peroneal nerve releases as well as on anterior tibilias hernia repair. I was injured during an athletics game several years ago. Since then I have had many ambulance rides, pain management treatmetns, hospitalizations, and surgeries. Currently I  am several months out from my latest surgery. This surgery has been a really tough one to recover from. I am still fighting footdrop. There is still some hope that the movement could come back, but no guarantees. I would love to hear from others who are going through similar things.

Welcome to the board and good luck with your recovery!
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mtviso on January 21, 2009, 01:30:28 PM
Hi Tanya!
I was in your situation with recovery last spring and I found a tremendous improvement for my daily activities from MBT-shoes. With those shoes my gait is almost normal and I am able to walk faster and longer. They even give me the feeling of a healthy person again! They look ugly and are expencive, but have made wonders at least for me.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Tanya8 on January 24, 2009, 06:58:54 AM
Hi Tanya!
I was in your situation with recovery last spring and I found a tremendous improvement for my daily activities from MBT-shoes. With those shoes my gait is almost normal and I am able to walk faster and longer. They even give me the feeling of a healthy person again! They look ugly and are expencive, but have made wonders at least for me.

Hi there mtviso,

Thanks so much for the information about the MBT shoes. I've continued to make progress and have been able to ditch all the braces...I can't say that my foot-drop foot can dorsiflex as normally as my normal foot, but I'm able to clear the ground when I walk, and I'm really really happy about that!  I don't really catch my foot or trip at all, but the MBT shoes sound like a great idea. Braces are great when you need them, but the best brace of all is NO brace.  Right now I wear Ecco walking shoes, which I find very comfortable for me, both walking and driving. And yes, I am able to drive again after more than a year, so I've been very lucky in all of this.  The name of this website is "Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?"  I don't know if I will ever be completely the way I was before, but I consider myself a recovery story.  My best to you and all the other posters on this website--and never give up hope! 
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: exrugbylad1986 on January 28, 2009, 12:45:39 PM
Hi Im a first timer on the board and am getting lots of useful tips but would like some help on various aspects of my injury.
Basically the injury occured while playing rugby.A couple of players landed on the side of my knee while going for the ball causing my knee to snap outwards and then snap back in (could do nothing about it due to the studs planted in the ground)
The outcome was a total dislocation of the knee causing all ligaments to tear (including the acl) and extensive peroneal nerve damage.I have had one operation (posterior lateral corner and ligament transfer) and am due for a second one next week (exploratory work on the nerve).
I am wondering how successful a nerve transfer is because that is what i believe is going to occur later on?
Also due to the nerve damage it has led to drop foot on my right leg, i will need a AFO to combat this and was wondering if anyone had any idea on what one to get. (have heard that the nhs one is not comfy whatsoever) Nerve regeneration obviously takes a long time and dont mind the price tag.
Has anyone else also been able to drive since such a injury because really miss not driving.
Thank you for your help
Matt
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Tanya8 on January 29, 2009, 05:58:13 AM
Hi Im a first timer on the board and am getting lots of useful tips but would like some help on various aspects of my injury.
Basically the injury occured while playing rugby.A couple of players landed on the side of my knee while going for the ball causing my knee to snap outwards and then snap back in (could do nothing about it due to the studs planted in the ground)
The outcome was a total dislocation of the knee causing all ligaments to tear (including the acl) and extensive peroneal nerve damage.I have had one operation (posterior lateral corner and ligament transfer) and am due for a second one next week (exploratory work on the nerve).
I am wondering how successful a nerve transfer is because that is what i believe is going to occur later on?
Also due to the nerve damage it has led to drop foot on my right leg, i will need a AFO to combat this and was wondering if anyone had any idea on what one to get. (have heard that the nhs one is not comfy whatsoever) Nerve regeneration obviously takes a long time and dont mind the price tag.
Has anyone else also been able to drive since such a injury because really miss not driving.
Thank you for your help
Matt

Hi Matt, and welcome to the forum...here's some info that you may find helpful. Braces---the plastic molded ones can be uncomfortable, but a light carbon brace by Otto Bock is really great by comparison.  Just use a search engine to find out about them and their Walk-on brace.  Also, Dorset Orthopaedics in England has a rubbery kind of brace, which many users say permits them to drive again---I have no experience with this brace, but as with Otto Bock, you can look them up on the web Research---excellent websites for peroneal nerve issues and information are New York University Medical center, and the Columbia University Medical Center, both located in New York.  Driving---although every case is different, I have resumed driving again after about a year of healing and a decompression surgery---it can be difficult when the right foot is the one affected, as it was in my case.  It took a little getting used to at first, but it did happen for me.  If you have any difficulty finding the URLs of the above mentioned websites, just leave a message on this website---Best of luck and healing to you!

Tanya
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: exrugbylad1986 on January 29, 2009, 02:02:40 PM
Thank you for the help Tanya, its proving very useful.
Have just come out of my cast and caliper, I have now got an NHS AFO on and its true what people say, not comfortable at all!!!
I had a look at the sillicone one from the Dorset orthopaedics and i think that looks and probably feels the best so im either gonna get the NHS to get it or obviously pay for it myself.
One more question what did the decompression surgery involve because im sure thats what im gonna have in a few months??

Matt
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Tanya8 on January 29, 2009, 08:13:08 PM
Hi Matt...I'm glad you found the information useful---

Even though I had decompression surgery, just remember that every case is different, and I can only speak from my experiences. Decompression surgery is usually performed on an ambulatory basis, and in my case it was no big deal---in the hospital in the early morning, surgery, and then out the door by 2:00 PM the same afternoon.  Although you should keep the leg quiet for a few days and relax a bit, you are permitted to walk on it right after surgery. I really experienced minimum discomfort throughout the whole thing. Although this type of surgery was helpful in my case, prior EMG electrical testing will determine if you are a candidate for this type of surgery, and if it can be helpful in your particular circumstances.  Also, as far as I know about decompression surgery, there is a certain time frame for performing it in order for it to be effective---I think that time frame is about 4 to 8 months after an injury, but you should check with your neurosurgeon to be sure about this.  Between queuing up for the electrical testing appointments and seeing your doctor, time will pass quickly until you get the results from your tests. It might be a good idea to start asking questions now, if this procedure is to benefit you.  The very best of luck to you and just post here if you have any more questions---and let us know how you are doing---Tanya
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Abbo62 on February 13, 2009, 06:45:05 PM
Hi All,
This post is so reassuring and inspirational.
I had a motorbike RTA March 08 after a car done a U turn on me. I took the impact on my left knee which basically punched my leg out the back of my pelvis taking the sciatic nerve with it and stretching it in the thigh.
Immediately I could not move my foot other than a slight wiggle of some toes, after surgery to repair my pelvis I was told the nerve was intact but looking 'tatty' and time would tell what recovery was likely.
The nerve pain, burning sensations in my foot were far worse than the pelvis. Unfortunately after eight weeks my toes stopped wiggling, this was not a good sign but my ortho consultant could not tell me why and so was referred to my 1st Neurologist, I'm on my 4th now and have at last got an answer, scar tissue build up around the nerve.
The NHS has been great but you must persevere until you find the right specialist. I have just under gone decompression surgery at RNOH as they specialise in nerve trauma to remove it and hopefully will now get some results. EMG and NCS have shown some nerve regeneration and I get a shock in my toes if I tap on my outer calf, also the wiggle is back, all good I've been told.
I recommend a Dorset Ortho SAFO as I've been wearing one for two months which has improved my walking no end, bit expensive tho!
The body is a miraculous healer just have to give it time and we will get there in the end.
Good luck to you all.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: ah51416 on March 04, 2009, 09:23:36 PM
Hello everyone,

It's been a while since I last posted, and I was just starting to see a little eversion.  Now I have gained strength in that eversion and I have a small amount of dorsiflexion.  In the last month,  I have been able to lift all of my toes except the big one.  I am still seeing results even after I was told otherwise.  I still wear the afo when I walk, but I wear an aso when I work out.  I have since started competing in Brazilian Jiu Jitsu and I won my first tournament a couple of weeks ago.  I believe that the brazilian jiu jitsu, wrestling, muay thai, and working out is opening up nerve pathways.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: soccerdoc on March 06, 2009, 02:08:54 AM
Hi All,

My peroneal nerve injury was a long time ago and recovery was a slow process.  I resumed refereeing soccer while using the afo.  I am fairly certain the gait alteration put some significant loads on my left knee which in retrospect I should have paid a bit more attention to.  The various martial arts involve significant visual motor behavioral rehearsal in addition to the meditative mind-body focus aspects and these can be very beneficial. It is interesting the different things one can do to help the body respond.  Your post should be a helpful inspiration to people who may be experiencing a slower than desired recovery...............jim
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on March 21, 2009, 01:45:00 AM
Hello to all the new and returning members!  You are still in our thoughts and prayers.

My daughter is now almost six years old.  We still attempt to do the EMG triggered biofeedback and TES stickers at night, but quite frankly she is getting cranky over doing the exercises.  Still no complete dorsiflexion, but she is getting some movement...  It might be subtle dorsiflexion?  ...It's so hard to tell...

I wondered if anyone's physical therapist has suggestions about other exercises to strengthen the anterior tibialis.  Andre, would you know?

I was thinking of getting her one of those little "stair climber" machines.  Would it be worth it?
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: ruaz on March 30, 2009, 04:25:19 PM
On 2/23/09 I suffered a left pilon fracture (tibia and fibula fracture just above the ankle) while skiing.  At first all I was dealing with was the broken leg.  I had a cast above the knee for a week and then I had surgery on 3/6/09 for internal fixation of the fracture.  Pre-op I could move my toes up and down and I had normal sensation.  The anesthesiologist and orthopedic surgeon suggested that I have a peroneal nerve block to prevent post-operative pain.  They injected local anesthesia around the nerve and they placed a catheter near the nerve in order to deliver anesthesia to the nerve for 2 -3 days post-op.  I thought that sounded like a good idea.  Everything with the surgery went ok.  On post-op day number 3, I had the catheter removed and I was discharged home.  After about 2 days, though, I was still numb and I still could not move my foot.  I knew this was not good.  The common peroneal nerve was either damaged from the nerve block, crushed by the tourniquet during the operation or had pressure on it from the cast that I could not detect because my leg was numb from the anesthesia.  I guess it really doesn't matter too much because the results are the same.  I can't dorsiflex my foot. 
The orthopedic surgeon and the anesthesiologist both think the nerve will come back with time.  Last week I saw the neurologist and neurosurgeon and I had an EMG with NCV done.  I didn't mind the EMG with the needles so much, but the nerve conduction studies were "shocking" to say the least.  My leg was burning for the next 24 hours.  Anyway, the nerve conduction tests seemed to indicate that the nerve was intact.  The EMG was not as good.  There were signs of deinnervation of the muscles supplied by the common peroneal nerve.  That was the bad news.  The good news was that I have sensation, although it is not exactly normal, along the outside of my shin and on the top of my foot (except for a small patch on the top of my foot that is completely numb).  The sensation has actually been getting better, but, slowly.  I also have a Tinnel's sign at  my knee as well as at the ankle.  Movement, though is a little strange.  I can, sort of, invert my foot.  It is very weak and I can only do it some of the time.  When I try very hard to dorsiflex my foot, my toes sort of move apart and they shake but they don't move up. Has anyone else had this happen?  I can't evert my foot at all.  The movement seems to be better, but, it is hard to tell.  Maybe I am just seeing things because I want the nerve to work so badly.
The worst part is the fear of the unknown.  I have no idea if the nerve will ever come back, I don't know if I will need to have the nerve explored, and I don't know if I will ever be able to walk without a brace.  Even reading all the research on the subject has left me confused, so it no surprise that  physicians are not sure what to tell patients.  I guess all I can do is sit tight and wait this thing out.  But, that is hard to do.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: deadhead2002000 on April 03, 2009, 04:17:22 AM
On 2/23/09 I suffered a left pilon fracture (tibia and fibula fracture just above the ankle) while skiing.  At first all I was dealing with was the broken leg.  I had a cast above the knee for a week and then I had surgery on 3/6/09 for internal fixation of the fracture.  Pre-op I could move my toes up and down and I had normal sensation.  The anesthesiologist and orthopedic surgeon suggested that I have a peroneal nerve block to prevent post-operative pain.  They injected local anesthesia around the nerve and they placed a catheter near the nerve in order to deliver anesthesia to the nerve for 2 -3 days post-op.  I thought that sounded like a good idea.  Everything with the surgery went ok.  On post-op day number 3, I had the catheter removed and I was discharged home.  After about 2 days, though, I was still numb and I still could not move my foot.  I knew this was not good.  The common peroneal nerve was either damaged from the nerve block, crushed by the tourniquet during the operation or had pressure on it from the cast that I could not detect because my leg was numb from the anesthesia.  I guess it really doesn't matter too much because the results are the same.  I can't dorsiflex my foot. 
The orthopedic surgeon and the anesthesiologist both think the nerve will come back with time.  Last week I saw the neurologist and neurosurgeon and I had an EMG with NCV done.  I didn't mind the EMG with the needles so much, but the nerve conduction studies were "shocking" to say the least.  My leg was burning for the next 24 hours.  Anyway, the nerve conduction tests seemed to indicate that the nerve was intact.  The EMG was not as good.  There were signs of deinnervation of the muscles supplied by the common peroneal nerve.  That was the bad news.  The good news was that I have sensation, although it is not exactly normal, along the outside of my shin and on the top of my foot (except for a small patch on the top of my foot that is completely numb).  The sensation has actually been getting better, but, slowly.  I also have a Tinnel's sign at  my knee as well as at the ankle.  Movement, though is a little strange.  I can, sort of, invert my foot.  It is very weak and I can only do it some of the time.  When I try very hard to dorsiflex my foot, my toes sort of move apart and they shake but they don't move up. Has anyone else had this happen?  I can't evert my foot at all.  The movement seems to be better, but, it is hard to tell.  Maybe I am just seeing things because I want the nerve to work so badly.
The worst part is the fear of the unknown.  I have no idea if the nerve will ever come back, I don't know if I will need to have the nerve explored, and I don't know if I will ever be able to walk without a brace.  Even reading all the research on the subject has left me confused, so it no surprise that  physicians are not sure what to tell patients.  I guess all I can do is sit tight and wait this thing out.  But, that is hard to do.

hello ive been a frequent flyer on this site since my motorcycle accident on oct 30th. 2008......i had an open dislocation and everything was torn and i mean everything!!!drs told me id never walk again and all the what seems to be regular bs some drs feed their patients...anyways back to my story....ive had foot drop since my accident....ive been able to wiggle my toes alittle since mid december but really no better since ive been able to move them..i met with a dr nath and am scheduled have a nerve transfer/nerve transplant/decompression surgery in about a weeks time and was wondering if anyone can tell me anything about what to expect from this procedure or anything that would help me..thks much,jeremy
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Tanya8 on April 07, 2009, 05:27:04 AM
Quote
hello ive been a frequent flyer on this site since my motorcycle accident on oct 30th. 2008......i had an open dislocation and everything was torn and i mean everything!!!drs told me id never walk again and all the what seems to be regular bs some drs feed their patients...anyways back to my story....ive had foot drop since my accident....ive been able to wiggle my toes alittle since mid december but really no better since ive been able to move them..i met with a dr nath and am scheduled have a nerve transfer/nerve transplant/decompression surgery in about a weeks time and was wondering if anyone can tell me anything about what to expect from this procedure or anything that would help me..thks much,jeremy
Quote

Hi Deadhead...if you want more information about the surgery and its aftermath, you should ask Dr. Nath to email you a copy of his research report entitled Successful Management of Foot Drop by Nerve Transfers to the Deep Peroneal Nerve /Neurotization of Deep Peroneal Nerve

Good Luck with your surgery next week!
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: DustysMom on April 13, 2009, 09:45:56 PM
Hello y'all!! I'm new here. I just want everybody to know that there is hope out there for anyone who is suffering from peroneal nerve damage. My son, had a Kawaski mule accident on March 1sth 2008. He was
12 years old. Before anyone judges me....he was not in my care when the accident happened.
Anyway.......he suffered a degloving injury to the back of his knee along with a broken tibia and a severed peroneal nerve. He had a muscle graft done to the back of his knee along with a nerve graft. He had foot drop and the doctors were hopeful that he would make some recovery but it would take time for the graft to take. 9inches it had to grow. Once the bone healed it was time to be fitted with a AFO,
which he wore for about 5 months. He went to physical therapy which they were just awesome. He went in walking with a walker , 5 months later he was walking out on his own. Now here's the part about the nerve damage. The whole time he had to wear that brace to keep his foot from dropping.
Then...all of a sudden he started to flex his foot. Little by little his foot....then his toes....and he decided he didnt need that brace after all!!....Dr. said that was fine because if he continued to wear that brace it was keeping certain muscles from being used in the calf area. Now he can walk & run. Still has a little trouble with his big toe....but hey...considering what the outcome could have been....we are just so grateful. His accident was just a little over a year ago. Keep the faith...and never give up! Recovery does happen!!! :)   
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: katieswimstar on April 17, 2009, 10:00:06 PM
hi everyone this is my first post i was looking around on the internet and found this
id really like to hear some success stories or encouragement because its hard to keep going
i damged my peroneal nerve in a ski race about 3 monthes ago
i still can't move my toe or foot at all i have total foot drop and my leg and foot are all numb.
the doctors know nothing really and i was just wondering if there is a time frame on this like how long it will be
i've been walking around on crutches
i cant put any weight on my leg without the knee bending
thanks a lot
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: ruaz on April 18, 2009, 03:08:20 AM
Just a quick update on my recovery.  Since the last time I posted, I have noticed just a few changes.  The area of numbness has decreased.  I used to be numb on the entire front surface and outside of my shin all the way to the top of my foot.  Now, the numbness goes from just above my ankle to my foot.  The area on my foot that is numb has also decreased in size, but it is still substantial.  The other thing that I have noticed is that I have a flicker of dorsiflexion.  I mean a flicker.  It only works for 2 or 3 times and then it stops.  I can still feel the muscle firing though, but I think that it must be very weak.  I just went for physical therapy today for the first time.  They have given me some exercises and they say they may try a nerve stimulator the next time I am in early next week.  I hope it does not hurt too bad.  Anyway, things seem to be moving forward, I just don't know what to think.  Some days I am pretty hopeful, but others I am worried I may never be "normal" again.  There are these shooting and burning pains that go down my leg to my foot (the dragon I guess) that have started recently.  Since they are associated with the return of a little flicker of movement, I don't mind so much.  Just as long as the movement continues to improve.  If anyone has any ideas about what to do to improve on a flicker of movement, please let me know.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: DustysMom on April 28, 2009, 10:50:00 PM
Ruaz, even a little flicker is a great sign. The nerve takes time to heal......Physical therapy will do alot for you. A flicker is a sign that the nerves are sparking, trying to make connections. The nerve stimulator that the PT placed on my son, he said it really didnt hurt...just felt really stange though.
Keep your chin up...time heals alot of things.  :)
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mindyst on April 29, 2009, 03:41:09 PM
Hi,

This is my first post here. I found this board before I had my surgery (last week). It's helpful to read your stories and I'm happy to hear recommendations for braces, etc. I'm still trying to learn all the lingo associated with these types of injuries!

I started having severe pain in my foot and eventual foot drop after several falls. The big fall was when I tackled a large Malamute and landed on my knee in some gravel. I run an animal rescue group for northern breed dogs and this was one of my foster dogs. After that, I started tripping more, especially when going up the deck stairs. Then, I fell a couple more times on ice during the winter and that's when it became clear I had a problem. The nerve pain in my leg and toes was horrid for several weeks and then it went away. Not sure what that means...possibly the nerve dying?

The doctor first thought I had an injury to my back and told me to come home and lay down until I could get an MRI. On my way to my bed I tripped and broke the 5th metarsal in that same foot. Eventually, after the MRI showed no problem with my back, I had two EMG tests, and that's when they discovered the problem was with the peroneal nerve. I finally was sent to the right doctors and had two surgeries in one last Thursday. The ortho surgeon put a screw in my foot and the neurosurgeon did the decompression sugery at my knee. I haven't really talked to the neurosurgeon yet, although I vaguely recall her saying that she definitely found nerve compression and was able to decompress them (I was very groggy). I look forward to meeting with both surgeons next week.

The broken foot is making me nuts. I can't step on it for two months (and wasn't supposed to be stepping on it for the last two months). I'm now flat on my back with my leg elevated for a few weeks. I know people have much worse problems and I'm trying to keep a good attitude but this kind of thing sure brings a person's life to a screeching halt. I won't have to lay in this position for too long but still own't be able to step on my foot for two months. >:( Maybe my next nonprofit effort will be to offer help to people who are going through this kind of thing. Jeesh...I hate having to ask people for help!

So that I don't end this on a negative note, I'm very grateful for my friends and family. I'm 54 years old and am lucky enough to still have my Mom around. She flew here and is taking care of me now. Never thought I would be this old and still yelling "MOM" from the couch. I think I'm very lucky.

Mindy from Michigan
See more about our rescue here:  www.cth.petfinder.com (http://www.cth.petfinder.com) 



Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: DMC192 on May 19, 2009, 05:38:43 PM
Hello all

This is my first time here and was wondering - if others had any imput or thoughts on e-stim
I delveloped my foot drop early Jan 2009 - had microsurgery to remove a disc that was presing on the nerve.  Surgeon said that he was able to remove the disc and did not see any other issues with the nerve.  With the nerve decompressed I began PT 3 weeks after the surgery.  PT for the drop foot was manual manipulation - exercises and e-stim.  I have been going 2 times per week.
So far there has been little recovery and with the e-stim they have not been able to fire the muscle (even thought the electric intensity has been high)
My questions are:
Is this PT approach similar to others ?
Have other had e-stim and what responses should I be looking for ?
Have others uses e-stim and them stopped to let the nerve regenerate and them continued with e-stim or another form of stimulation ?
Are there other approaches that have worked for some?
Do I need to be more patient with the time for recovery - what has been the recovery time for some others?
I appreciate your imput and thank you for letting me ask some of my questions


Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: DMC192 on May 19, 2009, 05:56:53 PM
Hello all

This is my first time here and was wondering - if others had any imput or thoughts on e-stim
I delveloped my foot drop early Jan 2009 - had microsurgery to remove a disc that was presing on the nerve.  Surgeon said that he was able to remove the disc and did not see any other issues with the nerve.  With the nerve decompressed I began PT 3 weeks after the surgery.  PT for the drop foot was manual manipulation - exercises and e-stim.  I have been going 2 times per week.
So far there has been little recovery and with the e-stim they have not been able to fire the muscle (even thought the electric intensity has been high)
My questions are:
Is this PT approach similar to others ?
Have other had e-stim and what responses should I be looking for ?
Have others uses e-stim and them stopped to let the nerve regenerate and them continued with e-stim or another form of stimulation ?
Are there other approaches that have worked for some?
Do I need to be more patient with the time for recovery - what has been the recovery time for some others?
I appreciate your imput and thank you for letting me ask some of my questions


 
 
 
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mindyst on May 25, 2009, 08:32:47 PM
I'm still in recovery mode from my surgery for nerve decompression and also to put a screw into my 5th metatarsil. I see the neurologist this week and then the ortho surgeon in mid-June. Hopefully, the ortho surgeon will tell me the foot has healed enough that I can now walk on it! In the meantime, I'm thinking about what brace I will buy to help with my foot drop. Someone this board recommended the Otto-Bock Walk-On 28U11. Is this something that has to be purchased online or do the local medical supply stores carry it? Also, approximately, how much does it cost?

Thanks for your help!
Mindy in Michigan
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on May 28, 2009, 09:14:34 PM
Hello and welcome to our new members!

I haven't had a chance to check the board in a few months.  I'm off to work now, but I'll write more later.

For those of you asking about e-stim, my daughter has been seeing a therapist that uses threshold electric stimulation overnight stickers and surface emg triggered biofeedback.

She's turning six now and can get a tiny bit of movement in the foot, still not complete dorsiflexion.  (Long story, read my old posts).

In the meantime, here is the website that describes some of the therapies we use.  They focus more on brachial plexus injuries, but our therapist is taking a chance on us with my daughter's peroneal nerve.  PM me for more details.

http://www.tascnetwork.net/
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Tanya8 on May 29, 2009, 06:17:10 AM
I'm still in recovery mode from my surgery for nerve decompression and also to put a screw into my 5th metatarsil. I see the neurologist this week and then the ortho surgeon in mid-June. Hopefully, the ortho surgeon will tell me the foot has healed enough that I can now walk on it! In the meantime, I'm thinking about what brace I will buy to help with my foot drop. Someone this board recommended the Otto-Bock Walk-On 28U11. Is this something that has to be purchased online or do the local medical supply stores carry it? Also, approximately, how much does it cost?

Thanks for your help!
Mindy in Michigan

Hii Mindy,

I think I was the one who mentioned the Otto Bock Walk-on brace.  Compared to the molded plastic ones, this carbon brace was very comfortable and really did the job.  In my case, my physiotherapist recommended that I get a new brace because the plastic one was painful and affecting my gait too much. My orthopedist wrote a prescription for the brace and my therapist recommended a local prosthetic firm, and they fitted me with the proper size brace. I really don't know if you can by this online, but I'm sure if you ask your orthopedist or therapist, they will refer you to a prosthetic establishment.  You should get the name of a few places, since not all of them carry carbon braces. I don't really know how much this brace costs because my insurance paid for it. When you have a doctors prescription for such a device, medical insurance will usually cover most or all of the expense.  Good luck with your recovery, and I'm sure recovery will come in your case. I also had a decompression surgery, and it has helped a great deal. Fortunately, I don't need to wear a brace any longer, however, the recovery can take quite a long time--- a year or even longer. Hang in there, and the time will pass.

Tanya
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: ruaz on May 31, 2009, 02:16:24 AM
More on my recovery.  Since the last time I posted I have had some more slight improvements.  The numbness has continued to decrease but I am still mostly numb on the outside of my leg about a hands length from my knee to the top of my foot. However, now I can really pick up my toes against gravity.  This is good, but, I can't pick dorsiflex my entire foot.  Just my toes.  I went to see the neurologist and neurosurgeon last week and the did another EMG/NCV on my left leg.  This time was not as bad because I think I knew what to expect.  The results of the EMG/NCV seemed to indicate that I have a conduction block at the fibular head.  The neurosurgeon said he could decompress the nerve at the fibular head and that this would maximize my recovery.  I guess I am a little scared to have more surgery.  What if I end up with less function than I have now after the surgery?  It probably seems silly, but, I don't really want another scar on my leg either.  The neurosurgeon said the surgery would not last long and that I could pretty much be up and moving around a couple of days after the surgery.  The other thing I worry about is that the surgery will not make a difference.  Then, I will have gone through the nerve decompression for nothing.  Has anyone had this surgery?  I think I saw that Tanya had it.  Anyway, if anyone has any information that would be great.  Hope that everyone continues to hang in there.  Out of all the injuries I have had in my life, this has to be the most frustrating.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Tanya8 on June 01, 2009, 06:44:21 AM
More on my recovery.  Since the last time I posted I have had some more slight improvements.  The numbness has continued to decrease but I am still mostly numb on the outside of my leg about a hands length from my knee to the top of my foot. However, now I can really pick up my toes against gravity.  This is good, but, I can't pick dorsiflex my entire foot.  Just my toes.  I went to see the neurologist and neurosurgeon last week and the did another EMG/NCV on my left leg.  This time was not as bad because I think I knew what to expect.  The results of the EMG/NCV seemed to indicate that I have a conduction block at the fibular head.  The neurosurgeon said he could decompress the nerve at the fibular head and that this would maximize my recovery.  I guess I am a little scared to have more surgery.  What if I end up with less function than I have now after the surgery?  It probably seems silly, but, I don't really want another scar on my leg either.  The neurosurgeon said the surgery would not last long and that I could pretty much be up and moving around a couple of days after the surgery.  The other thing I worry about is that the surgery will not make a difference.  Then, I will have gone through the nerve decompression for nothing.  Has anyone had this surgery?  I think I saw that Tanya had it.  Anyway, if anyone has any information that would be great.  Hope that everyone continues to hang in there.  Out of all the injuries I have had in my life, this has to be the most frustrating.

Hi ruaz---yes, frustrating is the real name of recovery from drop foot, but hang in there. Time is a great healer. Yes, you're right, I did have the decompression surgery, and it has made a world of difference in my case. Really, the surgery is no big deal and is done on an ambulatory basis. I was at the hospital at 7:00 AM, prepped for surgery, having apple juice and snacks by 11:30, and left the hospital before 2:00 PM. I think the surgery itself takes less than 45 min, but I'm not sure. I really felt very little discomfort from the surgery---as a matter of fact, I had less pain after the surgery since the pressure on the nerve was relieved. Of course, this is just my experience, but all and all it was a very positive one. I was given medicine for pain, but I didn't need any at all. I was able to walk on the leg right away, went home and chilled out for a couple of days, only because I thought it was the prudent thing to do. One thing I noticed right away after the surgery was that I could lift my toes off the floor. In the following months I started gaining dorsiflexion and strength to the foot and leg as well. Right now I'm a little over a year out from surgery, am walking without a brace, and am able to drive (this thing would have to affect my right foot.) I still feel that that is more progress to come, and even more dorsiflexion to come, but so far I'm very happy I had the surgery!

As for the scar, I really can't notice this one since it hardly shows at all. As for being afraid it won't work, your neurosurgeon would not be suggesting it if he thought it wouldn't help you. Try to look at this another way...be very very happy that there is a surgery that can help you get rid of drop foot---depending on where the injury occurred along the peroneal nerve, not everyone is lucky enough to be a candidate for this great surgery. Like you, I also had a block at the fibular head. Also, if you have fears that you will lose function because of this surgery to your leg, by all means you should discuss your concerns with your surgeon. I really don't think this surgery will endanger any progress you've made so far and having a frank discussion with your doctor should relieve most of your apprehension. One more thing---there is sort of a time limit on this kind of surgery, and your surgeon may have mentioned that. If you wait too long, it's not really that effective anymore. I had my surgery about 5 1/2 months after my injury and the timing seemed to be good.

Take care an let me know what you decide---if you have any questions, just post, and most of all---feel better. :)

Tanya

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: skimboarder on June 27, 2009, 12:08:30 AM
hello everyone

this is my first post and I just wanted to thank all the past contributors to this board, your stories are really the only concrete good news I have heard in the past month...

Five weeks ago I was skimboarding on a beach with very soft sand and as I planted my left foot, my foot sunk down in the sand about 5 inches and my knee buckled out, tearing my ACL, LCL, and stretching my peroneal nerve. I had surgery to repair the ligaments and had nerve decompression surgery all in one shot 3 weeks ago today. Unfortunately today I still have a full foot drop with no dorsiflexion and decreased sensation on the right side of the top of my left foot. I have a scheduled EMG in a couple days.

I was wondering about the timetable of my injury, and based upon everyones experience what are the chances of nerve recovery for me? I am only 18 years old, and would love to continue to run and play sports like i did previously, especially ultimate frisbee. Thank you all very much

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: jove on June 27, 2009, 05:15:29 PM
Hi and welcome.

Recovery can take quite a long time, up to and sometimes more than a year. Your chance of recovery depends on the severity of the injury, which your surgeon, having seen it and likely having done intra-operative NAPS (nerve action potential??? /some kind of electrical test that is done with the nerve exposed during the surgery) would be best able to tell you. Did they say how long the stretched or damaged section was? If not, ask....You need to ask your surgeon what your chance of recovery is-  anything anyone here tells you is only a guess.

 However, if you only required neurolysis (decompression by removing scar tissue), then your chance of recovery should be very good. Again, it will take time, so be a patient patient. If the nerve was torn or stretched badly enough to require a graft, then the chance of recovery is less. However, you did not mention having a graft (you would have extra incisions where the donor nerve was taken from, if you had), so I am guessing your chance of recovery (given TIME) is good.

While you are waiting for recovery, once your incisions are closed and you get the doctor's O.K., you can still be active and stay fit. Swimming, bike riding, weight lifting, martial arts, yoga, ...etc.....there are still lots of sports that you can do to stay fit. Just be aware, if you have lost feeling on your foot and leg, to be sure you are not causing any injury that you can not feel (check daily for blisters, abrasions, cuts, scrapes, etc. that you may not feel, and attend to them right away if you see any).

Good luck.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on June 28, 2009, 04:24:09 AM
Hey all,

Just checking in and saying welcome and good luck to our new members.  It's been THREE YEARS that we've been on this thread together!

As I said, my daughter turned six this week and it is coming up on THREE YEARS since her peroneal nerve decompression surgery.  She can move her toes and lift her foot somewhat now, but still not complete dorsiflexion, but something at least.  She is still using the AFO and in hot weather we use a little Swedo brace instead.

Hope you are all doing well,  you are in our thoughts and prayers.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: bolanbiker on June 28, 2009, 05:08:54 AM
I've had peroneal nerve palsy several times in my left leg, likely due to a PCL injury, and have been lucky enough to recovery reasonably well each time.  I'm pretty sure it was the knee injury, since the first time I felt the numbness was on a bicycle ride when I was pedaling forcefully, and the leg muscles were pulling my tibia where it wasn't supposed to go.  Backing off fixed that, but the palsy came on full force a few months later when I awoke, and again months later.  Each time, the neurologist used e-stim to get things back, along with a lot of hard work.  The neurologist never connected the foot drop with the knee injury, but I'm convinced enough to always wear a brace just to keep the tibia in its rightful position.

Best wishes to all,

the bolanbiker
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: ruaz on June 29, 2009, 08:01:10 PM
Thanks everyone for your support.  Tanya, thanks for the information about the nerve decompression surgery.  It made me feel better going into it after I read your post.  You were right.  It was not a big deal.  For a couple of days I had some pain, but, it was not unbearable.  The best news is that a few days post op I noticed that I had much more dorsiflexion and it quickly progressed.  Now, I have pretty decent function.  It is not normal, but, better than before the surgery.  I am about 3 weeks post op now and things are slowly improving.  I have some increased sensation, but, I still have a pretty good sized numb spot on my shin and foot.  It seems to be smaller though.  I also have more burning pains in the distribution of the nerve than I had before the operation.  I guess that is the feeling starting to come back.  It is more annoying than anything else.  Anyway, the surgery seems to have helped.  I am still on crutches from the pilon fracture that I have, but, at least I can bear a little weight now.  I don't think I will get the strength fully back in my muscles until after I can walk without crutches.  The funny thing is that even though I have dorsiflexion back, I can't dorsiflex my big toe.  It just sits there.  The other toes come up, just not that one.  I guess it will eventually come along.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Tanya8 on July 01, 2009, 05:23:00 AM
Hi ruaz---what wonderful news about your very fast progress!  ;D Thanks for letting me know, and you're very welcome! Things happened more slowly for me, but they did happen, and that's the important thing. I didn't have dorsiflexion for quite a while, but I do remember that all of my toes shot up right away after the surgery. I've been told that healing can take up to two years, so be patient with the entire process, and it sounds like you're off to a fine start. Also, peroneal nerve injuries and the subsequent healing process are not a one-size-fits-all kind of thing, since everyone has a different type of injury and heals at a different rate. The discomfort along the nerve also affects everyone differently---most times I just feel a little pulling and tightness along the peroneal nerve, and the numbness has gotten a lot better.  But then there are other times when the leg can  be downright annoying with a sort of burning feeling. I was told to expect anything and everything as the nerve is healing itself, so I can only pass this information along to you. I have noticed however, that as more time  passes, I feel better and better. Also, FYI "the nerve" likes warm weather and is not so crazy about cold weather---go figure??? 

Take care and my best wishes for your continued and full recovery!

Tanya
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: AmandaC on July 03, 2009, 05:25:47 AM
Hi All
I havnt posted for some time, nothing happening with me regarding the nerve. 
Welcome to all the new people online now and great to her from you Mom that your daughter has had some progress, great news.

Just wondering if Max, Gordon and Hamish are still popping online occassionally and how you are all doing?
I had a nerve conduction test about 5 weeks ago and saw a specialist about a tendon transfer operation, its no go for me as I have to much tibal nerve damage as well so there is not enough strenght to work with, my archilles tendon has now shortened so much it is very painful but they dont want to lengthen it as I will loose what little calf muscle I have.  Any way would love to hear how some of the original people are doing?

Best of luck to all new comers.
Amanda
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: correctional offic on July 06, 2009, 03:02:49 AM
hi everonyone my first time to post

I  am a correctional officer I got hurt at work in January of this year. I had to take somone down and tore my acl and peroneal nerve was damaged . I am seeing a surgeon  about this and i also have drop foot.He put me on a med for nerve pain that helps some it is Trileptal.  I lose more movement everyday and somedays the pain is so bad it is hard to do anything. I have lost movement totaly in my toes the feeling in my leg comes and gose and that is getting worse. i have to use a caine to walk with because my leg gives out. I go back to the DR. july 21 i hope he has a solution to this is the hardest thing ive had to go through.  thanks for listing 
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Hamish9 on July 06, 2009, 09:19:31 PM
Hi Amanda,

Been a long time since I have been on the site. I have been very lucky and have had some recovery from the footdrop. I would rate it at about 70%. my foot and side of my leg are still numb though, I broke my AFO and threw it away and dont wear one anymore but I do walk with a bit of a drag and sometimes look like a clumsy idiot when I catch my toe and go flying. My knee seems to be holding out pretty well and even managed a couple of days skiing this year. The good thing is with your foot and ankle strapped in a ski boot you don't have to worry about it too much.

I was doing a lot of work at the gym on my knee but haven't been to the gym for about 4 months and am beginning to feel it deteriorate a bit. Need to get back to it because i am still paying the membership and its only 5 minutes walk from my house (no thats a lie its 3 minutes walk).

Welcome Correctional Officer and sorry to hear what has happened to you. The nerve pain is a bugger particularly at the start but is does improve or you get used to it, one of the two. Push your doctor to get an EMG test to test the responsiveness of the nerve but if there is no response it does not mean there will not be an improvement in the future. I had nothing for over a year and then gradually started to get an improvement. Are you getting your acl reconstructed?

Good luck Hamish
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: correctional offic on July 10, 2009, 03:42:26 AM
 hi everyone

yes i have had my acl taken care of but there is still something else wrong there but i am more worried about the nerve .
there is more of a problem there than the knee  wright now. with the leg giveing out and the foot drop and feeling coming and going. thanks for asking 
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Tanya8 on July 10, 2009, 06:12:14 AM
hi everyone

yes i have had my acl taken care of but there is still something else wrong there but i am more worried about the nerve .
there is more of a problem there than the knee  wright now. with the leg giveing out and the foot drop and feeling coming and going. thanks for asking 

HI correctional officer...welcome to the blog...sorry to hear about your accident, but the best thing you can do now is find a good neurosurgeon to find out what's going on...orthopedists take care of acls, but neurosurgeons take care of drop foot. Neurologists can test your peroneal nerve to find out how much function you have, but from my own experience, it was the neurosurgeon who really zeroed in on exactly what was wrong and offered a surgical solution for the problem. As for the pain, it does get better in time...mostly I don't pay attention to it, but every few weeks for so, it can really act up and be annoying. I'm still in the healing stage, however, and this is not exactly a bad sign. Take care and wishes for a speedy recovery!
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: bolanbiker on July 10, 2009, 11:41:38 AM
My neurologist never put together the knee problem with the foot drop problem, and I suspect my OS (none of them actually--I have seen a lot of them in my area and a few outside  ;) ) would not have put one and one together, either.  While it would have been nice if there had been some synergy in the treatments, the bottom line is getting the foot drop corrected.  Mine came and went at least two times, and I am hoping that keeping everything lined up properly will prevent it from reoccurring.   ::)

Keep working at it--it's hard to predict if and when nerves will get back to work.

the bolanbiker
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on July 10, 2009, 04:55:12 PM
Hello All,

Welcome to the new members and please keep checking in.

Welcome back Hamish, good to see you are getting recovery!

I'd like to ask you all to continue to pray for my daughter.  I've had horrible anxiety lately as we are now coming up on the three year anniversary of her nerve decompression surgery and she still does not have as much recovery as I'd hoped.

We are still using the surface EMG triggered biofeedback and overnight TES stickers. 

I know the therapist from out of town who we see occasionally works with some other doctors who admit that with nerve injuries in childrren "habit hides recovery."

In other words, even if the nerve regenerates and reinnervates the muscle, the brain has forgotten how to use those muscles.  The brain needs to form new connections to learn how to use the muscles again.

It's been a nightmare this whole ordeal that has now dragged on for years.  I do realize that things could be a lot worse and my daughter is happy and healthy in all of the other ways, but she just turned six and as a mother I am so pained to see her still dealing with this injury. 

So your thoughts and prayers are still welcomed and blessing to all of you as well.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Abbo62 on July 23, 2009, 03:46:08 PM
Hi All,
I am now 4 months post decompression surgery and am getting some movement back in my toes, this seems to be getting stronger slowly and I'm hoping that by the end of the year I'll have significant difference and maybe some improvement to the footdrop.
My neurologist says be patient and wait and if all else fails he will do a posterior tibial tendon transfer which will give me back dorsi flexion. I'm keeping my fingers crossed that it will come back naturally but reasured that I'll get my foot back somewhat in the end.
Good luck to you all.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: kano358 on August 03, 2009, 02:31:16 AM
three months ago i destroyed my knee playing basketball. my eg was facing backwards and it was sureal and i had instant foot drop. tn days after that i had reconstructive knee surgery they fixed everything except for my acl and did peroneal nerve exploration and the nerve cam apart leaving me with a 10 cm gap. i am 28 years old and very active. three weeks ago i had a nerve graft and they used aboth sural grafts four 18 cm grafts and i feel like its a wild goose chase from all th information i been reading for the past three motnhs. i dontdo anything productive and i have the worse depression lost 40 pounds. they said it should take up to two years but if i knew my chances of recovery werent so good i would of had a tendon transfer which i have vistied two doctors and said are very good options. I wear a big plastic afo and it is so uncomfortable. my foot is deformed and i am numb fom my leg to my foot. i am obsessed with moving my foot and nothing happens. i been walking for 8 days and i can hardly get my foot in to sneakers with my mafo anf its just the worse feeling in the world. i need advice and help bad. i feel so desperate and alone. i am so discouraged. asfar as the dragons i had them when i had a 10 cm gap in my nerve and now the pain in my foot and ankle is so bad. i feel like life is partially over and i lost all the feeling in my foot because of the sural graft.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: AmandaC on August 13, 2009, 01:21:48 AM
Welcome kano358
I am very sorry to hear about your terrible accident!
After my accident the foot drop was the hardest injury to deal with mentally, I had several serious injuries but I knew the others were going to heal, the foot drop on the other hand was the unknown.  It has been 3 years since my accident I still have foot drop.  Hang in there it does get better, in the beginning my foot was so swollen the skin kept peeling of, I lost my toe nails and the pain was out of this world, my sciatic nerve was damaged at the hip so I have peroneal and tibial nerve damage as well as sciatic pain and wastage in the muscles above the knee as well.  It took me about 2 years before I could comfortably wear anything but sneakers, but it will happen.  To fit the brace in something comfortably I recommend wearing shoes 1 size bigger to your foot extra space, a inasole on top of the brace helps the uncomfortable feeling and it sounds like you need some medication for nerve pain, I was on nerontine for nearly 18 months, now am on nothing. 
Life will get better and there is still hope you will get some use back in the foot, if not you could look at a tendon transfer in the future,  I am now back riding horses, walk everywere, I cant run so it has ment the end of my sports days, I have had another child since my accident so its not the end of the world.

In the beginning i to was depressed and obsessed with trying to make the foot move, I would go to be everynight and say to myself tomorrows the day im going to make it move I have to, I went from about 160 pounds to 115 I just couldnt eat slept all the time I didn't look after my 17 month old baby girl for about 5 months.  One day I said oh well it could be worse I have to try here, I went back to work very part time started living life again and one day realised I hadnt even thought about the foot all day, that was the beginning for me or realising you can lead a pretty good life with foot drop, yeah it still sux dont get me wrong but we learn to cope with what we have. 

The pain will get better, movement may or may not return but life will carry on and you will come out the other end of this, dont give up mentally of physically.

Amanda
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: kano358 on September 11, 2009, 07:58:26 PM
Amanda,

Thank you for your kind words, they mean the world to me. I am still depressed and it's having a negative toll on my family. I just feel like I'm on a wild goose chase and the nerve pain seems to be so bad sometimes. I was taking percocet but I stopped. Did you have a nerve graft. Do you wear the plastic mafo and is their something more comfortable? Did you get any sensation back? Doesn't nerve pain mean your nerve is regenerating? My doctors don't tell sht. They are so negative.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Tanya8 on September 12, 2009, 05:13:02 AM
Hi Kano358---

I'm so sorry to hear about your terrible accident and the resultant problems with your foot---just to sum up my situation, I had foot drop from a broken leg, had nerve release surgery, and now can walk without a brace. This whole thing has been going on for a couple of years, and it's been anything but fun---I know what you're going through, but believe me, things will get better in time. Although I have recovered enough to ditch the brace, I wouldn't say things are perfect, and I still hope for continued improvement. I also know how awful those horrible plastic AFOs are---I used to have to wear two different size shoes just to fit into everything, and even with all of this, the plastic brace was still torture. I complained so much that my physiotherapist sent me to another prosthetic service, and the technician there fitted me with a Walk-on Brace by Otto Bock. It's made out of carbon and is light and flexible, but very supportive---you can call around in your area to the various prosthetic services and find out who carries it---you can also look them up on the Internet---it made a tremendous difference to me during my recuperation period, and maybe it will help you to. It was also great not to have all that pain that I experienced with the plastic variety. I hope this info helps you just a little bit and also that you make a full recovery in time. As for the "dragons" I had those horrible pains too, but with time they have diminished as well. If you have any further questions just post and I'll try to answer them---take care!
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: AmandaC on September 22, 2009, 07:24:54 AM
Hi Kano358
From my experience and advise from doctors nerve pain can be a positive and a negative thing.  It can be a sign of the nerve regenerating and it can also be caused by the damaged nerve still having some signals going through but not working.  I had serious nerve pain but it turned out my sciatic nerve was trapped in plates and pins in my hip.  I wear a splint called a toe of it is made out of some kind of carbon material it is better than the plastic ones but I still hate. 
Foot drop is a terrible thing but we can live a pretty good life still and ther is still hope
Amanda
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: kano358 on September 29, 2009, 04:30:13 PM
Tanya and Amanda thank you so much for the advice. Tanya I'm glad to hear you have improvement. Amanda, it's a little weird i think about you everyday and what you been through and i try to imagine you running around chasing your children. I even made a whole image of you and my heart breaks so much for you. You give me strength though lots of it and just the thought of you getting back on your horse makes me want to go run a marathon. Thank you so much ! P.S. i actually travel to New Zealand a lot my comapny does buisness with a company out there called Fonterra. I won;t be able to travel there for a very long time
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: AmandaC on October 03, 2009, 08:07:28 AM
Kano358, I work for a company that does contracts to Fonterra, I do all the accounts and office work its such a small world really.  Never give up home things will improve and yes foot drop can be debilitating and stop you from doing some things but we can still live a good full life, we have to be happy for what we have not what we have lost.  In time it will get easier but never give up hope it is early days yet and you still have heaps of healing to do.
Amanda
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: oldestman on October 07, 2009, 05:50:40 AM
Hi all - I am new to this thread but have been following since I broke my femur in an accident in Feb 2009. I am 28 and my femur was broken and caused damage to my sciatic nerve damaging both the peroneal and tibial nerve. 3 months post accident they did a nerve exploration on the sciatic nerve only to find my nerve was tethered by scar tissue and so they freed it. Since then my tibial nerve has recovered nicely and is almost 100% but unfortunately the peroneal still has not and I have full foot drop.

I can move all of my toes a little but not up and the side of my leg is getting less numb but the top of my foot is pretty dead. After 8 months most of my Drs say I need a few more months for the peroneal nerve to grow back to the muscle activators on my leg and hopefully start to see some recovery. I see many on this board talking about recovery of function much past 1 year but I was told the muscles will start to die after 12 months and regardless if the nerve grows the muscles won't work again. How are you all preventing that problem?

Also I met with one of the top Drs in the US for peroneal nerve surgery and he suggested we decompress my nerve at the top of my tibia below the knee to ensure it doesn't get entrapped while it is regrowing. My other and original nerve/plastic surgeon noted there was no reason to believe it would become entrapped there and the surgery was unnecessary. The new Dr said it may not help but wouldn't hurt...any thoughts? Surgery for surgery sake seems weird but the slim chance it could help is enticing me - while my first dr says it will just add another scar to my leg.

Mom444 your posts are very encouraging and have helped me the last 8 months. To be honest, all the recovery I am hoping for is for movement enough to wear flip flops at the beach again. Thanks for listening.
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: mom444 on October 07, 2009, 03:42:24 PM
Hi all - I am new to this thread but have been following since I broke my femur in an accident in Feb 2009. I am 28 and my femur was broken and caused damage to my sciatic nerve damaging both the peroneal and tibial nerve. 3 months post accident they did a nerve exploration on the sciatic nerve only to find my nerve was tethered by scar tissue and so they freed it. Since then my tibial nerve has recovered nicely and is almost 100% but unfortunately the peroneal still has not and I have full foot drop.

I can move all of my toes a little but not up and the side of my leg is getting less numb but the top of my foot is pretty dead. After 8 months most of my Drs say I need a few more months for the peroneal nerve to grow back to the muscle activators on my leg and hopefully start to see some recovery. I see many on this board talking about recovery of function much past 1 year but I was told the muscles will start to die after 12 months and regardless if the nerve grows the muscles won't work again. How are you all preventing that problem?

Also I met with one of the top Drs in the US for peroneal nerve surgery and he suggested we decompress my nerve at the top of my tibia below the knee to ensure it doesn't get entrapped while it is regrowing. My other and original nerve/plastic surgeon noted there was no reason to believe it would become entrapped there and the surgery was unnecessary. The new Dr said it may not help but wouldn't hurt...any thoughts? Surgery for surgery sake seems weird but the slim chance it could help is enticing me - while my first dr says it will just add another scar to my leg.

Mom444 your posts are very encouraging and have helped me the last 8 months. To be honest, all the recovery I am hoping for is for movement enough to wear flip flops at the beach again. Thanks for listening.

Hello and welcome to the board!  I hope things get better for you.  We are still hoping for more improvement with her.  It is now over three years since her decompression surgery, which she had approximately 18 months after the nerve injury we estimate.  (Remember the injury was unexplained and her condition was misdiagnosed for some time.)  We still do overnight threshold electrical stimulation (TES) and surface triggered EMG therapy.  Still not complete dorsiflexion but some movement and definite muscle contractions-- just not enough to lift the foot-- yet we hope.

My daughter is now six years old and very active and social despite her ailment.  We enrolled her in a "hip hop" style dance class through community ed, which is great  because it's low pressure and she can wear her brace and her normal clothes and still have fun.  Right now I'm a little concerned about putting her in sports or in any more stressful or disciplined dance...  But one day at a time. 

Please keep this thread alive everyone!
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Tanya8 on October 09, 2009, 04:30:52 AM
Hi all - I am new to this thread but have been following since I broke my femur in an accident in Feb 2009. I am 28 and my femur was broken and caused damage to my sciatic nerve damaging both the peroneal and tibial nerve. 3 months post accident they did a nerve exploration on the sciatic nerve only to find my nerve was tethered by scar tissue and so they freed it. Since then my tibial nerve has recovered nicely and is almost 100% but unfortunately the peroneal still has not and I have full foot drop.

I can move all of my toes a little but not up and the side of my leg is getting less numb but the top of my foot is pretty dead. After 8 months most of my Drs say I need a few more months for the peroneal nerve to grow back to the muscle activators on my leg and hopefully start to see some recovery. I see many on this board talking about recovery of function much past 1 year but I was told the muscles will start to die after 12 months and regardless if the nerve grows the muscles won't work again. How are you all preventing that problem?

Also I met with one of the top Drs in the US for peroneal nerve surgery and he suggested we decompress my nerve at the top of my tibia below the knee to ensure it doesn't get entrapped while it is regrowing. My other and original nerve/plastic surgeon noted there was no reason to believe it would become entrapped there and the surgery was unnecessary. The new Dr said it may not help but wouldn't hurt...any thoughts? Surgery for surgery sake seems weird but the slim chance it could help is enticing me - while my first dr says it will just add another scar to my leg.

Mom444 your posts are very encouraging and have helped me the last 8 months. To be honest, all the recovery I am hoping for is for movement enough to wear flip flops at the beach again. Thanks for listening.

Hi oldestman---welcome to the forum, and I hope you find it as helpful as I have since I broke my femur bone and landed up with drop foot too. You ask a lot of difficult questions, and I’ll try to give you my thoughts on a few of them. I had nerve release surgery at 7 months and was told that healing would continue for another 2 to 3 years. I think if all communication is lost between the nerve and the muscles for longer than 12 months or whatever time, the muscles as well as the nerve will start to die. However, if some communication is established before this time, this is enough to keep the muscles and nerves alive for more eventual healing. It has seemed to work this way with me.

As for the plastic surgeon vs. the neurosurgeon, how can anyone know that there is no compression below the knee without going in there surgically and taking a look? EMG testing sort of works by the process of elimination. It sort of goes like this…the problem is not at the spine, the problem is not at the upper thigh, so therefore the problem must be at the knee. Although you did have successful surgery of the sciatic nerve, how does anyone know there is not another problem at the peroneal branch of this nerve? My fracture was in the thigh area, and yet the neurological problem was below the knee????  If there is a problem and it is released, you will probably stand a good chance to regain a lot of function. If nothing is found there, there is really little harm done, since this surgery is a small one and done on an ambulatory basis---in and out on the same day. By the way, the scar almost disappears after a year.

If you were lucky enough to see “one of the top Drs in the US for peroneal nerve surgery,” I would be very inclined to take his advice. Plastic surgeons do fill a gap, but it was a neurosurgeon who got to the bottom of my drop foot issues.  The best of luck to you whatever you decide, and let us know how you are doing---Tanya
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: oldestman on October 15, 2009, 04:49:08 AM
Tanya- Thanks for your response. I think your comments about the muscle and nerve are text book from what I have heard as well. It can be a little longer/shorter than a year. The length my nerve needs to regrow is right around the 1yr mark to hit the muscle activators, so I am told. So hopefully I get even some flicker this winter before it is too late. At this point I was told EMGs are pretty much worthless until I see/feel some change in my lower leg. Essentially they don't need to stick me with needles to know the peroneal nerve isn't working right.

My initial nerve/plastic surgeon doesn't see why there would be any entrapment/compression of the peroneal branch below the knee because there wasn't any before. My second opinion peroneal specialist said there could be a problem when the nerve regrows but we won't really ever know and doing this will ensure there won't be a problem. My first surgeon said it probably won't hurt me and I'll just end up with another scar. But I am not entering any beauty contests, and as a guy who really cares anyway.  Since I am hoping for regrowth I won't have a release of pressure and all of a sudden function again but maybe it'll allow for easier/faster growth.

I am anxious to do anything possible to try for a full recovery so I am going to call and schedule the surgery tomorrow because of your encouragement. I am on month 8 so not much beyond where you were when you had it done. Both Drs said surgery is good to do by 9 months so I should be good on my recovery time line.  I'll let everyone know how it goes.

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Tanya8 on October 22, 2009, 01:02:25 AM
Oldestman---best of luck to you with your surgery, and I'm glad that any information I provided helped you come to a decision about this! From reading about peroneal neuropathy, I've found out that the passage of the nerve around the fibula of the knee is sort of a natural tight spot to begin with, and the reason we run into trouble with this nerve is because of this natural physiology common to everyone. There have even been cases of people getting drop foot by resting the side of their leg on the driver's door during long drives. I think that's why the nerve specialist wants to remove any obstacle, which could interfere with your best possible recovery. Also, even if you don't see some sort of flicker this winter, that doesn't mean that there is not some kind of flicker and communication going on---for a while, you may just not be able to see it! Also, you will know that you did everything you possibly could at the best possible time in order to get your nerve to heal.

FYI, my problem involved a tight compression of the peroneal nerve that eventually landed up choking the nerve and limiting function. After the nerve release, I didn't spring up and just have an instant cure either. I don't really think it happens like that---I noticed little things at first, like the color of my foot returning to a healthy pink from the sickly bluish black that was caused by the nerve compression. Next, I noticed that my big toe seemed a lot stronger as well---to walk without a brace, however, took 9 more months. Now more than a year has passed, and I've been told to expect healing for another 1-2 years!  I'm letting you know about all of this long healing process so you don't lose heart, and so you realize that this whole process needs a lot of patience, as well as excellent doctors. Take care, and we'll all be waiting to hear from you--Tanya

Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: dillman on October 23, 2009, 03:07:00 AM
Hello all.  i am brand new and this is my first post. I wanted to share my story because no one else seems to have what i have. 

I dont have a drop foot.  I can lift my foot slightly *dorsiflexion and can move my foot in and out, slightly.  So i do have movement but its limited movement and i haven't seen much improvement and fear about hitting a wall and having permanent damage to my ankle/foot.  I have not seen a neurologist yet but will soon to make sure the Peroneal nerve is not degenerating.  One thing i cant do is get my heel down when standing tall.  I am close but cant get it down.  I wear an ankle dynasplint to help stretch my achilles and help with the dorsiflexion.  I can walk in orthopedic tennis shoes pretty well and with a cane but in bare feet, forget it.  Can't come close to making the heel - toe motion.  I am improving so that is the positive news but it is very slow.  It has been 4 and half months since my accident and i was hit on the right side of my body -   broke my pelvis, femur, tibia, fibula, lost spleen and cracked ribs, and 2 collapsed lungs.  got hit by a drunk driver.  I had a ton of trauma and my right leg looked like a tree trunk for about 2 plus months.  So maybe i am being a bit hard on myself and need to be more patient.  Listening to everyone elses story makes me feel very lucky and most of the time i do feel really lucky, just lately i have been worried that my foot wont recover and reading all the stories kind of freaks me out.  I guess i am asking if anyone else has limited movement in their and did it get better?  I assume it will take a long time?  sometimes it feels like i have something blocking my foot from fully flexing upward and downward. like something is on the top of my ankle - where the ankle meets the leg and something is blocking my foot from going any higher?  when both feet are on the ground my left toes and ball of my left foot can raise above the floor easily but my right foot just lifts up a little, barely clearing the floor.  weird.  i have tingling in my right toes and ball of my right foot and calf area, but that is it.  doesnt hurt or burn, just tingles to the touch.  i have it good i know but was wondering if anyone else has similar "stuff" going on.  thanks for your time! 
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Snow1003 on October 27, 2009, 07:10:13 PM
Hello,

I am in such pain and have googled and googled and not found anything "encouraging" until I started reading this thread.

I have a left foot drop. I had a hip replacement surgery and woke up not being able to feel my foot or calf or part of my thigh. 

I can now feel the bottom of my foot, it is very sensitive to touch though. My toes feel like they are on fire, all of the time and I have spasms that hit me it is just so painful!

What does this all mean? When will the pain subside? I am going out of my mind, not being able to alleviate the pain and not being able to function.

I was told that there was swelling near the sciatica which then caused "damage" to the peroneal nerve.  I can move my big toe and move my foot to the side but cannot curl my toes or bring my foot up. I have a hard plastic brace that makes the pain worse.  I use a cane and sometimes just wear my sneakers w/o the brace. The brace feels so confining and my foot feels like I am walking over hot coals. It is awful.

I have had an EMG and nearly jumped off the table each time I was poked or jabbed.  I am taking Tylenol and Gabapentin. I don't sleep.

If anyone can offer any suggestions I would very much appreciate it!
Title: Re: Any Peroneal Nerve recovery stories?
Post by: Debbie B on November 01, 2009, 12:33:41 AM
I am new to this list too, but found it while searching for answers to my peroneal nerve injury.  In June of 2008 I had a really big, stupid dog crash me into a metal handrail on some stairs as well as on the concrete curbing.  Over the next few weeks, the leg became swollen and painful and I had pain that radiated down my tibia and fibula.  The orthopedic surgeon I saw sent me for an MRI, diagnosed me as having tibial periostitis and put me on voltaren.  A few days later, I lost about 50% of the dorsiflexion in my foot so back to the ortho surgeon who put me on prednisone.  A week later I was worse rather than better so I was sent in for a contrast MRI of the leg and back (to rule out a disc problem.)  The ortho surgeon decided I had anterior compartment syndrome and I had a fasciotomy done the next day.  Recovery was not fun - on cructhes for two weeks and lots of swelling in the leg that eventually resolved.  The peroneal nerve function steadily decreased and the pain in the limb steadily increased to the point that I had difficulty sleeping and walking.  By january I had no peroneal nerve function left.

While a drop foot sounds like a innocuous thing, it is not!  It is a major debilitating problem that affects pretty much everything you do.  Every time I went back to the ortho surgeon, he was angry, acted like I was doing this just to spite him.  He sent me in for physical therapy but my PT was so alarmed by the persistent swelling in the limb and the dysfunction that she asked me not to come back until I had clearance from the surgeon.  I was put on what turned out to be a woefully inadequate dose of gabapentin.  I was sent for an AFO which improved the mechanics of my walk but was so high arched that I could not wear it for more than 20 mintues it was so painful.  No way could I run in it or work in it.

After some research on my own, I decided I must have a peroneal nerve entrapment and asked the ortho surgeon who assured me that it was impossible and even if I did, nothing could be done for it.  I was told to give up my sporting activities and downsize my life, suck it up and use the AFO - which, by the way, he never bothered to look at.  I have a very flat foot and the Walk On AFO is very high arched.  The last time I saw him, he commented on how tired I looked and asked me if I had been busy with work.  I told him that my leg was so swollen and painful that I had difficulty sleeping so he offered me a prescription for Ambien.  That just infuriated me.

I began calling to get referrals to a neurologist for a real diagnosis.  The Mayo Clinic and Barrow Neurological Institue told me to send my medical records and they would evaluate them and contact me if they wanted to take on my case.  The first neurologist I saw congratulated me on being correct on the diagnosis but suggested I wait a year to see if I got better.  Next neurologist thought I had reflex sympathteic dystrophy and sent me for lumbar nerve blocks and put me on high doses of prednisone neither of which helped.  Due to the severe disability the drop foot caused, I found a different type of AFO ca